Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Individual discussions for each episode of Dragon Ball Super.

Moderators: Kanzenshuu Staff, General Help

Dbzfan94
I Live Here
Posts: 4916
Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2013 5:16 pm
Location: Mt. Paozu

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by Dbzfan94 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:19 pm

HybridSaiyan wrote:That point blank range Kamehameha should've done more damage, just saiyan.

The one against Cell blew off his entire upper body.
Honestly I'm surprised they didnt get killed. Big complaint about Super is that there's barely any battle damage

User avatar
LightBing
I Live Here
Posts: 3468
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:47 am

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by LightBing » Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:25 pm

Very enjoyable episode. The fight was pretty good, that last dodge and Kamehameha was excellent.

It's was a fine conclusion to this fight. Fight that like I said before dragged. I wonder how this will advance from him, Goku is extremely fatigued and he wasn't even able to master the offensive of Ultra Instinct and there's 17 minutes left.
I honestly hope he doesn't make it. I know he's a prodigy but learning something most Gods can't master in what, 20 minutes?

I'm welcoming other fighters participating in the next episode. Let's see what Universe 2 has too offer. Power of love go!

Dbzfan94
I Live Here
Posts: 4916
Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2013 5:16 pm
Location: Mt. Paozu

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by Dbzfan94 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:38 pm

I guess everyone who was so sure that Caulifla and/or Kale would be one of the last remaining are pretty quiet right now.

Melab
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 11:14 pm

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by Melab » Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:57 pm

I want to like Kale and Caulifla, but I happened to love Kefla. Her flare and her ambition are awesome. I was thinking she was going to SS3 during her last power up. It's distressing that the Namekians are the ones who are left. I wanted Kefla (or Kale and Caulifla) to stay around until the end of the tournament. The Namekians are just meh.

TheShadowEmperor8055
Regular
Posts: 717
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 3:36 pm

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by TheShadowEmperor8055 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:20 pm

That being said, Caulifla/Kale/Kafla don’t hurt me like it seems to do with a portion of the fan base. But I do think Kafla is one of the most senselessly overpowered characters ever. Super just has this habit of overpowering or underpowering (or sometimes both) characters in a given situation for the sake of the narrative. I know it happens in a lot of fiction, but it still nonetheless looks worse in Dragon Ball.

Still Ultra Instinct for days tho 8)

User avatar
PerhapsTheOtherOne
I Live Here
Posts: 2034
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 5:55 pm

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:24 pm

TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote:That being said, Caulifla/Kale/Kafla don’t hurt me like it seems to do with a portion of the fan base. But I do think Kafla is one of the most senselessly overpowered characters ever. Super just has this habit of overpowering or underpowering (or sometimes both) characters in a given situation for the sake of the narrative. I know it happens in a lot of fiction, but it still nonetheless looks worse in Dragon Ball.

Still Ultra Instinct for days tho 8)
Looking at your avatar....... Ultra Instinct just looks SO MUCH BETTER on blue-undershirt Goku.

User avatar
dbgtFO
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 7737
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2010 5:07 pm
Contact:

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by dbgtFO » Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:37 pm

Everything great, that needs to be said about this episode has been said, so I'll get right to my major talking point, the fact, that there was a lack of overt violence in this episode.
Yes Kafla haters get the satisfaction of her finally being knocked out and generally getting her butt kicked, but every hit that comes from Goku punching or kicking her is either a zoomed out shot or cleverly cut, so we only see the aftermath of the hit, ie Kafla being flung threw the air.
On the other hand, Kafla managing to block one of Goku's hits gets a zoomed in shot and it stays on the screen for quite some time. A certain bias creeping in from the animators perhaps? It reminds me a little bit of the Vegeta vs Frost at the last tournament with the hit not actually being shown, instead getting an impact frame instead, but this is quite different still.
I just find it jarring to go from the previous episodes, where Goku gets his face smashed in and other stuff, but it isn't returned in kind, when Goku now is in the driving seat, diminishing the impact of his hits. Of course maybe that was intentional to go with the whole idea, that his attacks are actually kind of weak, so who knows..

Jigurashi
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1176
Joined: Sun May 14, 2017 2:57 pm

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by Jigurashi » Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:43 pm

OLKv3 wrote:Now that it's finally over, rate Goku vs Caulifla/Kale/Kefla
I liked 113 and loved both 114 and 116. 115 was meh. Overall, they were two fun fights. Goku's last 3 fights (VS Jiren, VS Caulifla + Kale, VS Kefla) have all been 2-partners and are easily my favorite fights in this tournament. Some of the most epic, fun, and creative fights in DB in my opinion. I was thoroughly entertained with those fights.

TheShadowEmperor8055
Regular
Posts: 717
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 3:36 pm

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by TheShadowEmperor8055 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:53 pm

If Vegeta ever gets Ultra Instinct, it’s gonna be completely harder for him to get it and then master it than Gokū, given the former’s tendency to overthink and the form’s emphasis on not thinking. Hmm...

