Frieza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

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Frieza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by Hero » Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:05 pm

Yes, Goku and Vegeta are the characters the movie wants you to root for, but the more I see this movie the more I feel that it makes me root for Frieza instead.

Just like how in the show Goku and the others have to grow stronger to even have a chance against a seemingly insurmountable foe, Frieza has to train to beat a Goku who he knows can beat Majin Buu... only to have that Goku be SSJGSSJ/ SSJB level. It's like how Vegeta thought his final zenkai would be enough to beat Frieza's final form... only to Frieza actually be far above anything he thought.

Just like how in the show the odds are stacked against the heroes, Frieza has to beat Goku while knowing that Vegeta is still there... and THEN has to deal with Beerus and Whis being there too.

Just like how the heroes many times lose and have to think of other ways to win, Frieza loses to Goku both in his fourth form and Golden form and then has to beat the insurmountable foe with trickery.

Only then Vegeta is still fresh and waiting for him. Frieza then has to devise to beat him with trickery also.

Also, this movie gives you a lot of screentime with Freeza. I'm pretty sure it's more than the time Goku and Vegeta get. You also get to see a greater variety of new emotions in this movie with Frieza (which Ayres's amazing voice acting helps tremendously) while Vegeta is mostly relegated to his grumpy shtick and Goku is his usual goofy/ serious while fighting self.

So what do you all think of this?

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by TheDevilsCorpse » Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:26 pm

He never really feels like the protagonist, not in the sense where a lot of people equate it with being the story's hero anyway. He's not painted as a righteous and just figure from the beginning, as we have comments from Tagoma reminding us that he's a dictator that rules by fear and he continuously kills his own men.

I wouldn't argue against the point that he's the protagonist in the sense that it's mostly his story and he's basically the leading character though.
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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by TheGreatness25 » Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:32 pm

Oh I'm supposed to root for Freeza as the hero of the story because he wants to overcome a more powerful opponent than he is? I guess I should root for Lex Luthor over Superman or even Nappa over Goku. Freeza was driven by the anger of having been toppled by someone he considered to be trash. He wanted to kill the unworthy, filthy ape who had the nerve to stand up to him. Oh and he wanted to kill that ape's loved ones and destroy the planet he lives on.

But he's the underdog, so rah rah Freeza? Go, Freeza, go!

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by Cipher » Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:46 pm

Well, that's not true.

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by Doctor. » Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:48 pm

I've always rooted for (lord) Freeza, those monkeys had it coming.

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by Hero » Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:50 pm

TheGreatness25 wrote:Oh I'm supposed to root for Freeza as the hero of the story because he wants to overcome a more powerful opponent than he is? I guess I should root for Lex Luthor over Superman or even Nappa over Goku. Freeza was driven by the anger of having been toppled by someone he considered to be trash. He wanted to kill the unworthy, filthy ape who had the nerve to stand up to him. Oh and he wanted to kill that ape's loved ones and destroy the planet he lives on.

But he's the underdog, so rah rah Freeza? Go, Freeza, go!
Protagonist doesn't mean hero. Light Yagami in Death Note for example is the villain but is also the main character/ protagonist.

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by NitroEX » Thu Nov 05, 2015 11:08 pm

Since when does a story's protagonist always have to be the hero? There are plenty of examples of stories that are told from the perspective of a "bad" person and those stories end tragically for the characters, much like RoF.

Admittedly I've only seen the film once but I definitely came away from the experience feeling like I had been following Freeza's journey and not Goku's or Vegeta's. The fact that Freeza had failed repeatedly to achieve his goals in the past coupled with him being the underdog in this film made it easy for me to take pity on the character and want to see him redeem himself for once. I'm obviously aware that he's an evil dirtbag but the way the story is framed undeniably makes me connect to him more than anyone else and as a result he just comes off as a more sympathetic character.

If Goku and Vegeta had been trying to unlock Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan throughout the whole film then I'd agree they were the protagonists but instead we only saw glimpses of their training which, aside from giving reason for their new forms, doesn't really make me care about their goals.

What I'm still trying to figure out is if Toei intentionally set out to make Freeza the most engaging character from the outset or if it was just a happy accident due to poor storytelling.

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by TheGreatness25 » Thu Nov 05, 2015 11:08 pm

See, I feel like the protagonist of DB is the hero because the series revolves around good vs evil. Hard to root for the evil-doer. I feel like the true focus is on Goku and Vegeta's relationship, whereas Freeza is just there to play to it. I think we got a lot of time with Freeza in this movie to try to develop his character.

