Super Episode 112 (22 October 2017)

[HeroR]

Beerus is a God of Destruction so he can act exactly how he wants and get away with it.

Being a God of Destruction doesn’t excuse you from being an asshole.

[Username2016]

Beerus is a God of Destruction so he can act exactly how he wants and get away with it.

Being a God of Destruction doesn’t excuse you from being an asshole.

Beerus isn't an asshole though

[PerhapsTheOtherOne]

Beerus is a God of Destruction so he can act exactly how he wants and get away with it.

Being a God of Destruction doesn’t excuse you from being an asshole.

Beerus isn't an asshole though

And neither is Caulifla, really. She's mostly just overly confident in herself, much like Goku or Vegeta. Which makes sense, being a Saiyan and all.

A lot of people around here seem to conflate a bad attitude with a bad character, at least from how I'm perceiving what's being posted. I've seen the same sort of thing with Vegeta, where people say he's somehow regressed as a character when the only thing that's really notably negative is his attitude, and even then it's nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be.

[Cabba]

Being a God of Destruction doesn’t excuse you from being an asshole.

If you are going to be an asshole/cunt at least be a likeable character (which beerus is)
Caulifla is a new comer that hasnt won anyone hearts yet acting like a cunt wont do her any favors. Personally i feel neutral, i dont particularly like her but i dont dislike her either
I'm on the fence about Kale, she is staring to grow on me but think they fucked her transformation all for the sake of fan service scenes that look cool, they should have kept her at SS2 tier and grow her from there, nobody likes a mary sue

[SansrivaaL]

Yeah despite Beerus later coming off as an asshole which is why I want Goku or Vegeta to lay the smackdown on him one of these days, he wasnt an asshole who overhypes himself when he first showed up, he was actually calm and sort of graceful, Goku was the one mocking him when he said should he powerdown to 2 for him, and to top that Beerus is the GoD, its not that the title gives him the leeway to act like an asshole but he has the power to back it up, Cauli does not, she’s just a little brat still learning but she overhypes herself to something she clearly is not, Anyways it seems Vegeta isnt the only deluded character in that ring anymore, Cauli surpassed him, that little girl needs some heavy reality check on where she stands, que Freea quick!

[Kinokima]

Being a God of Destruction doesn’t excuse you from being an asshole.

Beerus isn't an asshole though

And neither is Caulifla, really. She's mostly just overly confident in herself, much like Goku or Vegeta. Which makes sense, being a Saiyan and all.

A lot of people around here seem to conflate a bad attitude with a bad character, at least from how I'm perceiving what's being posted. I've seen the same sort of thing with Vegeta, where people say he's somehow regressed as a character when the only thing that's really notably negative is his attitude, and even then it's nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be.

Or people can’t accept that it is okay for characters not to be perfect and to have flaws.

Ironic to call a character like Caulifla a Mary Sue (an over used term) when they don’t like her for a flaw her arrogance.

[HeroR]

Beerus is a God of Destruction so he can act exactly how he wants and get away with it.

Being a God of Destruction doesn’t excuse you from being an asshole.

Beerus isn't an asshole though

So someone who wants to destroy a planet with billion of lives over pudding isn’t being an asshole? Or how about him stomping on Vegeta’s head and calling him weak when he did everything in his power to keep Beerus happy?

If you are going to be an asshole/cunt at least be a likeable character (which beerus is)
Caulifla is a new comer that hasnt won anyone hearts yet acting like a cunt wont do her any favors. Personally i feel neutral, i dont particularly like her but i dont dislike her either
I'm on the fence about Kale, she is staring to grow on me but think they fucked her transformation all for the sake of fan service scenes that look cool, they should have kept her at SS2 tier and grow her from there, nobody likes a mary sue

What makes an asshole likable is subjective since while Beerus was liked in Battle of Gods, there were also many who hated him for his attitude and were not happy that he didn’t pay for anything he did. In fact, outside of being denied pudding he got everything he wanted.

And “Caulifla is a new comer that hasn't won anyone hearts yet” is factually untrue since both her and Kale are extremely popular.

[GhoulEto]

I hope and caulifla do not get the ssj3, it would be stupid.

[Li'l Lemmy]

The key difference here is that Vegeta was already an established character, with a lot history already that many people liked. When i first saw the Cell/android saga i recall thinking Vegeta why are you being such a tool? I still like you though but why? please stop kinda feel

With Caulilfla it feels more like an asshole/cunt new comer that acts like a hot shot before actually winning anyones heart, its natural people will react adversely to that

I think the mistake is that the staff or whoever believe that Caulifla being a jackass will endear her to us, so they overdo her being a total dick and for some of us, it causes the opposite of the intended effect.

