Unpopular DB opinions

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by ABED » Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:45 pm

Forte224 wrote:
ABED wrote:Equal in terms of what? I'm looking for a short one sentence answer. You may have explained, but it's not clear.
In terms of their character, which Freeza calls into question when Tagoma acts cowardly at fighting the Saiyans. All in Super, the movie I can't explain.

2 sentences.
Okay, that's just flat out incorrect. Sorbet was not talking about their character. He was referring to their strength. You misunderstood the quote.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Forte224 » Thu Apr 19, 2018 6:02 pm

ABED wrote:
Forte224 wrote:
ABED wrote:Equal in terms of what? I'm looking for a short one sentence answer. You may have explained, but it's not clear.
In terms of their character, which Freeza calls into question when Tagoma acts cowardly at fighting the Saiyans. All in Super, the movie I can't explain.

2 sentences.
Okay, that's just flat out incorrect. Sorbet was not talking about their character. He was referring to their strength. You misunderstood the quote.
It's not, I'm referring to the scene in Super. You're the one that's incorrect. Freeza contrasts Sorbet's point about Tagoma being equal with Zarbon and Dodoria by pointing out Tagoma's cowardice. That's all there is to go by, and it's spelled out very clearly.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Super_Divine_Genki » Fri Apr 20, 2018 11:41 am

Regarding the Piccolo VS Shisami discussion, the exact word from the film that was used is "comparable". Sorbet says something about the two being excellent fighters comparable to Zarbon and Dodoria. That would lead me to assume that he's referring to fighting ability, and not character traits or rank. :/

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by jeffbr92 » Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:35 pm

SingleFringe&Sparks wrote:I agree they completely dropped the ball on Gohan for the TOP. I don't understand what was so noble about 17, choosing life over a boat. How hi-tech does a boat have to be to require the Super Dragonballs? Its hard not to laugh at how ridiculous that whole thing is.
Makes me wonder what was the freaking point of that:

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Vegeta_Sama » Fri Apr 20, 2018 5:18 pm

jeffbr92 wrote:
SingleFringe&Sparks wrote:I agree they completely dropped the ball on Gohan for the TOP. I don't understand what was so noble about 17, choosing life over a boat. How hi-tech does a boat have to be to require the Super Dragonballs? Its hard not to laugh at how ridiculous that whole thing is.
Makes me wonder what was the freaking point of that:

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To make us understand that he'll never get SS Blue :lol:
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Turnip » Wed Apr 25, 2018 9:51 am

This probably isn't that unpopular, but I basically don't care about Dragon Ball Z's plot at all after the Android arc. The obsession a lot of fans seem to have with ridiculously overpowered transformations is something I can't relate to in the slightest, I don't give a heck who the "most powerful warrior in the universe" is and I'm not even that fond of the fights-- it's the context that makes them interesting, and that's why I stopped caring after the Cell Games, which were disappointing and just fell flat in my opinion, especially after the Saiyan, Frieza and Android arcs.

My favourite parts of DBZ are the goofy, fun adventure hijinks, even though they often had nothing to do with Toriyama himself, they captured the spirit of the original series in a way that I loved. Goku's Other World adventures might be my favorite B-Plot in the series, and I could have watched 100 episodes of him and North Kai's antics. They do exist in the canon, though-- Namek's game of cat-and-mouse between Vegeta, Frieza, Krillin and Gohan was great, even if it was comparably more serious in tone. Really, I just wish DBZ had stayed truer to the original series in this regard. I've only watched the first 10 episodes of DBS but so far but it's been refreshingly comedic, though I'm not really expecting that to last. Once again, I couldn't give a flying nimbus about "Super Saiya-jin God" or whatever.

The Super Saiya-jin was amazing the first time, when it became 'de facto' of the franchise it lost all mystique, made the Kaio-ken and basically everyone who wasn't a Saiya-jin irrelevant, and the constant need to one-up the action resulted in things like Goteks and the SSJ3 transformation which I absolutely hate. For real though, I'll never stop being upset that we lost THIS.

