REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

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REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by DBZfan29 » Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:25 am

It seems to me that the only reasons people dislike the original Japanese version is because Goku's got a high pitched feminine voice and, most recently, Freeza sounds "gay." Are there any REAL reasons why some of you dislike the Japanese version? To me, Goku's personality matches Nozawa's voice and I hardly ever realize it's actually a woman voicing him. Freeza was played so well, and for a fan of the American dub to say Freeza sounds "gay" when his voice was butchered by FUNimation is pretty stupid. I'd like a pretty well-thought-out reason.
An interviewer asks, "The soundtrack in Sonic 3 has become legendary. Is it true that you worked with Michael Jackson on it?" Takashi Iizuka kills all of our hopes and dreams by replying, "You know, those are just rumors, and SEGA does not want to say anything about them. So they will forever be just rumors..." WHY!?

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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:30 am

Da soundtrackk soudns liek 80s muisc

- Typical JPN DBZ Hater

But on serious note, I feel this topic is pointless. Why should you let their opinions get your panties in such a bunch? Most of the original FUNifans are morons, anyways.
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DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
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I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.

I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.

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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by VegettoEX » Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:41 am

DBZAOTA482 wrote:Da soundtrackk soudns liek 80s muisc

- Typical JPN DBZ Hater

But on serious note, I feel this topic is pointless. Why should you let their opinions get your panties in such a bunch? Most of the original FUNifans are morons, anyways.
Let this be a perfect example of a post not to make.

(1) If you feel the topic is pointless, you don't need to contribute to it.
(2) If you only have a joke sentence to write, you shouldn't write it in the first place.
(3) If you are just going to wrap it up by insulting people, you shouldn't be a part of this community in the first place.

It's a legitimate question. There's legitimate conversation to be had. It's a conversation that I think very easily dips into "whining" territory, but if you're constructive about it and actually put some thought into your... well, THOUGHTS... it can be pretty darn interesting.
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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by DBZfan29 » Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:42 am

It's not about that; I'm not angry. I'm interested in reading some sophisticated replies as opposed to hearing from friends "oh, Goku sounds like a girl."
An interviewer asks, "The soundtrack in Sonic 3 has become legendary. Is it true that you worked with Michael Jackson on it?" Takashi Iizuka kills all of our hopes and dreams by replying, "You know, those are just rumors, and SEGA does not want to say anything about them. So they will forever be just rumors..." WHY!?

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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by Gyt Kaliba » Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:48 am

While I never hated the original Japanese version, and really love it now, I can at least answer as to why I used to balk at it anyway - the usual attitude fans of that version treat the dub fans.

Back when I was first getting into DBZ, I'd have loved to have some sub fans actually show me why their version was better without them treating me like an idiot for the version I was watching, but that just wasn't the case. Most fans just seemed more pre-disposed to bully the dub fans. Because of that, I avoided the Japanese version of the show for the longest time. If that was how fans of that side were going to treat me, then why would I bother?

So yeah. I'd like to think more dub fans would be willing to give the Japanese version a go if they weren't met with vitriol at every turn. Just saying.
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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by Corpsecreate » Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:50 am

I haven't seen the whole series in Japanese yet (please don't kill me) but from what I have seen, there is A LOT less dialogue than the FUNimation dub. Of course, this is how its meant to be and FUNimation just added whatever they felt like at the time.

I think that since DBZ has so much filler as it is, the lack of dialogue makes it even more 'boring'. Now while I understand that less dialogue can also be a good thing (it can amplify emotions that are meant to be felt), it can also detract from the attention of the viewer in a "hurry up I want stuff to happen" mentality.

And another legitimate complaint (though not related to the actual dub itself) is that the sound quality is TERRIBLE :(

Oh and I do plan on watching it all in Japanese, I'm just holding out until my little project is completed.

