DBZ Audio Better when it aired... again...

[ShadowDude112]

Staff Edit- Topic about the 'new' series broke off into discussion of the DBZ audio, this is about where it happened.

Dragon Ball Hoshi? That title sounds awfully ridiculous to me, a native Japanese speaker. There is no doubt that this is fake.

Well you would know best as your VHS recordings are fake and you faked people out of rare dubs. So, hey, takes one to know one.

OT: I would think this would've been cool if it was real, but it's not. So, whatever. We got Kai which is not a new series but marketed as one so, take that as you wish.

[Metalwario64]

your VHS recordings are fake.

Did I miss something?

[Taku128]

Dragon Ball Hoshi? That title sounds awfully ridiculous to me, a native Japanese speaker. There is no doubt that this is fake.

Well you would know best as your VHS recordings are fake and you faked people out of rare dubs. So, hey, takes one to know one.

Hahaha damn dude, that's a real stretch of a link to the topic in a desperate attempt to justify making a post just to bash another user.

your VHS recordings are fake.

Did I miss something?

kei17 has posted screencaps and audio samples from VHS (or betamax or something I forget) recordings of the original broadcast of Z and claimed they showed the superior quality of the original broadcast and that the Dragon Box isn't as great as people claim. Other posters have given reasons why both of these claims are false, and I believe someone proved that he'd tampered with the audio to make it sound better.

[ThunderPX]

I believe someone proved that he'd tampered with the audio to make it sound better.

I don't think that's possible.

[MarcFBR]

I believe someone proved that he'd tampered with the audio to make it sound better.

I don't think that's possible.

It's more possible than you would think.

I'm not an audio person, but I tweaked some Z audio for less than five minutes and had multiple people convinced it sounded better (far better, to the extent a few of them assumed I had made up the "I'm just gonna tweak it real quick as an example.") And audio isn't even my thing.

At the slow rate he gives out clips, it's reasonable to believe he could do far better.

Something who does audio more than me could point out some 'issues' with the clips he gives out (if anyone at Daizex deals with audio that is), in that something most definitely does sound off about them in a way that doesn't necessarily match to what you expect it to on a VHS (and the issues seem to line up with the issues that crop up in the clips I edited also.)


It isn't proof that he 'did' mind you (someone else may have done a more in depth check of the audio and come to that conclusion) but something definitely sounds off to me.


The bigger proof to me is that despite the obvious technical know how of how to he doesn't just digitize it all. He digitizes small amounts over a large period of time. So it's either tweaked, in which case anyone could do it themselves and it's therefore worthless, or B- He actually does somehow have a magical VHS collection that no one else in Japan has even a single episode of, and he clearly doesn't intend to share outside of bragging, in which case, it's still worthless, because it'll never be digitized to the extent that Toei or anyone else would take it seriously to use.



Edit- After Taku brought it up, I found my comparison

http://db-destiny.net/DboxAudioComparison.rar

Unlike what I suggest before, where I only spent a few minutes doing this (with only a small idea what I was actually doing...), this was actually found in a secret lab, one mile under the earths crust, where it seemed to have been stored for hundreds of years, possibly having been sent back in time for DBZ fans. You are the first people to hear what will no doubt be the future of the DB franchise.

[Puto]

No offense, but that sounds pretty bad imo.

[Pokewhiz7]

But what is this about "rare dubs"?

[MarcFBR]

No offense, but that sounds pretty bad imo.

My mistake actually.

According to Taku those are kei's, not my tweaks.

Oops...

(I actually thought those were mine, but Taku thinks they are kei's 'lost tapes'.)

edit- haha! What fun. Rach has confirmed the zipped files I link to ARE my quicky test.

[Pokewhiz7]

My post disappeared, sorry if this is a double post.
What is this about "rare dubs"?

[Puto]

No offense, but that sounds pretty bad imo.

My mistake actually.

According to Taku those are kei's, not my tweaks.

Oops...

(I actually thought those were mine, but Taku thinks they are kei's 'lost tapes'.)

They still sound like shit.

[kei17]

Meh, believe what you want to. Please just keep this on-topic. Or else Mike will warn us soon.

If you really knew a way to make the optical audio sound better such easily, you'd take a patent on that and be a billionaire.

[MarcFBR]

They still sound like shit.

And had I spent the time to not just tweak stuff almost at random they might sound better.

[Chibi Mystic Gohan]

But what is this about "rare dubs"?

http://daizex.fanboyreview.net/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=9573

Old drama. Some of these guys said Kei never sent them DVDs, which is unfortunate.

[jpdbzrulz4sure]

Other posters have given reasons why both of these claims are false, and I believe someone proved that he'd tampered with the audio to make it sound better.

[citation needed]

...or B- He actually does somehow have a magical VHS collection that no one else in Japan has even a single episode of...

First of all, it's not at all unthinkable for someone to have recorded the entire series on VHS during the original run. DBZ aired in the late '80s and early '90s. Recording on tape was an existing concept.

Second, who ever said that Kei was the only one in Japan to have recordings of the original run? I'm pretty sure plenty of people over there who were devoted fans and saw the show from start to finish recorded it, but perhaps most have scrapped the tapes in favor of the Dragon Boxes or singles.

One more thing, if Kei doesn't have recordings of the original run in his posession, how do you explain how he has the original opening animations from episodes 1-16 and 200-201, with their animation goofs and episodes 1-3's different font size and positioning of the credits intact, which were present ONLY in the original run?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x08tjv9F ... detailpage

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16uL4Yy9 ... detailpage

And let's not forget about this.

[KiddoCabbusses]

Other posters have given reasons why both of these claims are false, and I believe someone proved that he'd tampered with the audio to make it sound better.

