Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by p-hyvo » Sun Nov 24, 2019 10:11 pm

Hugo Boss wrote:
Fri Oct 25, 2019 1:12 pm
SS Gogeta from Dragon Ball GT would probably be stronger than SS Gogeta from Dragon Ball Super, so he might be able to rival Omega Shenron.
Definitely not, no way.
By scaling and feats, ssj gogeta dbs>ssj4 gogeta gt by a long shot.
I mean, nobody in gt is even stronger than uio1 goku by feats.
We are talking about a gogeta that in base is arguably stronger than a ssb, form stronger than ssj god, who's definitely stronger than ssj4 by a lot, while in gt base gogeta wasn't even n near to a ssj4 in power, being just dozens of times base goku.
In dbs : broly fusion has been powered up to exaggeration, Like in dbs manga.
Now base fusion >ssb, meanwhile in z and gt base fusion<<<ssj4 , fusion being capable to sustain a fight with ssj4 only if it was a ssj potara fusion.
Not to mention that then god>>>old fusion ssj3>old fusion ssj>=ssj4, and now base fusion>ssb>>>god
I feel like if i Say here where do i get numerically with dbgt/dbs Power levels, someone will get a stroke.
Better to not talk about dragon ball heroes ones, i swear
Lol

Also i don't wanna be rude, even if i know i can seem It sometimes. I'm Just too harsh in some occasions, that's It. I can't control that. Is not that i want to be and asshole or mean to you, i Simply don't know how to Say what i think i other ways .Just clarifying

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Grand Marshal 1 » Mon Nov 25, 2019 5:17 am

p-hyvo wrote:
Sun Nov 24, 2019 10:01 pm
Shintoki wrote:
Sat Nov 23, 2019 12:28 pm
SS4 Gogeta was said to be dozens of times stronger than an SS4 whom itself was compared to SS vegito. combine that with the filler/films scaling and you pretty much have a solid case that SS4 gogeta > beerus (universal?)
Well yes, but actually no.
Ok, he's universal, no doubt and no argue, but he's not beerus level.
Feats wise, all the strongest characters in dbs are stronger than anyone in gt.
I mean, people like jiren , kefla and god toppo shakes an infinite space, no one in gt can really replicate that counting that not omega nor gogeta even shook the normal universe, which isn't infinite.
Not saying they can't, if base goku could in s17 arc they definitely can, but still that's far from shaking something infinite by various degrees.
Imo beerus>>ssbE vegeta >=god toppo>>>>ssj2b skefla >uio1 goku>= suppressed jiren >>>>everyone in gt

Personally, I put omega shenron between merged zamasu halo and merged zamasu corrupted, and I have ssj4 gogeta = ssb vegeth x3
Like :
Gogeta 180
Vegeth 60
Merged zamasu, corrupted 50
Omega 14
Ssj4s 1

Obviously is just an opinion of mine. You are free to dissent
I completely agree with the notion that GT peaks at mid/late FT arc. Not sure how I would scale Gogeta 4, but I am certain that he is at least, at least, as powerful as Blue KK×10 Goku. Although at this point, Omega should be roughly equivalent to SSG. But I can certainly see Gogeta 4 kicking some of Zamasu's butt in Halo form, with more difficulty in Corrupted. When a Giant, he would probably state the same a Vegito, having superior speed (albeit SS4 offers the same boost with Blue, or if Zamasu actually lost speed, or if the fusions already had a superior speed Stat to Zamasu).
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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Shintoki » Thu Nov 28, 2019 1:57 pm

p-hyvo wrote:
Sun Nov 24, 2019 10:01 pm
Shintoki wrote:
Sat Nov 23, 2019 12:28 pm
SS4 Gogeta was said to be dozens of times stronger than an SS4 whom itself was compared to SS vegito. combine that with the filler/films scaling and you pretty much have a solid case that SS4 gogeta > beerus (universal?)
Well yes, but actually no.
Ok, he's universal, no doubt and no argue, but he's not beerus level.
Feats wise, all the strongest characters in dbs are stronger than anyone in gt.
I mean, people like jiren , kefla and god toppo shakes an infinite space, no one in gt can really replicate that counting that not omega nor gogeta even shook the normal universe, which isn't infinite.
Not saying they can't, if base goku could in s17 arc they definitely can, but still that's far from shaking something infinite by various degrees.
Imo beerus>>ssbE vegeta >=god toppo>>>>ssj2b skefla >uio1 goku>= suppressed jiren >>>>everyone in gt

