Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

[Jackalope89]

Thanks. Hadn't recognized that one.

[dbgtFO]

[TheGodfather93]

Oh wow, they're really going to try absolve her of any blame. Can't wait to see Pan take Bra's side next.

[Fionordequester]

I'm just curious as to how Gotenks knew she was caught by surprise, personally. Perhaps the same way Bra knew about Cell's nucleus?

[Jackalope89]

Gotenks isn't wrong, per say, but neither is Vegeto.

I know! Kill'em both!

[coola]

Gotenks being most mature one? Who are you, and what you've done to REAL Gotenks? Seriously through, he is right, Vegetto (Or rather, half of Vegetto) is last person to blame anyone for selling his soul...

[Matches Malone]

It seems like something else drives Vegetto to becoming a "villain", as it looks like things are more or less calming down now...maybe.

[TobyS]

So I actually really like that it's Gotenks here.

Just because someone screws around and is silly (especially during an, untill now, no stakes tournament) doesn't mean they can't be serious.

If someone as goofy as Gotenks tells you to calm the fuck down you know you've fucked up.

Also an adult Gotenks is probably the second strongest to Vegetto in u16. Perhaps him and Gohan could have managed Bra together

He's right that vegeta gave himself over and did evil willingly to instigate a fight with Goku.

Bra was just mentally weaker then vegeta and cell. Even though she's physically stronger.
She is a teenage girl and a who's never had to work hard or have a real challenge, and as is a result dickhead who grew up with a disregard for the life of her friends because of her knowledge of two sets of Dragonballs and having a shit douchey dad who had Goku's ignorance and Vegetas arrogance and none of their post buu/super/GT growth.
But like it or not the word of god here is her actions were caused by the possession, even if the motivations to exactly how she acted out were there already.

I just don't like how sal thinks she's more likeable and tragic then she is boring and pitiable. And all the plot induced stupidity that allowed her to win.

[Koitsukai]

By now, I'm expecting Upper-half of Gohan siding up with Bra, and his Lower-half siding up with Vegito, because let's forgive her, why not? she only cut relatives in half.

[Perfectionist-Cell]

Man at this point, just fix everything and get back to the tournament. This page isn’t even making sense anymore. Bra has killed people even without being Majin so I don’t even get justifying her. To be controlled in the first place means you’re evil. Bra has had evil intentions which babidi was able use to his advantage. I’m pretty sure you can defy Babidi as well. Dabura defied Babidi by fighting Majin Buu , matter of fact once Dabura saw Majin Buu he didn’t even care about Babidi’s plans anymore he just tried to kill Majin Buu. He told Babidi he would be too powerful to control which he was right . Then we got Vegeta who outright defies Babidi easily and just uses his powers to try and beat Goku but he ends fighting up Buu and dying anyway in a novel meaningless way and finally Cell in the same webcomic defied Babidi and fought Bra. Yet Bra couldn’t do the same as the other characters?

[miguelnuva1]

I won't be surprised if u18 Gohan steps up next to say his counterpart would forgive Bra if he was there as they are the same person. This will then piss Vegetto off becasue they are not the same person and that's who he's choking in the vision.

Unless the next couple pages change it I see Vegetto snapping as Gotenks has called him out and Gast has outright stopped him. Characters written like he is being written hate having their authority challenges and Vegetto is use to being the supreme authority in his universe.

Bra also represents a fear of being the one Vegetto can't stop and that might have even made him withdraw from her emotionally which is why he's able to justify taking her out so easily.

Before it is brought up that Bra is a monster I would like to point out Darth Vader in Revenge of the Sith. He killed kids and killed all the Jedi and yet Obi-Wan who was like a brother to him knew how dangerous he was and still had to emotionally coach himself up to kill Vader.

Vegetto being able to kill Bra with no emotional repercussion still seems odd.

