Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by MasenkoHA » Sun Jun 13, 2021 1:13 am

Raki wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 7:58 pm
Dragon Ball Ireland wrote:
Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:26 am
ABED wrote:
Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:12 am
DBZ clicked. It wasn't the dub that clicked.
Maybe not, but the vast majority of fans in English-speaking countries today started with the dub. I say if it introduced them to this franchise and they checked out the Japanese version later the dub did something right. Evidently it's still a major selling point for the home releases that a lot of people still want.
I don't understand why people refuse to admit that. For DBZ I prefer the Japanese version but it's obvious the dub was a monster hit in the USA
Literally no one is refuting this. The argument is if Funimation’s changes and executive decisions were necessary to make Dragon Ball popular in America.

Spoiler: Not at all

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by Aim » Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:08 am

SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Wed Jun 09, 2021 9:19 pm
Aim wrote:
Wed Jun 09, 2021 9:11 pm
I’d be so angry if I was the One Piece creator or Toei if this is what I saw a foreigner do to my creation.
Yeah, it really makes me wonder if Oda saw any of the 4Kids dub back in the day because i'll bet if so he was probably quite mortified by how awful it was and how much the show had been bastardized due to all the rewrites and editing. Thank god FUNi picked it up a few years later because they made an actual good dub which is a world of difference in every respect.

The 4Kids dub was really an unfortunate tragedy, it could've been good but the direction and awful mandated censorship among other things killed it.
It makes me wonder exactly what Toriyama thinks about what has happened in the west to DB. Considering he routed for Nozawa not too long ago in 2013, I’d bet he doesn’t hold the same view on Nozawa not being fit for the role as many English fans feel.

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:15 am

Aim wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:08 am
SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Wed Jun 09, 2021 9:19 pm
Aim wrote:
Wed Jun 09, 2021 9:11 pm


I’d be so angry if I was the One Piece creator or Toei if this is what I saw a foreigner do to my creation.
Yeah, it really makes me wonder if Oda saw any of the 4Kids dub back in the day because i'll bet if so he was probably quite mortified by how awful it was and how much the show had been bastardized due to all the rewrites and editing. Thank god FUNi picked it up a few years later because they made an actual good dub which is a world of difference in every respect.

The 4Kids dub was really an unfortunate tragedy, it could've been good but the direction and awful mandated censorship among other things killed it.
It makes me wonder exactly what Toriyama thinks about what has happened in the west to DB. Considering he routed for Nozawa not too long ago in 2013, I’d bet he doesn’t hold the same view on Nozawa not being fit for the role as many English fans feel.
I've thought of this too, it would be interesting to hear what his thoughts are assuming he's seen at least some of the dub at some point.
DB collection related goals as of now:

1.) Find decent priced copy of Dragon Box Z Vol. 4 (Done)

2.) Collect rest of manga

3.) Get rest of Daizenshuu (2-7)

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by Aim » Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:19 am

SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:15 am
Aim wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:08 am
SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Wed Jun 09, 2021 9:19 pm


Yeah, it really makes me wonder if Oda saw any of the 4Kids dub back in the day because i'll bet if so he was probably quite mortified by how awful it was and how much the show had been bastardized due to all the rewrites and editing. Thank god FUNi picked it up a few years later because they made an actual good dub which is a world of difference in every respect.

The 4Kids dub was really an unfortunate tragedy, it could've been good but the direction and awful mandated censorship among other things killed it.
It makes me wonder exactly what Toriyama thinks about what has happened in the west to DB. Considering he routed for Nozawa not too long ago in 2013, I’d bet he doesn’t hold the same view on Nozawa not being fit for the role as many English fans feel.
I've thought of this too, it would be interesting to hear what his thoughts are assuming he's seen at least some of the dub at some point.
I do remember seeing that he spoke on the French dub if I remember, and he said he couldn’t imagine Goku saying something IIRC. I’m sure Kanzenshuu has it archived

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by Aim » Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:19 am

SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:15 am
Aim wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:08 am
SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Wed Jun 09, 2021 9:19 pm


Yeah, it really makes me wonder if Oda saw any of the 4Kids dub back in the day because i'll bet if so he was probably quite mortified by how awful it was and how much the show had been bastardized due to all the rewrites and editing. Thank god FUNi picked it up a few years later because they made an actual good dub which is a world of difference in every respect.

