Unpopular DB opinions

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by PurestEvil » Sun Mar 14, 2021 5:08 am

goku the krump dancer wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 1:10 am She's the toddler child of two side characters, how much personality do you expect her to have?
thus proving her unnecessary presence
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Soppa Saia People » Sun Mar 14, 2021 5:24 am

i mean she's just kinda there to flesh out the world and krillin's and #18 relationship. she doesn't really add anything to the story but i wouldn't really expect her too, it's like saying umigame is pointless and saying he's worthless as a character. do either need to exist ? not really, but they make the group feel a bit more fleshed out.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by PurestEvil » Sun Mar 14, 2021 6:14 am

Soppa Saia People wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 5:24 am i mean she's just kinda there to flesh out the world and krillin's and #18 relationship. she doesn't really add anything to the story but i wouldn't really expect her too, it's like saying umigame is pointless and saying he's worthless as a character. do either need to exist ? not really, but they make the group feel a bit more fleshed out.
umigame was a comic relief character and introduced Goku to Roshi. That is a pretty damn important role he had.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by DestructoDisc » Sun Mar 14, 2021 8:01 am

PurestEvil wrote: Tue Mar 09, 2021 7:35 am Marron is useless and could have been excluded without any revision. She is there to look cute
So she's basically a female Goten except she can't fight. At least as far as we know Toriyama never once forgot that she existed lol.

I think saying that Goten sucks would count more as an unpopular opinion considering he's the son of the main character, got way more scrrentime than Marron and has a lot more fans than her.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by goku the krump dancer » Sun Mar 14, 2021 1:27 pm

PurestEvil wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 5:08 am
goku the krump dancer wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 1:10 am She's the toddler child of two side characters, how much personality do you expect her to have?
thus proving her unnecessary presence
That's a bit harsh don't you think. She exist to symbolize that Krillin has retired from hardcore martial arts and is now a happy family man, which is something the average person usually strives for. Krillin as well as 18 are fully aware of just how dangerous practicing martial arts at their level can be, in regards to the beings that they attract so they're both seemingly equally reluctant to force little Marron into that lifestyle.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Jord » Tue Mar 16, 2021 4:04 am

goku the krump dancer wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 1:27 pm
PurestEvil wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 5:08 am
goku the krump dancer wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 1:10 am She's the toddler child of two side characters, how much personality do you expect her to have?
thus proving her unnecessary presence
That's a bit harsh don't you think. She exist to symbolize that Krillin has retired from hardcore martial arts and is now a happy family man, which is something the average person usually strives for. Krillin as well as 18 are fully aware of just how dangerous practicing martial arts at their level can be, in regards to the beings that they attract so they're both seemingly equally reluctant to force little Marron into that lifestyle.
Hit the nail right on the head there. She's a more like a symbol than a fleshed out character. Doesn't bother me since the spotlight is already crowded enough. Even if a "new generation" Dragon Ball would be produced I can't see her having a big role.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Tue Mar 16, 2021 10:54 am

I've noticed a lot of people saying they wished Toriyama had let the Saiyan characters keep their monkey tails. I, for one, think most Saiyans look much better without tails, the adults especially. I get that the tails gave them some unique alien quality, but purely on an aesthetic level, I agree with Toriyama's own assessment that the tails just get in the way. Would Goku's dramatic touchdown to save the gang from Nappa look any cooler with a tail flopping around behind him? Would Future Trunks look better with one? I don't think so, personally. As the Saiyans increase in power, it also makes sense for them to slowly shed their primal characteristics that held them back. I can make an exception for Super Saiyan 4 (as well as that unused concept art for 3, which did look quite cool) since that transformation is naturally all about returning the Saiyans to a primal state.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by MasenkoHA » Tue Mar 16, 2021 2:18 pm

LoganForkHands73 wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 10:54 am I've noticed a lot of people saying they wished Toriyama had let the Saiyan characters keep their monkey tails. I, for one, think most Saiyans look much better without tails, the adults especially. I get that the tails gave them some unique alien quality

It’s not really an alien quality. Just a holdover from the Journey to the West roots now with an in-universe explanation. “Oh Goku had a tail because he’s a member of an alien race that all look like earthlings but with tails”


I don’t even mind that Toriyama decided to ditch them I just wish we got something better than *shrug*



Goku’s tail grew back twice as a kid and then finally Kami-sama had to do some divine intervention to make sure it never grew back. Okay cool. Vegeta’s tail never grows back after losing it once but maybe adults can’t get their tails back after losing them. Fine that works. But then Gohan’s tail only grew back once and then never again (excluding anime exclusive material) and Trunks,Goten, and Bra just never had tails to begin with?


