Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Mon Mar 30, 2015 10:03 am

And Toriyama has possibly broken power levels. I love it.

If this stuff is true, I consider it a chance to come up with a new system to hold us over. That sounds more fun than the tired old "lazy incompetent Toriyama doesn't know his own series" crap.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Skar » Tue Mar 31, 2015 10:52 am

Kamiccolo9 wrote:And Toriyama has possibly broken power levels. I love it.

If this stuff is true, I consider it a chance to come up with a new system to hold us over. That sounds more fun than the tired old "lazy incompetent Toriyama doesn't know his own series" crap.
I considered power levels broken since they were introduced :P. They were okay when they were in the thousands but became too inflated too fast. It doesn't help that we don't know what the numbers mean since the scale kept changing throughout the manga. The only problem I have with Freeza's power level of 1.37 million is that it conflicts with what we see during the Freeza saga. Goku was 90,000 against Ginyu so his Kaioken x20 would've been over 1.8 million without taking into account his Zenkai. 2nd form Freeza was "over million". 50% Freeza would have to be at least 1,000,001 and his 100% form at least two million. The power level is minor compared to the other complaints I have about the movie so I guess it's not that big of deal.

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Herms » Wed Apr 01, 2015 1:42 am

The 1.37 million thing is apparently something Freeza says in his first form shortly after being revived, so it's not necessarily supposed to apply to Golden Freeza. Hmmm...if we go with the idea that's Freeza's final form (true form, whatever) is his equivalent of a Saiyan's base form, and Golden Freeza is his equivalent of Super Saiyan God, then...if his first form goes from 530,000 to 1,370,000, we could assume his final form likewise goes from 120,000,000 to about 310,000,000. And if we assume going Golden has the same sort of increase as Super Saiyan God...whatever the hell that is, but let's just assume it's ten times Super Saiyan 3, so 4,000...then that gets you 1,240,000,000,000, or 1.24 trillion. It's no 100 quintillion, but not too shabby.

*ahem*

But what I really came here for is to ask about is Japanese DB battle power fansite extraordinaire Chou-Koshiki ("Super Official"). It's a site that aims to be as thorough as humanely possible both with the sources it looks at (manga, anime, guides, video games, Carddass, etc), and with the scope of things it assigns speculative battle powers for (that mermaid Goku brings to Kame House, the average Yardratian, etc). Someone asked over in the translation thread about the possibility about getting the entire site translated, and the short of it is that there's probably not enough money or drugs to make me. So I thought maybe I could just do a general overview, just translating the character names/forms and the numbers...but that's probably the sort of thing you could just do with Google Translate, which makes me think someone probably has done it already. I guess could throw in a brief summary of the logic behind the numbers, since that's probably something that wouldn't necessarily come across too well in a Google translation. It seems like the sort of thing I could probably just bang out while watching TV. So my questions are A) has this already been done? and B) would there be any interest in me doing this?
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Hugo Boss » Wed Apr 01, 2015 7:42 am

I don't know if it was done, but I have interest in seeing those numbers. Not a great interest, but some.

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Skar » Wed Apr 01, 2015 12:57 pm

The legendary super Herms-sama!!!!! Hi nice to meet you. I looked at the site with Google translate and the numbers seem to show up fine. The descriptions are a little off but you can kinda get a general idea of what they're talking about.

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Blackstripe » Wed Apr 01, 2015 1:42 pm

So, this is a power level list I did over the course of a few hours. My ultimate goal was to basically see if I could keep all of the power levels fairly low without violating any clear cut statements made in the Manga. Not easy, since I also cover Battle of Gods at the end of it.

