Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Individual discussions for each episode of Dragon Ball Super.

Moderators: General Help, Kanzenshuu Staff

User avatar
ekrolo2
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 7865
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2014 8:27 am
Location: Split, Croatia

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by ekrolo2 » Mon Oct 05, 2015 3:05 pm

KaiserNeko wrote:This series continues its trend of terrible pacing and lackluster fighting. Sure, some of the animation in this one was okay, but only for short spurts, and the action never lasted long wnough. The way things are moving, I'm just bored out of my wits. They should have been at 100% two episodes ago, easily... but here we are, still "finally getting serious".
ekrolo2 wrote:At least the new animation manages to keep the auras present a lot more often, making things more visually stimulating where as Z took every chance to get rid of them quickly.
Believe it or not? I hate the auras. I feel like they clutter the action, are an unnecessary addition that also tax the budget, and often look really, terribly ugly. Especially the God auras.
I always felt that the auras made things look visually more impressive, especially because they signify a rise in power AKA the fighters getting serious although I will admit Red Gods fire does come off as wonky a lot of the time and Blue Gods is in-general unimpressive. Freeza's fire aura looked pretty great though and making that a motif for the new auras is a good way of distinguishing them from the old ones even if the execution isn't great.
When someone tells you, "Don't present your opinion as fact," what they're actually saying is, "Don't present your opinion with any conviction. Because I don't like your opinion, and I want to be able to dismiss it as easily as possible." Don't fall for it.

How the Black Arc Should End (by Lightbing!):

User avatar
Friezaa!
Newbie
Posts: 43
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 9:18 pm

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by Friezaa! » Mon Oct 05, 2015 3:07 pm

Doctor. wrote:I think Dragon Ball (the anime) has the worst fights in the series precisely because the animation is incredibly outdated, unlike Z's, which is more inconsistent, but its best fights still hold up really well today. That clip you just posted was not particularly impressive at all. The same frames being repeated over and over again.
This is obviously a subjective matter, but still (just out of curiosity), find me a fight better than this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwqjLvl3e_w
6:43-6:56

On topic:
So far this episode and episode 11 are the only ones i'm able to watch without it not feeling like a chore. hopefully future episodes are as good.

Also are people really asking for a 3rd goku vs super battle?? have they actually developed a fetish for superman killing goku? :think:
F-F-FFRIEEEEEZZAAAA!!!

User avatar
kidhero1000
Beyond-the-Beyond Newbie
Posts: 474
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2015 8:53 pm

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by kidhero1000 » Mon Oct 05, 2015 3:11 pm

Guess we'll never see Beerus doing his Sphere of Destruction in this series
He devolved into saying only one word. Time to hit the ol' cosmic trail.

User avatar
Doctor.
Banned
Posts: 10558
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:02 am
Location: Portugal

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by Doctor. » Mon Oct 05, 2015 3:34 pm

Friezaa! wrote:This is obviously a subjective matter, but still (just out of curiosity), find me a fight better than this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwqjLvl3e_w
6:43-6:56
That's probably Dragon Ball's best animated cut, so it isn't exactly representative of DB's whole quality of animation which is very sub-par (compared to any other DB series) as a whole. But even still, it isn't exactly hard to find cuts just as impressive.

Obviously it all comes down to opinion, but I think the Dragon Ball anime is painful to look at, it's extremely outdated, even more-so than Dragon Ball Z, which is just as unbearable, but at least it still holds up today at certain points. Only very few Dragon Ball fights have good choreography (again, in the anime, the manga has excellent choreography), but I don't expect good fighting choreography from a Dragon Ball animated product anyway.

User avatar
ekrolo2
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 7865
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2014 8:27 am
Location: Split, Croatia

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by ekrolo2 » Mon Oct 05, 2015 3:42 pm

Doctor. wrote:
Friezaa! wrote:This is obviously a subjective matter, but still (just out of curiosity), find me a fight better than this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwqjLvl3e_w
6:43-6:56
That's probably Dragon Ball's best animated cut, so it isn't exactly representative of DB's whole quality of animation which is very sub-par (compared to any other DB series) as a whole. But even still, it isn't exactly hard to find cuts just as impressive.

Obviously it all comes down to opinion, but I think the Dragon Ball anime is painful to look at, it's extremely outdated, even more-so than Dragon Ball Z, which is just as unbearable, but at least it still holds up today at certain points. Only very few Dragon Ball fights have good choreography (again, in the anime, the manga has excellent choreography), but I don't expect good fighting choreography from a Dragon Ball animated product anyway.
This is the reason why the DB section should be read in the manga, the anime was just not made to last at all.
When someone tells you, "Don't present your opinion as fact," what they're actually saying is, "Don't present your opinion with any conviction. Because I don't like your opinion, and I want to be able to dismiss it as easily as possible." Don't fall for it.

How the Black Arc Should End (by Lightbing!):

User avatar
Noah
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 8141
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2015 10:56 pm
Location: Virtual World

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by Noah » Mon Oct 05, 2015 4:11 pm

ekrolo2 wrote:This is the reason why the DB section should be read in the manga, the anime was just not made to last at all.
I have to disagree, the DB anime is quite enjoyable
乃亜

Top 10 DB/Z/GT Songs

Are we too old to enjoy new Dragon Ball movies/series?

