Things that grind your gears

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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by Nia » Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:03 pm

dbgtFO wrote:
Nia wrote:[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
The way Toyotaro draws Zamasu. Really, Toyotaro in general, but especially Zamasu. What is with his neck being thicker than Goku's legs? Why does he have an emover hairdo? For some reason, this drives me absolutely bonkers.
The neck is definitely a Toyotaro thing, he also drew Black with a thick neck most of the time, as opposed to the anime making him slim, his elegance in contrast to the foul brutish mortals.
In regards to his hair, there was a correction made by Toriyama, specifically for Toyotaro to draw inspiration from, but I can't recall, if he drew his hair like that.
Yeah, I saw the correction Toriyama did. It's perhaps even worse knowing that, given that Toriyama corrected him and he somehow still didn't get the memo.
Zamasu's hair is supposed to stick out a bit more, but I swear almost every time it appears in the manga, it's just kinda layered on top of itself. It's probably just me being nitpicky, but it really bothers me. That's probably a bit hypocritical of me considering how the anime looks sometimes, but I feel like they generally try to make the characters look right, all things considered.
DragonBallKing wrote:Seeing Dubism's in subtitles for Super also rustles my jamies.
So much yes to this.
Someone screencapped this for me a while back, and...
[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
*proceeds to froth at the mouth in annoyance*
It's even worse when a character blurts out something in audible English, and the subtitles read a different word altogether. During one episode (I think it was the baseball one), Yamcha audibly says "Lucky!" in English, yet the subs read "Nice!"
If they want to screw up the dub, so be it. But leave the subs out of it, dang it! Speaking of which... have they started releasing the dub on DVD yet? If so, does it have the same crappy subs?

Also, another gear grinding: that Dragon Garow Lee will probably never get more recognized, despite his works being quite a bit better than... that other doujin guy. Legit enjoyed his Yamcha spin-off, and I think Dragon Ball Sai (what I've read of it anyway) was a great take on a what-if scenario that was more than just a character swap or a case of "the bad guys win."

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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by MajinMan » Fri Sep 08, 2017 5:05 am

Nia wrote:
dbgtFO wrote:
Nia wrote:[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
The way Toyotaro draws Zamasu. Really, Toyotaro in general, but especially Zamasu. What is with his neck being thicker than Goku's legs? Why does he have an emover hairdo? For some reason, this drives me absolutely bonkers.
The neck is definitely a Toyotaro thing, he also drew Black with a thick neck most of the time, as opposed to the anime making him slim, his elegance in contrast to the foul brutish mortals.
In regards to his hair, there was a correction made by Toriyama, specifically for Toyotaro to draw inspiration from, but I can't recall, if he drew his hair like that.
Yeah, I saw the correction Toriyama did. It's perhaps even worse knowing that, given that Toriyama corrected him and he somehow still didn't get the memo.
Zamasu's hair is supposed to stick out a bit more, but I swear almost every time it appears in the manga, it's just kinda layered on top of itself. It's probably just me being nitpicky, but it really bothers me. That's probably a bit hypocritical of me considering how the anime looks sometimes, but I feel like they generally try to make the characters look right, all things considered.
DragonBallKing wrote:Seeing Dubism's in subtitles for Super also rustles my jamies.
So much yes to this.
Someone screencapped this for me a while back, and...
[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
*proceeds to froth at the mouth in annoyance*
It's even worse when a character blurts out something in audible English, and the subtitles read a different word altogether. During one episode (I think it was the baseball one), Yamcha audibly says "Lucky!" in English, yet the subs read "Nice!"
If they want to screw up the dub, so be it. But leave the subs out of it, dang it! Speaking of which... have they started releasing the dub on DVD yet? If so, does it have the same crappy subs?

Also, another gear grinding: that Dragon Garow Lee will probably never get more recognized, despite his works being quite a bit better than... that other doujin guy. Legit enjoyed his Yamcha spin-off, and I think Dragon Ball Sai (what I've read of it anyway) was a great take on a what-if scenario that was more than just a character swap or a case of "the bad guys win."
I'm like 99% sure Simmons is doing the subs for the Funimation release. And on the subject of dubisms in the Toei subs, I also really hate it. No matter what name or title they use for Muten Roshi, it is always shown as "Master Roshi." Even when Goku calls him gramps. And then they somehow managed to call it the "Kame" style in episode 105 when Roshi was giving his big speech, instead of the "Master Roshi" style. It shows that they know damn well who they're pandering to, but slip sometimes and let in more accurate translations.
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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by Nia » Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:22 pm