Cell Saga

Return of Frieza
Son Gohan – 1,000,000
Kuririn – 14,000
Yamucha – 8,200
Tenshinhan – 32,000
Vegeta – 2,800,000
Piccolo – 2,400,000
Planet Trade Empire soldiers – ~1,000
Cyborg Frieza – 40,500,000
(Unseen full power) – 135,000,000
Trunks – 3,000,000
(Super Saiyan) – 150,000,000
King Cold – 45,000,000
(Unseen third form) – 75,000,000
(Unseen final form) – 145,000,000
Son Gokuu – 3,100,000
(Super Saiyan) – 155,000,000

Now, King Cold is entirely speculation on my part. I will not deny it. It does however make sense from a character standpoint. He is King Cold. Does Frieza really seem like the type to defer such a title to someone weaker than him? Did Cold seem like the type to restore (and strengthen!) someone more powerful than himself when he was trying to bargain with Trunks?

Of course, I don’t think he’s as ludicrously powerful as Dragonball Multiverese makes him. I think he has to still be weaker than Super Saiyan Trunks, enough so that he would feel it probably wasn’t worth even trying to transform.

In Fukkatsu no F, Frieza recounted his father instructing him to never lay his hands on Beerus or Majin Buu, so he ¬did have authority over him.

Arrival of the Cyborgs
Kuririn – 20,000 (There’s really no evidence he surpassed the Ginyu Force or even Zarbon/Dodoria. Pure humans are just weak, even the relatively strong ones.)
Yamucha – 14,500
Yajirobe – 650
Tenshinhan – 135,000 Son Gohan – 3,250,000
Son Gokuu – 3,400,000
(Super Saiyan) – 170,000,000
(Sick) – 35,000,000
#19 – 20,000,000
(Goku’s energy absorbed) – 50,000,000
(Vegeta’s energy absorbed) – 110,000,000
(Disarmed) – 45,000,000 and dropping.
#20 – 25,000,000
(Vegeta and Piccolo’s energy absorbed) – 75,000,000
Vegeta – 3,500,000
(Super Saiyan) – 175,000,000
(Energy drained) – 115,000,000
Piccolo – 100,000,000
(without weights) – 135,000,000
Trunks – 3,300,000
(Super Saiyan) – 165,000,000
#18 – 180,000,000

An Invader from the Future
Nameless Namekian – 165,000,000
(without weights) – 190,000,000
(tired) 182,000,000
#17 – 190,000,000
Imperfect Cell – 150,000,000
(humans absorbed) – 210,000,000
#16 – 210,000,000
Semi-Perfect Cell – 305,000,000
(Full power) – 400,000,000
Shin Kikoho – 150,000,000
Vegeta – 6,500,000
(Super Saiyan) – 325,000,000
(Grade 2) – 487,500,000
Trunks – 6,300,000
(Super Saiyan) 315,000,000
(Grade 2) – 472,500,000
(Grade 3) – 567,000,000
Perfect Cell – 450,000,000
(Warm up) – 500,000,000
(vs Trunks) – 550,000,000
(Bulked up) – 990,000,000
Son Gokuu – 22,000,000
(Half Power Super Saiyan) – 550,000,000

Cell Games

Mr. Satan – 16.5 (Do keep in mind my start of Dragon Ball Gokuu is about 25, since I don’t follow the Daiz. I figure he should at least be on the level of some of the better 21st Tournament Preliminary fighters. He did apparently win his renown fairly, after all.)
Vegeta – 12,000,000
(Super Saiyan) – 600,000,000
Trunks – 11,500,000
(Super Saiyan) – 575,000,000
Piccolo – 500,000,000
Cell Jr.’s – 650,000,000
Son Gokuu – 1,100,000,000
(Warp Kamehameha) – 1,200,000,000
(Tired) – 450,000,000
Perfect Cell – 1,150,000,000
(Powered up against Gohan) – 1,350,000,000
(Full Power) – 1,850,000,000
(Super Perfect) – 2,800,000,000
Son Gohan – 25,000,000
(Super Saiyan) – 1,250,000,000
(Unseen Angry Super Saiyan) – 1,500,000,000
(Angry Super Saiyan 2) – 3,000,000,000
(Injured Super Saiyan 2) – 2,200,000,000
(Father-Son Kamehameha) – 3,300,000,000