Given how popular she is, I don’t think it did the opposite for the most part.

And Beerus is an even bigger dick and people loved him in Battle of Gods.

I'm not disputing how popular she may or may not be, but I'm not sure what kind of popularity it is. She has plenty of buzz, but not all of it is good. She's very controversial. So I don't know the extent of her actual popularity.

It could be quite high! I really don't know. I'm certainly no barometer for the fanbase.

[PerhapsTheOtherOne]

Being a God of Destruction doesn’t excuse you from being an asshole.

If you are going to be an asshole/cunt at least be a likeable character (which beerus is)
Caulifla is a new comer that hasnt won anyone hearts yet acting like a cunt wont do her any favors. Personally i feel neutral, i dont particularly like her but i dont dislike her either
I'm on the fence about Kale, she is staring to grow on me but think they fucked her transformation all for the sake of fan service scenes that look cool, they should have kept her at SS2 tier and grow her from there, nobody likes a mary sue

That's something I see people throw around all the time yet fail to really see at all. "Cunt" and "Mary Sue" are VERY strong words, words that really don't apply to Caulifla as a character.

Sure, she's arrogant, cocky, and self-centered, but then again, SO IS NEARLY EVERY SINGLE SAIYAN EVER. However, unlike many other Saiyans that aren't related to the main cast, she has legitimately admirable qualities like her strong friendship with Kale and belief in her ward's potential as a strong warrior, as well as a willingness to learn about how to do the cool things other Saiyans manage.

She's also not really a Mary Sue because the plot doesn't bend over backwards to accommodate her presence in the sense that nobody is worshiping her every step for how amazing she is. Everything she's accomplished, she's always made the effort even if people don't perceive it as such, such as taking note of how to go Super Saiyan in a much more economical way based on Cabba's musings on the matter and learning from a master of Super Saiyan forms (Goku) about how to use the others. Heck, she often has to put in quite a modicum of effort when she's fighting because she's explicitly not the best.

"Cunt" and "Mary Sue" are much too strong to truly apply to Caulifla. I think people need to use terminology that carries a lot less baggage. I think more appropriate descriptors would be "driven and overconfident".

[Xehanort]

As someone who does power-scale, Super Saiyan 2 Cabba would be stronger than true from Freeza. Assuming that Freeza is much stronger than base form Cabba, Freeza would have to be over 200x stronger than base form Cabba for him to stomp him.

Interesting, i'd love to know how you got to that conclusion. I'm not trying to be a douche here or question your calculations, i'm actually curious because I thought it was the opposite.

[Lord Beerus]

Caulifla could have easily said that of course she was scared, but then go on to give an inspirational speech to Kale about how despite being scared, they've still got to give it their all since U6 now rests on their shoulders. The way they wrote her this episode just sucked.

Also I find it funny how before this episode everyone acknowledged that Cabba was barely a character with barely a personality with barely a single thing interesting about him, and now all of a sudden people are like Oh Cabba's been a great character this entire time! Yeah funny how that all works now that we have an episode where he does get some character development, now all of a sudden Cabba's been a wonderfully interesting and well developed character this entire time! Who knew? Funny how that all works.

Hit already practically gave the whole "You need to keep fighting for Universe 6 despite the scenario" speech in last weeks episode. And knowing how much Hit was their ace-in-the-hole and seeing him get knocked out despite giving his all, Caulilfa wisely chose the easy route of just self motivating herself and Kale, because Gods knows they need every bit of confidence knowing what they're up against and who is left on their team.

Who has been saying that Cabba has always had a great character? I mean, for Saiyan with less traits that come with being a pure blooded Saiyan (Arrogant, energetic, a love for battle etc) Cabba is... okay. I don't really care much for him given that his character is pretty one dimensional, but he has his moments that I enjoy. I really think he's the kind of character who needs someone to pair up with.

Caulifla "wisely" chose the easy route of self motivating herself and Kale? I don't think I'd label anything Caulifla says as "wise". I don't think non-stop boasting and sucking her own dick is wise. There's a time and a place for it, but after seeing all the crazy shit that's been happening so far with people a zillion times stronger than her as well as most of her team being eliminated including Hit who is many times stronger than her, she should start to humble out a little bit and stop giving herself auto fellatio to think for a moment about what her next action is going to be other than "No worries Kale, I am literally the greatest, Jiren and Son Goku got nothin' on me." If she was saying this just to encourage Kale and give off a false sense of bravado it'd be fine, but she genuinely believes in the shit she's spewing.