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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by VegettoEX » Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:54 am

Gyt Kaliba wrote:So yeah. I'd like to think more dub fans would be willing to give the Japanese version a go if they weren't met with vitriol at every turn. Just saying.
That was certainly the case back then -- the original version was an accepted truth, and to have this incoming (generally 1999-onward) mass of fans coming in and praising what was universally being accepted as utter garbage was... well, everyone was young... and we didn't know what we were doing...

I think the tides turned, though. Fans of the original Japanese version had a wonderful case of bad karma thrown back at them (us!) for years on end when the accepted truth became the FUNimation English "reversioning" rather than the original. English-speaking majority, both online and off, was Casual Fan rather than Fansub Guy.

I thankfully see now-a-days as pretty even, particularly with FUNimation going back and taking such care with Kai. I see lots of long-time dub fans accepting the changes as the changes they were. I see lots of people, even those who don't care for the original Japanese version, not wanting to bank on dub script material when talking about things like "versus" battles or strength comparisons. All the versions exist in this strange parallel universe, and with most people getting older and chilling out a bit, it's only you young rascals coming in that get things all riled up again!

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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by Insertclevername » Mon Oct 08, 2012 11:03 am

When compared to the Funi dub music, you'll notice both versions have distinct atmospheres from each other. The original's soundtrack felt like an homage to 70's martial arts movies and overall had a nice "story telling" atmosphere thanks to Yanami, Jōji's grandfather like voice.

The dub most American's are familiar with feels completely different, unlike other dubs like the Latin version which retained a lot of originals music and tone. The music is more modern and techno which contrast highly to the originals retro sounding tunes. Also, the narrator, Kyle Herbert, has sort of a monster truck rally persona for his narrations. To some, that campy persona is really nostalgic to them.

So, I guess why people (I can only speak for the Funi fans I've encountered) don't like the original is because the original "lacks" some qualities that really make the show a lot of fun for some people.
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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by Gyt Kaliba » Mon Oct 08, 2012 11:06 am

VegettoEX wrote:That was certainly the case back then -- the original version was an accepted truth, and to have this incoming (generally 1999-onward) mass of fans coming in and praising what was universally being accepted as utter garbage was... well, everyone was young... and we didn't know what we were doing...

I think the tides turned, though. Fans of the original Japanese version had a wonderful case of bad karma thrown back at them (us!) for years on end when the accepted truth became the FUNimation English "reversioning" rather than the original. English-speaking majority, both online and off, was Casual Fan rather than Fansub Guy.

I thankfully see now-a-days as pretty even, particularly with FUNimation going back and taking such care with Kai. I see lots of long-time dub fans accepting the changes as the changes they were. I see lots of people, even those who don't care for the original Japanese version, not wanting to bank on dub script material when talking about things like "versus" battles or strength comparisons. All the versions exist in this strange parallel universe, and with most people getting older and chilling out a bit, it's only you young rascals coming in that get things all riled up again!

Fist! Shake! Lawn! Old days!
Haha, actually I'd have to agree with you. Things have calmed down quite a bit compared to how they were when I had those thoughts (back in...early 2000's I guess? Whenever the Trunks episodes onward were new to US TV), and I see lots of fans who like both versions rather than being polarized to just one side of the argument. Myself included there - I'm now at a point where I like the Japanese original as the better product, but find it much easier to watch the dubs more often since I tend to multi-task when I watch stuff.

It'll be interesting as time goes on to see the full effects of the more accurate Kai dub on kids who were first exposed to the franchise through that too, their thoughts when they go back to the Japanese version to find it not incredibly different...and then their shock at dub DBZ if they go there too heh.

But yeah, my comments were definitely regarding an older problem rather than a present one (not one that's rampant now anyway).
Insertclevername wrote:So, I guess why people (I can only speak for the Funi fans I've encountered) don't like the original is because the original "lacks" some qualities that really make the show a lot of fun for some people.
That's something I see in a lot of fans of any entertainment medium actually. Some people just prefer the original (IE the version they saw first) and can't give newer incarnations their fair shake. I've seen it come out a lot in TMNT fans.
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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by dbboxkaifan » Mon Oct 08, 2012 11:07 am

I don't dislike it for any reasons but if there were one, it would be that I can't understand what they're saying and for this I need subtitles.

