What was the point in excluding Chiaotzu?

[Krillin1994]

The last time we see Chiatzou on a battlefield in the show is when Mecha Frieza comes to earth. Then for every encounter with any enemies from then on Tien always says he told Chiaotzu to stay behind.

he's the only Z fighter to never have a victory in the show. But he doesn't let this deter him and chooses to keep training.

From Tien's perspective he says that Chiaotzu is too weak and doesn't want to see harm come to him. But in the series underdogs have had moments which have saved the day/helped fire situations until goku arrives.

I know Chiaotzu would want to respect Tien's wishes but at the same time if he cared he would go to the battlefield alongside him or sneak over later (a la Gohan and Krillin returning to fight Vegeta).

Has Toriyama ever given any statements about Chiaotzu? As to why he chose to avoid him from the action.

Also the filler that Toei added of Chiaotzu at master roshi's is some of the most frustrating as it has home completely relaxed and calm as his friends are all getting their asses kicked.

[Jaetinh]

I'm a fan of the original 5 Z-Warriors (Goku, Krillin, Tenshinhan, Yamcha and Chaozu) so yeah, I've been wondering that myself too.

Toriyama even included him as a Z-Warrior in this image which basically is how they all look after the timeskip (Trunks defeating Frieza)
We're led to believe he's going to fight too alongside everybody else because of this promo art, that unfortunately didn't happen.



Toriyama probably just got sick of drawing him and wrote him off for good after he drew that picture.

[Krillin1994]

Even if Toriyama hated drawing him, would fans have been so outraged if toei had chosen to have him at these events trying to help out.

In tree of might despite him not really being able to do too much I love the fact that he's there defending the earth still.

[Gyt Kaliba]

Sadly Chaozu just never really got much to do. People give the humans in general a lot of crap, but Kuririn has tons he gets to do over the course of the series, not to mention some great fights to be a part of. Same goes, though to a lesser degree, with Tenshinhan. The same also holds true to an even lesser degree for poor Yamcha - he might be used as a measuring stick a lot early on, but at least that's doing something with him, sorta.

Chaozu, though? He gets one fight (against Kuririn) really, and has a gimmick about being able to re-arrange tournament slots to his or a friend's wishes, but other than that...well, that's sorta it actually. We don't get to see any of his other fights really, not even against Nappa - he just sorta disappears and re-appears and blows himself up on his back. Then the next time his tournament rigging gimmick is needed, Goku has Boo do it. Sure, that would have required having Tenshinhan and Chaozu there again, but just having Chaozu do it would have at least given us Goku finally talking to him too.

Personally I think the only reason nobody rags on Chaozu much, the same way a lot do Kuririn or Yamcha? It's because Chaozu's never even really there to do anything to get ragged on about! And that's kinda disappointing, given how much we're expected to be invested in his friendship with Tenshinhan at times. Not to mention he had a fairly snarky and amusing personality in his initial introduction and fight with Kuririn - a snarky little guy who loved to talk shit, but was so bad at math that it could cause him to lose a fight. What happened to that side of him? It's been MIA ever since.

[apex_pretador]

a snarky little guy who loved to talk shit, but was so bad at math that it could cause him to lose a fight. What happened to that side of him?

That's what he has been training for over the years and is still really weak.

[RedRibbonSoldier#42]

it would have at least given us Goku finally talking to him too.
.

Actually, I may be forgetting something, but I don't think Gokuu has ever spoken with Chiaotzu.

[MozillaVulpix]

I mean, the only reason he seemed to be introduced in the first place was to give Krillin a rival and to give Tenshinhan someone to talk to. He barely gets any personality. I guess Toriyama could have always developed him a bit more, but I don't think anyone thought the series was really lacking a Chinese vampire child with psychic powers.

[Lord Beerus]

He just doesn't bring anything unique to the table, to be brutally honest.

[nite_jay]

He just doesn't bring anything unique to the table, to be brutally honest.

He could bring some really unique things to the table, but of course psychic abilities are weakened by the other character's raw strength.

[Krillin1994]

It seems that later characters took concepts that made Chiaotzu somewhat Unique. His ability of mimicry of techniques from seeing them was also used by buu (directly) and Cell had z fighters moves (indirectly), even Frieza debatably took krillin's attack and improved it.

Then the sort of psychic tournament jumbling up as said was taken by buu as well.

I just find it especially weird that whilst Tien helped Gohan out in the Buu saga, Chiaotzu did nothing. Tien's usual excuse of it being too dangerous is kind of moot considering he's like one of 5 people left on earth at this point.