MajinMan wrote: I'm like 99% sure Simmons is doing the subs for the Funimation release. And on the subject of dubisms in the Toei subs, I also really hate it. No matter what name or title they use for Muten Roshi, it is always shown as "Master Roshi." Even when Goku calls him gramps. And then they somehow managed to call it the "Kame" style in episode 105 when Roshi was giving his big speech, instead of the "Master Roshi" style. It shows that they know damn well who they're pandering to, but slip sometimes and let in more accurate translations.
I hope you're right Simmons is gonna do the subs for the DVDs and such, without the dubisms. I legitimately think the fansubs I saw before the Crunchyroll subs were much more on point (at least based on what I know of Japanese and the comparison to the Simmons subs).

Also, I don't think any single dubism in the subs drove me more bonkers than this:
[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
Like... come on, the dub doesn't even call the Kaioken that! ...Except for the first two Budokai games.
If I didn't know better, I'd almost swear they were doing that just to make the Japanese version look worse... except everyone clearly hears Kaioken, the same name used in the dub.

Another thing I just gotta gripe about with those subs is the honorifics. Maybe this is extremely nitpicky, or I'm completely wrong, but has at any point in any anime ever an honorific ever been done in a split like that? What I mean is, I've never once seen anyone use "Goku san" instead of "Goku-san." I've always seen it connected by a hyphen, and it seems really unnatural to see it spaced and for whatever reason italicized.
(If I'm wrong about this or I'm just being way too nitpicky, please feel free to chew me out.)

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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by Zeru14 » Sun Sep 10, 2017 1:33 am

Laughingstock Media over on YouTube, did videos about things thats grinded my gears for years:
-Why don't the Z Fighters know how to use Kaioken?
-Why don't the OTHER Z Fighters use the Time Chamber anymore?
-Where was King Kai in the Future Trunks Timeline?

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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by Kinokima » Sun Sep 10, 2017 1:50 pm

When to defend one character fans think they need to bash another character. Mainly see this with Goku vs Vegeta fans but it's a common problem in this fandom. And as I've gotten back into this fandom many years later it doesn't seem to have gotten better.

Or when fans can only see a character worth based on how strong they are or what fights they won. Granted I realize this is a fighting series and strength/power level is part of these characters but it isn't the only part of them or what makes them worthy as characters.

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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by Freeza9000 » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:02 am

You know what grinds my gears the most? The hypocrites that routinely throw constant bitchfests about how Dragon Ball Super has violated their lives and how torturous it is to watch it yet continue to keep up with the series 100+ episodes. The same people that always proclaim how much they want to drop the show only to pick it up and watch it again. The same people that have their own heads stuck up their asses and are so goddamn egotistical to the point where they feel the essential need to go to every forum and comment section to label everyone a "Supertard" and can't tell the differences between what a fact and an opinion is.

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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by Kinokima » Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:42 am

Freeza9000 wrote:You know what grinds my gears the most? The hypocrites that routinely throw constant bitchfests about how Dragon Ball Super has violated their lives and how torturous it is to watch it yet continue to keep up with the series 100+ episodes. The same people that always proclaim how much they want to drop the show only to pick it up and watch it again. The same people that have their own heads stuck up their asses and are so goddamn egotistical to the point where they feel the essential need to go to every forum and comment section to label everyone a "Supertard" and can't tell the differences between what a fact and an opinion is.

Oh yes definitely I never understand fans who "hate watch"

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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by MrUnusual » Sun Sep 17, 2017 9:11 am

Me and Salagir (Creator/Writer of Dragon Ball Multiverse) always used to argue about English translations lol. I love the guy but our views on this subject were so different, our debates were fun, at least, I'd like to think so. His name for Bardock is Baddack, Krillin is Kururrin, Dabura is Dabra. His versions of the names of the characters and attacks are more of a direct translation from Japanese and sometimes from Japanese to French.

I was assigned to correct his grammar for DBM so that sentences made sense, occasionally I would correct the names, it would drive him crazy lol. I explained to him that here in the West, fans are more familiar with the names of the characters in Anime's English dub and that not as many people in the US are as familiar with the Manga as they are the anime, but he argued to keep it that way. I will say this though, Dabra does make more sense than Dabura, however, Dabura was probably used to not make the name pun as obvious, which I like, just as Goku's real name is Kakarrot, not Carrot.

