Unpopular DB opinions

[sunsetshimmer]

Didnt like the new Broly movie. Half the movie was the history of the Sayians which we allready saw several times - the other half was Broly Power Maximummest! Dont mind all the struggles and training and new transformations Goku and Vegeta went through in the last 50 years - Broly just surpasses all of this within 10 Minutes....

But, but....at least he didn't fight Goku because he cried as a kid! New version fights him because...well, why exactly? I mean entire Goku crying thing was silly, but at least there was ANY reason for their fight. New movie just puts Goku there to fight Broly for no reason. They wanted revenge on Vegeta, but they forgot it's a new Broly and made him rush at Goku.

Yeah, that movie was dumb as hell and i can't understand people bashing OG Broly but praising this one. People were laughing for years how op old Broly was because his LSSJ form was able to trash every SSJ1 in sight. New Broly only needs regular SSJ to trash two SSJBs and apparently it all makes sense now. Don't even start with entire "new Broly is more inteligent and isn't just screaming around" which is complete bullshit as it's actually opposite.

The best and basically only good part of that movie was the prologue with saiyans + Frieza's wish was actually funny.

[Scsigs]

Didnt like the new Broly movie. Half the movie was the history of the Sayians which we allready saw several times - the other half was Broly Power Maximummest! Dont mind all the struggles and training and new transformations Goku and Vegeta went through in the last 50 years - Broly just surpasses all of this within 10 Minutes....

Canonically, not a lot has been shown of the Saiyans. In Z filler & the original Bardock TV special, yeah, but not from Toriyama himself. Considering how contradictory all of the material written by the anime staff could be, I'm ok with Toriyama establishing what's official, even if Minus is complete trash & I prefer how Bardock was in the original special.

[Hypersayian]

Yeah, that movie was dumb as hell and i can't understand people bashing OG Broly but praising this one. People were laughing for years how op old Broly was because his LSSJ form was able to trash every SSJ1 in sight. New Broly only needs regular SSJ to trash two SSJBs and apparently it all makes sense now.

Yeah people not caring about powerscaling/powerjumps or consistency can just shut off their brain and enjoy the movie - critical people not so much. OG Broly was pretty OP but at least he went from a PL of 10 000 as a baby to "just" Perfect Cell Level with the LSSJ transformation.

This Broly goes from a pl of 870 or so? transforms into a SSJ and surpasses SSJ1 - SSJ2 - SSJ3 - SSJ4 - SSJG- SSJGSSJ.....

Sure the animation was good, the fights very awesome - the soundtrack not so much " Broly, Broly,Broly - Gogeta, Gogeta,Gogeta" - but his ridiculous OP´ness achieved without any explanation within MINUTES was just to much.

[Dbzk1999]

But, but....at least he didn't fight Goku because he cried as a kid! New version fights him because...well, why exactly? I mean entire Goku crying thing was silly, but at least there was ANY reason for their fight. New movie just puts Goku there to fight Broly for no reason. They wanted revenge on Vegeta, but they forgot it's a new Broly and made him rush at Goku.

You’re making it sound like Broly didn’t specifically target Vegeta at the beginning of the fight.

Sure the animation was good, the fights very awesome - the soundtrack not so much " Broly, Broly,Broly - Gogeta, Gogeta,Gogeta" - but his ridiculous OP´ness achieved without any explanation within MINUTES was just to much.

Uh, there IS an explanation. He’s established as a mutant (just like his Z Counterpart) early in the film. He trained for around what, 40+ years with his father, and was already at that level because of it. The reason he starts off “low” is because he literally doesn’t know how to actually utilise his power until he goes against Goku and Vegeta (due to only having Paragus to spar with for the majority of his life)

[Hypersayian]

Uh, there IS an explanation. He’s established as a mutant (just like his Z Counterpart) early in the film. He trained for around what, 40+ years with his father, and was already at that level because of it. The reason he starts off “low” is because he literally doesn’t know how to actually utilise his power until he goes against Goku and Vegeta (due to only having Paragus to spar with for the majority of his life)

Sorry but this is a bs "explanation". Broly "trained" with his father who by the time they were rescued was as strong as Nappa - and at his prime perhaps as strong as Goku when he fought Nappa - Pl of 8000. Even if he is as strong as Super Perfect Cell by the beginning of his fight (how?) Within MINUTES he surpasses SSJ1/2/3 Buu Saga Vegito in his base, within MINUTES after that he becomes an SSJ who is thousands or Octillions of times stronger than SSJ3 Buu saga Goku.This is beyond stupid, makes less than 0 sense and as @ sunsetshimmer has pointed out thousands of times worse than original Broly who people complaned was OP.

[Koitsukai]

Within MINUTES he surpasses SSJ1/2/3 Buu Saga Vegito in his base, within MINUTES after that he becomes an SSJ who is thousands or Octillions of times stronger than SSJ3 Buu saga Goku.This is beyond stupid, makes less than 0 sense and as @ sunsetshimmer has pointed out thousands of times worse than original Broly who people complaned was OP.