Caulilfa only acted so self-reassuring and overconfident at that time because she could see how uncertain and low in moral Kale was. And a timed Kale in battle is basically dead weight. Which is something Universe 6 don't need, especially at a time like this. And knowing how much of an emotional crutch Kale is to her, she basically told Kale she can still get stronger and their universe can still have a chance to survive, and it gave Kale the confidence boost she needed. She never displays any delusion of being stronger than Goku or Jiren. She never talks about how she beating Jiren or Goku or anything like that. She just has the confidence she can still become more powerful than she already is.

[HeroR]

I think the mistake is that the staff or whoever believe that Caulifla being a jackass will endear her to us, so they overdo her being a total dick and for some of us, it causes the opposite of the intended effect.

Given how popular she is, I don’t think it did the opposite for the most part.

And Beerus is an even bigger dick and people loved him in Battle of Gods.

I'm not disputing how popular she may or may not be, but I'm not sure what kind of popularity it is. She has plenty of buzz, but not all of it is good. She's very controversial. So I don't know the extent of her actual popularity.

It could be quite high! I really don't know. I'm certainly no barometer for the fanbase.

So? Never stopped Broly.

As someone who does power-scale, Super Saiyan 2 Cabba would be stronger than true from Freeza. Assuming that Freeza is much stronger than base form Cabba, Freeza would have to be over 200x stronger than base form Cabba for him to stomp him.

Interesting, i'd love to know how you got to that conclusion. I'm not trying to be a douche here or question your calculations, i'm actually curious because I thought it was the opposite.

Super Saiyan 2 is officially a 200x multiplier of a Saiyan base form. Cabba back in the Champa Saga was stated by Vegeta to be an even match in base form. In Resurrection ‘F’, base form Vegeta and Goku were above true form Freeza. So Champa Saga Cabba > Resurrection ‘F’ Saga Freeza.

Freeza got stronger through mental training which seemed to allow him to surpassed base form Cabba who also got stronger. So true form Freeza > a tired base form Cabba.

However, unless Freeza is over 200x stronger than an exhausted base form Freeza than Super Saiyan 2 > true form Freeza.

Hope that helps.

[Username2016]

Being a God of Destruction doesn’t excuse you from being an asshole.

Beerus isn't an asshole though

And neither is Caulifla, really. She's mostly just overly confident in herself, much like Goku or Vegeta. Which makes sense, being a Saiyan and all.

A lot of people around here seem to conflate a bad attitude with a bad character, at least from how I'm perceiving what's being posted. I've seen the same sort of thing with Vegeta, where people say he's somehow regressed as a character when the only thing that's really notably negative is his attitude, and even then it's nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be.

Saiyans don't have to be as arrogant as Caulifla though, just like at Cabba and Kale.

Caulifla is just a power digger. Sure you can like her, but I don't

[SansrivaaL]

I wouldnt call Cauli a cunt nor a Mary Sue, she’s just a deluded brat.
This is quite rich coming from me tho as I call all fictional female characters a “bitch”

[Boo Machine]

I'm not disputing how popular she may or may not be, but I'm not sure what kind of popularity it is. She has plenty of buzz, but not all of it is good. She's very controversial. So I don't know the extent of her actual popularity.

It could be quite high! I really don't know. I'm certainly no barometer for the fanbase.

Caulifla is far from what I would consider "controversial".

She is mean, and is stronger than a select few people would like. That's about as worst as she got, and I'd have to reach pretty hard to call it controversial.

[HeroR]

Yeah despite Beerus later coming off as an asshole which is why I want Goku or Vegeta to lay the smackdown on him one of these days, he wasnt an asshole who overhypes himself when he first showed up, he was actually calm and sort of graceful, Goku was the one mocking him when he said should he powerdown to 2 for him, and to top that Beerus is the GoD, its not that the title gives him the leeway to act like an asshole but he has the power to back it up, Cauli does not, she’s just a little brat still learning but she overhypes herself to something she clearly is not, Anyways it seems Vegeta isnt the only deluded character in that ring anymore, Cauli surpassed him, that little girl needs some heavy reality check on where she stands, que Freea quick!

In the retelling, Beerus was an asshole, especially to Vegeta, who threw his title in everyone faces. In many ways, he wasn’t that different from Saiyan Saga Vegeta.

Cali can only surpassed Vegeta if she decides to go after Jiren. And I remember when fans wanted the Pride Troopers to teach Cali a lesson when she called them wimps and she and Kale ended up knocked out five of them.

Beerus isn't an asshole though

And neither is Caulifla, really. She's mostly just overly confident in herself, much like Goku or Vegeta. Which makes sense, being a Saiyan and all.