Buu Saga


7 Years of Peace
Son Gohan – 14,500,000
(Super Saiyan) – 725,000,000
Vegeta – 30,000,000
(Super Saiyan) – 1,500,000,000
Son Goten – 3,000,000
(Super Saiyan) – 150,000,000
Trunks – 3,100,000
(Super Saiyan) – 155,000,000
Videl – 18

25th Tenkaichi Budokai – Junior Division
Ikose – 5.5
Son Goten – 3,400,000
(Super Saiyan) 170,000,000
Idasa – 8
Trunks – 3,500,000
(Super Saiyan) – 175,000,000
Mr. Satan - 16.5

Adult Division
Kuririn – 17,500 (Gave up fighting to become a family man)
Pintar – 12
Yamucha – 10,500 (Also gave up fighting. Probably for the best.)
Piccolo – 650,000,000
(Unseen without weights) – 800,000,000
East Kaioshin – 1,000,000,000
Videl – 20
Spopovich – 25
Yamu – 28
Son Gohan – 22,000,000
(Super Saiyan) – 1,100,000,000
(Super Saiyan 2) – 2,200,000,000
Kibito – 100,000,000
#18 – 180,000,000
Jewel – 14
Killa – 12.5

Madoshi Babidi
Babidi – 2.5
Pui Pui - 1,500,000 (People are a little too harsh with Pui Pui. If you never trained in heavier gravity, it would still throw you off your game. He didn’t expect it to harm Vegeta or anything.)
Yakon – 40,000,000
Son Gokuu – 35,000,000
(Super Saiyan) – 1,750,000,000
(Super Saiyan 2) – 3,500,000,000
Dabura – 1,500,000,000
Majin Vegeta (Super Saiyan 2) – 3,500,000,000

The Playful Destroyer
Majin Buu – 1,250,000,000
(vs Dabura/Gohan/Kaioshin) – 3,000,000,000
(vs Vegeta) – 4,100,000,000
(vs Gokuu) – 6,000,000,000
(Full Power/Splitting) – 7,200,000,000
(Grey Buu) – 4,200,000,000
(Good Buu) – 3,000,000,000
Son Gokuu – 7,500,000,000 (Suppressed Super Saiyan 3)
Son Gohan (Z Sword Training) – 38,000,000
Gotenks – 36,500,000
(Super Saiyan) – 1,825,000,000
Van Zant – 5
Butler - 4

Rise of the Super Majin
Son Goten (post-training) – 3,950,000 (Goten narrowed the gap a bit, since they were working on equalizing their power)
Trunks (post-training) – 4,000,000
Gotenks – 40,000,000
(Super Saiyan) – 2,000,000,000
(Super Saiyan 3) – 16,000,000,000
Super Buu – 15,500,000,000
(With Piccolo+Gotenks) – 32,300,000,000
(With Piccolo) – 16,697,500,000
(With Gohan) – 36,197,500,000
(Buff) – 16,000,000,000
Son Gohan (Ultimate) - 19,500,000,000
Tenshinhan – 1,500,000 (It was said that Ten has alien ancestry, so I don’t count him as “Pure Human”, getting around the “Kuririn is the strongest pure human” argument. His feats honestly smash Kuririn’s.)
Vegetto: 2,500,000,000
(Super Vegito) – 125,000,000,000
(Unseen Super Saiyan 2) – 250,000,000,000
(Unseen Super Saiyan 3) – 1,000,000,000,000 (Listing these is important for the Battle of Gods section)

