Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Kai Recut [WIP, Saiyan to Cell COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WIP]

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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by DefinitiveDubs » Thu Feb 02, 2017 7:52 pm

IAmTheMilkMan wrote:
Scsigs wrote:Here's a serious question, if I may be so bold to ask. Can you use the Kai audio from the English dub of that for the recut of the original Z? Seeing as you agree it's a great dub, & is MUCH better than the original English dub, could you use the audio from the Kai dub instead of the original English dub because that dub sucks ass?
Also, could yoou maybe source the music & sound effects from the DBZ DVDs/Blu-Rays & source the dialogue from Kai if you could to make it even more accurate? I'd love to watch it like that because Kai's dub is just infinitely superior to Z's. Maybe you could get someone to help you with that if you''re not sure how to do that.
Sorry if someone's asked this already. I just wanna know if you'd d something like that.
Yep, that's been the plan from the beginning.
So wait, if you're doing this...what even is the point of Kai's recut?

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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by IAmTheMilkMan » Thu Feb 02, 2017 10:44 pm

DefinitiveDubs wrote:
IAmTheMilkMan wrote:
Scsigs wrote:Here's a serious question, if I may be so bold to ask. Can you use the Kai audio from the English dub of that for the recut of the original Z? Seeing as you agree it's a great dub, & is MUCH better than the original English dub, could you use the audio from the Kai dub instead of the original English dub because that dub sucks ass?
Also, could yoou maybe source the music & sound effects from the DBZ DVDs/Blu-Rays & source the dialogue from Kai if you could to make it even more accurate? I'd love to watch it like that because Kai's dub is just infinitely superior to Z's. Maybe you could get someone to help you with that if you''re not sure how to do that.
Sorry if someone's asked this already. I just wanna know if you'd d something like that.
Yep, that's been the plan from the beginning.
So wait, if you're doing this...what even is the point of Kai's recut?
You know, I've been asking myself that question a lot, lately. Like I've said before, the main reason I started it is because I didn't want to recut Z, but I thought I would at least recut Kai because it would be a breeze. I'm not sure that's the case anymore, but I'm too far into it to abandon it at this point.

Kai and Z will likely end up being two very different beasts. I probably won't be able to cut out as much from Z, while Kai will be almost a straight manga cut. Plus, I really enjoy Yamamoto's score, so that's also nice to have.

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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by DefinitiveDubs » Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:53 pm

IAmTheMilkMan wrote: You know, I've been asking myself that question a lot, lately. Like I've said before, the main reason I started it is because I didn't want to recut Z, but I thought I would at least recut Kai because it would be a breeze. I'm not sure that's the case anymore, but I'm too far into it to abandon it at this point.

Kai and Z will likely end up being two very different beasts. I probably won't be able to cut out as much from Z, while Kai will be almost a straight manga cut. Plus, I really enjoy Yamamoto's score, so that's also nice to have.
So for Z, since you're redoing the dub with Kai's dub, does that mean you're re-inserting all the music and sound effects? I'm a little confused since IIRC Kai is in 5.1 so it's relatively easy to separate (not without flaws), but Z is only stereo. If you ARE re-inserting the music and SE, you could create a custom Yamamoto score, or maybe even Faulconer.

Also, concerning filler cuts, will you be cutting all the Piccolo/Tenshinhan/Kuririn stuff in the final beamstruggle with Cell? You could probably cut it with little to no issue but I think that's one scene where the anime actually improved upon the manga, which seems anticlimactic in comparison.

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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by Danfun64 » Fri Feb 03, 2017 1:10 am

Z is also in surround, at least while using the Kikuchi soundtrack (and even some Mark Johnson scored episodes have a 5.1 surround mix IIRC...if only on the Ultimate Uncut DVDs)
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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by IAmTheMilkMan » Fri Feb 03, 2017 5:19 am

DefinitiveDubs wrote:So for Z, since you're redoing the dub with Kai's dub, does that mean you're re-inserting all the music and sound effects? I'm a little confused since IIRC Kai is in 5.1 so it's relatively easy to separate (not without flaws), but Z is only stereo. If you ARE re-inserting the music and SE, you could create a custom Yamamoto score, or maybe even Faulconer.
Like Danfun64 said, English Z is available in 5.1 so swapping dialog isn't a big deal. I will probably re-insert a higher quality Kikuchi score, though. While creating a custom Yamamoto or Faulconer score for Z is possible, there is no way that I will be doing that. Matter of fact, re-inserting the Yamamoto score back into the Android/Cell saga is the very reason that Kai is taking me so long to finish; it is the most un-fun thing that I have ever had to do as an editor and I absolutely hate it.
DefinitiveDubs wrote:Also, concerning filler cuts, will you be cutting all the Piccolo/Tenshinhan/Kuririn stuff in the final beamstruggle with Cell? You could probably cut it with little to no issue but I think that's one scene where the anime actually improved upon the manga, which seems anticlimactic in comparison.
Already cut it, sorry. Like I've said before, if it's filler, I will try to remove it. (As an aside, I personally prefer having those events play out as they do in the manga and I think it's just as climactic, if not more so, than its anime counterpart.)