Man at this point, just fix everything and get back to the tournament. This page isn’t even making sense anymore. Bra has killed people even without being Majin so I don’t even get justifying her. To be controlled in the first place means you’re evil. Bra has had evil intentions which babidi was able use to his advantage. I’m pretty sure you can defy Babidi as well. Dabura defied Babidi by fighting Majin Buu , matter of fact once Dabura saw Majin Buu he didn’t even care about Babidi’s plans anymore he just tried to kill Majin Buu. He told Babidi he would be too powerful to control which he was right . Then we got Vegeta who outright defies Babidi easily and just uses his powers to try and beat Goku but he ends fighting up Buu and dying anyway in a novel meaningless way and finally Cell in the same webcomic defied Babidi and fought Bra. Yet Bra couldn’t do the same as the other characters?

Bra is a teenage girl and lacked the mental stubbornness of Vegeta, Cell and Dabra. Interestingly Babidi also never told Dabra to not fight Buu, Dabra did that because he thought he was protecting Babidi. And no being controlled means you have a negative trait, Bra is very negative but I wouldn't say outright evil. An asshole yes but not evil.

[Fable]

"You wanted his control, that's why you never obeyed him."

... What?

[Jackalope89]

"You wanted his control, that's why you never obeyed him."

... What?

Maybe the translator missed a few words? I mean, its not factually wrong. But out of context, it would make no sense.

[Fable]

I get what the translator was trying to say, but it could have been worded differently. It winds up sounding like an oxymoron.

Anyways, how much are you all willing to bet Vegetto is going to pull a page 742 again by leaving to go sulk and rant about wanting to bash Gotenks skull in even though he was right?

[Lord Frieza]

I'm just gonna repost Ashanark's post from the site as it pretty much says all I want to. I'd tipe myself but It's late, I've got crap to do and get to be d for work.

1. Why is this Gotenks, fused of U16 Goten/U18 Trunks, calling Vegito "father?" Are they that interchangeable? Why is the first time Gotenks has ever been serious ever... to defend Bra? Half of him doesn't know Bra! The other version of him was killed by Bra!

2. "Brainwashed by surprise?" Hmm... if only the story showed us that. Instead of just informing us of the circumstances of Bra's offscreen Majinization and using them as an excuse to completely victimize and forgive her.

3. People originally said Bra wasn't a Creator's Pet because she couldn't resist immediately like Vegeta did, showing her as worse... and now the story's praising Bra for not resisting immediately like Vegeta did, showing her as better. So Bra, who did far worse things as a Majin than Vegeta ever did (Vegeta didn't chop Bulma in half and ask for more), is now morally superior than the man who never killed his family as a Majin (and in fact, hugged them.) And then died to atone. Knowing he'd go to hell.

4. As the cherry on top, we get to see the complete assassination of Vegito's character.

Vegito, who when Bra nearly killed him in space, didn't say a word about it but instead praised her for saving his life. Vegito, who specifically went out of his way to stop Bra from torturing Zangya. Vegito, who specifically took Bra out as a space cop when she was younger to teach her to protect innocents (and specifically made sure she wasn't killing people.) Vegito, who taught Bra special techniques even after she killed billions. Who kept Bra "from lashing out for years." Who Bra damaged in the HTC, yet he didn't even scratch in return. Who Gohan and Piccolo relied upon to stop Bra when she got out of hand. (Note how this page retcons that into a bad thing?) Who never shot back when Bra insulted him. Whom Bra, when Vegito rescued her from Ginyu, was surprised that he hurt her, showing such behavior was unusual. Who Salagir labeled as a "perfect master" of his emotions. Who went out of his way to protect the Vargas at the tournament despite not being asked to. Who was always worried about his potential offspring being a threat to the universe. Vegito, who is faced with the tough choice of picking either the universe's safety or his daughter, and picked the universe...