Pint Sized Destroyer
Son Gokuu (Super Saiyan 3; fighting level) – 12,500,000,000
(Full power, takes time to gather; strenuous on body) – 14,000,000,000
Pure Buu – 12,500,000,000
(vs Mr. Satan) – 666
(vs Vegeta) – 4,200,000,000
(vs Mr. Buu) – 10,000,000,000
(vs Genki Dama) – 15,000,000,000 (Looking back on Kid Buu’s fight with Gokuu, he never seemed particularly concerned or serious. And he can be both of those, as shown when he saw the Genki Dama and started going for the kill. He was also perfectly capable of holding back, as shown in his fight with Satan. No, it wasn’t a gag fight. It had plot significance. It leads to the revival of…)
Mr. Buu – 6,500,000,000 (“W-W-W-WHAAAT?! But Blackstripe! You yourself said Good Buu was only at 3 billion!” That’s right, but that was Good Buu. Mr. Buu is in fact a bit different. When Majin Buu split between his good and evil halves, both of them still had a bit of Kaioshin in them. Neither was ‘Pure’. If you will recall, Super Buu states that he gave “that guy” special treatment…and when he was removed, he took all traces of the Kaioshins with him: both Dai Kaioshin AND South Kaioshin. That’s why you get Pure Buu instead of Grey Buu again. Because of how Super Buu set the Kaioshins up inside of him, he’s able to use their full power to compensate for his lost Majin power)
Genki Dama – 52,807,978,000 (5 x 6.5 billion + the kids, Piccolo, Kuririn, Yamucha and Gohan. Would have killed any Majin.)

Battle of Gods

The God of Destruction awakens

Kuririn – 15,200 (is even more complacent than in the Buu Saga)
Yamucha – 8,100 (It’s over 8,000, if only just.)
Tenshinhan – 1,750,000
Piccolo – 1,000,000,000
Son Goten – 4,250,000
Trunks – 4,250,000
Pilaf – 2
Mai – 2.5
Shu – 2
Mr. Satan – 16
#18 – 180,000,000
Son Gohan – 19,500,000,000
Gotenks – 42,500,000
(Super Saiyan) – 2,125,000,000
Vegeta – 38,000,000
(Super Saiyan) – 1,900,000,000
(Super Saiyan 2) – 3,800,000,000
(Stealing Gohan’s modus operandi) – 25,000,000,000
Beerus – 400,000,000,000 (1% power)
(70% power) – 28,000,000,000,000
(100%) – 40,000,000,000,000
Son Gokuu – 40,000,000
(Super Saiyan) – 2,000,000,000
(Super Saiyan 2) – 4,000,000,000
(Super Saiyan 3) – 16,000,000,000
(Super Saiyan God) – 24,000,000,000,000
Whis – 60,000,000,000,000

The above power levels are based upon Akira Toriyama saying that if SSG Goku was a 6, then Beerus was a 10 and Whis was a 15.

Anyway, I hope you enjoyed reading this! I wanted to try a power level list that included BOG without getting too absurdly high.

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by thefalseprophecy » Wed Apr 01, 2015 3:31 pm

I'm one of those people who actually LIKES battle powers and I'm very interested to know what the sources are for the battle powers they came up with.

Correct me if I'm mistaken but isn't this the site that provided the V-Jump scans of the battle powers for Broli, Coola, and Gogeta?

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Lord Beerus » Wed Apr 01, 2015 4:59 pm

Blackstripe wrote:So, this is a power level list I did over the course of a few hours. My ultimate goal was to basically see if I could keep all of the power levels fairly low without violating any clear cut statements made in the Manga. Not easy, since I also cover Battle of Gods at the end of it.
I'm sorry but every instance of Krillin being weaker than Tien is incorrect. Given that Toriyama has stated that Krillin is the strongest earthling. On multiple occasions.

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by dbgtFO » Wed Apr 01, 2015 5:06 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:
Blackstripe wrote:
I'm sorry but every instance of Krillin being weaker than Tenshinhan is incorrect. Given that Toriyama has stated that Krillin is the strongest earthling. On multiple occasions.
You really didn't have to quote the entire post to get that point across.
At least use spoiler tags like so.

