Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Discussion regarding the entirety of the franchise in a general (meta) sense, including such aspects as: production, trends, merchandise, fan culture, and more.

Moderators: Kanzenshuu Staff, General Help

User avatar
Doctor.
Banned
Posts: 10558
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:02 am
Location: Portugal

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by Doctor. » Sun Jun 28, 2015 8:07 pm

Oh, and if GT counts, then... GT. Sorry, but I had to say it.

User avatar
LuckyCat
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1215
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2014 6:28 pm
Location: The Sacred Land
Contact:

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by LuckyCat » Sun Jun 28, 2015 8:39 pm

Manga?

Probably the Red Ribbon arc prior to Upa, Bora and Tao-pai-pai. Come to think of it, Tao-pai-pai might have been the wake-up boss for the franchise. Before Tao, every villain was sort of goofy, but Tao was strong, smart and extremely evil.

Anime?

The Buu arc following Goku's first SSJ3 transformation. Not even Kai could save it. Oddly, it's not really bad in the manga :D
Cipher wrote:The first and last word on Super's animation problems and why they exist.
(Have we transcended language to the point where we only communicate in YouTube links now? The talking has already been done for us.)

User avatar
SSJ Human
Regular
Posts: 627
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:35 pm

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by SSJ Human » Sun Jun 28, 2015 8:55 pm

Namek was the hardest part for both, particularly everything until Goku comes. It's just such a pain to watch for me and I'm not sure why. I know it's not just because Goku's not there because I'm not like that with the Garlic Jr. Saga but I'm not entertained until he gets on Namek.

User avatar
Cetra
I Live Here
Posts: 3856
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 3:01 pm

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by Cetra » Mon Jun 29, 2015 6:38 am

Do fan comments count?
"Citation needed."
"too lazy

feel free to take it with grain of salt or discredit me altogether, I'm not losing any sleep"

User avatar
Flame Dragon
Regular
Posts: 619
Joined: Fri May 11, 2012 9:52 am
Location: Italy

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by Flame Dragon » Mon Jun 29, 2015 6:59 am

The Fake Namek episodes make me want to kill myself.

User avatar
EXBadguy
I'm pretty cozy, here...
Posts: 1650
Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2013 6:24 pm
Location: NJ, 'MERICA

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by EXBadguy » Mon Jun 29, 2015 7:01 am

Fake Namek episodes, Goku running in snake way, half of Gohan's training in the wasteland, half of the SS Goku vs Frieza fight, most of the Semi-Perfect Cell fights(Vegeta's and Tien's fight with him are the exception), and some of the fusion episodes.
fadeddreams5 wrote: Cooler deserved his own saga, not ****ing Garlic Jr.
Yeah, I agree. I could imagine a plot similar to Furious 7 or have a Sub-Zero-ish vibe.
Akira Toriyama wrote:If anyone. ANYONE AT TOEI! Makes a movie about old and weak major villains returning, or making recolored versions of Super Saiyan, I'ma come to yo company and evict you from doing Dragon Ball ever again! Only I do those things, because people love me, and they despise you....derp!
Marco Polo wrote:Goku Black is a fan of DBZ who hates Super and has taken the form of a younger Goku (thinner shape, softer hair) to avenge the original series by destroying the new.

User avatar
DBZGTKOSDH
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 12401
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 7:45 pm
Location: Greece

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Mon Jun 29, 2015 8:30 am

Dragon Ball GT episodes 1-15, I think.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.

User avatar
Ajay
Moderator
Posts: 6123
Joined: Sun May 26, 2013 6:15 pm
Location: Surrey, UK
Contact:

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by Ajay » Mon Jun 29, 2015 9:02 am

It's been mentioned several times, and perhaps I'll come to appreciate it at some point, but the early parts of the Red Ribbon Arc are something I find hard to enjoy. Looking for the dragon balls again felt a little bit like retreading the Pilaf arc -- except with less interesting characters this time around. I adore Ha-chan and Murasaki, but the various commanders and generals felt quite uninspired, sadly leaving me feeling very cold. It's not until Upa and Tao Pai Pai's appearance that I fall in love with the series again. We drop straight back into these fantastical concepts of the Chōshinsui and Uranai Baba, before heading into some wonderful martial arts goodness.

