What If Eiichiro Oda wrote Dragon Ball?

[Flame Dragon]

True, but Kakashi didn't have any way to change Rin's, his father's, or the world's fate in general, while Obito did have the means to do it right in front of him. It's the easy route to accomplish all of his dreams, who wouldn't do that?

Huh, no one would do that.... If Obito wants his dream world so bad, then he should just find a way to put himself into a permanent genjutsu in which Rin is alive and all is well. But nooooooo. Lets destroy the world for everybody because I hurt inside. Ridiculous.

Keep telling yourself that, love IS powerful.

If your best friend killed your girlfriend/wife that you loved so much you couldn't bear living without her, and then an old man told you "i can give her back to you... and everything else you desire, if you do this for me..."

Then i doubt you would refuse, in fact i'm sure 95% of the human race would accept this.
Because humans can pretend all day long they are not, but they are selfish by nature.

I'm not even talking about Obito here, because he only had a crush so his faceturn was a bit forced... but about "romantic villains" in general
You need to know love and how it hurts to lose someone to understand "romantic villains", i don't even know myself how it would feel but i already know if i losed my loved one i would feel destroyed, desperate and would cry.

The point i'm trying to make, is that most guys that hate Obito are the ones that throught that behind the mask was hiding a badass, saying "Tobi is Kagami! Tobi is Izuna!" ( which would have been kinda retarded ) and then ragequitted because Tobi wasn't who they throught he was.

We can all pretend "I'm hard as a stone and can take any loss and still don't do what Obito did", but i'm sure if they had a terrible loss and a choice they would too follow it.

In short, Obito is not a pussy, it's just the haters that like to pretend they have balls of steel.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Yeah, and if everyone is in a coma or dead I guess there is peace. That's some flawless logic right there.

They are in an world where everyone does whatever he wants, with whoever he wants, becomes whatever he wants, has whatever he wants, and lives for as long as he wants. There would be no war, no death, no poor, no starvation, everything would be perfect for everyone. Who wouldn't want back his loved ones if they were dead? Who wouldn't want back his dead lover, wife, child, friend, or parent? Who wouldn't want to walk again if he has lost his legs? Who wouldn't want to be rich if he was so poor that he can't eat?

[rereboy]

Keep telling yourself that, love IS powerful.

If your best friend killed your girlfriend/wife that you loved so much you couldn't bear living without her, and then an old man told you "i can give her back to you... and everything else you desire, if you do this for me..."

Then i doubt you would refuse, in fact i'm sure 95% of the human race would accept this.
Because humans can pretend all day long they are not, but they are selfish by nature.

I'm not even talking about Obito here, because he only had a crush so his faceturn was a bit forced... but about "romantic villains" in general
You need to know love and how it hurts to lose someone to understand "romantic villains", i don't even know myself how it would feel but i already know if i losed my loved one i would feel destroyed, desperate and would cry.

The point i'm trying to make, is that most guys that hate Obito are the ones that throught that behind the mask was hiding a badass, saying "Tobi is Kagami! Tobi is Izuna!" ( which would have been kinda retarded ) and then ragequitted because Tobi wasn't who they throught he was.

We can all pretend "I'm hard as a stone and can take any loss and still don't do what Obito did", but i'm sure if they had a terrible loss and a choice they would too follow it.

In short, Obito is not a pussy, it's just the haters that like to pretend they have balls of steel.

99% of the people wouldn't want that just on the grounds that its not real. Its a dream. We aren't talking about bringing back with Edo Tensei or that self-sacrifice technique that resurrects people. That would actually make some sense. But an illusion? A dream?

And practically all the other 1% would object to a plan that involved the total destruction of the world. You know, because most of the people, even when hurt, aren't homicidal maniacs hellbent on the destruction of the world.

Yeah, and if everyone is in a coma or dead I guess there is peace. That's some flawless logic right there.

They are in an world where everyone does whatever he wants, with whoever he wants, becomes whatever he wants, has whatever he wants, and lives for as long as he wants. There would be no war, no death, no poor, no starvation, everything would be perfect for everyone. Who wouldn't want back his loved ones if they were dead? Who wouldn't want back his dead lover, wife, child, friend, or parent? Who wouldn't want to walk again if he has lost his legs? Who wouldn't want to be rich if he was so poor that he can't eat?

Its not real. Its fake. Its a dream. Its not a real world. Its making everyone in the world fall into a coma in which they have those dreams. Its nothing more than Naruto's version of the matrix and forcing everyone into the matrix.

And Obito wants to force everyone in the world into it because his love interest died on the job of being a ninja (and that she wanted to do).

[DBZGTKOSDH]

If you have watched Road to Ninja: Naruto The Movie, you will see that it's a very realistic dream.

[rereboy]

If you have watched Road to Ninja: Naruto The Movie, you will see that it's a very realistic dream.

So was the matrix. Does that make it real? Does that make Rin back? Does that make ACTUAL and REAL peace, and not a totally artificial one based on illusion and dreams...?