The 4Kids dub was really an unfortunate tragedy, it could've been good but the direction and awful mandated censorship among other things killed it.
It makes me wonder exactly what Toriyama thinks about what has happened in the west to DB. Considering he routed for Nozawa not too long ago in 2013, I’d bet he doesn’t hold the same view on Nozawa not being fit for the role as many English fans feel.
I've thought of this too, it would be interesting to hear what his thoughts are assuming he's seen at least some of the dub at some point.
I do remember seeing that he spoke on the French dub if I remember, and he said he couldn’t imagine Goku saying something IIRC. I’m sure Kanzenshuu has it archived

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:25 am

Aim wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:19 am
SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:15 am
Aim wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:08 am

It makes me wonder exactly what Toriyama thinks about what has happened in the west to DB. Considering he routed for Nozawa not too long ago in 2013, I’d bet he doesn’t hold the same view on Nozawa not being fit for the role as many English fans feel.
I've thought of this too, it would be interesting to hear what his thoughts are assuming he's seen at least some of the dub at some point.
I do remember seeing that he spoke on the French dub if I remember, and he said he couldn’t imagine Goku saying something IIRC. I’m sure Kanzenshuu has it archived
Interesting, and considering that it was one the earliest foreign dubs produced after the series had premiered in '86 and the French dub scripts were apparently not that great translation wise (plus most of Europe's other dubs adapted them in some form) i'd be interested to hear what he had to say on it at the time.
DB collection related goals as of now:

1.) Find decent priced copy of Dragon Box Z Vol. 4 (Done)

2.) Collect rest of manga

3.) Get rest of Daizenshuu (2-7)

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by MasenkoHA » Sun Jun 13, 2021 10:06 am

Aim wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:08 am
It makes me wonder exactly what Toriyama thinks about what has happened in the west to DB.
He didn’t seen to like Toei making Goku more heroic so I can’t imagine he cared much for Funimation going even further than that.

On the other hand, Funimation did Dr.Gero is the real mastermind of the Red Ribbon army and Jor-El!Bardock well before Toriyama did….

, I’d bet he doesn’t hold the same view on Nozawa not being fit for the role as many English fans feel.
He likes Nozawa as Goku so yeah….

ABED wrote:
Sun May 30, 2021 2:19 pm
Colleen's performance as Gohan and Goku sound very different. Clearly it's the same actor but it's a different characterization and different energy.

I know this was from like two weeks but I want to add I find it funny that Clinkenbeard gets ripped into her Goku and Gohan sounding too similar when , Nadolny’s Gohan for the Ultimate Uncut dub and movies 5-9 ends up sounding like her Goku. It just gets overlooked because the Clint Eastwood rasp is more remembered.


As far as criticisms that Clinkenbeard’s Goku and Luffy sound too similar or Clinkenbeard is basically using her Luffy voice for Goku (which is fitting since Luffy clearly takes inspiration from Goku anyways) I don’t know why that matters. People like Tara Strong and she basically only has one boy voice for all her male characters.

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by GhostEmperorX » Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:16 pm

SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Wed Jun 09, 2021 2:04 pm

You know what the real kicker was about all of this? 4Kids actually wanted to make a more faithful dub but Toei apparently pushed them to butcher it to oblivion in order to get the series onto network TV. That's right, they were so desperate for the series to be a success over here that they shot theselves in the foot by mandating all these things and it was a giant mess which really shouldn't have happened.
Sasuga Toei. Why am I not surprised?