Another instance would probably be Trunks and Vegeta's stand-off with Cell. It reminds me of the Saiyan arc, where we have side characters fighting against the main antagonists, as we anxiously await the arrival of our hero. It's a concept that I don't mind, but I never felt the fight was interesting enough to really warrant its length. You have some great moments, but I always felt it was the point in the series where it began to verge on parody. Vegeta fights Cell, Cell transforms, Vegeta fights Cell again, performs an incredible Final Flash, Cell doesn't die, Vegeta loses, Trunks fights, struggles, puffs himself up to the point of absurdity, and then... loses. This whole segment lasts an entire volume! It's insanely drawn out, and I really hate reading through it over and over.

Oh, and Dragon Ball Minus is an absolute chore to get through, since it's possibly the worst addition to the franchise that Toriyama has ever contributed. Never thought I could hate something so short.
Follow me on Twitter for countless shitposts.

Deadtuber.

User avatar
TheGmGoken
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 10591
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2013 5:19 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland
Contact:

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by TheGmGoken » Sat Aug 01, 2015 9:12 pm

Red Ribbon Arc because it's boring and I have a extreme dislike of boring things. Every single member of the RRA was very uninteresting and I had no reason to hate them or want them to get their ass kicked. The only redeeming factor in the arc was (grandpa) Gohan.

Boo Arc. Besides Goten, Trunks, and Gotenks..after the beginning of the saga to about Vegeta's sacrifice. It was downhill goooft shit and felt like a parody of itself. Boo was yet another ancient monster that loves to destroy :yawn: . Let's not forget the stupid plot points like Gohan dropping the potara. Lastly the final villain of the series (until 2013-present) wasn't even the strongest ultimate challenge.

The newest 2 movies were hard to watch as well.
I DO NOT HAVE A TWITTER
Son Goten

User avatar
ABED
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 17565
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:23 am
Location: VA
Contact:

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by ABED » Sun Aug 02, 2015 7:43 am

because it sounds like he is giving up his dream to get stronger than goku and that is awful in my opinion
No, he's simply dealing with his insecurities and admitting the truth. It was a psychologically healthy change and the final piece of the puzzle for Vegeta's development.

The hardest parts of the series to watch are the endless filler cutaways to Chichi or Bulma, the fake Namek episodes, and most of the Buu arc. I also don't like watching fights that are one sided and it's even worse when it's drawn out.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.

User avatar
Gaffer Tape
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5905
Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:25 pm
Contact:

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by Gaffer Tape » Sun Aug 02, 2015 10:16 am

Ajay wrote:Another instance would probably be Trunks and Vegeta's stand-off with Cell. It reminds me of the Saiyan arc, where we have side characters fighting against the main antagonists, as we anxiously await the arrival of our hero. It's a concept that I don't mind, but I never felt the fight was interesting enough to really warrant its length. You have some great moments, but I always felt it was the point in the series where it began to verge on parody. Vegeta fights Cell, Cell transforms, Vegeta fights Cell again, performs an incredible Final Flash, Cell doesn't die, Vegeta loses, Trunks fights, struggles, puffs himself up to the point of absurdity, and then... loses. This whole segment lasts an entire volume! It's insanely drawn out, and I really hate reading through it over and over.

Oh, and Dragon Ball Minus is an absolute chore to get through, since it's possibly the worst addition to the franchise that Toriyama has ever contributed. Never thought I could hate something so short.
Ooh, yes, definitely both of these. In fact, I'll see that and raise you to the moment that Piccolo and #17 head over to that island. I hate almost everything from that moment on until the characters finally leave it. I like Tenshinhan's moment, I like Kuririn's moment, and I like a little bit of Trunks. But for the most part, the whole thing is just a tedious exercise in futility and pointlessness. Boring locations, boring attacks (looking at you, Final Flash), and Vegeta's sad solidification into the most useless character in the series.