My point to this though as to what grinds my gears is when Japanese names are overused in English translations in some of the fanbase especially when some things are still referred to by one or the other by the same person, it reminds me of when people speak Spanglish, it could be very confusing. But this happens so much that it even happens in mainstream at times, like when Supreme Kai calls the Grand Supreme Kai, Dai Kaio in the FUNimation dub back in the Buu Saga, but he is then later referred to as the Grand Supreme Kai, I've heard many other instances of this happening in the anime too, make up your minds lol. But it's worst when things are translated incorrectly, like Android 17 and 18 are not Androids, they are Artificial Humans, that is a bit long to say, they can also be considered Cyborgs, that does not have a good ring to it though Cyborg 17 sounds funny, doesn't seem to fit, I just call then #17 and #18.

But it only really bothers me because some people do it just to sound cool, like "Hey, I'm American, but I know the actual Japanese names of the characters and attacks, so I'm going to overuse them in sentences in conversations about the English Dub to make myself sound more knowledgeable than others", like they will say in posts, "Krillin, AKA Kururrin is my favorite character in the series", perhaps they are just trying to appeal to all cultures when they do this, and that's fine, but I think some people do it to boast a bit lol. It's not as much that it bothers me as it is funny and everyone has there own reasons lol. This is not to say Salagir does this though as he lives in France and over there, they use different names, more close to the Japanese names, but I just notice people do that a lot.

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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by DragonBallKing » Sun Sep 17, 2017 11:06 am

MrUnusual wrote:Me and Salagir (Creator/Writer of Dragon Ball Multiverse) always used to argue about English translations lol. I love the guy but our views on this subject were so different, our debates were fun, at least, I'd like to think so. His name for Bardock is Baddack, Krillin is Kururrin, Dabura is Dabra. His versions of the names of the characters and attacks are more of a direct translation from Japanese and sometimes from Japanese to French.

I was assigned to correct his grammar for DBM so that sentences made sense, occasionally I would correct the names, it would drive him crazy lol. I explained to him that here in the West, fans are more familiar with the names of the characters in Anime's English dub and that not as many people in the US are as familiar with the Manga as they are the anime, but he argued to keep it that way. I will say this though, Dabra does make more sense than Dabura, however, Dabura was probably used to not make the name pun as obvious, which I like, just as Goku's real name is Kakarrot, not Carrot.

My point to this though as to what grinds my gears is when Japanese names are overused in English translations in some of the fanbase especially when some things are still referred to by one or the other by the same person, it reminds me of when people speak Spanglish, it could be very confusing. But this happens so much that it even happens in mainstream at times, like when Supreme Kai calls the Grand Supreme Kai, Dai Kaio in the FUNimation dub back in the Buu Saga, but he is then later referred to as the Grand Supreme Kai, I've heard many other instances of this happening in the anime too, make up your minds lol. But it's worst when things are translated incorrectly, like Android 17 and 18 are not Androids, they are Artificial Humans, that is a bit long to say, they can also be considered Cyborgs, that does not have a good ring to it though Cyborg 17 sounds funny, doesn't seem to fit, I just call then #17 and #18.

But it only really bothers me because some people do it just to sound cool, like "Hey, I'm American, but I know the actual Japanese names of the characters and attacks, so I'm going to overuse them in sentences in conversations about the English Dub to make myself sound more knowledgeable than others", like they will say in posts, "Krillin, AKA Kururrin is my favorite character in the series", perhaps they are just trying to appeal to all cultures when they do this, and that's fine, but I think some people do it to boast a bit lol. It's not as much that it bothers me as it is funny and everyone has there own reasons lol. This is not to say Salagir does this though as he lives in France and over there, they use different names, more close to the Japanese names, but I just notice people do that a lot.
I can understand wanting to appeal to all fandom's in such a widespread series, and wanting to be as accurate to the source as possible. It's nowhere near as bad as other anime fandom's using random Japanese just to seem cool, like the One Piece "nakama" obsession. On the other hand it's annoying to have subs for Super using exclusively dub terms, for example no matter they call Muten Roshi be it kame sennin or ji-chan it's always master Roshi in the subs and that bothers me.
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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by Ripper 30 » Sun Sep 17, 2017 11:10 am

DragonBallKing wrote:
MrUnusual wrote:Me and Salagir (Creator/Writer of Dragon Ball Multiverse) always used to argue about English translations lol. I love the guy but our views on this subject were so different, our debates were fun, at least, I'd like to think so. His name for Bardock is Baddack, Krillin is Kururrin, Dabura is Dabra. His versions of the names of the characters and attacks are more of a direct translation from Japanese and sometimes from Japanese to French.