Personally, I put omega shenron between merged zamasu halo and merged zamasu corrupted, and I have ssj4 gogeta = ssb vegeth x3
Like :
Gogeta 180
Vegeth 60
Merged zamasu, corrupted 50
Omega 14
Ssj4s 1

Obviously is just an opinion of mine. You are free to dissent
not to be a party pooper, but infinite of ''nothing'' is still ''nothing''. it's not a good feat :crazy: it's all our opinions really. so appreaciate the feedback

also one other thing, fused zamasu par example is ''galaxy'' (milky way) but broly in the films (which are canon to GT) is confirmed Multi galaxy, the scaling is wacky when you think about it.

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by p-hyvo » Thu Nov 28, 2019 2:44 pm

Shintoki wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 1:57 pm
p-hyvo wrote:
Sun Nov 24, 2019 10:01 pm
Shintoki wrote:
Sat Nov 23, 2019 12:28 pm
SS4 Gogeta was said to be dozens of times stronger than an SS4 whom itself was compared to SS vegito. combine that with the filler/films scaling and you pretty much have a solid case that SS4 gogeta > beerus (universal?)
Well yes, but actually no.
Ok, he's universal, no doubt and no argue, but he's not beerus level.
Feats wise, all the strongest characters in dbs are stronger than anyone in gt.
I mean, people like jiren , kefla and god toppo shakes an infinite space, no one in gt can really replicate that counting that not omega nor gogeta even shook the normal universe, which isn't infinite.
Not saying they can't, if base goku could in s17 arc they definitely can, but still that's far from shaking something infinite by various degrees.
Imo beerus>>ssbE vegeta >=god toppo>>>>ssj2b skefla >uio1 goku>= suppressed jiren >>>>everyone in gt

Personally, I put omega shenron between merged zamasu halo and merged zamasu corrupted, and I have ssj4 gogeta = ssb vegeth x3
Like :
Gogeta 180
Vegeth 60
Merged zamasu, corrupted 50
Omega 14
Ssj4s 1

Obviously is just an opinion of mine. You are free to dissent
not to be a party pooper, but infinite of ''nothing'' is still ''nothing''. it's not a good feat :crazy: it's all our opinions really. so appreaciate the feedback

also one other thing, fused zamasu par example is ''galaxy'' (milky way) but broly in the films (which are canon to GT) is confirmed Multi galaxy, the scaling is wacky when you think about it.
It is an infinit empty place, but still is infinite so it does count.
Every feat that influences something infinite is superior to every feat that doesn't.
For the broly multi galaxy thing, the explanations are 2 :
1) Movies have an exaggerated scaling when compared to the manga, characters in movies are much , much stronger than their manga counterparts and oftten even the relationships between characters (speaking of power) are really different

2) it is Dragon ball, keep it in mind. If you are looking for a manga that constantly makes sense and never contradicts itself, this isn't for you at all. Db is a contraddictions pool
I feel like if i Say here where do i get numerically with dbgt/dbs Power levels, someone will get a stroke.
Better to not talk about dragon ball heroes ones, i swear
Lol

Also i don't wanna be rude, even if i know i can seem It sometimes. I'm Just too harsh in some occasions, that's It. I can't control that. Is not that i want to be and asshole or mean to you, i Simply don't know how to Say what i think i other ways .Just clarifying

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Shintoki » Thu Nov 28, 2019 2:57 pm

p-hyvo wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 2:44 pm
Shintoki wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 1:57 pm
p-hyvo wrote:
Sun Nov 24, 2019 10:01 pm