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:22 pm

GhostEmperorX wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:16 pm
SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Wed Jun 09, 2021 2:04 pm

You know what the real kicker was about all of this? 4Kids actually wanted to make a more faithful dub but Toei apparently pushed them to butcher it to oblivion in order to get the series onto network TV. That's right, they were so desperate for the series to be a success over here that they shot theselves in the foot by mandating all these things and it was a giant mess which really shouldn't have happened.
Sasuga Toei. Why am I not surprised?
I know right, some of their decisions like this make no sense to me at all. Or other infamous examples like giving ADV substandard quality second or third generation master tapes of Sailor Moon when the former were doing those subbed releases of the series back in the early 2000's.
DB collection related goals as of now:

1.) Find decent priced copy of Dragon Box Z Vol. 4 (Done)

2.) Collect rest of manga

3.) Get rest of Daizenshuu (2-7)

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by GhostEmperorX » Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:31 pm

SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:22 pm
I know right, some of their decisions like this make no sense to me at all. Or other infamous examples like giving ADV substandard quality second or third generation master tapes of Sailor Moon when the former were doing those subbed releases of the series back in the early 2000's.
Well they were the same ones who were throwing away HQ material while everyone else kept theirs intact. And while they were giving away many of their series to the West in the 80’s to make fake adaptations (most of those were mecha shows), the likes of Sunrise (as I usually bring up) didn’t do that even once for any single one of their shows, and they weren’t about to start either when dubbing began to replace adaptations. It’s how the likes of G Gundam and Wing got to at least avoid adaptation damage as massive as what DB & quite a few other series (also mostly Toei) got. They only got off with a few words changed here & there (the usual suspects such as Devil, Death, God, etc) and additional sound effects. Of course, one word changed is too many but they for the most part retained their integrity unlike just about anything Toei exported.

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:39 pm

GhostEmperorX wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:31 pm
SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:22 pm
I know right, some of their decisions like this make no sense to me at all. Or other infamous examples like giving ADV substandard quality second or third generation master tapes of Sailor Moon when the former were doing those subbed releases of the series back in the early 2000's.
Well they were the same ones who were throwing away HQ material while everyone else kept theirs intact. And while they were giving away many of their series to the West in the 80’s to make fake adaptations (most of those were mecha shows), the likes of Sunrise (as I usually bring up) didn’t do that even once for any single one of their shows, and they weren’t about to start either when dubbing began to replace adaptations. It’s how the likes of G Gundam and Wing got to at least avoid adaptation damage as massive as what DB & quite a few other series (also mostly Toei) got. They only got off with a few words changed here & there (the usual suspects such as Devil, Death, God, etc) and additional sound effects. Of course, one word changed is too many but they for the most part retained their integrity unlike just about anything Toei exported.
Yes, they've done things which i think most other studios wouldn't like junking the broadcast audio tapes especially DB and DBZ. While i can get that at the time when the series were originally aired in the '80s and '90s there wasn't plans in place beyond the original airings and storing 400+ episodes worth would've been massive amounts of space taken up it does make me wish they had put more thought into preserving it all for a time when home releases would be viable for the series.
DB collection related goals as of now:

1.) Find decent priced copy of Dragon Box Z Vol. 4 (Done)

2.) Collect rest of manga

3.) Get rest of Daizenshuu (2-7)

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by Robo4900 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 2:26 pm

ABED wrote:
Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:18 pm
Dragon Ball Ireland wrote:
Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:26 am
ABED wrote:
Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:12 am
DBZ clicked. It wasn't the dub that clicked.
Maybe not, but the vast majority of fans in English-speaking countries today started with the dub. I say if it introduced them to this franchise and they checked out the Japanese version later the dub did something right. Evidently it's still a major selling point for the home releases that a lot of people still want.
This isn't the dub or sub thing. It's a simple matter of the story shining through in spite of the changes. It's not the dub that people are responding to, it's Toriyama's story.
I'm coming back into this a bit late, but I agree 100%.

The English dubs were not so terrible that they completely obscured the great show underneath, and that's what people enjoyed. Dragon Ball is a good show, and Funimation's shit isn't why it's a success, it's a success in spite of Funi's refusal to present the show completely honestly.
The point of Dragon Ball is to enjoy it. Never lose sight of that.

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by Adamant » Tue Jun 15, 2021 5:46 pm

SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:15 am
I've thought of this too, it would be interesting to hear what his thoughts are assuming he's seen at least some of the dub at some point.
Considering his initial "thoughts" on Dragonball Evolution compared to his later comments on it, I can guarantee you what you'd hear from Toriyama would be the following:

1) Toei/Shueisha/whoever is soliciting this comment informs Toriyama that the people asking for his thoughts probably like this dub.
Potential but not required 2) Toriyama actually takes a look at the dub and forms his thoughts on it.
3) Toriyama says something vague and noncommittal but not negative about it.