And then there’s the universe 6 Saiyans who just never had tails as an entire race because....uh reasons

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by MyVisionity » Tue Mar 16, 2021 2:40 pm

I'm all for Saiyans keeping their tails if it means more Oozaru and more nudity. There are many places to go with both of those things.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Tue Mar 16, 2021 4:57 pm

MasenkoHA wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 2:18 pm It’s not really an alien quality. Just a holdover from the Journey to the West roots now with an in-universe explanation. “Oh Goku had a tail because he’s a member of an alien race that all look like earthlings but with tails”
I mean, yeah, that is the out-of-universe explanation but Goku and the Saiyans having tails was always signalled as a not-entirely-normal quality that distinguishes them from humans, even before it was revealed Goku was from another world.
I don’t even mind that Toriyama decided to ditch them I just wish we got something better than *shrug*

Goku’s tail grew back twice as a kid and then finally Kami-sama had to do some divine intervention to make sure it never grew back. Okay cool. Vegeta’s tail never grows back after losing it once but maybe adults can’t get their tails back after losing them. Fine that works. But then Gohan’s tail only grew back once and then never again (excluding anime exclusive material) and Trunks, Goten, and Bra just never had tails to begin with?

And then there’s the universe 6 Saiyans who just never had tails as an entire race because....uh reasons
I wish Toriyama had taken the time to properly explain it or at least acknowledge it in the series itself, but his shrug-off explanation from interviews works well enough. I think it was thematically appropriate that the Saiyans gradually grow out of their monkeyness the stronger they become, even the veterans like Vegeta and Gohan. After a certain point, most people just stopped noticing that they were missing anyway. Goten and Trunks were monstrously strong from early ages. While it might've been worthwhile for them to at least mention that they cut off their tails at birth or something, that would probably draw awkward connotations to a mutilation ritual that unfortunately still happens to baby boys in real life...

The U6 Saiyans don't have them simply because they're further evolved past needing them, which isn't that big of a stretch. You would expect some things to be different in a parallel universe. Freeza's (Frost's?) race also seem to have black legs in U6 for some reason, among other subtle differences.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Koitsukai » Wed Mar 17, 2021 9:31 am

LoganForkHands73 wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 4:57 pm The U6 Saiyans don't have them simply because they're further evolved past needing them, which isn't that big of a stretch. You would expect some things to be different in a parallel universe. Freeza's (Frost's?) race also seem to have black legs in U6 for some reason, among other subtle differences.
The U6 saiyans missing their tails explains perfectly(and unintentionally, I think) how they can be that strong without super saiyan, if you consider they might have their ohzaru pawaa blended in with their regular power since birth. Like a non-forced Ikari power up that isn't actually a form.

A U6 saiyan arc Vegeta would be around 180,000 and a Namek arc Vegeta would be in the 10-20 millions. U6 Namek arc Goku would be 30 millions and he had hardly fought 5 decently strong people in his entire life. And their SS would be similar to a mid-late U7 Cell arc SS.

It amuses me when people complain about them, "how can they be so strong??? and why don't they have tails??", when if you apply yourself and mix those two things together, you'll end up with a pretty decent explanation for both complaints.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Yosheets » Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:10 pm

Tenshinhan is just as much of a loser as Yamcha is.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by MasenkoHA » Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:43 pm

Yosheets wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:10 pm Tenshinhan is just as much of a loser as Yamcha is.
Tenshinhan won a martial arts tournament and placed in the semi finals in the next one. Compare to Yamcha who never once placed above the quarterfinals. He also didn’t die to a henchman’s kamikaze attack. So this claim is just factually false.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Yuli Ban » Thu Mar 18, 2021 12:56 am

