Theory for how Trunks+Goten went SSJ

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Theory for how Trunks+Goten went SSJ

Post by Dayspring » Thu Oct 27, 2005 5:00 pm

I went to check fact for a different thread about Saiyans, and chanced upon a blurb from the Narrator that stated, once Goku had finished his training in 100g, that Goku had surpassed the limit that Saiyans can normally achieve. This limit would be a PL between 30,000 and 60,000. It made me come to the conclusion that anytime he entered a state of rage afterwards, he could have gone SSJ.

I think this held true for the kids going SSJ so young. The fact that they were hybrids, added to their intense rivalry and training, made it so that they surpassed the Saiyan limits at a very young age. Entering a state of rage isn't that unbelievable for them considering how comic and immature their characters are. Imagined example:
Trunks: "Dad never lets me train with him at Xg and up! It's not fair!!" **Goes SSJ**
Goten: ""Trunks! You went super saiyan! How come everybody can go super saiyan but me? I wanna go super saiyan too!!" **Cries, but goes SSJ as well**

Even if you feel SSJ is caused by tapping into a ki reserve, by surpassing this limit, it makes it possible for this reserve to have been increased to a point where it simply becomes easier to tap into that reserve.
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Post by h3ndrix2005 » Thu Oct 27, 2005 5:13 pm

I like to think that the reason why Goten & Trunks were able to obtain it so easily was because their fathers were both super saiyans when they were conceived.

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Post by desirecampbell » Thu Oct 27, 2005 5:58 pm

h3ndrix2005 wrote:I like to think that the reason why Goten & Trunks were able to obtain it so easily was because their fathers were both super saiyans when they were conceived.
That's a good theory, but wasn't Trunks concieved before Vegeta went off training in space (where he went super saiyan)?

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Post by h3ndrix2005 » Thu Oct 27, 2005 6:27 pm

I'm not sure, but wasn't that filler? In the manga, Vegeta says he endured a 'training from hell', but he never mentioned space.

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Post by Dayspring » Thu Oct 27, 2005 6:35 pm

h3ndrix2005 wrote:I'm not sure, but wasn't that filler? In the manga, Vegeta says he endured a 'training from hell', but he never mentioned space.
Though it was filler, I still think Trunks was conceived (not born though) prior to Vegeta becoming a Super Saiyan. I think Goku+Vegeta being as powerful as they were simply added to the speed in which Trunks+Goten achieved SSJ, not solely responsible for it.
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Post by The S » Thu Oct 27, 2005 10:22 pm

I'd like to think the following things attributed to them become Super Saiyans earlier than others:

1) They were hybrids.
2) Extreme training (Vegeta trained Trunks specifically for going Super Saiyan, and Son Goten trained with Chi-Chi... 'nuff said!)
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Post by h3ndrix2005 » Thu Oct 27, 2005 10:44 pm

Vegeta trained Trunks specifically for going Super Saiyan
I don't think so; he was training him, but not with the intent of making Trunks turn super saiyan. Why else would he be so surprised when Trunks actually made the transformation?
Son Goten trained with Chi-Chi
Extreme training? From Chi-Chi? LoL, I think not.

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Post by Jerseymilk » Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:20 pm

Actually Chi-Chi did indeed train him, seeing as Goku wasn't exactly around, being dead and all. I think what S meant was that Chi-Chi is a pretty hard taskmaster for anything. :P
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Post by h3ndrix2005 » Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:42 pm

Well, of course Chi-Chi trained him; I just meant that 'extreme' is not the right word to describe her regimen. Piccolo's training methods; now that is extreme.

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Post by Jerseymilk » Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:44 pm

Well like I said, the woman is scary, so in that sense, it is extreme. :lol:
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Post by h3ndrix2005 » Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:48 pm

Beware the frying pan!

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Post by Jerseymilk » Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:59 pm

And that screaming voice with fire in her eyes. XD
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Post by Bejiita » Sun Oct 30, 2005 1:35 pm

Maybe it'd because when the Saiyan blood is mixed with human blood, transforming is easier, like why Gohan was able to reach it at a young age. Also, because Gohan was always studying, Goten was probably training more instead, and as for Chi Chi's temper, wasn't she supposed to have calmed down a lot after Goku died? I don't think her training Goten made him achieve SSJ.

But a possibilty is that Trunks invited Goten to the house and they spent time in the gravity room, Goten did say to Gohan that him and Trunks always play fighting games with each other, and since Goten is younger, Trunks' extra power made Goten train even harder than him, since Trunks trained with Vegeta in the room a lot, he's higher power made Goten fight harder when they sparred, and you know how Saiyan's always get better after they lose, well Goten probably lost most of the fights they had so he was progressing faster than Trunks, although Trunks' abilities were more advanced(like, he could fly first), he probably went SSJ before Goten. Although there is the possibility that Goten went SSJ first, causing Trunks to transform easily after because he's slightly stronger.
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Post by Panda » Mon Oct 31, 2005 8:03 pm

I think it's fairly accurate to say that Goten may have been more powerful then Trunks if given the proper training and resources that Trunks had from the beginning.

