Would you move the DB/DBZ split?

[Fizzer]

As we know, the Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z animes are adapted from a single manga series, Dragon Ball. Toei decided to split the two series because of the tone shift that occurred throughout the first 17 volumes.

Do you think another point in the story would be better for the split to occur, for some reason? Would you do away with it completely?

I've always thought I'd like to do away with it completely, but since the Buu arc is so cut off from the rest of the story (and also a bit of a mess in my eyes) I might consider it a good idea to end the first series with the Cell arc. The Freeza arc feels like the end of Goku's personal journey to me, but Gohan's begins in the Saiyan arc and feels like it ends in the Cell arc, and I wouldn't want to cut that up like the original split cut Goku's up.

[thekingfallsdown]

Not me personally. I don't feel like it could work. I honestly think the cut works perfectly. Not because I want their to be a Z portion, but because the whole raditz situation feels to radically different to the rest of dragonball.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

The split shouldn't be there at all. If it had to stay though, it works perfectly where it is.

Splitting Piccolo, even with the time skip, would be dumb. Same with the Saiyan and Freeza Arcs, since they are so closely linked. I guess you could split it with the arrival of Trunks, but the Artificial Human stuff isn't really that far removed from what came before it. That would only leave Buu, and I'd find it asinine to split off just one arc, no matter how different it is in tone or characters.

[thekingfallsdown]

The split shouldn't be there at all. If it had to stay though, it works perfectly where it is.

Splitting Piccolo, even with the time skip, would be dumb. Same with the Saiyan and Freeza Arcs, since they are so closely linked. I guess you could split it with the arrival of Trunks, but the Artificial Human stuff isn't really that far removed from what came before it. That would only leave Buu, and I'd find it asinine to split off just one arc, no matter how different it is in tone or characters.

The only place a split makes sense is during a drastic time split. Hence where it is, and for the Buu arc make the most sense. Maybe before the buu arc would be a good split, I'm unsure. (even if it's short, it is radically different both in terms of tone, pace, and style.)

[jda95]

That really is the best place for a split. Although the "tone shift" toward a darker storytelling begins significantly earlier, at the beginning of the Piccolo Daimao arc, that part of the story still feels very much like a continuation from his previous adventures, and eventually the climax of his childhood battles. Likewise despite having a timeskip resulting in a completely new Goku, the Piccolo Junior arc is still of course very in debt to the previous arc and can't exactly be a cut off point.

Beginning "Z" with the Saiyans makes sense in a lot of ways, from introducing the next generation of heroes with Gohan and having the first (known) extraterrestrial villain rather than an Earth-based threat. Honestly I'm not a fan of a split at all and dislike grouping the series apart when realistically there is a pretty smooth flow between everything, the Saiyans really are the only place to do it.

[Daimakku]

Nah, I thought Toei was spot-on in where to split the series. The arrival of the saiyans truly did shift the feel of the show from comedy and comedy/action to full-on action. It's where things became crazy with the power levels and fighting the strongest fighters in the universe, etc.
Although I wouldn't have minded for Z to begin during the King Piccolo saga either. That's where things really began to shift into full action. King Piccolo was the first truly serious villain with great strength who Goku actually struggled to beat.

At least DB and DBZ have different tones to them, whereas Naruto and Naruto Shippuden feel all the same to me. The only difference between them is that Naruto is all grown up in Shippuden instead of a kid in the original. I really never saw the point of splitting up the two series. I feel like they tried to emulate the DB/DBZ split but it just fails.

[Ajay]

I feel like Toei split the series where they did because of the major time skip rather than relating to anything tonally. Bearing in mind that they wouldn't even be aware of the major and lasting tone shift at this point since the manga was still being written. Coincidentally, it seemed to work out rather well considering how different things ended up being in the long run.

It'd be nice if they'd done away with the split and kept it as a long running series. We potentially wouldn't have had to suffer through the endless flashbacks and explanations created to accommodate an audience who may have missed the first series.

However, you're then looking at a 444 episode long series as opposed to slightly more manageable numbers. These are the type of figures that totally throw off new fans. It's an intimidating and very daunting thing to see and commit too. Look at the number of people who fall back on reading shows like One Piece after seeing the enormous near-700 episodes that have aired already.

It's nice to look at Dragon Ball and think, 'ah, that's only 153 episodes to start with!'. Chances are, if you find yourself really enjoying those initial 153, the extra 291 are going to be far less intimidating; you're going to want to continue if you're hooked enough.

So, I think the split makes sense, I don't think I'd change or remove it.

[UpFromTheSkies]

I wouldn't have split it at all. I remember reading that TOEI split the series and added a Z, the last letter of the alphabet, to signify that this was the last "chapter" of the story and it was going to come to an end soon, but I'm not sure how true that is.

[Freeza Soldier #156]

I wouldn't have split it at all. I remember reading that TOEI split the series and added a Z, the last letter of the alphabet, to signify that this was the last "chapter" of the story and it was going to come to an end soon, but I'm not sure how true that is.