I was assigned to correct his grammar for DBM so that sentences made sense, occasionally I would correct the names, it would drive him crazy lol. I explained to him that here in the West, fans are more familiar with the names of the characters in Anime's English dub and that not as many people in the US are as familiar with the Manga as they are the anime, but he argued to keep it that way. I will say this though, Dabra does make more sense than Dabura, however, Dabura was probably used to not make the name pun as obvious, which I like, just as Goku's real name is Kakarrot, not Carrot.

My point to this though as to what grinds my gears is when Japanese names are overused in English translations in some of the fanbase especially when some things are still referred to by one or the other by the same person, it reminds me of when people speak Spanglish, it could be very confusing. But this happens so much that it even happens in mainstream at times, like when Supreme Kai calls the Grand Supreme Kai, Dai Kaio in the FUNimation dub back in the Buu Saga, but he is then later referred to as the Grand Supreme Kai, I've heard many other instances of this happening in the anime too, make up your minds lol. But it's worst when things are translated incorrectly, like Android 17 and 18 are not Androids, they are Artificial Humans, that is a bit long to say, they can also be considered Cyborgs, that does not have a good ring to it though Cyborg 17 sounds funny, doesn't seem to fit, I just call then #17 and #18.

But it only really bothers me because some people do it just to sound cool, like "Hey, I'm American, but I know the actual Japanese names of the characters and attacks, so I'm going to overuse them in sentences in conversations about the English Dub to make myself sound more knowledgeable than others", like they will say in posts, "Krillin, AKA Kururrin is my favorite character in the series", perhaps they are just trying to appeal to all cultures when they do this, and that's fine, but I think some people do it to boast a bit lol. It's not as much that it bothers me as it is funny and everyone has there own reasons lol. This is not to say Salagir does this though as he lives in France and over there, they use different names, more close to the Japanese names, but I just notice people do that a lot.
I can understand wanting to appeal to all fandom's in such a widespread series, and wanting to be as accurate to the source as possible. It's nowhere near as bad as other anime fandom's using random Japanese just to seem cool, like the One Piece "nakama" obsession. On the other hand it's annoying to have subs for Super using exclusively dub terms, for example no matter they call Muten Roshi be it kame sennin or ji-chan it's always master Roshi in the subs and that bothers me.
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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by TheGodfather93 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:01 pm

Kinokima wrote:When to defend one character fans think they need to bash another character. Mainly see this with Goku vs Vegeta fans but it's a common problem in this fandom. And as I've gotten back into this fandom many years later it doesn't seem to have gotten better.

Or when fans can only see a character worth based on how strong they are or what fights they won. Granted I realize this is a fighting series and strength/power level is part of these characters but it isn't the only part of them or what makes them worthy as characters.
Being a Gohan fan, I know this all too well. Some people can't seem to fathom that I like Gohan for his character, not for his strength, and that I prefer Great Saiyaman to Ultimate Gohan.
DragonBallKing wrote:I can understand wanting to appeal to all fandom's in such a widespread series, and wanting to be as accurate to the source as possible. It's nowhere near as bad as other anime fandom's using random Japanese just to seem cool, like the One Piece "nakama" obsession. On the other hand it's annoying to have subs for Super using exclusively dub terms, for example no matter they call Muten Roshi be it kame sennin or ji-chan it's always master Roshi in the subs and that bothers me.
I think using nakama in the One Piece fandom is passable, because there isn't really a direct English translation for it. I think the closest translation is the word 'comrade', but that sounds a bit too formal to be used by pirates.
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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by DragonBallKing » Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:15 am

DragonBallKing wrote:I can understand wanting to appeal to all fandom's in such a widespread series, and wanting to be as accurate to the source as possible. It's nowhere near as bad as other anime fandom's using random Japanese just to seem cool, like the One Piece "nakama" obsession. On the other hand it's annoying to have subs for Super using exclusively dub terms, for example no matter they call Muten Roshi be it kame sennin or ji-chan it's always master Roshi in the subs and that bothers me.
I think using nakama in the One Piece fandom is passable, because there isn't really a direct English translation for it. I think the closest translation is the word 'comrade', but that sounds a bit too formal to be used by pirates.[/quote]

Comrade or crewmate would work just fine depending on the situation. The problem is the fan base thinks that it has some deeper meaning when it doesn't, all Shonen series use the term heavily but it's only the english speaking One Piece fans that make it out to be a special word.
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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by Soppa Saia People » Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:11 am

Crunchyrolls subs sucked, and if Simmons didn't do the subs for the official release, I'm gonna be peeved.
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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by Draconic » Wed Sep 20, 2017 12:09 pm

How in the Super manga everything is just a "technique".