[spoiler]Image

Image[/spoiler]

Though really, I guess I should be thankful that Kaio-ken was never overplayed the way SSJ was. It had it's moment and it was awesome, and that's enough. If only the rest of the series had this much restraint! Sideline: hey, remember when Dragon Ball was about martial arts and not just ridiculous planet-destroying transformation bullshit? That was great. For my final bitch-fest I'll just say that I think art was best between the Piccolo Jr. and Namek arcs. It was round and expressive, there was a 'softness' to it that I loved, which also made the violence seem more brutal, I've added some GIFs so you can hopefully see what I mean. The later art isn't 'bad' so much as I don't find it as appealing.

[spoiler]Image

Image

Image

Image

Image[/spoiler]

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Exline » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:46 pm

Turnip wrote:This probably isn't that unpopular, but I basically don't care about Dragon Ball Z's plot at all after the Android arc. The obsession a lot of fans seem to have with ridiculously overpowered transformations is something I can't relate to in the slightest, I don't give a heck who the "most powerful warrior in the universe" is and I'm not even that fond of the fights-- it's the context that makes them interesting, and that's why I stopped caring after the Cell Games, which were disappointing and just fell flat in my opinion, especially after the Saiyan, Frieza and Android arcs.
Yeah I don't think this is too unpopular.

I do love the Cell Saga, but that doesn't mean it flawless. The constant change from villain to villain was a bit odd, as well as the escalation of power levels to greater heights. At this point, I'm not sure which Arc broke the power ceiling in Dragon Ball.. Frieza Saga or Cell Saga. I think the Cell Saga excels in storytelling somewhat compared to the other arcs. I still feel the Buu Arcis the worst offender when it comes to storytelling and battles and character usage.

And I agree with you that overpowered transformations are sort of what made me lose interest Dragon Ball prior to Super. It was the same thing over and over again and at some point for me, it got ridiculous and I didn't want to watch it anymore. That doesn't mean I hate transformations though. I thought they were great and would love to see more of it implemented. They don't need to be ridiculously overpowered. Dragon Ball fails at balancing the power ceiling, which is what lead us from martial arts champions to universe busting super-humans.
My favorite parts of DBZ are the goofy, fun adventure hijinks, even though they often had nothing to do with Toriyama himself, they captured the spirit of the original series in a way that I loved. Goku's Other World adventures might be my favorite B-Plot in the series, and I could have watched 100 episodes of him and North Kai's antics. They do exist in the canon, though-- Namek's game of cat-and-mouse between Vegeta, Frieza, Krillin and Gohan was great, even if it was comparably more serious in tone. Really, I just wish DBZ had stayed truer to the original series in this regard. I've only watched the first 10 episodes of DBS but so far but it's been refreshingly comedic, though I'm not really expecting that to last. Once again, I couldn't give a flying nimbus about "Super Saiya-jin God" or whatever.
Nah man, Super does well with that goofy side Dragon Ball had. It gets bad in the FT Saga but thats the only time in the anime where I find DB Humor to be extremely annoying.
The Super Saiya-jin was amazing the first time, when it became 'de facto' of the franchise it lost all mystique, made the Kaio-ken and basically everyone who wasn't a Saiya-jin irrelevant, and the constant need to one-up the action resulted in things like Goteks and the SSJ3 transformation which I absolutely hate. For real though, I'll never stop being upset that we lost THIS.

[spoiler]Image

Image[/spoiler]

Though really, I guess I should be thankful that Kaio-ken was never overplayed the way SSJ was. It had it's moment and it was awesome, and that's enough. If only the rest of the series had this much restraint! Sideline: hey, remember when Dragon Ball was about martial arts and not just ridiculous planet-destroying transformation bullshit? That was great. For my final bitch-fest I'll just say that I think art was best between the Piccolo Jr. and Namek arcs. It was round and expressive, there was a 'softness' to it that I loved, which also made the violence seem more brutal, I've added some GIFs so you can hopefully see what I mean. The later art isn't 'bad' so much as I don't find it as appealing.