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Well no, but it is something. It's not real, but it appears to be real.

[TheAldella]

Soooo, if Oda wrote Dragon Ball....

[Flame Dragon]

According to Road to Ninja, it pretty much creates an alternate dimension that you can control however you please. Sure that dimension is just in your head, but it makes no difference.
What we feel in the world is thanks to our brain, even if we live on a fake world, what we would feel would still be real because it's our brain that stimulates us in the first place.

And you answered your question yourself. Nobody would do it because it can't be done in real life. But Naruto was never supposed to be realistic.
If the option to create his dream world was out there in the real world, i already know what would happen
Those who live well in the real world, who are famous, rich and powerful would oppose it.
Those who have a hard life, like they are sick, or lost someone important in their life would seek it.

I just think Obito hate is misproportionate, i think Obito is the least of the problems of the awful, awful war arc.

And i think we can close the subject and go back on topic.

[rereboy]

And you answered your question yourself. Nobody would do it because it can't be done in real life. But Naruto was never supposed to be realistic.
If the option to create his dream world was out there in the real world, i already know what would happen
Those who live well in the real world, who are famous, rich and powerful would oppose it.
Those who have a hard life, like they are sick, or lost someone important in their life would seek it.

And i think we can close the subject and go back on topic

Nobody would oppose if somebody wanted to slip into a coma with pleasant dreams, unless they opposed it on the grounds of opposing self-mutilation. That would be that person's choice.

But practically everybody would oppose others imposing that option on other people, just like practically everyone opposes people imposing harm on others indiscriminately.

Being able to choose such a thing is something that most people in the world would agree on. Like I said, Obito could just find a permanent genjutsu to put on himself, it would be his choice. He's not doing that. He is imposing his dream world on everybody, killing who gets in the way, not caring for people choices or what they think, effectively ending the world because he wants to and because he feels sad for losing a love interest.

I'm sorry, but if you think people in the real world would be OK with people imposing them a fake dream world, giving them no choice, just because they are from a lower social ladder, I'm afraid I believe you are completely wrong... And even with a choice, most would prefer the real world over a fake one.

Obito is a uninteresting, unintelligent and weak villain, and his whole character is basically a emo blowout.

Well no, but it is something. It's not real, but it appears to be real.

So, if the appearance is all that matters, why doesn't he just use a genjutsu on himself? In his mind, everyone would be at peace. But it wouldn't be real? Well, he certainly doesn't seem to care about that factor since his plan for peace is a collective illusion, in which Rin is alive. So, being real only matters for some things and not for others? Hm. Very coherent.

[Flame Dragon]

I'm not saying people would be OK with it (the Shinobi Alliance is certainly not OK with it), i'm just saying it could happen for someone to enforce his own beliefs down to other people. Hell, it happens all the time on the real world.
Especially someone as depressed as Obito, depressed people can't see the light at the end of the tunnel, they think the entire world sucks and there is no hope.
If someone's opinion would be that the world is cruel and humans keep harming each other and it can't be stopped, then they surely would pick an option that allows them to stop it.
You have to understand that in Obito's mind, he's the one that's doing the right thing, and the Shinobi Alliance is evil.
He thinks he will create a world of peace, and he also thinks he can force his vision down on others because he has seen how screwed up the world can be.

Now let's end this debate.

[rereboy]

I'm not saying people would be OK with it (the Shinobi Alliance is certainly not OK with it), i'm just saying it could happen for someone to enforce his own beliefs down to other people. Hell, it happens all the time on the real world.
Especially someone as depressed as Obito, depressed people can't see the light at the end of the tunnel, they think the entire world sucks and there is no hope.
If someone's opinion would be that the world is cruel and humans keep harming each other and it can't be stopped, then they surely would pick an option that allows them to stop it.
You have to understand that in Obito's mind, he's the one that's doing the right thing, and the Shinobi Alliance is evil.
He thinks he will create a world of peace, and he also thinks he can force his vision down on others because he has seen how screwed up the world can be.

Now let's end this debate.

It would be stupid, uninteresting and terrible someone trying to end the world because a love interest died in real life, and its stupid, uninteresting and terrible in Naruto (she wasn't even his girlfriend or his wife...).

And I'm not opposed to villains that want to end the world because they suffered and they think there's no hope... as long as their backstory is good and their motivations are compelling (or they are just crazy and interesting characters). Obito has none of this. Madara, for example, has basically the same goal that Obito has but, even though he's not a great villain, he succeeds at being a little better than Obito.

[SaiyanZ]

Obito's reasoning sucks to me. He's 6 and likes an 11 yr old that doesn't love him back.....and thats true love.....wtf?

[DonZ]

Obito's reasoning sucks to me. He's 6 and likes an 11 yr old that doesn't love him back.....and thats true love.....wtf?

Lol, same here.