Tombstone1988
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 185
Joined: Sat Jul 08, 2017 6:18 pm

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by Tombstone1988 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 2:21 pm

OLKv3 wrote:Now that it's finally over, rate Goku vs Caulifla/Kale/Kefla
Episodes 114 and 116 were good, but episodes 113 and 115 were very poor. Much of the reason just has to do with pacing/padding. There is WAY too much cutting to the sidelines for talking that is usually useless. There are certain comments, such as Whis describing Ultra Instinct, that are helpful to have. Others are just completely pointless fluff: "Hey, those lasers Kefla's firing are really powerful!" If we were always cutting to pertinent information or cutting to other fights, like Gohan and Piccolo against the Universe 6 Namekians, it wouldn't be as much of a problem. This isn't the case. If you can very easily edit two episodes down to make one solid, cohesive episode... just do so. This fight would have worked much better as 2.5 episodes (have Goku vs. Caulifla be the second half of an episode, then Goku vs. Caulifla and Kale, then Goku vs. Kefla).
JazzMazz wrote:Let me clear myself up.

I'm fine with them having this massive battle in the tournament, but narratively its a useless fight that does little to change the setting or circumstances and doesn't flow onto anything bigger. This fight would have been a great way to lead onto Jiren fighting Goku, instead, we're just going to get several more episodes of Goku getting his ass handed to him and recovering his stamina, which feels really out of place considering that we just had Goku getting his ass handed to him and recovering his stamina.

I'm just saying the placement of the fight doesn't really help progress the story and doesn't really lead into anything despite how much time was spent on it. Thats my main problem with it.
I agree, as this is one of the other major issues with the fight. This fight feels like a 3rd act fight, yet I'm fairly sure we're still in the 2nd act of the tournament. The next episode preview has three fighters ganging up on a tired Goku. Almost feels familiar... like this exact thing happened in episode 112 or something...
"If you notice this and understand that it's flawed and just don't let it bother you, that's perfectly fine. But enjoying a flawed movie and calling a movie flawless are two completely different things."

-Adam from YourMovieSucksDOTorg
(Replace "movie" with "DBS episode" and that's pretty much my thoughts in regards to DBS critique)

User avatar
Venus
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 123
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2016 11:40 am

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by Venus » Sun Nov 19, 2017 2:29 pm

I don't know what to say honestly, this episode was epic, epic as hell, Goku's Kame-Hame-Ha was just awesome darn, I'm happy to see the U6 Saiyans being taken out, not because I hate them, but thanks to that, we are going to see other interesting fights.

I believe the U6 Namekians have something up their sleeve, otherwise I doubt that Toei would have them be the very last ones standing of U6.

Ribrianne next week :thumbdown:, however I like her when she is not transformed, so I'm looking forward to her new power up next week, hopefully it's a new transformation where she looks much better than in her teletubbie form.

User avatar
Daimo-Rukiri
I'm pretty cozy, here...
Posts: 1529
Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2009 11:44 am
Location: U..S..A..

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by Daimo-Rukiri » Sun Nov 19, 2017 2:43 pm

Awesome episode, now just another episode to finally and hopefully get rid of Ribrianne and then we finally can "hopefully" continue the tournament.

I don't get the Cell comparison, sure the same blast would kill Cell but the same amount of exerted ki in comparison is not as remember if he did exert the same amount of force as he did with Cell sure Kefla would die but he'd also get disqualified as well...
Steam: Rukiri89 | uPlay: Rukiri89 | Origin: XxRukiriXx | Xbox LIVE: XxRUKIRIxX89 | PSN: Ericks1989 | Nintendo Network ID: Rukiri

Dragon Ball Hero's Spirit development blog - An Action-RPG coming soon to monitor near you!
https://dragonball-hs.tumblr.com/

User avatar
MajinMan
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1225
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2014 3:42 am
Location: Los Angeles

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by MajinMan » Sun Nov 19, 2017 3:41 pm

sintzu wrote:
MajinMan wrote:
If they weren't above Vegetto's level from 5 arcs ago, then there would be no point in any of this. Hell, Goku still made Kafla look like a fool in the end. I don't see how this is a problem in the slightest.
Both went from not knowing what a ssj was to being able to give UI Goku a challenge, so much so that he would've been a mess if he got hit by her attack.

How on earth is that not a problem ? That'd be like Saiyan arc goku and vegeta doing that.
They quite clearly did not challenge Ultra Instinct. The reason they even had a slight chance was only because Goku was low on energy and didn't even have good control over it. And who's both? Kale and Caulifla didn't challenge it, their potara fusion did. And no, it's not like Saiyan arc Goku and Vegeta. They were introduced as characters with high potential and power, way above anything those two were capable of in that arc.
Heroes come and go, but legends are forever.

60.

User avatar
Zillamon51
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 180
Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2012 12:30 pm
Location: S.E. Michigan
Contact:

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by Zillamon51 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 3:44 pm

After drifting off to sleep last night, I was awakened by a great disturbance in geekdom. A nerdgasmic howl of joy emanating from basements and game rooms, sweeping the globe from East to West.