While watching Doraemon with English subs yesterday, Nobita's mum said "Lunch is ready" or "Food is ready" and while so in Japanese the word "gohan" was used which reminded me of Gohan from DBZ (he didn't exist in DB). :P

What does Doraemon and DBZ both have in common? The music was composed by Shunsuke Kikuchi.
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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by JulieYBM » Mon Oct 08, 2012 11:13 am

If there were 'real' (however one would define that) reasons to hate the 'original Japanese version' then one would really just hate Dragon Ball's cartoons.
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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by Fizzer » Mon Oct 08, 2012 11:17 am

I avoided the Japanese version for quite a long time, praising the dub for making something great out of source material that didn't seem all too good. I thought the music was cheesy and outdated in the few scenes I watched (like Goku's SSJ and SSJ3 transformations) compared to the replacement music which I thought really added feeling to the scenes, and Goku's voice was awful.

Just over a year ago I started watching the series from the beginning (of DB) while switching between audio tracks every so often, but mostly having the dub track on with the subtitles up, so I could get the best of both sets of dialogue. I ended up just watching in Japanese from about the 22nd Tenkaichi Boudoukai onwards. I have been converted to the Japanese version of the series, mostly for the dialogue, but I do think that some parts, such as much of the Buu arc, which I'm viewing now, are actually boring to watch in Japanese. There's too much filler in Z, and some of that filler is just episode after episode of fighting with no real story progress, and it's boring. By inserting dialogue, and maybe also by changing the music, Funimation made these parts of the series much more interesting, and I never found myself not really paying attention with the dub. So that's my complaint about the original version : it doesn't grab my attention very well at times. The Japanese version does have better atmosphere and dialogue, but only when it actually has them.

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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by VegettoEX » Mon Oct 08, 2012 11:29 am

Fizzer, I really like that analysis, and I'm really curious how many people have different/similar experiences with the Majin Buu arc in particular.

For starters, there's no Kai version -- if you're revisiting the series (at least in anime form), you're FORCED to watch the original version. No non-filler for you! Additionally, it's one of the largest musical score shifts in the series. I happen to love all the later-movie and new music introduced, but it's a more clear division than it ever was before with each subsequent arc.

I also wonder how much of it is age. I know I have a really hard time sitting down and watching the show 15+ years after discovering it, and like many folks, the end of the series is what I've watched the least. Particularly after investing so much time into the original manga, that TV experience can be... testing, to say the least. I have less emotional attachment to that part of the anime from seeing it so little back in the day (most of the Buu arc I think I've only watched maybe once via fansubs, minus some of the big stuff like Vegeta vs Buu and some Gotenks material), so I therefore have less fuzzies when RE-watching it.
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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:18 pm

I consider myself a dub fan, but I don't dislike the original Japanese version! Especially after having seen a lot of it. After having watched a lot of the Japanese version for a couple years, I went from disliking it to simply not preferring it. Really what it came down to was that I don't, and still don't, have a sentimental attachment to the Japanese voice cast. I love a lot of the voices, especially Ryo Horikawa as Vegeta and Ryusei Nakao as Freeza, but they're not what the voices that I was introduced to the characters with and, as such, feel like alternate cast members. They're not even bad, I actually believe them to be quite good! They just don't have the sentimentality factor going for them (in my individual case, I mean).

Let's put it this way. When I read the manga, the English dub cast are the voices I hear in my head (I hear Chris Ayres in the case of Freeza, though).