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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by Fizzer » Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:58 am

It isn't possible to separate the dialogue/effects/music from the Japanese tracks for DB and Z, though, right?

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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by Scsigs » Fri Feb 03, 2017 1:45 pm

Fizzer wrote:It isn't possible to separate the dialogue/effects/music from the Japanese tracks for DB and Z, though, right?
For Kai, it's possible, if extremely hard, because it's a stereo track completely recorded from scratch. Z, no. It's only a mono track because Toei threw out the audio masters for some stupid reason.
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Post by Quintex » Fri Feb 03, 2017 2:21 pm

IAmTheMilkMan wrote:Matter of fact, re-inserting the Yamamoto score back into the Android/Cell saga is the very reason that Kai is taking me so long to finish; it is the most un-fun thing that I have ever had to do as an editor and I absolutely hate it.
Have you taken a look at SuperSaiyanHedgehog's Yamamoto Revival in this section? He had already scored the last two episodes of Kai that were never released with Yamamoto's music, and it feels professional. Even moreso than Toei's in my opinion, because Dragon Soul felt really out of place for the scene where everyone flies home after Cell's defeat and Gohan tells his mom that Goku is dead. If you have trouble with track placement in those episodes, I strongly reccomend taking a look.

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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by Danfun64 » Fri Feb 03, 2017 3:56 pm

IAmTheMilkMan wrote:Matter of fact, re-inserting the Yamamoto score back into the Android/Cell saga is the very reason that Kai is taking me so long to finish; it is the most un-fun thing that I have ever had to do as an editor and I absolutely hate it.
Let me guess. On the Japanese side of things you're using Japanese Blu-Ray audio and HDTV raws to preserve as much Yamamoto as possible? What about the last couple episodes that are only available Kikuchi? Are they going to stay Kai Kikuchi on the English track for consistency between the two?
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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by Scsigs » Fri Feb 03, 2017 5:11 pm

IAmTheMilkMan wrote:Already cut it, sorry. Like I've said before, if it's filler, I will try to remove it. (As an aside, I personally prefer having those events play out as they do in the manga and I think it's just as climactic, if not more so, than its anime counterpart.)
I'd say for the Buu saga, recutting Z is pretty much necessary, seeing as how Toei didn't make 4:3 masters for some stupid reason.
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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by DefinitiveDubs » Fri Feb 03, 2017 9:56 pm

Quintex wrote:
IAmTheMilkMan wrote:Matter of fact, re-inserting the Yamamoto score back into the Android/Cell saga is the very reason that Kai is taking me so long to finish; it is the most un-fun thing that I have ever had to do as an editor and I absolutely hate it.
Have you taken a look at SuperSaiyanHedgehog's Yamamoto Revival in this section? He had already scored the last two episodes of Kai that were never released with Yamamoto's music, and it feels professional. Even moreso than Toei's in my opinion, because Dragon Soul felt really out of place for the scene where everyone flies home after Cell's defeat and Gohan tells his mom that Goku is dead. If you have trouble with track placement in those episodes, I strongly reccomend taking a look.
I think what he means is the Android/Cell saga in general, since those tracks have never been released and need to be ripped from the episodes themselves, and if this video is anything to go by, that's pretty hard to do. And since Yamamoto's music is so loud and he's trying to cut out any filler it plays over, it's another nightmare entirely to not have obvious jumpcuts here and there.

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Post by Nejishiki » Sat Feb 04, 2017 4:40 am

Danfun64 wrote:
IAmTheMilkMan wrote:Matter of fact, re-inserting the Yamamoto score back into the Android/Cell saga is the very reason that Kai is taking me so long to finish; it is the most un-fun thing that I have ever had to do as an editor and I absolutely hate it.
What about the last couple episodes that are only available Kikuchi? Are they going to stay Kai Kikuchi on the English track for consistency between the two?
SuperSaiyanHedgehog revived the episodes with their Yamamoto score.

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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by Danfun64 » Sat Feb 04, 2017 2:54 pm

I already knew about that, but I have the feeling that IAmTheMilkMan would rather place the Yamamoto mix back into English Kai by himself so he can still use surround sound. Even so, the Yamamoto mix for the last few episodes is pure guesswork, since they have never been released in Japanese with Yamamoto intact. That's why i'm asking if those last few episodes will be in Kikuchi for both Japanese and English, with it using Yamamoto for everything else.
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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by DefinitiveDubs » Sat Feb 04, 2017 8:14 pm

Could you consider adding this awesome English version of OP 1 to the dubbed version of Z Recut?