This morning, I found out why: Two prominent Mary Sues of obnoxious stature had finally fallen. :clap: :wave: :thumbup:

Seriously though, I have warmed up to the pair since the beginning of the actual ToP. Caulifla's enthusiasm and desire to learn were endearing, and Kale's initial rampage was pretty awesome. But their time had come, and I'm happy to move on.

I have no love for Ribrianne and co., though. That shtick wore out long ago. She's gotta go next week.
"...It’s still going to be the same sort of easy-to-understand content as always." - Akira Toriyama, on transitioning from DBZ to DBS.

"Just repeat to yourself, It's just a show,
I should really just relax..." - MST3K theme song

Gig
Beyond-the-Beyond Newbie
Posts: 394
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 3:24 am

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by Gig » Sun Nov 19, 2017 4:41 pm

A thing which is puzzling me is why Goku isn't capable of using UI during attacking now (which leads to less effective attacks), while in previous fight with Jiren he didn't seem to have this limit.. :-/

User avatar
PerhapsTheOtherOne
I Live Here
Posts: 2034
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 5:55 pm

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Sun Nov 19, 2017 4:47 pm

Gig wrote:A thing which is puzzling me is why Goku isn't capable of using UI during attacking now (which leads to less effective attacks), while in previous fight with Jiren he didn't seem to have this limit.. :-/
It could be that Goku was fully in "Ultra Instinct mode" then and had absolutely no control over it, but here he managed to awaken it on his own and thus had some manner of control over it, which is a BAD thing in this case.

Ironic, really. The greatest power seen yet, and it requires that you let go of all control over your body and allow it to fight for you.

User avatar
Kaiosama
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 267
Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:03 am

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by Kaiosama » Sun Nov 19, 2017 5:19 pm

emperior wrote:This episode was awesome. Ultra Instinct is as great as it always is, and that Kamehameha was one of the best in the franchise.
I liked how Vegeta remembered about Whis’ teachings. I think he will be able to use the offensive UI, and I could see him and Goku working together to beat Jiren.
I’m very curious about Brianne’s new transformation, and I wonder what will Gohan and Freeza do. I would like to see Gohan being the one to master UI first.
Vegeta getting UI in this tourney would be an unforgivable asspull and destroy this arc. Horrible writing. This arc is supposed to be about Goku completing the work of the Gods. Vegeta has a big problem with overthinking and being too tense while fighting, where Goku does not, so this is a technique/form that Vegeta is incompatible for (which will be demonstrated next episode when he fails miserably to obtain UI and gets attacked by the power ranger). Goku needs to master UI to fight Jiren. This arc is Goku. The show IS Goku. Vegeta doesn't deserve anymore handouts. He's historically not compatible with this technique, and it would awful writing if they changed that out of the blue.

User avatar
mfwlegend3
Regular
Posts: 639
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2017 7:00 am

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by mfwlegend3 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 5:20 pm

Dbzfan94 wrote:I guess everyone who was so sure that Caulifla and/or Kale would be one of the last remaining are pretty quiet right now.
Who REALLY thought they would make it out of that fight without being eliminated? Not only were they fighting UI Goku, but they also had Freeza spectating the fight while waiting for his turn. Their fates were sealed.

Dbzfan94
I Live Here
Posts: 4916
Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2013 5:16 pm
Location: Mt. Paozu

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by Dbzfan94 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 7:24 pm

mfwlegend3 wrote:
Dbzfan94 wrote:I guess everyone who was so sure that Caulifla and/or Kale would be one of the last remaining are pretty quiet right now.
Who REALLY thought they would make it out of that fight without being eliminated? Not only were they fighting UI Goku, but they also had Freeza spectating the fight while waiting for his turn. Their fates were sealed.
I mean loooong before the UI Goku VS Kefla was even announced.

Around ep100 people kept saying Cauli and/or Kale would be in the top 10. I'm not going through thousands of posts but I saw it quite a few times.

User avatar
Asura
I'm pretty cozy, here...
Posts: 1919
Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2010 8:53 pm

Re: Super Episode 116 (19 November 2017)

Post by Asura » Sun Nov 19, 2017 7:35 pm

Zillamon51 wrote:Two prominent Mary Sues of obnoxious stature had finally fallen. :clap: :wave: :thumbup:
You mean the Mary Sues who could barely manage to outclass an exhausted, near staminaless SSJ2 Goku in a 2v1? Those Mary Sues? Yeah they sure were perfect in every shape and form weren't they? :D
Dbzfan94 wrote:
mfwlegend3 wrote:
Dbzfan94 wrote:I guess everyone who was so sure that Caulifla and/or Kale would be one of the last remaining are pretty quiet right now.
Who REALLY thought they would make it out of that fight without being eliminated? Not only were they fighting UI Goku, but they also had Freeza spectating the fight while waiting for his turn. Their fates were sealed.
I mean loooong before the UI Goku VS Kefla was even announced.

Around ep100 people kept saying Cauli and/or Kale would be in the top 10. I'm not going through thousands of posts but I saw it quite a few times.
People also said Hit was going to be one of the last ones remaining too. What's your point exactly?

Post Reply