Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by kei17 » Sat Dec 06, 2014 2:41 am

I got them on a Chinese online shop, but they're already discontinued and out of stock.

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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by LordCrumb » Sat Dec 06, 2014 2:45 am

Sweet. Which shop?

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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by kei17 » Sat Dec 06, 2014 4:45 pm

I asked about this on a Chinese forum. As a result, unfortunately, the fourth box is the only volume that comes with M&E audio. For your information, the fourth VCD box contains episodes 157 to 208.
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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by shinmaru » Sat Dec 06, 2014 5:13 pm

It's possible to buy from here http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=201 ... cb30ac7daa but I'm still figuring out how to buy

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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Sat Dec 06, 2014 11:49 pm

ChibiGoku wrote:A lot of dubs are missing it, due to the materials that Toei Animation provided didn't include the track in the M&E tracks. Happened with a couple insert songs on Dragon Ball for the US release, for instance. It's also inconsistent, because some dubs got the music included in the materials, while others didn't. Probably depends on whatever revision of the masters that Toei Animation provided overseas, would be guess.
Exactly. There are a lot of clips floating around on YouTube of international dubs with "Unmei no Hi" playing in the background, but those are fan edits. In reality, almost no dub out there had this in the background, simply because Toei provided audio masters that didn't have the song for whatever reason.

Of all the dubs, three come to mind in this regard for different reasons:
-The French dub had the instrumental track for "Unmei no Hi," but not the vocal track.
-The German dub, which is based on the French dub, replaced the music entirely with a piece of publicly-available German stock music (which, according to the one who told me the story, was coincidentally used twice before; once in a car commercial, and in a, well...porn).
-The only dub to not only include "Unmei no Hi," but actually dub it, is the Catalan dub.
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by DB_Fan1991 » Sun Dec 07, 2014 5:06 am

TheBlackPaladin wrote:
ChibiGoku wrote:A lot of dubs are missing it, due to the materials that Toei Animation provided didn't include the track in the M&E tracks. Happened with a couple insert songs on Dragon Ball for the US release, for instance. It's also inconsistent, because some dubs got the music included in the materials, while others didn't. Probably depends on whatever revision of the masters that Toei Animation provided overseas, would be guess.
Exactly. There are a lot of clips floating around on YouTube of international dubs with "Unmei no Hi" playing in the background, but those are fan edits. In reality, almost no dub out there had this in the background, simply because Toei provided audio masters that didn't have the song for whatever reason.

Of all the dubs, three come to mind in this regard for different reasons:
-The French dub had the instrumental track for "Unmei no Hi," but not the vocal track.
-The German dub, which is based on the French dub, replaced the music entirely with a piece of publicly-available German stock music (which, according to the one who told me the story, was coincidentally used twice before; once in a car commercial, and in a, well...porn).
-The only dub to not only include "Unmei no Hi," but actually dub it, is the Catalan dub.
2 things, the German music was in a sex hotline not a porn movie, and the Cantonese dub had the song in full while the Valencian dub left the song partially, It played up until the narrator started talking then it fades out, so yes as you hear Nozawa's scream is left in and Furukawa saying "Gohan".

Watching the three videos I noticed how wel Sandro Bluemel's scream was as Gohan while Brigitte Lecrodier's is awful and yuck that the Catalan video uses Orange Brick footage which obviously was not the original airing footage.
Last edited by DB_Fan1991 on Sun Dec 07, 2014 5:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by Attitudefan » Sun Dec 07, 2014 5:10 am

Since I can speak French, those people in the comments are harsh against the American dub. Really harsh!

The French dub isn't that great either, to be honest.

The German one sounded amazing actually. That music insert couldn't be worse though. At least it has the same genre and tone to it.

Wasn't Battle Point Unlimited given with the Sound Effects track?
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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by DB_Fan1991 » Sun Dec 07, 2014 5:14 am

Attitudefan wrote:Since I can speak French, those people in the comments are harsh against the American dub. Really harsh!

The French dub isn't that great either, to be honest.

The German one sounded amazing actually. That music insert couldn't be worse though. At least it has the same genre and tone to it.

Wasn't Battle Point Unlimited given with the Sound Effects track?
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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by Puto » Sun Dec 07, 2014 8:26 am

DB_Fan1991 wrote:the Cantonese dub had the song in full
Curiously, you can tell they added the song on their own as opposed to coming with the M&E, because it ends slightly later than the Super Saiyan aura's sound effect.
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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by dexterp » Sun Dec 07, 2014 10:17 am

I can get a bootleg of the entire VCD set rather cheaply, but I'm unsure as to if this audio will be on it.

Christmas is here, and no matter how much I want it to see, I just don't have the money.