However, I always feel weird participating in "English or Japanese?"-type discussions for DBZ because I'm a bit of a weirdo in that area in that I love elements of both. I can't definitively declare either one to be the perfect viewing experience. I wish there was one version that I could decidedly love and think of as perfect, but alas, I'm a weirdo who prefers a mish-mash of elements of both the English dub and the original Japanese version. I love and prefer the Japanese dialogue, I love and prefer the Japanese music, I love and prefer the overall atmosphere of the Japanese version...and yet when it comes specifically to what voices I hear talking, I love and prefer the English cast. The Kai dub came the closest to realizing this odd mish-mash and, as such, is my favorite way to experience the anime.
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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by Ashura » Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:25 pm

One thing to also point out is there's potentially 3 different experiences now, too:

1.) Original Japanese.
2.) English Dub with the Replacement Music.
3.) English Dub with the Original Music.

I wonder how newbies who are picking up the bricks or got the Dragon Boxes take in the dub with the original music, since the music gives it a completely different tonal shift. Some people have watched it completely through that way on their first time, which is untrue of anyone who watched the dub as it aired.
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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by Gyt Kaliba » Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:39 pm

Ashura wrote:One thing to also point out is there's potentially 3 different experiences now, too:

1.) Original Japanese.
2.) English Dub with the Replacement Music.
3.) English Dub with the Original Music.

I wonder how newbies who are picking up the bricks or got the Dragon Boxes take in the dub with the original music, since the music gives it a completely different tonal shift. Some people have watched it completely through that way on their first time, which is untrue of anyone who watched the dub as it aired.
That was actually how I re-watched the show (some of it for the first time too) when the Season Sets started coming out. Same thing with GT (though I took a looooot more pleasure in cutting out that's dub score than I did Z's). It does clash pretty badly at times, but going to the Japanese music made all three series mesh together better for me, musically I mean. If I watched the original dub scores again, I'd have been going from the fun soundtrack of DB, to the hard rock of DBZ (which switches composers a few times too, making it even weirder), to the pseudo-rap of GT...not exactly my preferred musical experience anymore.
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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:51 pm

VegettoEX wrote:
DBZAOTA482 wrote:Da soundtrackk soudns liek 80s muisc

- Typical JPN DBZ Hater

But on serious note, I feel this topic is pointless. Why should you let their opinions get your panties in such a bunch? Most of the original FUNifans are morons, anyways.
Let this be a perfect example of a post not to make.

(1) If you feel the topic is pointless, you don't need to contribute to it.
(2) If you only have a joke sentence to write, you shouldn't write it in the first place.
(3) If you are just going to wrap it up by insulting people, you shouldn't be a part of this community in the first place.

It's a legitimate question. There's legitimate conversation to be had. It's a conversation that I think very easily dips into "whining" territory, but if you're constructive about it and actually put some thought into your... well, THOUGHTS... it can be pretty darn interesting.
I'm sorry but I don't just like Dub vs. Sub debates. In a scenario like this, the people WOULD very often quickly start to antagonize and belittle the dub and it's fans for liking it then whine about them not liking the Japanese version (I.E. penguintruth), thus starting just another dub-bashing thread.

I should shut up now.
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DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
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I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.

I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.

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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by VegettoEX » Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:58 pm

You're still not contributing anything, and you're still insulting and placing blame on other users for no reason.

It's OK to *NOT* post sometimes.

I don't know how to get that across without being somewhat rude, though I really don't intend it to come across that way. My job here is to foster great conversation, and if you're going to actively work against that, I don't know what else I can possibly do without issuing account warnings (and I really don't think it deserves that).
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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by dbboxkaifan » Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:08 pm

Ashura wrote:One thing to also point out is there's potentially 4 different experiences now, too:

1) Original Japanese version with the Original Music (by Shunsuke Kikuchi)
2) Ocean Cast - English Dub with the Canadian Music (by Ron Wasserman)
3) FUNimation - English Dub with the US Music (by Faulconer Productions)
4) FUNimation - English Dub with the Original Music (by Shunsuke Kikuchi)
Well, it was sort of unfair that you didn't list the Ocean Dub as it's an official English dub too. *fixed*
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Re: REAL Reasons to Dislike the Original Japanese Version

Post by Hellspawn28 » Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:17 pm

From what I've seen that most Americans won't watch it because they are in sub titles. Most Americans just can't get into something that is foreign.
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