Well yes, but actually no.
Ok, he's universal, no doubt and no argue, but he's not beerus level.
Feats wise, all the strongest characters in dbs are stronger than anyone in gt.
I mean, people like jiren , kefla and god toppo shakes an infinite space, no one in gt can really replicate that counting that not omega nor gogeta even shook the normal universe, which isn't infinite.
Not saying they can't, if base goku could in s17 arc they definitely can, but still that's far from shaking something infinite by various degrees.
Imo beerus>>ssbE vegeta >=god toppo>>>>ssj2b skefla >uio1 goku>= suppressed jiren >>>>everyone in gt

Personally, I put omega shenron between merged zamasu halo and merged zamasu corrupted, and I have ssj4 gogeta = ssb vegeth x3
Like :
Gogeta 180
Vegeth 60
Merged zamasu, corrupted 50
Omega 14
Ssj4s 1

Obviously is just an opinion of mine. You are free to dissent
not to be a party pooper, but infinite of ''nothing'' is still ''nothing''. it's not a good feat :crazy: it's all our opinions really. so appreaciate the feedback

also one other thing, fused zamasu par example is ''galaxy'' (milky way) but broly in the films (which are canon to GT) is confirmed Multi galaxy, the scaling is wacky when you think about it.
It is an infinit empty place, but still is infinite so it does count.
Every feat that influences something infinite is superior to every feat that doesn't.
For the broly multi galaxy thing, the explanations are 2 :
1) Movies have an exaggerated scaling when compared to the manga, characters in movies are much , much stronger than their manga counterparts and oftten even the relationships between characters (speaking of power) are really different

2) it is Dragon ball, keep it in mind. If you are looking for a manga that constantly makes sense and never contradicts itself, this isn't for you at all. Db is a contraddictions pool
well, depends what you are counting it for? because the place has no space-time to begin with, and its infinity aspects comes from being filled with an infinite of nothing. so it's like applying infinity to 0.

I know the scaling is wacky, I was mentioning as a point in how GT's scaling is wacky when you think about it since the films are a part of it.

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Grand Marshal 1 » Thu Nov 28, 2019 5:22 pm

Well, infinite times nothing would be the same as saying infinity×0 which is undefined and requires a limit to be solved.

But, to be 100% accurate, limits of the form of infinity times 0 are indeterminate. Basically, the result value is based on further analysis of the form itself. So, if I were to say something about the world of void feat, based on mathematics, I would say that it doesn't mean anything, as the result of that action can result to anything. It is as much of an amazing feat, as it is useless and with no value.

But like hell would DB producers resort to such thoughts for a cartoon that has things like magic fusions and transformations. Of course sometimes mathematics cannot be applied to the physical world (example being the N-dimensional vectors that represent space in 3D, but in 4D they just exist in a higher dimension, without it being time), so someone can argue that the indeterminate limits cannot be applied to this feat.

Meh, it doesn't matter. I tried to give some reasoning to this.
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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Hugo Boss » Fri Nov 29, 2019 12:51 pm

p-hyvo wrote:
Sun Nov 24, 2019 10:11 pm
Hugo Boss wrote:
Fri Oct 25, 2019 1:12 pm
SS Gogeta from Dragon Ball GT would probably be stronger than SS Gogeta from Dragon Ball Super, so he might be able to rival Omega Shenron.
Definitely not, no way.
By scaling and feats, ssj gogeta dbs>ssj4 gogeta gt by a long shot.
I mean, nobody in gt is even stronger than uio1 goku by feats.
We are talking about a gogeta that in base is arguably stronger than a ssb, form stronger than ssj god, who's definitely stronger than ssj4 by a lot, while in gt base gogeta wasn't even n near to a ssj4 in power, being just dozens of times base goku.
Goku and Vegeta in DBGT are probably stronger than themselves in DBSuper by scaling. So, in the same form, Gogeta in DBGT would be stronger than Gogeta in DBSuper. There is no need to come up with convoluted explanations.