[spoiler]Image

Image

Image

Image

Image[/spoiler]

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Alruneia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 3:14 pm

Exline wrote:At this point, I'm not sure which Arc broke the power ceiling in Dragon Ball... Frieza Saga or Cell Saga.
Definitely the Frieza arc. Frieza on his own destroys the power ceiling five times over. First he's over four times as strong as his strongest underling (Ginyu), then he has a second form that's about twice as strong as that, then a third form that dwarfs the second form, and then a final form even stronger than that again, and then it's revealed that he's only using a small percentage of his full power? He breaks the scaling so many times that it's a mouthful. We jump from 120,000 in Ginyu to (supposedly) 120,000,000 in Frieza. Over the course of one long fight. That is extreme, and part of why it's so hard to give good power level numbers beyond Frieza's second form 1,000,000 figure.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by WittyUsername » Fri Apr 27, 2018 10:10 pm

I didn't really care for this scene (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzdsEsbkbic). I didn't mind them bringing in the guys from Team Four Star, but did we really need to have Lanipator deliver a "IT'S OVER 9000" joke?

In general, I'm not too crazy about including references to old memes in an official Dragon Ball dub. It just seems like a really tacky thing to do. It comes across as trying too hard to make longtime fans of the series laugh.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Vegeta_Sama » Sat Apr 28, 2018 11:46 am

WittyUsername wrote:I didn't really care for this scene (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzdsEsbkbic). I didn't mind them bringing in the guys from Team Four Star, but did we really need to have Lanipator deliver a "IT'S OVER 9000" joke?

In general, I'm not too crazy about including references to old memes in an official Dragon Ball dub. It just seems like a really tacky thing to do. It comes across as trying too hard to make longtime fans of the series laugh.
Well, I heard they removed it.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Dbzfan94 » Sat Apr 28, 2018 7:24 pm

Vegeta_Sama wrote:
WittyUsername wrote:I didn't really care for this scene (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzdsEsbkbic). I didn't mind them bringing in the guys from Team Four Star, but did we really need to have Lanipator deliver a "IT'S OVER 9000" joke?

In general, I'm not too crazy about including references to old memes in an official Dragon Ball dub. It just seems like a really tacky thing to do. It comes across as trying too hard to make longtime fans of the series laugh.
Well, I heard they removed it.
They did. And good riddance too.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by MasenkoHA » Sat Apr 28, 2018 8:12 pm

WittyUsername wrote:I didn't really care for this scene (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzdsEsbkbic). I didn't mind them bringing in the guys from Team Four Star, but did we really need to have Lanipator deliver a "IT'S OVER 9000" joke?

Ih.
Funimation seems to be waay into that meme though. Even though it’s expiration date was like 2009

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Ripper 30 » Sun Apr 29, 2018 11:54 am

DragonBallKing wrote:
8000 Saiyan wrote:
DragonBallKing wrote: Oh yeah forgot about him, kinda weird that he sounded so half assed. Love his Dabura and Crocodile tho.
Direction maybe? I would have preferred if Ginga had voiced him.
I'm pretty sure Ginga didn't even voice anyone in Kai, in OG Z he only voiced King Vegeta and Bora in a couple of scenes. Maybe Toei was just trying to save money on Kai
Unshō Ishizuka could have done a good Cold Daio in Kai.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Jord » Wed May 02, 2018 10:27 am

WittyUsername wrote:I didn't really care for this scene (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzdsEsbkbic). I didn't mind them bringing in the guys from Team Four Star, but did we really need to have Lanipator deliver a "IT'S OVER 9000" joke?

In general, I'm not too crazy about including references to old memes in an official Dragon Ball dub. It just seems like a really tacky thing to do. It comes across as trying too hard to make longtime fans of the series laugh.
Wow, I hadn't seen that before. That's just pathetic. I thought Funimation was supposed to grown up by now and no longer fill their dub with inaccuracies, bad comedy and straight up deviations?