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Wed Apr 01, 2015 6:38 pm

Just finished my numbers on Cell arc:
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Blackstripe » Wed Apr 01, 2015 7:30 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:
Blackstripe wrote:So, this is a power level list I did over the course of a few hours. My ultimate goal was to basically see if I could keep all of the power levels fairly low without violating any clear cut statements made in the Manga. Not easy, since I also cover Battle of Gods at the end of it.
I'm sorry but every instance of Krillin being weaker than Tenshinhan is incorrect. Given that Toriyama has stated that Krillin is the strongest earthling. On multiple occasions.
Does that make any sense to you, though? Ten consistently shows himself to be stronger from the very day he enters the series all the way to the Buu saga.

Besides, like I said. Tenshinhan is technically part-alien. So you don't have to count him as an "Earthling". Problem solved.

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by SSJ2FutureGohan » Wed Apr 01, 2015 7:45 pm

Blackstripe wrote:Besides, like I said. Tenshinhan is technically part-alien. So you don't have to count him as an "Earthling". Problem solved.
Except any hint of him being "partially alien" comes from a guidebook, and the same guidebook lists him as an earthling under the same category as Krillin. Tenshinhan is also called an "Earthling" in the manga.

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Kaboom » Wed Apr 01, 2015 8:08 pm

Blackstripe wrote:Does that make any sense to you, though? Ten consistently shows himself to be stronger from the very day he enters the series all the way to the Buu saga.
Besides, like I said. Tenshinhan is technically part-alien. So you don't have to count him as an "Earthling". Problem solved.
Nothing shows Tenshinhan to be stronger later in the series. He's shown to be braver and/or more reckless, and to have more destructive techniques, but never actually "stronger." The last time that was the case was when they had their battle powers read by the Saiyans, and that was before they each underwent massive power growth during Namek. Evidently, Kuririn's was more massive than Ten's.

Also, the manga never portrays Ten as an alien. One of the guidebooks adds that he has distant alien ancestry (he's descended from the "three-eyed tribe" who are themselves descendants of aliens), but that same guidebook STILL grouped him in with the other native Earthlings. He's no less an Earthling than the distantly Saiyan-descended ones in DB Online.

Tenshinhan and Kuririn are both universally considered Earthlings. The manga, the guidebooks, and Toriyama himself all declare that Kuririn is the strongest Earthling. Therefore, Kuririn is stronger than Tenshinhan.

There's really nothing about it to be denied or debated. It just is what it is.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Blackstripe » Wed Apr 01, 2015 8:21 pm

Kaboom wrote:
Blackstripe wrote:Does that make any sense to you, though? Ten consistently shows himself to be stronger from the very day he enters the series all the way to the Buu saga.
Besides, like I said. Tenshinhan is technically part-alien. So you don't have to count him as an "Earthling". Problem solved.
Nothing shows Tenshinhan to be stronger later in the series. He's shown to be braver and/or more reckless, and to have more destructive techniques, but never actually "stronger." The last time Tenshinhan was shown to be stronger than Kuririn was when they had their battle powers read by the Saiyans, and that was before they each underwent massive power growth during Namek. Evidently, Kuririn's was more massive than Ten's.

Also, the manga never portrays Ten as an alien. One of the guidebooks adds that he has distant alien ancestry (he's descended from the "three-eyed tribe" who are themselves descendants of aliens), but that same guidebook STILL grouped him in with the other native Earthlings. He's no less an Earthling than the distantly Saiyan-descended ones in DB Online.

Tenshinhan and Kuririn are both universally considered Earthlings. The manga, the guidebooks, and Toriyama himself all declare that Kuririn is the strongest Earthling. Therefore, Kuririn is stronger than Tenshinhan.

There's really nothing about it to be denied or debated. It just is what it is.
Then why is he always depicted as being generally more useful than Kuririn? Why couldn't Kuririn buy a bit of time against Semiperfect Cell like Ten could? How could Ten do better against Gotenks Buu than Kuririn did against regular ol' Super Buu?