And, yes, Minus. I've already wasted too many words on this pathetic display. But at least it has one thing over the aforementioned scenario: it's short!
Do you follow the most comprehensive and entertaining Dragon Ball analysis series on YouTube? If you do, you're smart and awesome and fairly attractive. If not, see what all the fuss is about without even having to leave Kanzenshuu:

MistareFusion's Dragon Ball Dissection Series Discussion Thread! (Updated 6/8/20!)
Current Episode: The Budoukai Sells Its Soul - Dragon Ball Dissection: The Majin Boo Arc Part 4!

User avatar
DBZAOTA482
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 6427
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2012 4:04 pm
Contact:

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Sun Aug 02, 2015 10:23 am

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Dragon Ball GT episodes 1-15, I think.
This. By the end of the 15th episode, I was like:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zxzi62IiB9E
fadeddreams5 wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=31207&p=969551#p969545

User avatar
MCDaveG
I Live Here
Posts: 4747
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 5:54 pm
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Contact:

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by MCDaveG » Sun Aug 02, 2015 10:38 am

Garlic Jr. arc, hands down. I never saw it in entirety, always one or two episodes at a time.
Everytime I tried to rewatch the arc, I couldn't sit trough.
FighterZ: Funky_Strudel
PS4: Dynamixx88

User avatar
BeholdeR
Newbie
Posts: 45
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2014 1:26 pm

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by BeholdeR » Sun Aug 02, 2015 11:16 am

When Cell said he could destroy a solar system but didn't do it :-(

Na but hmm in manga

The buu saga in general compared to the other sagas was just not nearly as good.



In anime? Nowadays when I am way older, a lot of it.. :D

Just too much useless filler, the parts with bulma under water in namek saga for example.
fadeddreams5 wrote:If Gohan fights, he is 100% getting knocked the **** out.

User avatar
ABED
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 17565
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:23 am
Location: VA
Contact:

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by ABED » Sun Aug 02, 2015 3:08 pm

Ooh, yes, definitely both of these. In fact, I'll see that and raise you to the moment that Piccolo and #17 head over to that island. I hate almost everything from that moment on until the characters finally leave it. I like Tenshinhan's moment, I like Kuririn's moment, and I like a little bit of Trunks. But for the most part, the whole thing is just a tedious exercise in futility and pointlessness. Boring locations, boring attacks (looking at you, Final Flash), and Vegeta's sad solidification into the most useless character in the series.
Useless in what way?

Piccolo vs. 17 is one of the best fights in the series.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.

User avatar
Gaffer Tape
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5905
Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:25 pm
Contact:

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by Gaffer Tape » Sun Aug 02, 2015 4:40 pm

I am defining usefulness as the ability to have a positive net gain towards the heroes' goals. This starts Vegeta's run as the guy who purposefully makes things worse for everybody. So not only is he not usefully contributing like, to be fair, most characters in this series are guilty of, at least they aren't being actively detrimental. Compare that to the Vegeta of the Freeza arc, a doer, a master manipulator. A character who makes things happen. And then compare that to the Vegeta in the Cell and Boo arcs who is basically Gilligan except not funny. So that, to me, makes him the most useless character.

I've never really understood the hype for Piccolo vs #17. I mean, yes, it has a little bit of fun choreography, but it's ultimately forgettable because it's so completely pointless. So many things in the Cell arc, and on those islands in particular, are just pointless, "raising the stakes by constantly failing" tedium.
Do you follow the most comprehensive and entertaining Dragon Ball analysis series on YouTube? If you do, you're smart and awesome and fairly attractive. If not, see what all the fuss is about without even having to leave Kanzenshuu:

MistareFusion's Dragon Ball Dissection Series Discussion Thread! (Updated 6/8/20!)
Current Episode: The Budoukai Sells Its Soul - Dragon Ball Dissection: The Majin Boo Arc Part 4!