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by p-hyvo » Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:01 pm

Hugo Boss wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 12:51 pm
p-hyvo wrote:
Sun Nov 24, 2019 10:11 pm
Hugo Boss wrote:
Fri Oct 25, 2019 1:12 pm
SS Gogeta from Dragon Ball GT would probably be stronger than SS Gogeta from Dragon Ball Super, so he might be able to rival Omega Shenron.
Definitely not, no way.
By scaling and feats, ssj gogeta dbs>ssj4 gogeta gt by a long shot.
I mean, nobody in gt is even stronger than uio1 goku by feats.
We are talking about a gogeta that in base is arguably stronger than a ssb, form stronger than ssj god, who's definitely stronger than ssj4 by a lot, while in gt base gogeta wasn't even n near to a ssj4 in power, being just dozens of times base goku.
Goku and Vegeta in DBGT are probably stronger than themselves in DBSuper by scaling. So, in the same form, Gogeta in DBGT would be stronger than Gogeta in DBSuper. There is no need to come up with convoluted explanations.
Still, feats are a thing and by them everyone stronger than suppressed jiren is automatically stronger than anyone in the gt verse too.
Gt goku could have an higher base power, but super goku isn't a lot weaker and he has the edge by the multipliers side, being that god>mortal forms and that gt's ssj is a x2 and not a x50.

I'm talking as a fan of by, but really, at least the big players from super certainly stomps gt verse.

To not say that in super and gt the fuaion's multiplier is different from one another. in gt , gogeta is just tens/dozens of times stronger than goku, in super, we saw base gogeta possibly being stronger than ssb goku, what are we talking about? It is a complete different realm of power.

I'd bring out the fact that ssj gogeta broke the fabric of reality fighting with ssj broly, and just by that he's stronger than everyone in gt because of his unrivaled feat. He was so strong that the universe couldn't contain him anymore, nothing similar never happened in gt.
I feel like if i Say here where do i get numerically with dbgt/dbs Power levels, someone will get a stroke.
Better to not talk about dragon ball heroes ones, i swear
Lol

Also i don't wanna be rude, even if i know i can seem It sometimes. I'm Just too harsh in some occasions, that's It. I can't control that. Is not that i want to be and asshole or mean to you, i Simply don't know how to Say what i think i other ways .Just clarifying

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Hugo Boss » Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:12 pm

p-hyvo wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:01 pm
To not say that in super and gt the fusions’ multiplier is different from one another.
If Goku and Vegeta are stronger in DBGT, the Fusion multiplier would be far greater than if they do Fusion in DBSuper.

Rakurai already clarified that “dozens of times” is a figure of speech that refers to a much higher number, likely not above 1,000. It’s not supposed to be interpreted literally.

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by p-hyvo » Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:40 pm

Hugo Boss wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:12 pm
p-hyvo wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:01 pm
To not say that in super and gt the fusions’ multiplier is different from one another.
If Goku and Vegeta are stronger in DBGT, the Fusion multiplier would be far greater than if they do Fusion in DBSuper.

Rakurai already clarified that “dozens of times” is a figure of speech that refers to a much higher number, likely not above 1,000. It’s not supposed to be interpreted literally.
Still no.
No matter how strong are the bases, the power of the fusion depends on the strongest form that the fusees had mastered.
And if you don't take gt perfect files literally, there is absolutely no way to determine how strong gogeta is , and it is easy to fall under headlining. For example, assuming that fusion works like in super is completely headcanon.
We never saw base gogeta or ssj gogeta in gt, but the fact alone he was in his ssj4 state and never powered down implies that he needed ssj4 to dominate omega, and that also mean that his base cannot be ssj4+ tier in the same way dbs gogeta base is ssb+ tier.
We have completely different multipliers here, regardless if you want to take gt perfect files literally Or not.