[Flame Dragon]

I think Obito and Rin have the same age. In the Kakashi Gaiden they probably were both in their teens.
Anyway i don't care about Obito as a villain, it's clear that he was just a puppet for Madara all the time (especially since he had no problem sacrificing him for the Rinne Tensei.) so even if his reasons suck (they kinda do) he was just a brainwashed idiot with really good acting skills.
Trust me, Obito is the least of the war arc problems. Althrough once the Juubi revival arc starts its gets a little better...

Maybe this topic should be named "If Masashi Kishimoto wrote Dragon Ball"

[SaiyanZ]

I think Obito and Rin have the same age. In the Kakashi Gaiden they probably were both in their teens.
Anyway i don't care about Obito as a villain, it's clear that he was just a puppet for Madara all the time (especially since he had no problem sacrificing him for the Rinne Tensei.) so even if his reasons suck (they kinda do) he was just a brainwashed idiot with really good acting skills.
Trust me, Obito is the least of the war arc problems. Althrough once the Juubi revival arc starts its gets a little better...

Maybe this topic should be named "If Masashi Kishimoto wrote Dragon Ball"

Obito was 13 during the Gaiden. But his feelings for Rin turned into love during the Chunin Exams when he was 6 and she was 11. Madara is on a roll right now tbh, but Obito in general is just terrible. He passes through the boulders somehow....wtf? You need Kamui to do that, and to Kamui, you need Mangekyo Sharingan, which he didn't have. He didn't even to bother to find out why Kakashi stabbed Rin either

[DBZGTKOSDH]

But his feelings for Rin turned into love during the Chunin Exams when he was 6 and she was 11.

Where did you get the ages? Don't they have the same age?

He passes through the boulders somehow....wtf? You need Kamui to do that, and to Kamui, you need Mangekyo Sharingan, which he didn't have.

He didn't pass through them like he does with the Kamui, he slipped physically out of luck.

He didn't even to bother to find out why Kakashi stabbed Rin either

Are you reading the manga? He did find out the reason.

[caejones]

Since no one else is going to do it:

If Oda wrote Dragonball:

• All the anime filler prior to the fight with Freeza (and possibly some therein) would probably be in the manga. (Justification: most of it's world building/references/explanations, which Oda seems to like.)
• Dr. Frappe would either not exist, or be the RRA's "check to be sure that Gero isn't trolling us" spot-checker.
• Instead of shrugging off "Oh, I guess I was the one who killed Grandpa after all", Goku would spend a few pages crying before Vegeta kicks him into a mountain.
• I wouldn't be surprised if there had been three saiyans to fight the Earthlings, just so team shaft could get in a victory.
• Piccolo and Buu references would show up early on, somehow.
• Mecha Freeza's reconstruction will consist of alternating panels of Freeza's head weeping, and gradually more robot parts.
• A significant portion of the fights that do not currently consist of panels of blurry lines and impact waves will be replaced with generic fistycuffs.
• Tiencha / Yamhan becomes canon.

I'd do it for Kishimoto, but I think that'd be harder.

[FortuneSSJ]

Oda is great for creating something so big as one piece but I wouldnt change toriyama

[SaiyanZ]

But his feelings for Rin turned into love during the Chunin Exams when he was 6 and she was 11.

Where did you get the ages? Don't they have the same age?

He passes through the boulders somehow....wtf? You need Kamui to do that, and to Kamui, you need Mangekyo Sharingan, which he didn't have.

He didn't pass through them like he does with the Kamui, he slipped physically out of luck.

He didn't even to bother to find out why Kakashi stabbed Rin either

Are you reading the manga? He did find out the reason.

Kakashi had been said to graduate as a Chunin at age 6 in Part I, if memory serves me right. Rin's I got from a screenshot that one of the admins on the Naruto wikia showed me (they aren't as bad as DB's, don't worry lol)

Somehow slipping through boulders with luck is even more dumber and worse writing than not using Kamui lol

I'm caught up, but to my knowledge Obito doesn't know why. If he does, than he is just bitchmade for not facing reality and understanding that there was a valid reason behind why she had to die. He already is a wuss anyway, it can't hurt him if he does know

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Kakashi had been said to graduate as a Chunin at age 6 in Part I, if memory serves me right. Rin's I got from a screenshot that one of the admins on the Naruto wikia showed me (they aren't as bad as DB's, don't worry lol)

Yeah, but where did you get that Rin is older than Obito? All 3 of them were in the same class, so they should have the same age.

Somehow slipping through boulders with luck is even more dumber and worse writing than not using Kamui lol

Errr... What? He didn't slip through inside them like when he does with Kamui. He

I'm caught up, but to my knowledge Obito doesn't know why. If he does, than he is just bitchmade for not facing reality and understanding that there was a valid reason behind why she had to die. He already is a wuss anyway, it can't hurt him if he does know

That was Kakashi's whole point, that he should accept reality, and that he should accept Rin's decision to sacrifice herself in order to save her village. But Obito decided not to accept her death, and stopped cared about everything that happened in the world, because he was going to create a new world.