As a theory if both boys were able to reach higher levels of power faster then the orginal Saiya-jins and Gohan because of their father's power levels at conception then Goten should easily be able to over power Trunks if both had been trained at the same time and rate. Personally I'm disappointed that Goten ends up slacking off with his training which pretty much throws this possibility out the drain. :(

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Post by Conan the SSJ » Mon Oct 31, 2005 8:15 pm

Goten was conceived well after Goku became a SSJ and while he was training against the Androids, Trunks was conceived while Vegeta was training at his utmost hardest to become a SSJ, let's face it, the boys were born with strong DNA because their Dads were pumping their limits at the max, no pun intended.

On the subject of Goten, I recall Gohan once saying Goten could of been the strongest of them all, I see that as a strong possibility since he was the youngest SSJ (he couldn't even remember when he first transformed), and his fusion with Trunks just shows all the more what kind of potential he had. After the battle with Buu, he evidently underwent more training with Goku as Gohan was to settle down with finishing school and starting a life with Videl, so it's pretty safe to say he was stronger than Trunks by the end of Z. If he would of just trained more rather than merely staying in shape between Z's end and GT's beginning, he may have been the most powerful of them all. Unfortunatly he was still a mere SSJ that couldn't hold a candle to Goku, though he did give Gohan a run for his money when Bebi posessed him. Goten could of been so much more... :(
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A likely story...

Post by Akira » Thu Nov 03, 2005 10:38 pm

The following is my own opinion and evaluation of the topic.

I do not think that Goku or Vegeta's strength at time of conception makes any difference whatsoever. The fact that they are saiyans, and almost all saiyans have great potential would be in effect though.

Gohan had extreme rage power that came to light when he was outraged emotionaly as a child. His power jumped to just over 1300 on the scouters when Raditz scanned him. Gohan was trained by Piccolo, who only had battle power of a few thousand at that time.

The extreme rage powerup comes with those of mixed blood. Saiyan + Human DNA combonation. Imagine kids born later in the series (Trunks and Goten) Who are trained or spar with for fun people whose battle powers are uncalculable by scouters or any device on earth? How fast would they advance to that battle power range Dayspring mentioned of 60,000 most likely to be the necessary minimum requirement to go Super Saiyan?

What would happen when an emotional outburst from one of these boys with such high battle power erupted? You guessed it, they would most likely become Super Saiyans.

It makes the most sense to me this way, and I feel it is a fair assessment of the situation. I also feel it is a much better explanation than that "Thier fathers were Super Saiyans with Super Saiyan chromosomes, therefore thier boys were able to go Super Saiyan from childhood" notion.

Of course, everyone is entitled to thier own opinion. I am just sharing mine.
Last edited by Akira on Thu Nov 03, 2005 11:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by ChaotixXero » Thu Nov 03, 2005 10:47 pm

Gohan was nine when he went SSJ. Why can't Trunks and Goten become SSJ at 7 or 8?

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Post by desirecampbell » Fri Nov 04, 2005 12:19 am

ChaotixXero wrote:Gohan was nine when he went SSJ. Why can't Trunks and Goten become SSJ at 7 or 8?
because Gohan had been in intesive training to become a SuperSaiyan for months before he was able to acheive it. And before that he had been ftraining and fighting for his life for years. Gohan, by this time, is already a veteran warrior who has fought the toughest fighters in the universe. He has experienced hardships and tragedy unlike anything Goten or Trunks have ever seen. They have never been pushed to the point necessary to become super saiyans.

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Post by Duo » Fri Nov 04, 2005 7:08 am

Actually, Gohan wasn't in the room for very long before he managed to assumed the state of Super Saiyan for a few seconds. On the outside, it was about when Cell was becoming complete.

As for reigning and controlling in the form, he did that about the time Trunks was busy not hitting Cell.

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Post by Dayspring » Fri Nov 04, 2005 9:58 am

desirecampbell wrote:
ChaotixXero wrote:Gohan was nine when he went SSJ. Why can't Trunks and Goten become SSJ at 7 or 8?
because Gohan had been in intesive training to become a SuperSaiyan for months before he was able to acheive it. And before that he had been ftraining and fighting for his life for years. Gohan, by this time, is already a veteran warrior who has fought the toughest fighters in the universe. He has experienced hardships and tragedy unlike anything Goten or Trunks have ever seen. They have never been pushed to the point necessary to become super saiyans.
Trunks has been training under high gravities almost all his life. Added to that, he's been sparring with Goten with a competitiveness equal to their fathers on an almost daily basis. Who's to say they didn't go SSJ just months prior to us seeing them as such?
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