I'm not so sure Broly surpassed Z Vegito in his base form.
I seriously doubt that, that only happens when he enters his ikari form, which is like turning into a giant ape but still looking like a person, and proves to be more than a challenge for SSG but not enough for SSB.
But in his base he is only SS-SS2 level (and gets beaten up, too), with power inflation and all, Vegeta's SS should be Z SS3 level. And even before Broly goes full ikari mode, he gets injected with some of that power a few times to help him fight Vegeta without "transforming", so his performance in his base form isn't purely because of his base power.

Broly has 3 advantages, he has an incredible base form, equivalent to a SS2 perhaps, due to being a freak of nature, he has his humanoid ape transformation (which may or may not be another unique trait of being a freak of nature), and can turn SS on top of all of that.

[Hypersayian]

I'm not so sure Broly surpassed Z Vegito in his base form.

Base Vegeta before the Zamasu arc was vastly superior to SSJ3 Gotenks. By the Broly movie base Vegeta/Goku are much stronger - so at minimum SSJ1 Buu saga Vegito probably SSJ3 Buu saga Vegito+. Broly managed to keep up with a serious base Vegeta so he ist SSJ1 Vegito level minimum in his base. Up from Captain Ginyu? Android 17? Perfect Cell level? In minutes....

[Koitsukai]

I'm not so sure Broly surpassed Z Vegito in his base form.

Base Vegeta before the Zamasu arc was vastly superior to SSJ3 Gotenks. By the Broly movie base Vegeta/Goku are much stronger - so at minimum SSJ1 Buu saga Vegito probably SSJ3 Buu saga Vegito+. Broly managed to keep up with a serious base Vegeta so he ist SSJ1 Vegito level minimum in his base. Up from Captain Ginyu? Android 17? Perfect Cell level? In minutes....

You are talking about crazy anime with filler episodes that don't have Toriyama's intent behind them, but when the anime follows Toriyama's plotlines, it uses the manga scaling where there's no Toei filler scaling. One example: SS2 Trunks can't be stronger than Vegito out of the blue, well, everybody who makes base Goku sweat a little should be above Vegito in the anime, and several people do so, so following what the anime established brings us to impossible scenarios like the one you are rightfully having issues with.
But that would be discussing the anime, and that's not the point.

The movie follows both continuities or none of them if you will, which would be the most apt conclusion (one would think the movie is closer to the manga because Toriyama is involved in it), and by being written by him we can be sure no insane base forms or filler anime episodes were taken into account. The Potaefu arc shouldn't be factored into the Broly movie, meaning base Vegeta is as strong as he was in the manga, which isn't much stronger than he was in Z.

[Hulk10]

Pretty sure Vegeta is now way stronger than he was during the Buu Saga.

[Hellspawn28]

I like Moro and I consider him to be a good villain. Yeah, he is a rehash of Piccolo Daimo, but they did something different with him. He uses magical powers and he was the first villain that Goku felt scared by. I also feel like that he has nothing in common with Cell other than he absorbed someone to become powerful. I wish Toriyama thought of him sooner because him stealing up Elder Kaioshin in the Z Sword would make more sense than Beerus doing it.

[Hulk10]

The dragon ball wikia has some good info even if it has its flaws. Wikia is not necessarily a bad thing. I run some wikias and they have good information.

[SupremeKai25]

I like Moro and I consider him to be a good villain. Yeah, he is a rehash of Piccolo Daimo, but they did something different with him. He uses magical powers and he was the first villain that Goku felt scared by. I also feel like that he has nothing in common with Cell other than he absorbed someone to become powerful. I wish Toriyama thought of him sooner because him stealing up Elder Kaioshin in the Z Sword would make more sense than Beerus doing it.

I find it very difficult to think that Goku wasn't scared when Cell was going to blow up the planet, or when Majin Buu blew up the Earth, or when Zamasu blew up the entire cosmos...

[WittyUsername]

I also feel like that he has nothing in common with Cell other than he absorbed someone to become powerful. I wish Toriyama thought of him sooner because him stealing up Elder Kaioshin in the Z Sword would make more sense than Beerus doing it.

His ability to drain the energy out of living things is pretty similar to Imperfect Cell. Also, was it Toriyama who conceived of Moro? I thought he was Toyatoro’s idea?

[Hellspawn28]

We don't know for sure, but it's possible that Toriyama help out with the idea and Toyatoro wrote the story. The current manga arc is set right after the Moro arc ended and it has references to it.

[Scsigs]

Even though I still don't like the Buu Saga's English dub for Z, as it's still a mostly bad translation with a mostly bad script adaptation of said translations, & really bad direction for the actors of said scripts, it still has some decent lines that I actually think are decent. Not a lot, but some.

[Ringworm128]

Power levels and verses debates are good and fun actually.