Kuririn Fan
Banned Alternate Account
Posts: 2313
Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2015 12:32 pm

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by Kuririn Fan » Mon Oct 05, 2015 4:20 pm

Noah wrote:
ekrolo2 wrote:This is the reason why the DB section should be read in the manga, the anime was just not made to last at all.
I have to disagree, the DB anime is quite enjoyable
Yep, definitely.

User avatar
ekrolo2
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 7865
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2014 8:27 am
Location: Split, Croatia

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by ekrolo2 » Mon Oct 05, 2015 4:23 pm

Kuririn Fan wrote:
Noah wrote:
ekrolo2 wrote:This is the reason why the DB section should be read in the manga, the anime was just not made to last at all.
I have to disagree, the DB anime is quite enjoyable
Yep, definitely.
I tried watching it recently and I have to disagree on it being enjoyable, I could barely watch four episodes before giving up. However, the manga version is really damn fun since I've started reading it this past week.
When someone tells you, "Don't present your opinion as fact," what they're actually saying is, "Don't present your opinion with any conviction. Because I don't like your opinion, and I want to be able to dismiss it as easily as possible." Don't fall for it.

How the Black Arc Should End (by Lightbing!):

User avatar
DragonHermit
Regular
Posts: 585
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2015 12:07 am

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by DragonHermit » Mon Oct 05, 2015 4:25 pm

Toei wants to milk the crap out of their products, so the pacing is no surprise. Just look at One Piece for the past year.

User avatar
FortuneSSJ
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5810
Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2013 9:07 pm

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by FortuneSSJ » Mon Oct 05, 2015 4:50 pm

DragonHermit wrote:Toei wants to milk the crap out of their products, so the pacing is no surprise. Just look at One Piece for the past year.
Only past year?! :lol:
A world without Dragon Ball is just meh.

User avatar
Lord Beerus
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 21389
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 5:20 pm
Location: A temple on a giant tree
Contact:

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by Lord Beerus » Mon Oct 05, 2015 5:01 pm

FortuneSSJ wrote:
DragonHermit wrote:Toei wants to milk the crap out of their products, so the pacing is no surprise. Just look at One Piece for the past year.
Only past year?! :lol:
The pacing in the One Piece anime has been awful since the Thriller Barck arc. As far as Super is concerned, I find the pacing to be actually quite good. But there certainly some areas where some fat could be trimmed.

User avatar
ShadowDude112
I'm, pretty, cozy, here...
Posts: 1871
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 8:54 pm

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by ShadowDude112 » Mon Oct 05, 2015 5:11 pm

Man, I want to fight the person who thought stretching BoG this much was a good idea. It was fine for a while, but over 13 episodes to resolve it? That's really unnecessary. Then there's hardly any breathing room for new content and then it's onto Freeza. A movie that will have only been out for 7 months when the episodes air. It's ridiculous. I just want to see cool stuff.
Tanooki Kuribo wrote:If Toriyama joined Kanzenshuu, he'd probably forget his login name and password.
Kamiccolo9 wrote:
JacobYBM wrote:No, why would it? It's fiction. The strength of the characters is not possible to reach in reality.
I mean, you're pretty open about looking at cartoon porn. Why would you do that? It's fiction. The proportions of these women are not possible to reach in reality.

User avatar
fadeddreams5
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5156
Joined: Fri Aug 08, 2014 10:53 pm
Location: New York

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by fadeddreams5 » Mon Oct 05, 2015 5:47 pm

Doctor. wrote: Obviously it all comes down to opinion, but I think the Dragon Ball anime is painful to look at, it's extremely outdated, even more-so than Dragon Ball Z, which is just as unbearable, but at least it still holds up today at certain points.
It still holds up today... period.

I don't see how it's unbearable to look at. But then again, I don't find the Meta-Cooler fight bad at all either. :?
"Dragon Ball once became a thing of the past to me, but after that, I got angry about the live action movie, re-wrote an entire movie script, and now I'm complaining about the quality of the new TV anime. It seems Dragon Ball has grown on me so much that I can't leave it alone." - Akira Toriyama on Dragon Ball Super

User avatar
Doctor.
Banned
Posts: 10558
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:02 am
Location: Portugal

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by Doctor. » Mon Oct 05, 2015 6:21 pm

fadeddreams5 wrote:It still holds up today... period.

I don't see how it's unbearable to look at. But then again, I don't find the Meta-Cooler fight bad at all either. :?
Z's unbearable not because the animation itself is in general bad (even if there are a lot of bad-looking action scenes and fights), but because it's too slow. I've used this example before, but look at this. From the moment he flies off (1:30), to the moment he hits Vegeta, it took 18 seconds. Z's action scenes are awkwardly paced and that makes them unwatachable regardless of how good or bad they are technically.