[citation needed]

...or B- He actually does somehow have a magical VHS collection that no one else in Japan has even a single episode of...

First of all, it's not at all unthinkable for someone to have recorded the entire series on VHS during the original run. DBZ aired in the late '80s and early '90s. Recording on tape was an existing concept.

Second, who ever said that Kei was the only one in Japan to have recordings of the original run? I'm pretty sure plenty of people over there who were devoted fans and saw the show from start to finish recorded it, but perhaps most have scrapped the tapes in favor of the Dragon Boxes or singles.

One more thing, if Kei doesn't have recordings of the original run in his posession, how do you explain how he has the original opening animations from episodes 1-16 and 200-201, with their animation goofs and episodes 1-3's different font size and positioning of the credits intact, which were present ONLY in the original run?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x08tjv9F ... detailpage

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16uL4Yy9 ... detailpage

And let's not forget about this.

I don't think the disbelief is so much about the idea that they could've been recorded, but the idea that these tapes (which I'm still confused over whether they're VHS or Betamax or what) could've survived for a long time without notable audio decay.

I've recorded a ton of dubbed DBZ from Toonami in the past, and the vast majority of the tapes of those had the audio decay -rapidly-, to the point where on my VHS players it usually sounded muffled and quiet. Even the ones that didn't quite do that still don't sound "crisp and clear", y'know? Bits of volume/clarity jumping, the occasional VHS Tracking, jumping from Hi-Fi to Lo-Fi... these are all comon issues with VHS Audio Decay. It's not like a digitally-recorded/stored file where the file's the same quality no matter how many times it is played, copied, etc.

Course, on the other end of it, it wasn't like I was an obsessed fan who anal-retentively stored my VHSes in cold storage so they wouldn't decay or anything like that. It's always possible that there's legitimacy to this.

[ThunderPX]

Geez, I didn't expect one of my random asides to spin off into its own topic. Oh well, here's my opinion on the matter:

No offense, but Marc's tweaked clip sounds worse, if anything. Increasing the bass and volume doesn't make the sound better, nor does it fix any of the problems with the original DBox audio, such as clipping and excessive sibilance... which I seriously doubt is even possible since there is essentially missing audio data which can't be recreated. Although there are some apps that will calculate what a clipped peak might have originally sounded like, I've never been able to get adequate results out of it.

And I totally agree that it's kind of weird that VHS from the early 90s still sounds so great, but I just don't believe any sort of audio remastering process applied to the DBox audio results in something with as much clarity and fidelity as the Piccolo vs. Cell clip kei17 posted way back when.

[TonyTheTiger]

I've recorded a ton of dubbed DBZ from Toonami in the past, and the vast majority of the tapes of those had the audio decay -rapidly-, to the point where on my VHS players it usually sounded muffled and quiet. Even the ones that didn't quite do that still don't sound "crisp and clear", y'know? Bits of volume/clarity jumping, the occasional VHS Tracking, jumping from Hi-Fi to Lo-Fi... these are all comon issues with VHS Audio Decay. It's not like a digitally-recorded/stored file where the file's the same quality no matter how many times it is played, copied, etc.

Course, on the other end of it, it wasn't like I was an obsessed fan who anal-retentively stored my VHSes in cold storage so they wouldn't decay or anything like that. It's always possible that there's legitimacy to this.

It also may depend on the recording quality. As a kid with limited resources, I always taped TV shows on EP simply because I needed the space, quality be damned. That 6 hours looked awfully attractive to a kid recording his favorite cartoons every Saturday morning (or running back and forth to Blockbuster, raiding the anime section). Of course looking at them now those tapes look and sound like total ass but it got the job done back then.

While it might be the exception rather than the norm, I can at least entertain the idea that somebody taping the show on the SP setting, properly storing the tapes, and rarely watching them could pull them out 20 years later to very little quality loss. And if we're talking Betamax then it becomes even more likely.

At least, I can vouch that a bunch of retail VHS tapes I have still hold up pretty damn well after all these years. Lots of late 80s/early 90s stuff like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Denver the Last Dinosaur, Rescue Rangers, and a plethora of movies.

[Rukura]

And if we're talking Betamax then it becomes even more likely.

To add to that statement, a YouTube user from Portugal called LUSITANIATV has been uploading (for quite a while now) commercials and clips from shows of ye olden days of our country (we're talking 20 and 30 year-old stuff here) from tape formats such as VHS and Betamax.
And lot of that content is virtually lossless, simply because it's been well preserved.

If a tape in a 2nd world country can be stored for over 20 years with very minimal quality loss...i fail to understand why the same can't happen in Japan

[coola]

On my metalcoola Youtube channel,you can find few very old VHS recordings from Polish TV (Oldest is from 1991) Both audio and video are in similar quality they used to be,since 1st airing,so yes,it is possible

[SSJ2Engels]

While it might be the exception rather than the norm, I can at least entertain the idea that somebody taping the show on the SP setting, properly storing the tapes, and rarely watching them could pull them out 20 years later to very little quality loss. And if we're talking Betamax then it becomes even more likely.

At least, I can vouch that a bunch of retail VHS tapes I have still hold up pretty damn well after all these years. Lots of late 80s/early 90s stuff like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Denver the Last Dinosaur, Rescue Rangers, and a plethora of movies.

Kei said he thinks the tapes are in EP mode, not SP.

Here is the link to the post: http://www.daizex.fanboyreview.net/view ... 37#p289037.

EDIT: This topic wasn't really the most appropriate place (there are better options) for my second point so I flat out erased it. Just to clarify. This point about the mode of the tapes might still be relevant and/or informative through...