Mostly true; except that it was Toriyama, himself, that came up with the "Z" for that reason.

[Rocketman]

I'd split it before the 23rd Budokai so that it wouldn't be completely forgotten in everything.

[Flame Dragon]

I wouldn't have split it at all. I remember reading that TOEI split the series and added a Z, the last letter of the alphabet, to signify that this was the last "chapter" of the story and it was going to come to an end soon, but I'm not sure how true that is.

Mostly true; except that it was Toriyama, himself, that came up with the "Z" for that reason.

And then GT happened

[trick007z]

No the split is perfect where it is. You have several things going on that make it work.

1. The introduction of Saiyans. From the Saiyan arc on, Saiyans become a prominent feature of the series. The Saiyan characters grow to overwhelm the main cast and push all the humans off to the side. The Saiyan transformations are a huge plot point. It's an ever-present thing after the split.

2. The birth of Gohan. Gohan goes on to become the second lead of the show and his development is strictly established from the Z split on.

3. From this point on the entire series features arcs where it ultimately is about a no holds barred, high stakes, battle for the safety of Earth or the universe. Tournaments aren't important, no armies, etc. Battles become everything. It's battle, lose, train, return stronger, transform, etc.

[Daimakku]

No the split is perfect where it is. You have several things going on that make it work.

1. The introduction of Saiyans. From the Saiyan arc on, Saiyans become a prominent feature of the series. The Saiyan characters grow to overwhelm the main cast and push all the humans off to the side. The Saiyan transformations are a huge plot point. It's an ever-present thing after the split.

2. The birth of Gohan. Gohan goes on to become the second lead of the show and his development is strictly established from the Z split on.

3. From this point on the entire series features arcs where it ultimately is about a no holds barred, high stakes, battle for the safety of Earth or the universe. Tournaments aren't important, no armies, etc. Battles become everything. It's battle, lose, train, return stronger, transform, etc.

Not to mention the revelation/twist that Goku wasn't a human after all, but from an alien race which explains his extraordinary strength. And like you said, the introduction of Gohan and the saiyans. All of this within the first episode of Z.

It was the perfect place to split it.

[DoomieDoomie911]

I think the split is put in the right place. The series really does change a lot after the 23rd Tenka'ichi Budōkai, so the split feels perfect (I guess that could just be because it's engraved into my mind that they're both separated though).

[jjgp1112]

Nope, it's exactly where it should be. Unlike all of the other sagas preceding it, the Saiyan saga begins at a point that's more or less completely divorced from everything before it from a narrative standpoint, starting essentially at a clean slate. The other storylines segued into each other, with the end of the 23rd Martial Arts Tournament wrapping it all up so tightly that Master Roshi had to break the fourth wall to tell us it wasn't the grand finale of the entire series! The end was as decisive as you can get, and then the Saiyan saga happens several years later. Unlike the previous three year time-skips, it wasn't a setup to the next fight ahead, but rather a time of peace after all of the conflicts.

Hell, one could argue that the Buu saga could get a new series for it too, since the Cell saga completely wrapped up everything starting from Raditz' arrival .

[sintzu]

It's perfect where it is cause the story changes so much at that point that it can be watched without knowing anything about the first show

At least DB and DBZ have different tones to them, whereas Naruto and Naruto Shippuden feel all the same to me. The only difference between them is that Naruto is all grown up in Shippuden instead of a kid in the original. I really never saw the point of splitting up the two series. I feel like they tried to emulate the DB/DBZ split but it just fails.

Another reason Naruto's split doesn't work is cause shippuden is more of a continuation to the original Naruto story where Z stands on it's own from the original.

[Fizzer]

Not to mention the revelation/twist that Goku wasn't a human after all, but from an alien race which explains his extraordinary strength. And like you said, the introduction of Gohan and the saiyans. All of this within the first episode of Z.

It was the perfect place to split it.

That can also be an argument against the split though. There are quite a few major revelations and twists in the Saiyan arc, such as Goku having a kid, Goku being an alien, Goku and Piccolo teaming up, Goku dying, and Piccolo developing feelings for Gohan, none of which really have any weight for someone who starts watching from Z. A split after Freeza would also have the same problems - loads of characters at all once, we don't know Goku and Freeza's history (like with Piccolo in the Saiyan arc), we don't get the full impact of there being another super Saiyan...

Moving the split later would worsen the problems of the large number of characters for a new-comer to keep up with and their long histories, but in the Buu arc the characters appear more gradually and none of the events really rely on previous stuff for impact.

I'm glad the split is where it is from a real-world perspective, otherwise DBZ may never have made it big in the West. Artistically, none at all is probably best.

[MCDaveG]

I would erase that split if possible and leave the branding as Dragon Ball for the whole series if possible.

[Doctor.]

Not really. I'm used to the split as it is, so even if a split would be better off anywhere else, I think that it's currently well done. Although I would erase the split if possible.