[Scsigs]

I don't hear this said at all, but Budokai 2's rendition of the Time Chamber is my favorite across all DB media. Rather than having the plain white void, it has a nice aurora borealis effect to it with nice blues, greens, & sparkle effects that make it more visually distinct & pleasing to the eye than the normal one from the manga & show. I genuinely wish that would be the canon depiction of it & it's 1 of the reasons I'm sad Budokai 2 didn't get an HD remaster.

[Dbzfan94]

But, but....at least he didn't fight Goku because he cried as a kid! New version fights him because...well, why exactly? I mean entire Goku crying thing was silly, but at least there was ANY reason for their fight. New movie just puts Goku there to fight Broly for no reason. They wanted revenge on Vegeta, but they forgot it's a new Broly and made him rush at Goku.

Yeah, that movie was dumb as hell and i can't understand people bashing OG Broly but praising this one. People were laughing for years how op old Broly was because his LSSJ form was able to trash every SSJ1 in sight. New Broly only needs regular SSJ to trash two SSJBs and apparently it all makes sense now. Don't even start with entire "new Broly is more inteligent and isn't just screaming around" which is complete bullshit as it's actually opposite.

I agree 100%. Really shows how Toriyama's name and pretty animation changes someone's view. it's hypocritical honestly.

[TobyS]

But, but....at least he didn't fight Goku because he cried as a kid! New version fights him because...well, why exactly? I mean entire Goku crying thing was silly, but at least there was ANY reason for their fight. New movie just puts Goku there to fight Broly for no reason. They wanted revenge on Vegeta, but they forgot it's a new Broly and made him rush at Goku.

Yeah, that movie was dumb as hell and i can't understand people bashing OG Broly but praising this one. People were laughing for years how op old Broly was because his LSSJ form was able to trash every SSJ1 in sight. New Broly only needs regular SSJ to trash two SSJBs and apparently it all makes sense now. Don't even start with entire "new Broly is more inteligent and isn't just screaming around" which is complete bullshit as it's actually opposite.

I agree 100%. Really shows how Toriyama's name and pretty animation changes someone's view. it's hypocritical honestly.

His power scaling is a stretch. Although being a mutant like the ginyus, plus being a stronger race to start with, plus being a legendary super Saiyan like Kale and OG Broly, plus training with his dad for years and surviving on a harsh planet toughening him up, plus the rage boost of his dad dying, plus toriyama also establishing saiyans can get stronger the longer fights go on..... Kinda almost are enough combined.

As for his motivation that's head and shoulders better.

It's a familial grudge, his dad wants to kill the Vegetas and his abusive father orders him to attack vegeta. He's also still loyal to The freeza force, they don't know he killed the Saiyans but the saiyan govt had effectively betrayed him already anyway. Goku gets involved because he literally wants to fight Broly and jumps in. We literally see it on screen.

That's far better than a baby crying or some bullshit and it's dishonest to put those in the same league.

[MasenkoHA]

But, but....at least he didn't fight Goku because he cried as a kid! New version fights him because...well, why exactly? I mean entire Goku crying thing was silly, but at least there was ANY reason for their fight. New movie just puts Goku there to fight Broly for no reason. They wanted revenge on Vegeta, but they forgot it's a new Broly and made him rush at Goku.

Yeah, that movie was dumb as hell and i can't understand people bashing OG Broly but praising this one. People were laughing for years how op old Broly was because his LSSJ form was able to trash every SSJ1 in sight. New Broly only needs regular SSJ to trash two SSJBs and apparently it all makes sense now. Don't even start with entire "new Broly is more inteligent and isn't just screaming around" which is complete bullshit as it's actually opposite.

I agree 100%. Really shows how Toriyama's name and pretty animation changes someone's view. it's hypocritical honestly.

His power scaling is a stretch. Although being a mutant like the ginyus, plus being a stronger race to start with, plus being a legendary super Saiyan like Kale and OG Broly, plus training with his dad for years and surviving on a harsh planet toughening him up, plus the rage boost of his dad dying, plus toriyama also establishing saiyans can get stronger the longer fights go on..... Kinda almost are enough combined.

As for his motivation that's head and shoulders better.

It's a familial grudge, his dad wants to kill the Vegetas and his abusive father orders him to attack vegeta. He's also still loyal to The freeza force, they don't know he killed the Saiyans but the saiyan govt had effectively betrayed him already anyway. Goku gets involved because he literally wants to fight Broly and jumps in. We literally see it on screen.

That's far better than a baby crying or some bullshit and it's dishonest to put those in the same league.

All of this.

I don’t seem to remember the Super Broly pretending Broly has any special hatred for Goku. Goku was just in the way.

That is leagues better than trying to create some deep rooted hatred for Goku because he wouldn’t stop crying in the nursery .

And I watched Z movie 8 about a month ago, it’s better than I remembered, honestly better than the 4 movies preceding it. But Super Broly is still the better movie in every aspect.