Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by jeffbr92 » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:24 am

8bitdee wrote:I think a lot of people suffer from the nostalgia-glasses effect where they think back on DBZ and remember it having a grander than life plot and expect DBS to be the same. When in fact, DBZ was just the same as DBS: "a visual, super powered spectacle to sell merchandise first and foremost" with a so-so narrative.
"Nostalgia" is also a bad argument, fans nowadays know how flawed DB and Z were back then, that doesn't mean we shouldn't expect Super to be better in that expect.
Miracles wrote:
TBMx wrote:My feeling on episode 130:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykmZp5cgbkU

Mindless flash with no story is tedious.
Your first Dragonball episode, congratulations! :lol:
If it's that so. Why are you still here if you think this series is fully composed of mindless flash with no story? lol
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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by Miracles » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:26 am

jeffbr92 wrote:If it's that so. Why are you still here if you think this series is fully composed of mindless flash with no story? lol
I'm here for what Dragonball always been about. The flash and action. The story is always simple in Dragonball.
Barring Zamasu's character, something even Toriyama admitted was new for him.
Last edited by Miracles on Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:34 am, edited 7 times in total.
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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by Professor Freeza » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:26 am

jeffbr92 wrote:
8bitdee wrote:I think a lot of people suffer from the nostalgia-glasses effect where they think back on DBZ and remember it having a grander than life plot and expect DBS to be the same. When in fact, DBZ was just the same as DBS: "a visual, super powered spectacle to sell merchandise first and foremost" with a so-so narrative.
"Nostalgia" is also a bad argument, fans nowadays know how flawed DB and Z were back then, that doesn't mean we shouldn't expect Super to be better in that expect.

No. Nostalgia is a very potent argument. Honestly if DB or Z aired today for the first time, it would be SLAUGHTERED.

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by TBMx » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:27 am

RIP_Power_Levels wrote:I don’t understand why some are letting Super’s narrative, character development, plot, etc weigh it down so much in their opinion. For a lot of shows I watch I do value these aspects, just not for Dragon Ball. Why? Because this show is meant to be eye candy first. This isn’t Game of Thrones (admittedly one of the best shows ever made). It’s supposed to be a visual, super powered spectacle to sell merchandise first and foremost, and this episode delivered on that goal spectacularly. If Super had a great narrative I would love this show even more, fantastic. If it doesn’t, I won’t let it bother me and cause me to hate the show. As long as the narrative is so-so I’m happy. I don’t watch this show every week to have a large helping of character and narrative development (which shows like Game of Thrones pull off so well they engross me), I watch every week to set my brain aside for thirty minutes and just enjoy the show for what it is. It’s why millions have watched and loved this show.

On topic, I loved this episode. The animation throughout was stellar, and I’d like to especially commend Tate, as this was his best work so far. To me Tate’s work in this episode came the most naturally and fluidly compared to previous episodes. I did NOT expect 17 to still be alive, and my first reaction was hype. Just one more episode for the series seems a bit rushed to wrap everything up, but I hope it’s pulled off well.
Why even have a story at all then? This should have just been a Natoshi Shida demo reel. Which is basically what it was. All the commentary and story was an irrelevant burden. They beat each other up and Frieza shows up. Didn't need any dialogue at all. Roll preview, next episode. That's all it needed.

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by Asura » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:27 am

Absolutely amazing, I have almost no words. I was going to skip coming here until after the finale to avoid spoilers, but after seeing episode 130 I couldn't help myself. Fucking fantastic!

However, I've got to be honest, Android 17 still being alive and in the ring is so laughably stupid. In fact, I laughed my ass off thinking of those conspiracy theories of Hit and Android 17 hiding out, still uneliminated in the arena.
The final episode being a Freeza/17 team-up to stop Jiren is so mindblowingly bizarre, but I love it.

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by MajinMan » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:28 am

Best animated episode of all time. That’s really all that needs to be said.
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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by Dbzfan94 » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:30 am

ToshioWrites wrote:
Dbzfan94 wrote:
Doctor. wrote: Did you miss all the complaints when it happened to Vegeta too?
Absolutely not. I was one of the people complaining.
One time was fine, but they did it 5 times in the span of 3 episodes.
Vegeta didn't have 5 flashbacks to his FAMILY

He flashed to cabba in 123

He thought about cabba and his family in 126

He thought about bulma and cabba in 128

he thought about his family twice. Anyways the director of dbs said this week , vegeta is more of a family man than goku so i'd expect more vegeta flashbacks than goku thinking about chichi and his sons
He still had those same flashbacks over and over when one was plenty. They beat it into the ground to get emotion which ended up doing the reverse for me.