And still, the feats thing is not convoluted in the slightest. You don't need an IQ of 120 or something to get that some dbs characters did something unseen up to that point, and by that they are stronger then any in gt.
The highest shaking feat in gt is by base goku shaking hell, and after that no one ever shook anything more, not even ssj4 gogeta. I'm not saying that base goku is stronger, obviously it wouldn't make sense, but I'm saying that gt characters are basically featless and assume that they can complete with the likes of jiren or ssj gogeta is totally baseless and headcanon, don't try to make it seem objective because it isn't, feats aren't by your side
I feel like if i Say here where do i get numerically with dbgt/dbs Power levels, someone will get a stroke.
Better to not talk about dragon ball heroes ones, i swear
Lol

Also i don't wanna be rude, even if i know i can seem It sometimes. I'm Just too harsh in some occasions, that's It. I can't control that. Is not that i want to be and asshole or mean to you, i Simply don't know how to Say what i think i other ways .Just clarifying

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:53 pm

But is GT Goku really stronger than DBS Goku?

GT Vegeta is definitely not stronger than DBS Vegeta who at one point was enough for SS3 Gotenks just in base.
Actually BoG Vegeta is stronger than GT Vegeta, his SS2 was stronger than Goku's SS3, while in GT his SS failed to take down Professor SS Gohan and base Playboy Goten (Goku in base took both his SS kids down without trouble).
The main reason being that in GT he already stopped keeping up with Goku(until episode 59 or 60) while in Super, Goku is the one needing to keep up with him.

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by p-hyvo » Fri Nov 29, 2019 4:36 pm

Koitsukai wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:53 pm
But is GT Goku really stronger than DBS Goku?

GT Vegeta is definitely not stronger than DBS Vegeta who at one point was enough for SS3 Gotenks just in base.
Actually BoG Vegeta is stronger than GT Vegeta, his SS2 was stronger than Goku's SS3, while in GT his SS failed to take down Professor SS Gohan and base Playboy Goten (Goku in base took both his SS kids down without trouble).
The main reason being that in GT he already stopped keeping up with Goku(until episode 59 or 60) while in Super, Goku is the one needing to keep up with him.
There I have to bring up the point that, by scaling and being rildo>buu in general, from the m2 mini arc everyone in gt is strong enough to beat the entire a verse.
Rildo alone when suppressed was stronger than buu in goku's eyes, hyper mega Rildo is easily at least x3 suppressed Rildo, larval form baby was strong enough to kill him and steal his power and still base Goten was stronger than an older and stronger baby than the one who killed Rildo.

Speaking of buu, goku bringing him in the comparison without further specifying what buu he means to be, means he's speaking about buu in general, so his strongest form is the one compared to rildo, that being enraged Buchan who forced vegeta to go all out to stop him.

Gt has just a nonsense scaling , everyone is strong enough just to drive the story on, regardless of that strength on that character is nonsense or not. Logic doesn't really apply on it, if you try you'll just fuck up the facts and bend them to your will, and that means to not scale it the right way.

Said so, I don't disagree with the " gt goku isn't necessarily stronger than dbs goku" point.
Simply , they took different ways : one,with god ki, one without. I'm not that one is necessarily stronger than the other, imo battle of gods meta fits inside s17 arc in comparison to gt, and anyone at least as strong as suppressed jiren from dbs so 110 is stronger than ananyone seen in gt basing on feats.

Plus, as I already said, the 2 series have really different mechanics and, moreover, multipliers. The problems started with that : gt may have higher bases, but has muuch lower multipliers, while super could have lower bases, but it's advantage is in the muuch higher multipliers for god forms and the fusion retcon. Things that should at least counterbalance the difference in base forms, even if you don't consider the feats to be valid how someone here appears to stupidly do.
And I'm talking as a fan of gt, just being a bit objective here
I feel like if i Say here where do i get numerically with dbgt/dbs Power levels, someone will get a stroke.
Better to not talk about dragon ball heroes ones, i swear
Lol

Also i don't wanna be rude, even if i know i can seem It sometimes. I'm Just too harsh in some occasions, that's It. I can't control that. Is not that i want to be and asshole or mean to you, i Simply don't know how to Say what i think i other ways .Just clarifying

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Fri Nov 29, 2019 5:07 pm

p-hyvo wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 4:36 pm
Koitsukai wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:53 pm
But is GT Goku really stronger than DBS Goku?