He was able to make a honest and not very positive comment about the French dub because it's not like anyone in France were ever going to know. The very fact that you think it'd be interesting to hear his thoughts are precisely why you'll never get to hear his thoughts.
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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by MasenkoHA » Tue Jun 15, 2021 6:08 pm

I like that in 10 pages way more was discussed about the quality of the Z dub than the original Dragon Ball.

I guess that’s more of a testament to how low end middle of the road it is. Not quite as mind numbingly bad as Z and GT but far far worse than Kai and even Super.

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 6:59 pm

Adamant wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 5:46 pm
SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:15 am
I've thought of this too, it would be interesting to hear what his thoughts are assuming he's seen at least some of the dub at some point.
Considering his initial "thoughts" on Dragonball Evolution compared to his later comments on it, I can guarantee you what you'd hear from Toriyama would be the following:

1) Toei/Shueisha/whoever is soliciting this comment informs Toriyama that the people asking for his thoughts probably like this dub.
Potential but not required 2) Toriyama actually takes a look at the dub and forms his thoughts on it.
3) Toriyama says something vague and noncommittal but not negative about it.

He was able to make a honest and not very positive comment about the French dub because it's not like anyone in France were ever going to know. The very fact that you think it'd be interesting to hear his thoughts are precisely why you'll never get to hear his thoughts.
Ok then, good to know. I guess that is what i would figure he'd most likely say about it, or the English dub or whatever other x dub out there.
DB collection related goals as of now:

1.) Find decent priced copy of Dragon Box Z Vol. 4 (Done)

2.) Collect rest of manga

3.) Get rest of Daizenshuu (2-7)

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by Adamant » Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:22 pm

I mean we already know he doesn't like his characters being "reinterpreted" to do or say things he doesn't think they'd do or say, so it's not like he'd need to watch any particular heavily rewritten dub for us to know what his genuine thoughts on their script is going to be.
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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by DrBriefsCat » Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:51 pm

Passable for Toonami back in 2001, but really showing its age today since Kai's dub showed Funi can handle the franchise better. The voices were a mixed bag and the adaptation was too sanitized for TV-Y7 (although understandable).

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by MasenkoHA » Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:56 pm

DrBriefsCat wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:51 pm
Passable for Toonami back in 2001, but really showing its age today since Kai's dub showed Funi can handle the franchise better. The voices were a mixed bag and the adaptation was too sanitized for TV-Y7 (although understandable).
I wouldn’t say the edited dub was too sanitized for a TV-Y7 rating. The problem is the uncut dub is TV-14 (the same rating Family Guy gets) and is overtly sanitized

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by DrBriefsCat » Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:33 pm

MasenkoHA wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:56 pm
DrBriefsCat wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:51 pm
Passable for Toonami back in 2001, but really showing its age today since Kai's dub showed Funi can handle the franchise better. The voices were a mixed bag and the adaptation was too sanitized for TV-Y7 (although understandable).
I wouldn’t say the edited dub was too sanitized for a TV-Y7 rating. The problem is the uncut dub is TV-14 (the same rating Family Guy gets) and is overtly sanitized
I meant too sanitized for use in an uncut dub, because Funi just lazily ported over dialog from the edited version on Toonami.

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Re: Opinions on the original Funi Dragon Ball dub

Post by MasenkoHA » Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:39 pm

DrBriefsCat wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:33 pm
MasenkoHA wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:56 pm
DrBriefsCat wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:51 pm
Passable for Toonami back in 2001, but really showing its age today since Kai's dub showed Funi can handle the franchise better. The voices were a mixed bag and the adaptation was too sanitized for TV-Y7 (although understandable).
I wouldn’t say the edited dub was too sanitized for a TV-Y7 rating. The problem is the uncut dub is TV-14 (the same rating Family Guy gets) and is overtly sanitized
I meant too sanitized for use in an uncut dub, because Funi just lazily ported over dialog from the edited version on Toonami.
I mean the thing is they didn’t? There was enough dialog differences between the two often completely tame dialog in the uncut dub would be even more tame in the edited version. It seemed like the sanitized uncut dub was produced first and the Toonami safe version was further edited down from that

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