Vegeta being a "Family man" is only a new thing in DBS and they go the opposite direction with Goku. In Z filler he had nightmares about his family getting killed so idk why they couldnt flash to Chichi and Goten for 15 seconds or so.

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by 8bitdee » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:31 am

jeffbr92 wrote:
8bitdee wrote:I think a lot of people suffer from the nostalgia-glasses effect where they think back on DBZ and remember it having a grander than life plot and expect DBS to be the same. When in fact, DBZ was just the same as DBS: "a visual, super powered spectacle to sell merchandise first and foremost" with a so-so narrative.
"Nostalgia" is also a bad argument, fans nowadays know how flawed DB and Z were back then, that doesn't mean we shouldn't expect Super to be better in that expect.
You can hope that is better, but you shouldn't expect it to be. We have been given no reason to expect better when it's always been flawed.

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by jeffbr92 » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:33 am

Professor Freeza wrote:No. Nostalgia is a very potent argument. Honestly if DB or Z aired today for the first time, it would be SLAUGHTERED.
So you're quoting the wrong person as I'm not blind due nostalgia.
8bitdee wrote:You can hope that is better, but you shouldn't expect it to be. We have been given no reason to expect better when it's always been flawed.
Why not? I don't see why a TV show can not evolve to be better than what was on its past days.
Last edited by jeffbr92 on Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by Nickolaidas » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:33 am

*sees 17*

Fucking.

Called it.

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by Dbzfan94 » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:34 am

Welp i can safely say that i 100% called 17 being alive. Saw it coming from a mile away

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by Miracles » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:37 am

Professor Freeza wrote:No. Nostalgia is a very potent argument. Honestly if DB or Z aired today for the first time, it would be SLAUGHTERED.
No way. As this cupcake generation would of absolutely loved the growth of Gohan's character throughout Saiyan saga, The touching death of Piccolo shielding Gohan, The Yamcha burial scene with the back to the camera would of been used over the net. I could go on but DB and Z would do very well today. :lol:
Dbzfan94 wrote:Welp i can safely say that i 100% called 17 being alive. Saw it coming from a mile away
Congrats man. You know somebody at TOEI?
Last edited by Miracles on Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by MIDI 1138 » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:38 am

More generic shonen narratives that I witness in this show. More than the black arc or the previous tournament. I was genuinely interested to see if this episode of Super would possibly strive to be better than usual but of course I was incorrect in my assumption. Other than the superficiality of "muh animation" being amazing(I dislike the cinematography greatly whenever the frames moves frantically consistently and it doesn't stop to give you stills to breath it in a bit except for the shitty master shots of the redundant crew who commentates the match) the entirety of the thematic purpose of of "Episdoe 30" has just been getting weaker and weaker. With no stakes on the line, all it amounts to is Jiren and Goku fighting. There just isn't anything there.

The worst of it is when 17 came back. It's almost as if this anime loves to ruin sacrifices. Repeating of Majin Vegeta and now this...

Same as the last or 100...

I just want to see the ending to this show because specific aspects had peaked my inherent interest, which is slowly dying.

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by OverHeaven » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:40 am

Turambar wrote:..........and that is why Dragon Ball is the best Shounen anime of all time.
Nope, let's not get ahead of ourselves.
The episode was great only due to action and animation. (okay, I do hope this is not the only thing that you care about)
Last edited by OverHeaven on Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:45 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by Professor Freeza » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:40 am

Miracles wrote:
Professor Freeza wrote:No. Nostalgia is a very potent argument. Honestly if DB or Z aired today for the first time, it would be SLAUGHTERED.
No way. As this cupcake generation would of absolutely loved the growth of Gohan's character throughout Saiyan saga, The touching death of Piccolo shielding Gohan, The Yamcha burial scene with the back to the camera would of been used over the net. I could go on but DB and Z would do very well today. :lol:

You are joking right????


A post was made a few months ago here about how DBZ would be slaughtered today.