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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Sun Dec 07, 2014 10:45 am

Puto wrote:
DB_Fan1991 wrote:the Cantonese dub had the song in full
Curiously, you can tell they added the song on their own as opposed to coming with the M&E, because it ends slightly later than the Super Saiyan aura's sound effect.
Which makes me wonder if that's a fan edit. There's a lot of them on YouTube, where fans simply took the liberty of posting the scene and adding in the song for the sake of hearing what the scene would have sounded like. Like I said, almost no dubs left the song in. I do mean "almost" though, because I do recall seeing two, maybe three dubs that still had the song in.
Attitudefan wrote:The German one sounded amazing actually. That music insert couldn't be worse though. At least it has the same genre and tone to it.
My one problem--on a purely technical level--with the German dub of that scene is that no echo was added to Sandro Blumel's scream. It didn't have to be a very pronounced echo, but an echo should have been used. The scream itself was great, but without an echo, it sounds too "dry," like it was recorded in a booth, and it takes me out of the moment a little.
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by kei17 » Sun Dec 07, 2014 11:01 am

Puto wrote:
DB_Fan1991 wrote:the Cantonese dub had the song in full
Curiously, you can tell they added the song on their own as opposed to coming with the M&E, because it ends slightly later than the Super Saiyan aura's sound effect.
Toei always provide insert songs on separate tapes, so that doesn't mean the M&E didn't have the song and they added it on their own.
TheBlackPaladin wrote:Which makes me wonder if that's a fan edit. There's a lot of them on YouTube, where fans simply took the liberty of posting the scene and adding in the song for the sake of hearing what the scene would have sounded like. Like I said, almost no dubs left the song in. I do mean "almost" though, because I do recall seeing two, maybe three dubs that still had the song in.
No, it's not a fan edit. From what I know, the Cantonese dub is the only dub that has all the insert songs completely kept as-is.

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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Sun Dec 07, 2014 11:14 am

kei17 wrote:
Puto wrote:
DB_Fan1991 wrote:the Cantonese dub had the song in full
Curiously, you can tell they added the song on their own as opposed to coming with the M&E, because it ends slightly later than the Super Saiyan aura's sound effect.
Toei always provide insert songs on separate tapes, so that doesn't mean the M&E didn't have the song and they added it on their own.
TheBlackPaladin wrote:Which makes me wonder if that's a fan edit. There's a lot of them on YouTube, where fans simply took the liberty of posting the scene and adding in the song for the sake of hearing what the scene would have sounded like. Like I said, almost no dubs left the song in. I do mean "almost" though, because I do recall seeing two, maybe three dubs that still had the song in.
No, it's not a fan edit. From what I know, the Cantonese dub is the only dub that has all the insert songs completely kept as-is.
Very interesting...so, if the insert songs are on separate tapes, that makes me wonder if the many other dubs that didn't include the song did still receive the separate tapes for the insert songs, and just decided not to use them.

I'd have to imagine that in the case of many European dubs, it's not their fault because they could only use what France gave them. For that matter, the fact that the French dub had an instrumental-only version also makes me wonder if we missed out on other possible dubbed versions of "Unmei no Hi" besides the Catalan one. In other words, France chose not to dub the song, but they had the materials to do so if they wanted to, and might have been able to pass those materials on to the other European countries. Alas, what could have been...
Last edited by TheBlackPaladin on Sun Dec 07, 2014 12:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by Puto » Sun Dec 07, 2014 11:58 am

The fact that Toei provided instrumentals of the inserts makes me wonder why FUNimation didn't use at least the instrumentals on the DB dub. I mean, they might've not wanted to have a Japanese-lyric song in the dub when they couldn't add a lot of talking over it to cover up the language, but surely having the instrumental would be better than dead silence? Particularly thinking about the scene in the first tournament that was missing Mezase Tenka'ichi, and the scene right after at the start of the Red Ribbon arc that was missing Dragon Ball Densetsu.
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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by InfernalVegito » Sun Dec 07, 2014 8:15 pm

TheBlackPaladin wrote:My one problem--on a purely technical level--with the German dub of that scene is that no echo was added to Sandro Blumel's scream. It didn't have to be a very pronounced echo, but an echo should have been used. The scream itself was great, but without an echo, it sounds too "dry," like it was recorded in a booth, and it takes me out of the moment a little.
This is interesting that you say that because I also would have liked a bit of an echo there, just to make it more voluminous and bigger for such a cathartic scene.