User avatar
Lord Beerus
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 21389
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 5:20 pm
Location: A temple on a giant tree
Contact:

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by Lord Beerus » Mon Oct 05, 2015 6:26 pm

fadeddreams5 wrote:
Doctor. wrote: Obviously it all comes down to opinion, but I think the Dragon Ball anime is painful to look at, it's extremely outdated, even more-so than Dragon Ball Z, which is just as unbearable, but at least it still holds up today at certain points.
It still holds up today... period.

I don't see how it's unbearable to look at. But then again, I don't find the Meta-Cooler fight bad at all either. :?
To be fair, the whole reason Dragon Ball Kai even became a thing was because of how badly the original DBZ anime aged in some areas. Inconsistent animation, horrible pacing, filler etc. And for the English dub specifically, this was chance to rectify the awful original script, as well as the lackluster voice acting.

User avatar
ekrolo2
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 7865
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2014 8:27 am
Location: Split, Croatia

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by ekrolo2 » Mon Oct 05, 2015 6:29 pm

Exactly, just compare how Kai and Z handle the same Doctor placed above. Sure Z has some cool shots in it but goddamn, it shouldn't take him that long to start the fight. Kai manages to keep the scene impressive and fast thanks to its editing and music.
When someone tells you, "Don't present your opinion as fact," what they're actually saying is, "Don't present your opinion with any conviction. Because I don't like your opinion, and I want to be able to dismiss it as easily as possible." Don't fall for it.

How the Black Arc Should End (by Lightbing!):

User avatar
fadeddreams5
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5156
Joined: Fri Aug 08, 2014 10:53 pm
Location: New York

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by fadeddreams5 » Mon Oct 05, 2015 6:50 pm

Doctor. wrote:
fadeddreams5 wrote:It still holds up today... period.

I don't see how it's unbearable to look at. But then again, I don't find the Meta-Cooler fight bad at all either. :?
Z's unbearable not because the animation itself is in general bad (even if there are a lot of bad-looking action scenes and fights), but because it's too slow. I've used this example before, but look at this. From the moment he flies off (1:30), to the moment he hits Vegeta, it took 18 seconds. Z's action scenes are awkwardly paced and that makes them unwatachable regardless of how good or bad they are technically.
That punch was super dramatic. It's really cool. lol. I still enjoy the hell out of DBZ fights. More so than a lot of modern Shonen stuff, so idk what to say. It's impossible to find over-the-top action like this elsewhere. =P
Lord Beerus wrote: To be fair, the whole reason Dragon Ball Kai even became a thing was because of how badly the original DBZ anime aged in some areas. Inconsistent animation, horrible pacing, filler etc. And for the English dub specifically, this was chance to rectify the awful original script, as well as the lackluster voice acting.
Oh yeah, that I know. Kai was a blessing for US fans of the show not attached to Bruce Faulconer. I meant in regards to the action in the fights (not actually how long they take to finish, such as the Goku vs Frieza one).
"Dragon Ball once became a thing of the past to me, but after that, I got angry about the live action movie, re-wrote an entire movie script, and now I'm complaining about the quality of the new TV anime. It seems Dragon Ball has grown on me so much that I can't leave it alone." - Akira Toriyama on Dragon Ball Super

User avatar
FortuneSSJ
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5810
Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2013 9:07 pm

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by FortuneSSJ » Mon Oct 05, 2015 6:52 pm

Lord Beerus wrote: To be fair, the whole reason Dragon Ball Kai even became a thing was because of how badly the original DBZ anime aged in some areas.
This is business. It was because of money. Money speaks louder.
Dragon Ball is way more outdated than DBZ. Why they didn't bother with it so far?! Because Z sells way more.
Last edited by FortuneSSJ on Mon Oct 05, 2015 6:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
A world without Dragon Ball is just meh.

User avatar
Doctor.
Banned
Posts: 10558
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:02 am
Location: Portugal

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by Doctor. » Mon Oct 05, 2015 6:54 pm

fadeddreams5 wrote:That punch was super dramatic. It's really cool. lol. I still enjoy the hell out of DBZ fights. More so than a lot of modern Shonen stuff, so idk what to say. It's impossible to find over-the-top action like this elsewhere. =P
I enjoy Dragon Ball fights more than most other Shounens too, but that's because most of them are garbage.

User avatar
fadeddreams5
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5156
Joined: Fri Aug 08, 2014 10:53 pm
Location: New York

Re: Super Episode 13 (04 October 2015)

Post by fadeddreams5 » Mon Oct 05, 2015 7:01 pm

Doctor. wrote:
fadeddreams5 wrote:That punch was super dramatic. It's really cool. lol. I still enjoy the hell out of DBZ fights. More so than a lot of modern Shonen stuff, so idk what to say. It's impossible to find over-the-top action like this elsewhere. =P
I enjoy Dragon Ball fights more than most other Shounens too, but that's because most of them are garbage.
lol. To be fair, does any other animated medium have over-the-top battles with beams, magic, exaggerated jumps, and so forth?
"Dragon Ball once became a thing of the past to me, but after that, I got angry about the live action movie, re-wrote an entire movie script, and now I'm complaining about the quality of the new TV anime. It seems Dragon Ball has grown on me so much that I can't leave it alone." - Akira Toriyama on Dragon Ball Super

Post Reply