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Post by SaiyamanMS » Sun Feb 05, 2017 7:43 am

NintendoBlaze53 wrote:22nd Tenkaichi Budokai 18>8 (HOW)
Honestly, that arc is downright infested with filler. The fights themselves aren't particularly padded, but then between each fight you have half an episode of Tsurusen'nin dicking around and trolling Bulma and the others. I remember when I first showed Dragon Ball to my dad, the 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai was the first time he started complaining about the pacing.

Anyway, I've started finally watching this tonight (about a year and a half after downloading it) and am enjoying it so far. Only gotten up to Oolong, so not much to cut so far, but what has been cut makes a notable difference. Doing it with the dub, because it's been many years since I watched it and last time I did the show was in Japanese. (DB had a much better dub than Z, but there's still a huge gap between it and Kai.) Looking forward to when Z and Kai are released! I'm real keen to see DBZ with the original Kikuchi placements with the Kai dub. (Also, have you had any cases where you've been stuck with a line from Nadolny's Gohan or Young's Freeza without Clinkenbeard or Ayres dialogue to replace it? How do you handle such a situation?)

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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by Scsigs » Tue Feb 07, 2017 9:38 am

Let me just pose this question. Would anyone be willing to cut down the filler like this guys' doing for Z & Kai on, say, Naruto Shippuden, or One Piece when the filler REALLY started affecting those shows' qualities?
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Post by Ajay » Tue Feb 07, 2017 9:44 am

Scsigs wrote:Let me just pose this question. Would anyone be willing to cut down the filler like this guys' doing for Z & Kai on, say, Naruto Shippuden, or One Piece when the filler REALLY started affecting those shows' qualities?
People have actually already done that. One Pace for One Piece, and Naruto by Yellow-Flash for the first series, and I believe Naruto Kai covers Shippuuden.

One Pace is done very well, though they're extremely strict about what they cut, so you do sometimes lose out on some beneficial extended scenes. Yellow-Flash's Naruto project is similar, though less intrusive. I can't speak for Naruto Kai, sorry.
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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by Scsigs » Tue Feb 07, 2017 12:53 pm

Ajay wrote:
Scsigs wrote:Let me just pose this question. Would anyone be willing to cut down the filler like this guys' doing for Z & Kai on, say, Naruto Shippuden, or One Piece when the filler REALLY started affecting those shows' qualities?
People have actually already done that. One Pace for One Piece, and Naruto by Yellow-Flash for the first series, and I believe Naruto Kai covers Shippuuden.

One Pace is done very well, though they're extremely strict about what they cut, so you do sometimes lose out on some beneficial extended scenes. Yellow-Flash's Naruto project is similar, though less intrusive. I can't speak for Naruto Kai, sorry.
Good to know.
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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by IAmTheMilkMan » Wed Feb 08, 2017 12:30 am

Danfun64 wrote:I already knew about that, but I have the feeling that IAmTheMilkMan would rather place the Yamamoto mix back into English Kai by himself so he can still use surround sound. Even so, the Yamamoto mix for the last few episodes is pure guesswork, since they have never been released in Japanese with Yamamoto intact. That's why i'm asking if those last few episodes will be in Kikuchi for both Japanese and English, with it using Yamamoto for everything else.
You are correct. Unfortunately, SuperSaiyanHedgehog's tracks don't work for what I'm doing, so I have to mix the Yamamoto score back into it myself... and it is a nightmare. I really can't stand it. Honestly, I'm kind of amazed SuperSaiyanHedgehog was able to make it through the entire thing. Hats off to that gentleman.

I plan on offering those few episodes that only ever aired with Kikuchi with three accompanying audio tracks: 1) English w/custom Yamamoto, 2) English w/original Kikuchi, and 3) Japanese w/original Kikuchi. I will likely use SuperSaiyanHedgehog's placements as a reference for the custom track, though I am interested in what kei17's placements were.
DefinitiveDubs wrote:Could you consider adding this awesome English version of OP 1 to the dubbed version of Z Recut?
No, I'm sticking with the Japanese version. I considered using an English version, but I've never heard one that I was happy with. This one is pretty decent, but I wish it were just a little more professional sounding.
SaiyamanMS wrote:Also, have you had any cases where you've been stuck with a line from Nadolny's Gohan or Young's Freeza without Clinkenbeard or Ayres dialogue to replace it? How do you handle such a situation?
Haven't gotten that far yet, but I'm sure it's bound to happen. I suppose I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.

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Re: Dragon Ball Recut [COMPLETE], Dragon Ball Z Kai Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS], Dragon Ball Z Recut [WORK IN PROGRESS]

Post by simtek34 » Wed Feb 08, 2017 8:11 am

IAmTheMilkMan wrote:
DefinitiveDubs wrote:Could you consider adding this awesome English version of OP 1 to the dubbed version of Z Recut?
No, I'm sticking with the Japanese version. I considered using an English version, but I've never heard one that I was happy with. This one is pretty decent, but I wish it were just a little more professional sounding.
Have you thought of using Kageyama's English version for the English dub at all?

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