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by Araki » Fri Nov 06, 2015 3:30 am

NitroEX wrote:If Goku and Vegeta had been trying to unlock Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan throughout the whole film then I'd agree they were the protagonists but instead we only saw glimpses of their training which, aside from giving reason for their new forms, doesn't really make me care about their goals.

What I'm still trying to figure out is if Toei intentionally set out to make Freeza the most engaging character from the outset or if it was just a happy accident due to poor storytelling.
It's interesting that, if we remove the training scenes on Beerus' planet, one could make a case the movie is told from Freeza's point of view. Even when he's not present in the remaining scenes, it's always about him or people reacting to him.
He's the first named character we see, and it takes a while until we finally see Goku and Vegeta - the whole beginning of the movie is about bringing him back to life.

I'm not sure if Toriyama had that in mind when he wrote the script, but it certainly seems like he really wanted to put Freeza in the spotlight.

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by Khin » Fri Nov 06, 2015 5:24 am

I hope they remove Freeza's Golden Form weakness and actually have him beating Goku with no dirty tricks.

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by Son Edo » Fri Nov 06, 2015 5:36 am

Villains are cool and generally the better characters 90% of the time.

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by Kid Buu » Fri Nov 06, 2015 6:26 am

I'm not sure if I'd say he is the protagonist, but he does seem to have more of a focus than any of the Z-Fighters, really.
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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by ABED » Fri Nov 06, 2015 8:44 am

I don't like these "the villain is really the hero of the story" things I've been seeing pop up recently, such as The Joker is the REAL hero in The Dark Knight. Freeza isn't overcoming the odds in order to achieve some positive, life affirming goal. He is trying to get revenge on Goku and even destroys an entire planet with billions of people on it. He's only could be the protagonist in the literal sense that he is arguably the focal character.
Villains are cool and generally the better characters 90% of the time.
I find that is overstated and typically true for only a couple of reasons - the writer deliberately makes the villain more interesting or doesn't know how to write a compelling hero.
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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by Man-Child » Fri Nov 06, 2015 9:47 am

Well I certainly wanted him to win for a change, thats for sure. As opposed to the utter humiliation they brought him back for.

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by Khin » Fri Nov 06, 2015 9:48 am

Man-Child wrote:Well I certainly wanted him to win for a change, thats for sure. As opposed to the utter humiliation they brought him back for.
I second this.I actually wish Freeza to acutally defeat Goku so that his revival would not be a waste.

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by ABED » Fri Nov 06, 2015 10:58 am

SSJ3 Vegeta wrote:
Man-Child wrote:Well I certainly wanted him to win for a change, thats for sure. As opposed to the utter humiliation they brought him back for.
I second this.I actually wish Freeza to acutally defeat Goku so that his revival would not be a waste.
Did you want him to win or just defeat Goku?
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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by Man-Child » Fri Nov 06, 2015 12:15 pm

I wanted him to have some chance of beating Goku or Vegeta in a fair fight. It's sad that Sorbet landed a bigger blow than Freeza could through their entire battle.

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by ABED » Fri Nov 06, 2015 1:17 pm

It is arguable that Freeza had a chance earlier on in the fight, but he drew it out because he didn't realize his fatal flaw.
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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by LuckyCat » Fri Nov 06, 2015 2:45 pm

I'm trying to be open to this idea, but there just isn't enough morally gray area to work with. Freeza's revenge is completely unsympathetic, since he was the instigator of his battle with Goku by killing his race and friends. Freeza ignores countless opportunities to grow as a character by dismissing suggestions from his own minions that he can control an empire and forget about Goku. He dismisses another chance to grow by not accepting Goku's offer to train and fight another day. And his reasoning for declining growth is so petty and infantile, that the audience is really left with the idea that Freeza is a lost cause.

If they showed scenes that established Freeza as maintaining some sort of legitimate empire, and that his evil deeds actually served a higher purpose of galactic stability, Freeza could be a protagonist as a necessary evil (like Beerus). But without scenes like this, we're left with the conclusion that Freeza is petty and infantile in all situations, making for a terrible leader even without the Goku grudge.

So if you must paint Freeza as the protagonist, he's a shallow one at best, and that doesn't really make the movie better.

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Re: Freeza is the Protagonist of Resurrection F

Post by Man-Child » Fri Nov 06, 2015 4:16 pm

ABED wrote:It is arguable that Freeza had a chance earlier on in the fight, but he drew it out because he didn't realize his fatal flaw.
Good point. Though I never felt he was a real threat in that whole sequence. The constant analysis of his powers from Goku, and the comedic dialogue from the rest of the characters just took the tension right out of that fight for me.
Last edited by Man-Child on Sat Nov 07, 2015 9:58 am, edited 2 times in total.

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