How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Discussion regarding the entirety of the franchise in a general (meta) sense, including such aspects as: production, trends, merchandise, fan culture, and more.

Moderators: General Help, Kanzenshuu Staff

User avatar
SSJ Human
Regular
Posts: 627
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:35 pm

How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by SSJ Human » Sun May 24, 2015 9:23 pm

So basically I was thinking about the impact that the Super Saiyan transformation had on the franchise and I was writing a series that at one point I wanted to include a transformation in. I wanted the hair color to change and strength to be gained, but I don't want it to be seen as a ripoff of Super Saiyan. Any suggestions?

User avatar
Kamiccolo9
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 10353
Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:32 pm
Location: Regensburg, Germany

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Sun May 24, 2015 9:25 pm

Don't have strength gain go along with a change in hair color.

Not the answer you're wanting, I know. but Super Saiyan is more or less ingrained in popular culture now.
Champion of the 1st Kanzenshuu Short Story Tenkaichi Budokai
Kamiccolo9's Kompendium of Short Stories
Cipher wrote:If Vegeta does not kill Gohan, I will stop illegally streaming the series.
Malik_DBNA wrote:
Scarz wrote:Malik, stop. People are asking me for lewd art of possessed Bra (with Vegeta).
"Achievement Unlocked: Rule 34"

User avatar
SSJ Human
Regular
Posts: 627
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:35 pm

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by SSJ Human » Sun May 24, 2015 9:30 pm

Kamiccolo9 wrote:Don't have strength gain go along with a change in hair color.

Not the answer you're wanting, I know. but Super Saiyan is more or less ingrained in popular culture now.
I just want there to be some indication that they are different. I was thinking maybe they could have an aura, but that's another characteristic of Super Saiyan.

I know right? It's as though anything that I watch that has characters which are superhuman in ability have a power up that is similar to it.

User avatar
fadeddreams5
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5156
Joined: Fri Aug 08, 2014 10:53 pm
Location: New York

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by fadeddreams5 » Sun May 24, 2015 9:36 pm

Try to think of changes in other aspects of the physical body, rather than hair and muscles. Skin, veins, eyes, etc.
"Dragon Ball once became a thing of the past to me, but after that, I got angry about the live action movie, re-wrote an entire movie script, and now I'm complaining about the quality of the new TV anime. It seems Dragon Ball has grown on me so much that I can't leave it alone." - Akira Toriyama on Dragon Ball Super

User avatar
TheGmGoken
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 10592
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2013 5:19 pm
Location: Capsule Corps

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by TheGmGoken » Sun May 24, 2015 9:38 pm

Have only the eyes change. No muscle change. Just eye change. Whateva it's colour, shape, or design

User avatar
fadeddreams5
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5156
Joined: Fri Aug 08, 2014 10:53 pm
Location: New York

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by fadeddreams5 » Sun May 24, 2015 9:45 pm

TheGmGoken wrote:Have only the eyes change. No muscle change. Just eye change. Whateva it's colour, shape, or design
I think Naruto did that. lol.
"Dragon Ball once became a thing of the past to me, but after that, I got angry about the live action movie, re-wrote an entire movie script, and now I'm complaining about the quality of the new TV anime. It seems Dragon Ball has grown on me so much that I can't leave it alone." - Akira Toriyama on Dragon Ball Super

User avatar
SSJ Human
Regular
Posts: 627
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:35 pm

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by SSJ Human » Sun May 24, 2015 9:51 pm

fadeddreams5 wrote:Try to think of changes in other aspects of the physical body, rather than hair and muscles. Skin, veins, eyes, etc.
I don't think I'll mess with skin but I could definitely see eyes being altered, but again, that's something else that Super Saiyan does. The eyes won't turn green though. That's for sure.
TheGmGoken wrote:Have only the eyes change. No muscle change. Just eye change. Whateva it's colour, shape, or design
Didn't Naruto already do that? I like the idea, but I couldn't use red like they did or green like Super Saiyan does so I've got fewer options.