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Forte224 » Wed May 02, 2018 10:49 am

Dbzfan94 wrote:
Vegeta_Sama wrote:
WittyUsername wrote:I didn't really care for this scene (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzdsEsbkbic). I didn't mind them bringing in the guys from Team Four Star, but did we really need to have Lanipator deliver a "IT'S OVER 9000" joke?

In general, I'm not too crazy about including references to old memes in an official Dragon Ball dub. It just seems like a really tacky thing to do. It comes across as trying too hard to make longtime fans of the series laugh.
Well, I heard they removed it.
They did. And good riddance too.
Haha, agreed.
Jord wrote:
WittyUsername wrote:I didn't really care for this scene (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzdsEsbkbic). I didn't mind them bringing in the guys from Team Four Star, but did we really need to have Lanipator deliver a "IT'S OVER 9000" joke?

In general, I'm not too crazy about including references to old memes in an official Dragon Ball dub. It just seems like a really tacky thing to do. It comes across as trying too hard to make longtime fans of the series laugh.
Wow, I hadn't seen that before. That's just pathetic. I thought Funimation was supposed to grown up by now and no longer fill their dub with inaccuracies, bad comedy and straight up deviations?
Sadly, that was just for Kai 1-98. With BoG and Kai TFC they started to creep that stuff back in there. Now in Super it's gotten more prevalent, even complete with Vegeta making a Yamcha joke. Lol memes!!! Amirite?

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Hyena_Yamcha » Wed May 02, 2018 1:13 pm

MasenkoHA wrote:
Forte224 wrote:I'm not the biggest fan of Cha-La Head Cha-La. I respect it and everything, but it's just not a song that calls out to me I guess. My favorite in the entire series from Dragon Ball all the way to Super is We Gotta Power by a longshot.
I think Cha-La Head Cha-La is overrated but I dunno still like it over We Gotta Power. Dragon Ball's opening is probably my favorite though and then GT's. Then both of DBZ's.

Also on the subject of unpopular opinions I prefer the English dub of Mystical Adventure and I'll give you romance :shifty:
Wow ! I though i was the only here.

However i do like Cha-La a lot.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Scsigs » Wed May 02, 2018 4:36 pm

Forte224 wrote:Sadly, that was just for Kai 1-98. With BoG and Kai TFC they started to creep that stuff back in there. Now in Super it's gotten more prevalent, even complete with Vegeta making a Yamcha joke. Lol memes!!! Amirite?
You are REALLY overstating how they've done the dubs of BoG, Kai TFC, & Super as a whole. Seriously, actually watch their dubs with the subtitles turned on if you have the home releases. 9 times out of 10, they're dead-on with the Japanese in terms of translation. You're focused on isolated incidents that don't represent the dubs' quality overall. Examples you've brought up or are talking about...
TFS being in Kai TFC. Was this a bad thing? I don't think so. If Dragon Ball were owned by a company in Japan that had a sense of humor, or at least realized that it didn't impact the popularity of the main shows & movies overall, I think keeping it in there would've been an option. I mean, look at some of the dubs that based THEIR scripts off the FUNi scripts. They actually kept those lines in their dubs no problem & that was just an improvised 2-minutes of 1 single episode. If you actually look at the symbolism behind the lines (intended or not by the dub team), it's much more than that they brought TFS into the studio to parody that scene (which, that scene was already a parody of Dragon Ball Z, so I don't get what the problem is with people who make their livings thanks to comedy videos).