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by Extreme_kai » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:41 am

jeffbr92 wrote:They could have done better... Still with Jiren blasting Goku off the stage, but then having Freeza to blast Jiren on his back to also fall of the ring. We could end this god damn episode with Freeza being the last man standing, but no they have to include #17 in every way possible and even worst prolong the battle unnecessarily.
That has to be my biggest complaint about this episode, it's just unnecessary padding for the sake of padding. Unneeded padding, a second fake out death attack with no real impact, and only one more episode left? I'm strongly thinking we may get a cliffhanger at this point, which is not what I want.

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by Morbidden » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:41 am

Man, I don't really know what to say.

Dragon Ball fans really do not know how to put themselves in the shoes of the characters that are portrayed on the screen. Let's speak a little bit about Jiren from this episode. In defence of Jiren:

They humanized Jiren so much in this episode, and in my opinion, it was the best thing to happen to his character. I mean let's look at Jiren and how he has been portrayed:

In short: Jiren is strong and conflicted.

So...

Ever since we learned his cookie-cutter backstory (I am not going to include my own headcanon where Jiren has a dissociative personality disorder and was the one who killed everyone in his own backstory, without knowing) Jiren has been shown to have a sore spot when topics of trust and friendship come out.

Jiren, in essence, is a self-made man. Due to him losing his parents, his master and his friends, and the subsequent betrayal of his surviving friends left him jaded. Jiren from that point on lived with a conviction: ''Strength above everything, strength will never betray you.''

Jiren as a character is a bit of a paradox in a sense that he seems to yearn for bonds with people (thus becoming Pride Trooper) but is so afraid of losing said bonds so he goes as far as pushing them away himself. He seems a bit damaged on the inside having both trust and abandonment issues. Jiren knows he has ''friends'' now with the Pride Troopers but almost certainly thinks they would all abandon him if he lost. He also probably thinks that this is NORMAL and would happen to others as well.

In 130 Jiren just cannot comprehend this bond that Goku has with others. And goes as far as trying to make a point by attacking them. But here is the kicker, is Jiren an asshole for doing this? I mean he has to be right? What reason would there possibly be for him doing this? But yeah, he is totally an asshole, right?

No...

But is Jiren irrational? I would say so, but then again: Jiren is under a lot of PRESSURE. And he is getting his reverse scale poked at, his whole ideology in life is being challenged by a guy who doesn't know ANYTHING about him, not to mention he is getting hurt and he is feeling pain. Since when has Jiren felt physical pain? How many years has it been for him? If you cannot see all of this from JIren's POV I don't even know what to say. Jiren is like a kid who loses his parents and has other kids (Goku and the peanut gallery) come to him and telling how great time they are having with their parents.

But then again. If Jiren's attack landed on the bleachers, then what? If Jiren won, Goku's friends and family would die anyway. So Jiren ain't technically doing anything wrong here. It has never been said in the rules the audience cannot be attacked, it is just that the audience cannot intervene. In the end, after Goku was about to finish him off Jiren begrudgingly accepted his fate and what Goku was saying to him, even turning his head away.

Jiren knows that his views are wrong and he knows that Goku is getting the strength to protect those who he cares about due to the bonds he has formed with them. But Jiren doesn't have any of that and he cannot relate to anything Goku is saying.

In conclusion: Jiren's character is practically a mirror of Goku's. Goku had Dragon Balls, Jiren didn't. To Jiren death is real and final. To Goku, it is a regular day. Both of them love fighting, but one of them has been shafted enough for him to become jaded. But even so, at the end when Jiren is about to finish Goku off he doesn't sound malicious towards him at all.

In short: Jiren is fine.

Edit: Shit, my first post, defending Jiren...
Last edited by Morbidden on Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by sintzu » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:43 am

Kaiosama wrote:Vegeta has officially been surpassed in importance in the series by Frieza and 17. Who would have thought.
No one, you're the only one who thinks that. :lol:
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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by precita » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:44 am

Hyena_Yamcha wrote:Am i the only one who's bothered with them not mentioning Yamcha at all in this episode ?
They show Yamcha in the group shot in Roshi's glasses when he was talking about all the friends Goku was fighting for.

Interesting enough Mr. Satan and Buu weren't in that shot, I guess Goku doesn't care about them as much. :lol:

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Re: Super Episode 130 (18 March 2018)

Post by sintzu » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:45 am

Kaiosama wrote: You're just salty that 17 and Freeza have surpassed Vegeta in importance in the narrative for this tournament. Times are changing bud.
Can you remind us again who took down Toppo and who was nearly killed by him ?
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