GT Vegeta is definitely not stronger than DBS Vegeta who at one point was enough for SS3 Gotenks just in base.
Actually BoG Vegeta is stronger than GT Vegeta, his SS2 was stronger than Goku's SS3, while in GT his SS failed to take down Professor SS Gohan and base Playboy Goten (Goku in base took both his SS kids down without trouble).
The main reason being that in GT he already stopped keeping up with Goku(until episode 59 or 60) while in Super, Goku is the one needing to keep up with him.
There I have to bring up the point that, by scaling and being rildo>buu in general, from the m2 mini arc everyone in gt is strong enough to beat the entire a verse.
Rildo alone when suppressed was stronger than buu in goku's eyes, hyper mega Rildo is easily at least x3 suppressed Rildo, larval form baby was strong enough to kill him and steal his power and still base Goten was stronger than an older and stronger baby than the one who killed Rildo.

Speaking of buu, goku bringing him in the comparison without further specifying what buu he means to be, means he's speaking about buu in general, so his strongest form is the one compared to rildo, that being enraged Buchan who forced vegeta to go all out to stop him.

Gt has just a nonsense scaling , everyone is strong enough just to drive the story on, regardless of that strength on that character is nonsense or not. Logic doesn't really apply on it, if you try you'll just fuck up the facts and bend them to your will, and that means to not scale it the right way.

Said so, I don't disagree with the " gt goku isn't necessarily stronger than dbs goku" point.
Simply , they took different ways : one,with god ki, one without. I'm not that one is necessarily stronger than the other, imo battle of gods meta fits inside s17 arc in comparison to gt, and anyone at least as strong as suppressed jiren from dbs so 110 is stronger than ananyone seen in gt basing on feats.

Plus, as I already said, the 2 series have really different mechanics and, moreover, multipliers. The problems started with that : gt may have higher bases, but has muuch lower multipliers, while super could have lower bases, but it's advantage is in the muuch higher multipliers for god forms and the fusion retcon. Things that should at least counterbalance the difference in base forms, even if you don't consider the feats to be valid how someone here appears to stupidly do.
And I'm talking as a fan of gt, just being a bit objective here
lol we've been through this before, the whole Buu Rildo thing, and it got us nowhere. Let's not go down that road again.

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by p-hyvo » Fri Nov 29, 2019 6:19 pm

Koitsukai wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 5:07 pm
p-hyvo wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 4:36 pm
Koitsukai wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:53 pm
But is GT Goku really stronger than DBS Goku?

GT Vegeta is definitely not stronger than DBS Vegeta who at one point was enough for SS3 Gotenks just in base.
Actually BoG Vegeta is stronger than GT Vegeta, his SS2 was stronger than Goku's SS3, while in GT his SS failed to take down Professor SS Gohan and base Playboy Goten (Goku in base took both his SS kids down without trouble).
The main reason being that in GT he already stopped keeping up with Goku(until episode 59 or 60) while in Super, Goku is the one needing to keep up with him.
There I have to bring up the point that, by scaling and being rildo>buu in general, from the m2 mini arc everyone in gt is strong enough to beat the entire a verse.
Rildo alone when suppressed was stronger than buu in goku's eyes, hyper mega Rildo is easily at least x3 suppressed Rildo, larval form baby was strong enough to kill him and steal his power and still base Goten was stronger than an older and stronger baby than the one who killed Rildo.

Speaking of buu, goku bringing him in the comparison without further specifying what buu he means to be, means he's speaking about buu in general, so his strongest form is the one compared to rildo, that being enraged Buchan who forced vegeta to go all out to stop him.