...is in the wrong. Completely. And Bra is absolutely guiltless. And apparently no one in U16--not Bulma (whom the story's never cared about enough to give even a single scene with her daughter), or Gohan, or anyone--is in any way at fault. Just Vegito. How is that "morally grey?"
(Note: The U1 Kais killed potential threats as babies to keep the universe safe, purely on the chance they would be a problem, and yet the Kais are still un-Majinizable and therefore pure good. Vegito tries to kill someone with two confirmed killing sprees and he's out-of-line?)
This is the culmination of a months-long retcon, all for Bra's sake. It was clear back in June, and it's only gotten more blatant since. Complete with sympathetic angles, shading, and yes, even googly eyes, now combined with manipulating our instinctive response to seeing a young girl get hit by an adult male. (If Bra were a guy, this scenario would be very different.) We've seen a character with exactly one positive quality--that she shed a tear for Pan once--kill families and friends while laughing and boasting, and had the ability to break free but only did so when her strength was challenged... just receive a full-on pardon with no lasting consequences while her dad gets retconned into an abusive father and thrown under the bus.

...What?

[Fionordequester]

"You wanted his control, that's why you never obeyed him."

... What?

Maybe the translator missed a few words? I mean, its not factually wrong. But out of context, it would make no sense.

I get what the translator was trying to say, but it could have been worded differently. It winds up sounding like an oxymoron.

Actually, the translators probably wanted something different. It's Salagir himself who tends to sabotage things:

http://www.dragonball-multiverse.com/en/page-1257.html

Vegito said "No one in the universe can" should be an is instead of can

FYI, based on some of the other translations, what Vegetto said in the last panel might better be translated to something like: "Even my little Bra can't reach a tenth of my level. No one in any universe can."

This error it my full choice (it may not be a good one, but it's on purpose and not the fault of the english translators ^^).

Here is the discussion that happened between me and my proodreaders:
(Context: He changes "can" to "is" and I say no.)
npberryhill:
This sentence is incomplete. No one in any universe can... can what? That's why I changed it to "is" previously. But I think it can be fixed by changing the previous sentence slightly so it's a direct response the way I think you want. "Even my little Bra can't come close to a tenth of my level." That would make the second sentence work fine I think.
Salagir:
The french version contains the same "error".
The 2 sentences don't fit perfectly with each others: Yes. It's talk. He doesn't prepare his text in advance... It doesn't need to be all calculated and perfectly fitting.
He modify his "argumentation" over time. First, he says she is not strong enough. Then, he adds that well, no one can be that strong enough anyway.
npberryhill:
Okay, cool. I agree we should strive to be as close to the original as possible. Well, if I can, let me suggest we add one word to the end of the second sentence then? "No one in any universe can be." It's small, I don't think it changes meaning, only fixes.
(I still refused, cause i'm a troll)

[Fable]

*snip*

Very well articulated.

Fionordequester, you hit the nail on the head, too: “Bra is the face of DBM; She is to Salagir what Goku was to Toriyama.”

[miguelnuva1]

We were shown the good things about Vegetto first and now we're being shown the Bad.

However someone feels about the story the result is still Vegetto sucked as a parent and now Bra is boiling over and he doesn't know or care to attempt to ring her in.

Bra is the only thing Vegetto has a problem with and his reaction is to just get rid of the problem.

When she lacked control as a little kid he passed her on Gohan, when she killed Goten he makes her handle that on her own.

Good or bad a parent's job is to guide Bra. He just have never given up in the Rosat and while he should have punished her with Goten he shouldn't have said he'd kill her and he should have telelorted her home then made her fix her mess.

If her SS2 is such a problem find a way to seal it with the Dragonballs, or ask Gohan who was also monsterrous in the form to help her.

[FoolsGil]

So tired of Salagir's whataboutism.

[ZeroNeonix]

Umm... Sure, Gotenks. Bra was taken by surprise, so she's not technically responsible. But there's just one tinsy little problem... Babidi's magic only works on people who are evil. If Bra wasn't a monster to begin with, she would have been immune to his mind control. But no, as we've recently seen, she murders her own brother, along with an entire solar system, and doesn't bat an eye. Are we seriously supposed to believe that Bra is actually a good person? Give me a break. She passed the point of no return a long time ago. Making her feel bad about it now doesn't redeem her. It just shows how terribly incoherent this story is.