User avatar
Lord Beerus
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 21389
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 5:20 pm
Location: A temple on a giant tree
Contact:

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by Lord Beerus » Sun May 24, 2015 10:02 pm

It's kind of hard to come up with a transformation that doesn't somehow relate to Super Saiyan. Because Super Saiyan covers every basis of change in appearance that comes with a transformation; hair, eyes, aura, muscle mass etc.

Maybe you could do a change of skin colour.

User avatar
Bullza
Banned
Posts: 8621
Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2013 12:48 am
Location: UK

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by Bullza » Sun May 24, 2015 10:44 pm

Yeah maybe something more akin to Luffy's Gear Two mode or the Hulk.

User avatar
SSJ Human
Regular
Posts: 627
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:35 pm

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by SSJ Human » Sun May 24, 2015 10:54 pm

Bullza wrote:Yeah maybe something more akin to Luffy's Gear Two mode or the Hulk.
You could argue that, but I had an idea of doing something similar to Kaio-ken where it would be an aura around them that was a different color than red.

User avatar
Kamiccolo9
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 10353
Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:32 pm
Location: Regensburg, Germany

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Sun May 24, 2015 11:06 pm

I don't see how a Hulk ripoff would be any less recognizable than one of a Super Saiyan.
Champion of the 1st Kanzenshuu Short Story Tenkaichi Budokai
Kamiccolo9's Kompendium of Short Stories
Cipher wrote:If Vegeta does not kill Gohan, I will stop illegally streaming the series.
Malik_DBNA wrote:
Scarz wrote:Malik, stop. People are asking me for lewd art of possessed Bra (with Vegeta).
"Achievement Unlocked: Rule 34"

User avatar
SSJ Human
Regular
Posts: 627
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:35 pm

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by SSJ Human » Sun May 24, 2015 11:28 pm

Kamiccolo9 wrote:I don't see how a Hulk ripoff would be any less recognizable than one of a Super Saiyan.
That's a good point especially if it causes them to not act like themselves.

It's kind of like Super Sonic from the Sonic the Hedgehog franchise. We know it is inspired by Super Saiyan but there's a level of originality to it.

User avatar
Bullza
Banned
Posts: 8621
Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2013 12:48 am
Location: UK

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by Bullza » Mon May 25, 2015 2:18 am

There is? He powers up and turns into a pointy haired Gold being. It's 100% a Dragon Ball Z ripoff.

A character transforming, getting stronger and having a difference in appearance especially with the hair is just synonymous with DBZ now.

It might work if you also drastically changed the rest of the characters appearance too like with Ichigo Kurosakis Final Getsuga form.

User avatar
Pantalones
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1432
Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2011 2:30 pm

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by Pantalones » Mon May 25, 2015 2:55 am

Yeah, any "hair change, aura, power boost" transformation is going to be seen as Super Saiyan-like. The hair turning gold, though, is the aspect that people associate most strongly with Super Saiyan -- so if you avoid "hair changes to some bright, unusual color," or avoid hair changes altogether, you should be fine. Alternatively, a very subdued hair color change (like a brunette's hair becoming lighter brown, or darkening until it's near-black) could possibly work without resembling Super Saiyan that much -- the drastic change from black (...or purple) to gold is a big part of why Super Saiyan's color change stood out so much.

Just an aura without a hair change, though, I think can work without seeming too "Super Saiyany"... so long as the aura's at least a bit different from the standard "gold swooshy energy" that Super Saiyans get. Maybe it's just wind swirling around then rather than an actual visible aura, maybe it takes a shape rather than the general "big flame-like swooshes around the whole body" thing (like "wings" or "claws" or "arms/fists" of energy forming around the appropriate parts of the character's body, rather than a general full-body aura.) If you do want a full-body aura, well, an aura taking the form of armor -- like not actually becoming solid armor, just taking the shape of it and surrounding the appropriate body parts -- has probably been done before somewhere, but it's certainly different from Super Saiyan to the point where nobody in their right mind would associate them just based on appearance. Or how about rather than the wide aura that Super Saiyans show, it's an aura that's condensed right around the surface of someone's body, so you can only see a silhouette of their original shape and the rest is all the glowy stuff? They'd basically look like they were made of some weird energy all of a sudden. That's definitely different from Super Saiyan.