Gt has just a nonsense scaling , everyone is strong enough just to drive the story on, regardless of that strength on that character is nonsense or not. Logic doesn't really apply on it, if you try you'll just fuck up the facts and bend them to your will, and that means to not scale it the right way.

Said so, I don't disagree with the " gt goku isn't necessarily stronger than dbs goku" point.
Simply , they took different ways : one,with god ki, one without. I'm not that one is necessarily stronger than the other, imo battle of gods meta fits inside s17 arc in comparison to gt, and anyone at least as strong as suppressed jiren from dbs so 110 is stronger than ananyone seen in gt basing on feats.

Plus, as I already said, the 2 series have really different mechanics and, moreover, multipliers. The problems started with that : gt may have higher bases, but has muuch lower multipliers, while super could have lower bases, but it's advantage is in the muuch higher multipliers for god forms and the fusion retcon. Things that should at least counterbalance the difference in base forms, even if you don't consider the feats to be valid how someone here appears to stupidly do.
And I'm talking as a fan of gt, just being a bit objective here
lol we've been through this before, the whole Buu Rildo thing, and it got us nowhere. Let's not go down that road again.
This time the buu thing isn't really important, I used that just to say that even gt vegeta is stronger than ssj3 Gotenks really. Even if it was kid buu, vegeta would be stronger than that anyway in the baby saga.
Back to the original discussion, what do you think about my point of super vs gt?
I feel like if i Say here where do i get numerically with dbgt/dbs Power levels, someone will get a stroke.
Better to not talk about dragon ball heroes ones, i swear
Lol

Also i don't wanna be rude, even if i know i can seem It sometimes. I'm Just too harsh in some occasions, that's It. I can't control that. Is not that i want to be and asshole or mean to you, i Simply don't know how to Say what i think i other ways .Just clarifying

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Fri Nov 29, 2019 8:38 pm

p-hyvo wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 6:19 pm
This time the buu thing isn't really important, I used that just to say that even gt vegeta is stronger than ssj3 Gotenks really. Even if it was kid buu, vegeta would be stronger than that anyway in the baby saga.
Back to the original discussion, what do you think about my point of super vs gt?
I agree with you about Super having the edge due to the new godly stuff. The movies, at least, are consistent with their bases being incredible (the show oscillates more). DBS Base Gogeta seems to be around post-ToP SSB level. He already starts at a level that dwarfs most of GT, if not all of it, really.

And IIRC, SS4 Goku was compared to Super Vegito in an official guide, some believe Vegito from Z, others from GT, if it is from GT then Super Gogeta = SS4 Goku.


What I don't agree with is GT Base Vegeta being stronger than SS3 Gotenks, though, but let's leave that one for a rainy day.

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by p-hyvo » Sat Nov 30, 2019 5:32 am

Koitsukai wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 8:38 pm
p-hyvo wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 6:19 pm
This time the buu thing isn't really important, I used that just to say that even gt vegeta is stronger than ssj3 Gotenks really. Even if it was kid buu, vegeta would be stronger than that anyway in the baby saga.
Back to the original discussion, what do you think about my point of super vs gt?
I agree with you about Super having the edge due to the new godly stuff. The movies, at least, are consistent with their bases being incredible (the show oscillates more). DBS Base Gogeta seems to be around post-ToP SSB level. He already starts at a level that dwarfs most of GT, if not all of it, really.

And IIRC, SS4 Goku was compared to Super Vegito in an official guide, some believe Vegito from Z, others from GT, if it is from GT then Super Gogeta = SS4 Goku.


What I don't agree with is GT Base Vegeta being stronger than SS3 Gotenks, though, but let's leave that one for a rainy day.
Yes, the comparison between ssj4 and vegetto is only if both are from the same saga. In gt, even lowballing super baby 1 says that he has obtained the greatest saiyan power ever, and goku even being aware of vegetto's confirms that. So, that comparison can't just be between buu saga vegetto and baby saga ssj4 goku.