The Yamcha joke. This is the single line you weigh the entirety of Super's dub against? Not the badass moments where the dub actors (particularly Sean Schemmel) deliver their lines or scream entirely epically to either match or outshine their Japanese counterparts? Not the fact that they got James Marsters to play Zamasu (who gets better by the episode), or the fact that Eric Vale, Sean Schemmel, & James Marsters all play off each other perfectly in episode 61's dub excellently, complete with great lines that, while taking slight liberties, work within the context of an English dub? The Yamcha joke? Really? This is about as spotty as people saying Super has bad animation every episode based only on episode 5 making headline news (I'm not saying Super's without it's animation problems, but, the majority of the time, it's sold for what I expect from it). You're really gonna judge an English dub based on few-second meta jokes that don't show up that often? There are also legitimate problems with Super's writing from the original Japanese version, but the dub's lines are the ones you're focusing on? Wow.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Forte224 » Wed May 02, 2018 5:14 pm

Scsigs wrote:
Forte224 wrote:Sadly, that was just for Kai 1-98. With BoG and Kai TFC they started to creep that stuff back in there. Now in Super it's gotten more prevalent, even complete with Vegeta making a Yamcha joke. Lol memes!!! Amirite?
You are REALLY overstating how they've done the dubs of BoG, Kai TFC, & Super as a whole. Seriously, actually watch their dubs with the subtitles turned on if you have the home releases. 9 times out of 10, they're dead-on with the Japanese in terms of translation. You're focused on isolated incidents that don't represent the dubs' quality overall. Examples you've brought up or are talking about...
TFS being in Kai TFC. Was this a bad thing? I don't think so. If Dragon Ball were owned by a company in Japan that had a sense of humor, or at least realized that it didn't impact the popularity of the main shows & movies overall, I think keeping it in there would've been an option. I mean, look at some of the dubs that based THEIR scripts off the FUNi scripts. They actually kept those lines in their dubs no problem & that was just an improvised 2-minutes of 1 single episode. If you actually look at the symbolism behind the lines (intended or not by the dub team), it's much more than that they brought TFS into the studio to parody that scene (which, that scene was already a parody of Dragon Ball Z, so I don't get what the problem is with people who make their livings thanks to comedy videos).

The Yamcha joke. This is the single line you weigh the entirety of Super's dub against? Not the badass moments where the dub actors (particularly Sean Schemmel) deliver their lines or scream entirely epically to either match or outshine their Japanese counterparts? Not the fact that they got James Marsters to play Zamasu (who gets better by the episode), or the fact that Eric Vale, Sean Schemmel, & James Marsters all play off each other perfectly in episode 61's dub excellently, complete with great lines that, while taking slight liberties, work within the context of an English dub? The Yamcha joke? Really? This is about as spotty as people saying Super has bad animation every episode based only on episode 5 making headline news (I'm not saying Super's without it's animation problems, but, the majority of the time, it's sold for what I expect from it). You're really gonna judge an English dub based on few-second meta jokes that don't show up that often? There are also legitimate problems with Super's writing from the original Japanese version, but the dub's lines are the ones you're focusing on? Wow.
I am very disappointed with, in particular, Super's dub. Obviously the Yamcha line is not my one and only issue. Here are some more, in no particular order:

-Vegeta's "I'm the star of this show" line. An attempt at breaking the fourth wall at worst; a quirky line that Vegeta would never say at best
-Trunks' encounter with 18, when she brings up him killing her in the future, he stutters and doesn't know what to say in Japanese; he replies with "Well it was you or mankind, so yeah" in English in a brash tone. What's the point of this change?
-James Marster's voice is very spotty and sounds good one line and average the next. It also doesn't match the age that Zamasu looks
-Vegeta calling Bulma "babe" is 100% out of character, along with him using "earth speak" in general
-Vale's overall raspiness that started in Kai, got worse in Xenoverse, and is now only slightly better than XV in Super
-Vegeta's "lame show" in TFC
-TFS in TFC, particularly the "Over 9000" meme being included
-Schemmel's Goku Black really lacks the punch Nozawa's had. To be fair, I don't think anybody could play him better than her
-Sabat's Vegeta sounds way worse than he did in Kai. He's way more gruff, it's like he's trying to find a mid point between Kai 1.0 and the Funi re-dubs

These aren't everything. There are a lot though, and for me, they really add up over time. You may say the lines don't change the overall story, but technically neither did Funi's original Superman Goku. He still became a Super Saiyan and defeated Freeza. But it altered his character, which I'm not a fan of. This is what these altered lines do to the characters. Subtlety is everything when it comes to establishing a character, and the dub slightly altering things (that require no altering) actively messes with those subtleties.