Speaking of armor, transformations that create armor can be a thing, too. Either "organic"-ish armor (bug shells, scales, fur -- people aren't going to think Oozaru or SSj4 right off, I'd imagine most people's minds are much more likely to hover toward werewolf if a human suddenly sprouts thick fur over their body) or full-on metal armor (or Power Ranger spandex-metal?) appearing out of nowhere could work.

Glowing eyes have been a "transformation thing" long before Dragonball Z, so as long as the change isn't just a "pupil/iris region of eye changes color" thing like Super Saiyan's, I don't think an eye change will automatically draw cries of "Super Saiyan ripoff" -- and if does, the people saying so will either be dumb, or stretching things a bit much.

Having the effect of the transformation be different than just a generalized power boost would probably help differentiate them, too.

User avatar
Polyphase Avatron
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 6643
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:48 am

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Mon May 25, 2015 3:27 am

Pretty much every type of transformation has been done in one series/fictional story or another... hair/eyes/aura changing, bulking up, growing wings/extra arms, turning into a monster, etc. Perhaps one way to make it different would be to make the transformation permanent and irreversible.
Cool stuff that I upload here because Youtube will copyright claim it: https://vimeo.com/user60967147

User avatar
Fionordequester
I Live Here
Posts: 2873
Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2011 6:33 pm

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by Fionordequester » Mon May 25, 2015 3:58 am

Honestly, I wouldn't even worry about it. Like others have said, transformations of all sorts have been done so much, that trying not to "rip off" any transformation is a little like trying to write a story that does not resemble ANY other story that ever existed. It's either not going to happen, or the end result isn't going to be that great.

That said though, be careful not to "rip off" TOO much from anything. Put your own unique spin on it. That's what most artists do I think.
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".

User avatar
Godo
I Live Here
Posts: 3360
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2006 9:25 am

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by Godo » Mon May 25, 2015 1:42 pm

Face change. The more powerful they become, the more distinct shape their face gets. Like a boy transforms, and he suddenly has the face of a grown-up man. A geezer becomes bishônen.
If you are writing a comedy series, that would be funny as hell.

User avatar
Doctor.
Banned
Posts: 10558
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:02 am
Location: Portugal

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by Doctor. » Mon May 25, 2015 1:44 pm

How about you change up the fighting style? I really haven't seen that kind of stuff before outside of transformations that modify the user's entire body (like Luffy's Gears).

User avatar
SSJ Human
Regular
Posts: 627
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:35 pm

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by SSJ Human » Mon May 25, 2015 2:05 pm

Doctor. wrote:How about you change up the fighting style? I really haven't seen that kind of stuff before outside of transformations that modify the user's entire body (like Luffy's Gears).
Right. I remember that transformation. I just thought the hair color change would be the easiest to point out and be distinct from the regular appearance more than their eyes as was suggested earlier.

User avatar
Doctor.
Banned
Posts: 10558
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:02 am
Location: Portugal

Re: How to not ripoff Super Saiyan?

Post by Doctor. » Mon May 25, 2015 2:32 pm

SSJ Human wrote:
Doctor. wrote:How about you change up the fighting style? I really haven't seen that kind of stuff before outside of transformations that modify the user's entire body (like Luffy's Gears).
Right. I remember that transformation. I just thought the hair color change would be the easiest to point out and be distinct from the regular appearance more than their eyes as was suggested earlier.
You can still give him a hair colour change, just instead of giving him a huge boost in power as a result, his fighting style changes somehow (how it's written, you'll have to figure it out, I'm afraid).

Post Reply