A lot of people around here seem to conflate a bad attitude with a bad character, at least from how I'm perceiving what's being posted. I've seen the same sort of thing with Vegeta, where people say he's somehow regressed as a character when the only thing that's really notably negative is his attitude, and even then it's nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be.

Saiyans don't have to be as arrogant as Caulifla though, just like at Cabba and Kale.

Caulifla is just a power digger. Sure you can like her, but I don't

And people don’t like them for being weak and even call Cabba a pussy.

[Xehanort]

Super Saiyan 2 is officially a 200x multiplier of a Saiyan base form. Cabba back in the Champa Saga was stated by Vegeta to be an even match in base form. In Resurrection ‘F’, base form Vegeta and Goku were above true form Freeza. So Champa Saga Cabba > Resurrection ‘F’ Saga Freeza.

Freeza got stronger through mental training which seemed to allow him to surpassed base form Cabba who also got stronger. So true form Freeza > a tired base form Cabba.

However, unless Freeza is over 200x stronger than an exhausted base form Freeza than Super Saiyan 2 > true form Freeza.

Hope that helps.

Yeah i've seen the "official" numbers and multipliers being debunked a lot on the internet, but for a basic understanding it did help me understand it better and it seems to be a plausible explanation for Freeza turning Gold at that moment to me. I gotta stay more informed about power-scaling.

[Asura]

Hit already practically gave the whole "You need to keep fighting for Universe 6 despite the scenario" speech in last weeks episode. And knowing how much Hit was their ace-in-the-hole and seeing him get knocked out despite giving his all, Caulilfa wisely chose the easy route of just self motivating herself and Kale, because Gods knows they need every bit of confidence knowing what they're up against and who is left on their team.

Who has been saying that Cabba has always had a great character? I mean, for Saiyan with less traits that come with being a pure blooded Saiyan (Arrogant, energetic, a love for battle etc) Cabba is... okay. I don't really care much for him given that his character is pretty one dimensional, but he has his moments that I enjoy. I really think he's the kind of character who needs someone to pair up with.

Caulifla "wisely" chose the easy route of self motivating herself and Kale? I don't think I'd label anything Caulifla says as "wise". I don't think non-stop boasting and sucking her own dick is wise. There's a time and a place for it, but after seeing all the crazy shit that's been happening so far with people a zillion times stronger than her as well as most of her team being eliminated including Hit who is many times stronger than her, she should start to humble out a little bit and stop giving herself auto fellatio to think for a moment about what her next action is going to be other than "No worries Kale, I am literally the greatest, Jiren and Son Goku got nothin' on me." If she was saying this just to encourage Kale and give off a false sense of bravado it'd be fine, but she genuinely believes in the shit she's spewing.

Caulilfa only acted so self-reassuring and overconfident at that time because she could see how uncertain and low in moral Kale was. And a timed Kale in battle is basically dead weight. Which is something Universe 6 don't need, especially at a time like this. And knowing how much of an emotional crutch Kale is to her, she basically told Kale she can still get stronger and their universe can still have a chance to survive, and it gave Kale the confidence boost she needed. She never displays any delusion of being stronger than Goku or Jiren. She never talks about how she beating Jiren or Goku or anything like that. She just has the confidence she can still become more powerful than she already is.

Your assumption that Caulifla was saying all of this solely just to boost Kale's morale and not satisfy her own ego is just that, an assumption. Based on what we already know about Caulifla and what she said, she's purely just indulging in her own ego. There are a million ways they could have shot that scene that implied Caulifla was saying it just for Kale's sake, but they didn't go that direction. Instead they decided to make Caulifla even more egotistical than Vegeta (quite the accomplishment!) in a situation that sure as hell didn't call for it. Like I said, if it was false bravado to make Kale not scared then it would have been fine, more than fine actually since that's what they should have done. Nope, instead they have to make Caulifla look bad.

[Li'l Lemmy]

I'm not disputing how popular she may or may not be, but I'm not sure what kind of popularity it is. She has plenty of buzz, but not all of it is good. She's very controversial. So I don't know the extent of her actual popularity.

It could be quite high! I really don't know. I'm certainly no barometer for the fanbase.

Caulifla is far from what I would consider "controversial".

She is mean, and is stronger than a select few people would like. That's about as worst as she got, and I'd have to reach pretty hard to call it controversial.

Well, not necessarily controversial in terms of content, but she certainly seems to be a divisive figure. She is either beloved or loathed, from what I can tell. The fandom is definitely split open with regard to Caulifla and, to a lesser extent, Kale. Maybe not as much as I tend to think, but there's definitely an effect.