No idea why you're so upset with me though. I won't attack you for liking it but I also don't have to sit and accept the things that you're ok with. If Kai 1.0 never existed I would've probably been more accepting of Super's current dub, but Funi proved they can do an accurate script that we could all love before, and changed it for no reason now.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Scsigs » Wed May 02, 2018 6:38 pm

Forte224 wrote:I 99.9% hate this term and almost never use it, but it feels accurate here: Triggered.

Yes, I am very disappointed with, in particular, Super's dub. You're being purposefully naive if you think my one and only issue is the Yamcha line. Here are some more, in no particular order:

-Vegeta's "I'm the star of this show" line. An attempt at breaking the fourth wall at worst; a quirky line that Vegeta would never say at best
-Trunks' encounter with 18, when she brings up him killing her in the future, he stutters and doesn't know what to say in Japanese; he replies with "Well it was you or mankind, so yeah" in English in a brash tone. What's the point of this change?
-James Marster's voice is very spotty and sounds good one line and average the next. It also doesn't match the age that Zamasu looks
-Vegeta calling Bulma "babe" is 100% out of character, along with him using "earth speak" in general
-Vale's overall raspiness that started in Kai, got worse in Xenoverse, and is now only slightly better than XV in Super
-Vegeta's "lame show" in TFC
-TFS in TFC, particularly the "Over 9000" meme being included
-Schemmel's Goku Black really lacks the punch Nozawa's had. To be fair, I don't think anybody could play him better than her
-Sabat's Vegeta sounds way worse than he did in Kai. He's way more gruff, it's like he's trying to find a mid point between Kai 1.0 and the Funi re-dubs

These aren't everything. There are a lot though, and for me, they really add up over time. You may say the lines don't change the overall story, but technically neither did Funi's original Superman Goku. He still became a Super Saiyan and defeated Freeza. But it altered his character, which I'm not a fan of. This is what these altered lines do to the characters. Subtlety is everything when it comes to establishing a character, and the dub slightly altering things (that require no altering) actively messes with those subtleties.

No idea why you're so upset with me though. I won't attack you for liking it but I also don't have to sit and accept the things that you're ok with. If Kai 1.0 never existed I would've probably been more accepting of Super's current dub, but Funi proved they can do an accurate script that we could all love before, and changed it for no reason now.
It's not that I'm triggered, it's just that my problem is that I don't understand how some of their script choices are particularly bad. Now that you expand these thoughts, I still don't agree with most of them, but some of them, I can see. It's just that I feel people nitpick things that don't harm the overall product. Maybe it's the fact that I'm more so dissatisfied with the bad choices of some of the writing of Super in general, but I find the dub better than some of the people on here are giving it credit for & the things people are focusing on feel more like nitpicks than actual criticisms. Kai's dub also made some references to TFS, but you don't see people remembering that little detail. It's also had people do some acting choices, or even casting choices, that aren't that good, yet you don't hear people complaining about those. There are also small inconsistencies in Kai that also indirectly impact the later dubs (such as attack names going back to their original Japanese ones at first, then suddenly switching back to their English dub names later for no reason). It's even to the point that someone literally on this forum said to me, unironically, that they thought Kai's dub reused every line from the Z dub, just somewhat rewritten, when they clearly wasn't the case. Kai's dub is excellent, but it's not without its minor flaws, or what you could call flaws. I find it laughable that people compare TFC & Super's dubs to Kai's, yet Kai's just as guilty of taking some creative liberties as the others. Seriously, it's so ironic that you can complain about the smallest joke or inconsistency here, yet say Kai was free of them.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Forte224 » Wed May 02, 2018 8:23 pm

Scsigs wrote:
Forte224 wrote:I 99.9% hate this term and almost never use it, but it feels accurate here: Triggered.