For the vegeta point, really the only way to have him weaker than ssj3 Gotenks in the baby saga is to draw fat buu as a meter of comparison for Rildo, and that's just stupid. Not to say that in s17 arc every saiyan excluding pan outperforms majuub, a being at least stronger than super baby 1 , vegeta outperforms him in base while the half blooded saiyan does as ssjs. So nothing, at least from s17 arc base gt vegeta is stronger than z Gotenks, even if you lowball like no tomorrow
I feel like if i Say here where do i get numerically with dbgt/dbs Power levels, someone will get a stroke.
Better to not talk about dragon ball heroes ones, i swear
Lol

Also i don't wanna be rude, even if i know i can seem It sometimes. I'm Just too harsh in some occasions, that's It. I can't control that. Is not that i want to be and asshole or mean to you, i Simply don't know how to Say what i think i other ways .Just clarifying

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Hugo Boss » Sat Nov 30, 2019 9:09 am

p-hyvo wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:40 pm
Hugo Boss wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:12 pm
p-hyvo wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 1:01 pm
To not say that in super and gt the fusions’ multiplier is different from one another.
If Goku and Vegeta are stronger in DBGT, the Fusion multiplier would be far greater than if they do Fusion in DBSuper.

Rakurai already clarified that “dozens of times” is a figure of speech that refers to a much higher number, likely not above 1,000. It’s not supposed to be interpreted literally.
Still no.
No matter how strong are the bases, the power of the fusion depends on the strongest form that the fusees had mastered.
And if you don't take gt perfect files literally, there is absolutely no way to determine how strong gogeta is , and it is easy to fall under headlining. For example, assuming that fusion works like in super is completely headcanon.
We never saw base gogeta or ssj gogeta in gt, but the fact alone he was in his ssj4 state and never powered down implies that he needed ssj4 to dominate omega, and that also mean that his base cannot be ssj4+ tier in the same way dbs gogeta base is ssb+ tier.
We have completely different multipliers here, regardless if you want to take gt perfect files literally Or not.

And still, the feats thing is not convoluted in the slightest. You don't need an IQ of 120 or something to get that some dbs characters did something unseen up to that point, and by that they are stronger then any in gt.
The highest shaking feat in gt is by base goku shaking hell, and after that no one ever shook anything more, not even ssj4 gogeta. I'm not saying that base goku is stronger, obviously it wouldn't make sense, but I'm saying that gt characters are basically featless and assume that they can complete with the likes of jiren or ssj gogeta is totally baseless and headcanon, don't try to make it seem objective because it isn't, feats aren't by your side
I couldn’t care less about feats, since by scaling Goku and Vegeta are stronger in GT than in Super, obviously counting the same forms. I don’t see any good reason to assume they got weaker by the years.

Assuming Fusion works differently in each portion of the story is baffling, since the result depend only on the form they perform the technique, not on a hypothetical strongest form the character may have.

(Honestly, this talk about IQ is embarrassing).

The easy conclusion is that SS4 Gogeta is stronger than any version of SS Gogeta that appears in DBSuper.

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Sat Nov 30, 2019 1:49 pm

There is nothing backing up SS4 Gogeta >> SS Gogeta from the Broly movie

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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Grand Marshal 1 » Sat Nov 30, 2019 2:08 pm

Koitsukai wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 1:49 pm
There is nothing backing up SS4 Gogeta >> SS Gogeta from the Broly movie
Indeed, by pure scaling alone my headcanon is that SS4 Gogeta in the Broly movie would be around SSG level. And that's a lot for post ToP God forms. Facing off against a semi FP Wrathful II Broly is already a feat on itself. Again, my headcanon, but I can see SS4 GT Gogeta having the edge over SS Super Gogeta, but not by match. SS Super Gogeta is still a powerhouse.
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Re: Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Hugo Boss » Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:20 pm

Koitsukai wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 1:49 pm
There is nothing backing up SS4 Gogeta >> SS Gogeta from the Broly movie
Goku and Vegeta have become that much weaker for what reason exactly? That’s like saying SS Goku from DBSuper being stronger than SS4 Goku from DBGT is feasible. :eh:

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