Kinda like all the daimons in the German Sailor Moon dub have that huge echo when they die. Maybe not as excessive for Son Gohan but you should catch my drift.
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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by superrayman3 » Mon Dec 08, 2014 11:10 am

Puto wrote:The fact that Toei provided instrumentals of the inserts makes me wonder why FUNimation didn't use at least the instrumentals on the DB dub. I mean, they might've not wanted to have a Japanese-lyric song in the dub when they couldn't add a lot of talking over it to cover up the language, but surely having the instrumental would be better than dead silence? Particularly thinking about the scene in the first tournament that was missing Mezase Tenka'ichi, and the scene right after at the start of the Red Ribbon arc that was missing Dragon Ball Densetsu.
If I could take a guess as to why FUNi never used the instrumental versions it's probably because Toei never provided them with the instrumentals for those songs in the first place, if there's one thing I've learned about Toei over the years it's the fact that they are by far one of the weirdest and most inconsistent companies when it comes to providing material for international distributors of their works, it's like they just send out what they have right on hand at the time and if you do want a more complete package of material then you're pretty much out of luck unless you either pay Toei more money to search for such missing material, that or if you don't want to do that, you'd have to try and find another international distributor of the same show and hope they have the missing pieces in their package and try to convince them to make a copy of those missing pieces for you something FUNi could have easily done if they really wanted to, because think about it, doesn't it seem odd that at least to the best of my knowledge Harmony Gold was the only company in the world to ever get a clean version of DB's 2nd opening animation as well as a clean version of DB movie 3's ending animation while companies that came before Harmony Gold did not? Or if said companies did they've never let it be known to people, another example is Unmei no hi, as far as I know only the french version uses the instrumental version while almost every other version doesn't have any version of the song at all.
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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by chungohan » Sun Aug 09, 2020 9:01 am

Hello!

Sorry for bringing back a so old topic, but I would like to know if finally someone was able to get all those Music and Effects from any episode from those Chinese VCD, and if he is willing to share them with me :wink:

Long ago (2013) I posted here because I got my hands on some reel-to-reel material for the catalan dub (I am from catalonia) and part of this were the M&E for episodes 138,139,140,147,148,240 and 241, as commented in this thread:
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=23426&p=648187#p648187

Some time after I managed to extract all the reels I found to WAV. On those reels I also found some interesting matherial, like openings and endings, and songs that played inside episodes before being inserted into them (so, clean without the FX or dialogue), but catalan dubbed, of course. If someone is interested, here is an example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yHWEoTnyCJA

AFAIK, the catalan dub received all the insert songs separated from the music and effects material, except from one song for episode 139, which was directly not received neither included. In fact that was one of the episodes I got.

As a curiosity, I also found some material from kinnikuman like some openings and endings which never aired here (we got the french one) but they were sent to the studio because they appear on some episodes in the background, so they dubbed all the songs they received separately, except for one, where they leaved a note which reads "we don't know which episode this song appears". As a matter of fact, it was an ending, not an insert song, that's why it didn't appear in any episode... so as they didn't know where to put it, they didn't dub it.

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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by Woodlandbuckle » Sun Aug 09, 2020 4:15 pm

This topic has a lot of potential. People here are talking about the possibility of fan dubbing more scenes but I feel like you could do even more than that. Like you could invert the audio with the japanese version and get the JP vocals without SFXs and music. That alone could be used for mods, animations, and so much more. I'm looking forward to see where this could go.
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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by Robo4900 » Sun Aug 09, 2020 5:59 pm

Woodlandbuckle wrote: Sun Aug 09, 2020 4:15 pm This topic has a lot of potential. People here are talking about the possibility of fan dubbing more scenes but I feel like you could do even more than that. Like you could invert the audio with the japanese version and get the JP vocals without SFXs and music. That alone could be used for mods, animations, and so much more. I'm looking forward to see where this could go.
It likely wouldn't work, as you'd have to line them up perfectly (speed adjustments would be required) to even get a kinda workable thing, but the characteristics of the sound will be quite different, so it won't quite work...

It's mostly good for fandubbing and such, really.

Though, I used a little M&E segment I managed to get ahold of, combined with a segment of isolated Westwood Ocean voices (I used Spleeter; results weren't great, though) to make a bit of Ocean + Kikuchi.
The conclusions I came to from this experiment are:
1. Better voice isolation software is needed.
2. It would be more useful to have separate M and E tracks so I could swap some music out for stereo versions.
2b. With that in mind, M&E tracks would mostly be useful in fan projects as a base to work off of, and fall back on, with a custom mix using elements from Funi's 5.1 mixes being a far more useful thing to work off of, since you can pull SFX from it, and put stereo music over the top of that, and mess with stereo panning the SFX (though a lot of it already has been, at least somewhat, in Funi's mixes).
3. If someone could get better voice isolation, then editing the Westwood Ocean dub to be uncut with Kikuchi music would be possible, and awesome.
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Re: Voiceless Audio Track on Chinese VCDs

Post by kei17 » Tue Aug 11, 2020 12:40 pm

chungohan wrote: Sun Aug 09, 2020 9:01 am Sorry for bringing back a so old topic, but I would like to know if finally someone was able to get all those Music and Effects from any episode from those Chinese VCD, and if he is willing to share them with me :wink:
I've got that VCD box (more precisely, a box with VCD video files on DVDs) and its M&E audio is not very useful. It suffers from the unstable playback speed, muffled sound quality, and heavy compression. I can share it if you'd like, but don't expect too much from it.

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