Yes, I am very disappointed with, in particular, Super's dub. You're being purposefully naive if you think my one and only issue is the Yamcha line. Here are some more, in no particular order:

-Vegeta's "I'm the star of this show" line. An attempt at breaking the fourth wall at worst; a quirky line that Vegeta would never say at best
-Trunks' encounter with 18, when she brings up him killing her in the future, he stutters and doesn't know what to say in Japanese; he replies with "Well it was you or mankind, so yeah" in English in a brash tone. What's the point of this change?
-James Marster's voice is very spotty and sounds good one line and average the next. It also doesn't match the age that Zamasu looks
-Vegeta calling Bulma "babe" is 100% out of character, along with him using "earth speak" in general
-Vale's overall raspiness that started in Kai, got worse in Xenoverse, and is now only slightly better than XV in Super
-Vegeta's "lame show" in TFC
-TFS in TFC, particularly the "Over 9000" meme being included
-Schemmel's Goku Black really lacks the punch Nozawa's had. To be fair, I don't think anybody could play him better than her
-Sabat's Vegeta sounds way worse than he did in Kai. He's way more gruff, it's like he's trying to find a mid point between Kai 1.0 and the Funi re-dubs

These aren't everything. There are a lot though, and for me, they really add up over time. You may say the lines don't change the overall story, but technically neither did Funi's original Superman Goku. He still became a Super Saiyan and defeated Freeza. But it altered his character, which I'm not a fan of. This is what these altered lines do to the characters. Subtlety is everything when it comes to establishing a character, and the dub slightly altering things (that require no altering) actively messes with those subtleties.

No idea why you're so upset with me though. I won't attack you for liking it but I also don't have to sit and accept the things that you're ok with. If Kai 1.0 never existed I would've probably been more accepting of Super's current dub, but Funi proved they can do an accurate script that we could all love before, and changed it for no reason now.
It's not that I'm triggered, it's just that my problem is that I don't understand how some of their script choices are particularly bad. Now that you expand these thoughts, I still don't agree with most of them, but some of them, I can see. It's just that I feel people nitpick things that don't harm the overall product. Maybe it's the fact that I'm more so dissatisfied with the bad choices of some of the writing of Super in general, but I find the dub better than some of the people on here are giving it credit for & the things people are focusing on feel more like nitpicks than actual criticisms. Kai's dub also made some references to TFS, but you don't see people remembering that little detail. It's also had people do some acting choices, or even casting choices, that aren't that good, yet you don't hear people complaining about those. There are also small inconsistencies in Kai that also indirectly impact the later dubs (such as attack names going back to their original Japanese ones at first, then suddenly switching back to their English dub names later for no reason). It's even to the point that someone literally on this forum said to me, unironically, that they thought Kai's dub reused every line from the Z dub, just somewhat rewritten, when they clearly wasn't the case. Kai's dub is excellent, but it's not without its minor flaws, or what you could call flaws. I find it laughable that people compare TFC & Super's dubs to Kai's, yet Kai's just as guilty of taking some creative liberties as the others. Seriously, it's so ironic that you can complain about the smallest joke or inconsistency here, yet say Kai was free of them.
Well first of all, I did edit the "triggered" and "naive" out of my post. I was a bit taken aback at the reply and responded in a way I shouldn't have. Apologies. I can't remember a TFS reference in Kai 1.0. And, sure, it had creative liberties too (and I never did like them changing attack names mid series) but they weren't anywhere near as obvious. It's taste really, and in my case, I feel what seem like nitpicks or things that don't really matter are actually subtle character quirks that alter my perception of them. But, we can at least both agree that we're way better off than we were back in the late 90s, early 00s when it comes to localization and dubbing.

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