[LordCrumb]

it would have at least given us Goku finally talking to him too.
.

Actually, I may be forgetting something, but I don't think Gokuu has ever spoken with Chiaotzu.

In the Dub (could be in Kai), Goku says something like "and Chiaotzu too! good one little guy", when they return from 'Other World'. But that's not really talking to him either.

[Dr. Casey]

I think Goku does speak telepathically to Chaozu at some point during the Namek saga in the anime, but I'm not completely sure on that.

Idle speculation here that could easily be totally wrong, but I've gotten the impression that Toriyama just doesn't care about Chaozu that much. I don't know if he finds him difficult to draw or to otherwise work with, but the scenes in which he's supposed to be a focus do tend to pass by oddly fast. Tao Pai Pai injures him in the 23rd Tenkaichi preliminaries, the scene with everyone reacting afterwards flies by. He returns from the hospital after Goku wins the tournament, it's glossed over in one or two panels and nobody except Tenshinhan shows any response. Tenshinhan tells the group in a quick statement that he's leaving Chaozu at home for the Cell Games, Goku gives a wordless nod, nothing more is said about it. Tenshinhan could create an imaginary friend for himself and the Dragon Ball cast would acknowledge its existence to roughly the same degree they do Chaozu's.

[Majin Jator]

Personally I think the only reason nobody rags on Chaozu much, the same way a lot do Kuririn or Yamcha? It's because Chaozu's never even really there to do anything to get ragged on about! And that's kinda disappointing, given how much we're expected to be invested in his friendship with Tenshinhan at times. Not to mention he had a fairly snarky and amusing personality in his initial introduction and fight with Kuririn - a snarky little guy who loved to talk shit, but was so bad at math that it could cause him to lose a fight. What happened to that side of him? It's been MIA ever since.

Well, when everyone around you can blow your head with a single punch, you restrain yourself from make any snide remark. That's my headcanon explanation, anyway.

[Krillin1994]

Goku seems to be fond enough of Chiaotzu to give Nappa a punch whilst saying 'this is for Chiaotzu'. But yeah I'm a bit puzzled as to when they would have interacted considering that he met him for the first time at the tournament as his enemy. Then when having a meal together the King Piccolo stuff began.

Then he didn't see Chiaotzu until the 23rd tournament and only briefly at the start and end.

Then not for the 5 years until the start of Z, and another year goes by before he avenges him....

So that's kind of a decade with barely any interaction....

I mean Goku kind of spent the same amount of time barely speaking to Tien/Yamcha/Krillin and others but he was already good friends with them or in the case with Tien fought him and fought with him against King Piccolo gaining respect.

[Marugoto]

Goku would've never thought about Chaozu if Nappa hadn't reminded him. Then he was suddenly all like: "Oh shit yeah, there was this Chaozu guy too. Better include him in my big comeback beatdown."

Same thing happened when Kaio called him on his way to Namek. He was totally baffled on who this mysterious fourth guy might be. "Could it be old man Kami? Ohh...it's just Chaozu. Well ah...good for him, I guess."

But seriously, you know you're on Toriyama's shitlist if he hasn't drawn you with abs by the time the Androids showed up.

[Krillin1994]

Same thing happened when Kaio called him on his way to Namek. He was totally baffled on who this mysterious fourth guy might be. "Could it be old man Kami? Ohh...it's just Chaozu. Well ah...good for him, I guess."

Is this legit?

[DBZAOTA482]

The point is Chiaotzu sucks. He's a shit fighter without his telekinesis and bukujutsu.

[Krillin1994]

He knows the dodon ray which for comparable power levelled people is stronger than the Kamehameha

[Marugoto]

Is this legit?

It's sad but true

[TheGreatness25]

I never really appreciated Chaozu, but I do think that the original Z Warriors should always be included in some fashion or another. This is a brotherhood that stood together in the overwhelming fact of doom... and then they were overpowered and became totally irrelevant. I think that the bond between Kuririn and Gohan should be the type that keeps them close forever. Likewise, Kuririn should always feel bonded with Yamucha, Tenshinhan, and Chaozu. They never had that hardcore bonding like Gohan and Kuririn did, for example, but when you have a buddy (regardless of how little you know him) stand by your side as you're dying, that's the type of thing that bonds you forever. Chaozu sacrificed himself for Tenshinhan, Kuririn, and Gohan and since he returns, nobody even seems to mention him or what he did. Chaozu is made to look like he's just the little guy that gets in Ten's way.