The same Kuririn, mind you, who stops training seriously, whereas Ten basically lives in the wilderness and probably trains hard every day. I'm telling you, it doesn't make one lick of sense.

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Kaboom » Wed Apr 01, 2015 8:30 pm

Blackstripe wrote:Then why is he always depicted as being generally more useful than Kuririn? Why couldn't Kuririn buy a bit of time against Semiperfect Cell like Ten could? How could Ten do better against Gotenks Buu than Kuririn did against regular ol' Super Buu?
"Useful" does not equal "stronger."

Tenshinhan himself was not responsible for stalling Cell, the Shin Kikoho was. It's an extraordinarily broken and highly-amplified attack, said to be "many levels above the Kamehameha," and all it did was push him around. Ten used some form of the Kikoho to deflect Boo's little blast, too (and from the side, not even a head-on clash). To cite either of those things as evidence that Ten's stronger than Kuririn, you'd have to prove that Kuririn couldn't do the same thing with the same technique, which is impossible.

Also, Kuririn engaging Evil Boo is 100% filler.
Blackstripe wrote:The same Kuririn, mind you, who stops training seriously, whereas Ten basically lives in the wilderness and probably trains hard every day.
Which wouldn't matter if Kuririn had a big enough lead on Ten before retiring. "One trained, the other didn't" isn't proof of anything in and of itself.
Blackstripe wrote:I'm telling you, it doesn't make one lick of sense.
It makes plenty of sense, once you get past the "big, imposing guy with a surly attitude who does a lot of stuff" surface-level qualities of Tenshinhan.

If the line from the manga and the quotes from extra material and Toriyama all saying Kuririn's the strongest didn't exist, then there'd be room for debate. But it'd still be up in the air, because there is objectively nothing demonstrating or saying that Tenshinhan remained stronger than Kuririn.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by SSJ2FutureGohan » Wed Apr 01, 2015 8:31 pm

How can Krillin hold of Form 2 Cell with a technique he doesn't posses? (Shin Kikoho)

Using their fights against Super Buu aren't very good arguments since:

1. We don't actually see Krillin vs. Super Buu isn't in the actual manga
2. The situations aren't really comparable

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by SSJ2FutureGohan » Fri Apr 03, 2015 3:25 am

Vegeta - 4.600.000
    • Super Saiyan - 230.000.000
Artificial Human #20/Dr. Gero - 5.000.000
  • Post-absorption - 7.000.000
I'm not so sure Vegeta would have trouble catching #20 if he was 32-46x stronger than him.
Artificial Human #19 - 4.000.000
Post-absorption - 100.000.000
Artificial Human #20/Dr. Gero - 5.000.000
Post-absorption - 7.000.000
#20 was questionable as being as strong as expected. #19 wasn't even considered. Vegeta also commented that #19 wasn't as bad as made out to be after watching his fight with Goku, yet made no comments watching Piccolo's fight with #20.

#20 post > #19 post

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DBZAOTA482
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Sat Apr 04, 2015 3:28 pm

This is my first shot at a complete power level list on the series. Hope you like it.

Son Goku Saga
21st Tenkaichi Budokai
Red Ribbon Army Saga coming soon....
fadeddreams5 wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
jjgp1112 wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:31 am
I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.

I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by SSJ2FutureGohan » Sat Apr 04, 2015 4:08 pm

:?

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by xmysticgohanx » Mon Apr 06, 2015 12:11 am

Re: the current Krillin vs Tien debate

I like to think that any time Tien does something with his Shin Kikoho, Krillin would've done better with his Kienzan.
Canon is Jaco, Dragon Ball except for EoZ, Dragon Ball Super anime and manga (both are separate canons)
Kai >>> Z
Current Roshi/Kulilin >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SSJ3 Gotenks

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