Koitsukai wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 9:31 am It amuses me when people complain about them, "how can they be so strong??? and why don't they have tails??"
Because it's a fan theory.
A very neat one that I'll probably adopt going forward because I agree it makes a good deal of sense, but it's still a fan theory and not everyone has to accept it.
As of right now, the U6 Saiyans are strong because they're strong.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Kid Buu » Thu Mar 18, 2021 1:32 am

MasenkoHA wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:43 pm
Yosheets wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:10 pm Tenshinhan is just as much of a loser as Yamcha is.
Tenshinhan won a martial arts tournament and placed in the semi finals in the next one. Compare to Yamcha who never once placed above the quarterfinals. He also didn’t die to a henchman’s kamikaze attack. So this claim is just factually false.
Hey man, Yamcha had a sucessful baseball career! :lol:
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by TheQuestioner » Thu Mar 18, 2021 6:40 pm

Yosheets wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:10 pm Tenshinhan is just as much of a loser as Yamcha is.
Ten didn't become a complete joke character.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by ABED » Thu Mar 18, 2021 9:30 pm

TheQuestioner wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 6:40 pm
Yosheets wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:10 pm Tenshinhan is just as much of a loser as Yamcha is.
Ten didn't become a complete joke character.
He also helped out numerous times even if only to provide a momentary distraction at crucial moments.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by 90sDBZ » Fri Mar 19, 2021 8:36 am

Yuli Ban wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 3:41 am But again, this just would've been a silly fantheory that it was Goku's cries that made Broly insane, a troll-worthy answer if not for how aggressively the localization team tripled down on this explanation. They also scrubbed away Broly's insane desire to fight at all costs to instead make him plainly insane. He constantly complements the senshi for their fighting spirit and prowess, suggesting he actually respects them and is really beating them to death because of an instinctive Saiyan battlelust and spontaneous acts of violence. He only becomes insane after he's defeated by Goku, who his Super Saiyan nature now drives him to focus solely on defeating.
The dub version made him into a black-hearted sadist who mocks the senshi at every turn, considers them wastes of blood, and hated Goku from the beginning. Especially in the games.

The fans played the games and read the character bios. They all had this explanation, for many odd years.

TFS didn't do anything that wasn't already there. They just burned it in with memes. But then again their whole shtick from the start was to parody the American dub of DBZ, so of course they were going to lampoon the "Goku's cries made Broly insane" thing. It's seeing their supplemental material, their continued mention of Broly as a tear-driven berserker and as someone who hated Goku because he cried rather than someone he didn't hate at all but rather explosively needed to fight that makes me wonder if they're even aware of Broly's Japanese nature.
This is an interesting take on Broly, but I don't entirely agree. He was already a blackhearted sadist in the original, blowing up the slaves' planet and laughing like a lunatic, licking blood off his face and smiling, taking obvious pleasure in torturing his opponents, repeatedly trying to kill Gohan to spite Goku, and even calling himself a demon.

People on this site have a tendancy to blame every little misconception on Funimation's dub, even when it's completely unfounded.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by MasenkoHA » Fri Mar 19, 2021 9:58 am

90sDBZ wrote: Fri Mar 19, 2021 8:36 am

People on this site have a tendancy to blame every little misconception on Funimation's dub, even when it's completely unfounded.
I will say while Funimation is guilty of a lot of things quite of bit of criticisms leveled at Funimation can be found in Toei as well (Making Goku more heroic, making Gohan a would be fighter like Goku and not would be Scholar, blatantly making shit up that will be contradicted later on)

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Fri Mar 19, 2021 10:33 am

MasenkoHA wrote: Fri Mar 19, 2021 9:58 am
90sDBZ wrote: Fri Mar 19, 2021 8:36 am

People on this site have a tendancy to blame every little misconception on Funimation's dub, even when it's completely unfounded.
I will say while Funimation is guilty of a lot of things quite of bit of criticisms leveled at Funimation can be found in Toei as well (Making Goku more heroic, making Gohan a would be fighter like Goku and not would be Scholar, blatantly making shit up that will be contradicted later on)
Yeah TOEI are no saints by any means. The Battle of Gods arc in Super revealed Beerus did in fact tell Freeza to destroy planet Vegeta, which was originally thought to be Funimation's fault in the Battle of Gods movie. Interestingly Chris Sabat said in his interview with Geekdom that was what was in the translation, which is why they went with the line for the movie.
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