User avatar
Kid Buu
I Live Here
Posts: 3954
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 4:02 am

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by Kid Buu » Sun Aug 02, 2015 5:23 pm

Ajay wrote: It reminds me of the Saiyan arc, where we have side characters fighting against the main antagonists, as we anxiously await the arrival of our hero.
I thought Namek was worse at repeating this than Cell arc. Nappa/Recoome beats everyone up, Goku arrives on planet, Goku saves everyone, Goku gets defeated, the other heroes have to save Goku.

I agree with you on the Red Ribbon Army arc though, but I don't hate DB Minus. It's just rather bland.
Rocketman wrote:"Shonen" basically means "stupid sentimental shit" anyway, so it's ok to be anti-shonen.

User avatar
Hellspawn28
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 14019
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 9:50 pm
Location: Maryland, USA

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by Hellspawn28 » Sun Aug 02, 2015 5:31 pm

The Garlic Jr saga is a chore to watch. I can't sit through it at all.
PS4 username: Guyver_Spawn_27
MAL Profile: http://myanimelist.net/profile/Hellspawn28
Steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/GS27/

User avatar
Avery
Beyond-the-Beyond Newbie
Posts: 364
Joined: Fri May 01, 2015 1:18 am
Location: Iraq

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by Avery » Sun Aug 02, 2015 5:50 pm

Every scene with Videl pre-tournament. I just can't stand her. I admit, the first time I watched the Boo arc, I...um..well, skipped most of her episodes :D
The entirety of GT was hard to watch, but the first 20 episodes were just awful.

EDIT: oh yeah, RoF is the single most boring DB-related thing. And it was extra hard to watch for me because Vegeta in particular was so painful to look at with the horrible new animation. Please, Super, fix it...wait, the whole movie was crap, there's nothing to "fix".
An angry Final Fantasy fan wrote: And after all the outrage, when I'm ready, I'll go out on to GameStop and buy a Persona 5 copy. And when my mother finds me investing my precious time trying to bond with this hot anime girl, I'll look straight into her eyes and say "but have you looked at the menu screen? have you actually seen the menu screen? In that very moment, she knows. She fucking knows. As she handles me the nugget pieces she previously cooked for me, she leaves my room with these words: "Persona 5 is the true savior of the JRPG".
VegettoEX wrote: In a blunt nutshell, no-one wants to read bullshit. Don't post bullshit. Be a cool person that posts cool things that other people would actually want to read. Don't be Zamasu from episode 63 talking to himself.

NintendoFan28
Newbie
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2014 9:39 pm

Re: Hardest part of the series to watch and/or read?

Post by NintendoFan28 » Sun Aug 02, 2015 6:45 pm

The hardest part of the series for me to watch were:

- The fake Namek episodes and Bulma and the Giant Crab. I can't describe how much loathe these parts.

- The majority of the Android and Cell Arcs. The only parts of the Android and Cell Arcs I enjoyed or liked were, Android 19 and 20, the Imperfect Cell Arc and Imperfect Cell as a villain, Goku vs Perfect Cell, Gohan's transformation, and Cell's death. Everything else to me, was boring.

- The later parts of the Boo Arc. While I enjoyed first half of the Boo arc, I thought the middle part of the story brought the Boo Arc down a whole lot, and it never recovered in my honest opinion. However, I did enjoy Boo as a villain (especially Fat Boo), because of his wacky personality, and I also enjoyed some of the fights like, Ultimate Gohan vs Super Boo/Gotenks Boo.

- Some of GT. Goku being turned into kid. While I did not mind this, I felt like Goku should have gotten his adult body back, after he defeated Bebi. The space travel episodes were terrible, the Super 17 Arc, Goku and Pan being the only two to fight first six Shadow Dragons. Speaking of Shadow Dragons, I thought first two were lame as hell, while the third one was okay. Although GT was not that great, it was still decent follow up to Dragon Ball Z, and I still enjoyed it for what it was. I thought some of fights were decent. I also thought Bebi was an awesome villain. While Super 17 was a terrible villain, I loved his design and his fighting abilities. The reminding four Shadow Dragons were pretty good, (especially that Mole Dragon) and I thought Syn/Omega Shenron was a decent final villain.

Post Reply