Beerus can't destroy everything just because he's a strong guy, but because Hakai is an overpowered technique.

Whis can't move without thinking just because that's his fighting style, but because it's some technique he knows.

I love techniques, don't get me wrong. Used well they can turn the tables in an otherwise uneven battle, make characters unique and useful for certain situations and also enhance their role in the story.

For example, Muten Roshi knows a bunch of different techniques, but that doesn't take away from his role in the plot, but enhaces his character and purpose as the Divine Master of Martial Arts, since we can assume he picked them up trough his hundreds of years of experience.

Beerus, on the other hand, is supposed to be the God of Destruction, aka strong enough to destroy anything in the blink of an eye. But he can only do that because he knows this awesome technique that Goku can apparently just pick up on off-screen. What's his purpose in the story then? What makes him special anymore? He's rendered a one trick pony who lost that trick.

Can you imagine if everything was like that from the start? Tao Pai Pai isn't just some talented martial artist, but he has a pole-ridding technique; or Piccolo doesn't just have this demonic/alien biology, but a special egg-spitting technique; Vegeta isn't just the strongest Saiyan ever, but has a Saiyan Elite technique that puts him above everybody; Freeza isn't just an extremely overpowered guy, but he has this technique that allows him to get away with everything.

I mean, it's not story breaking in any way and Goku using Hakai against Zamasu is a cool moment (certainly a highlight of the arc), but it's just one of those little things that makes the characters much more flat and less interesting to read about in Toyotaro's version.
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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by DragonBallKing » Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:09 pm

The fact that here in the west purist's get so offended and angry when you bring up a decent dub for any anime, acting like dubbing anything is akin to Satanism. While in Japan they don't give a crap about purism or which version you watch because nearly every big Hollywood movie gets dubbed. Same thing with dubbing cartoons in other languages but anime has some serious elitists.
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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Wed Sep 20, 2017 4:15 pm

Draconic wrote:How in the Super manga everything is just a "technique".

Beerus can't destroy everything just because he's a strong guy, but because Hakai is an overpowered technique.

Whis can't move without thinking just because that's his fighting style, but because it's some technique he knows.

I love techniques, don't get me wrong. Used well they can turn the tables in an otherwise uneven battle, make characters unique and useful for certain situations and also enhance their role in the story.

For example, Muten Roshi knows a bunch of different techniques, but that doesn't take away from his role in the plot, but enhaces his character and purpose as the Divine Master of Martial Arts, since we can assume he picked them up trough his hundreds of years of experience.

Beerus, on the other hand, is supposed to be the God of Destruction, aka strong enough to destroy anything in the blink of an eye. But he can only do that because he knows this awesome technique that Goku can apparently just pick up on off-screen. What's his purpose in the story then? What makes him special anymore? He's rendered a one trick pony who lost that trick.

Can you imagine if everything was like that from the start? Tao Pai Pai isn't just some talented martial artist, but he has a pole-ridding technique; or Piccolo doesn't just have this demonic/alien biology, but a special egg-spitting technique; Vegeta isn't just the strongest Saiyan ever, but has a Saiyan Elite technique that puts him above everybody; Freeza isn't just an extremely overpowered guy, but he has this technique that allows him to get away with everything.

I mean, it's not story breaking in any way and Goku using Hakai against Zamasu is a cool moment (certainly a highlight of the arc), but it's just one of those little things that makes the characters much more flat and less interesting to read about in Toyotaro's version.
I wouldn't say Goku's "Hakai" technique was cool in the slightest it was just too stupid to comprehend, there was literally no build up to it and as far as I know Goku didn't even witness it in the Manga did he? And like you said it more or less renders Beerus useless that a mortal can easily use a GoD's technique, his title of GoD essentially means nothing then in the Manga, he is just a fairly strong guy with a title.

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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by dbgtFO » Thu Sep 21, 2017 2:03 am

"There is a universe, where lives a mortal, even a God of Destruction can't beat."

Where lives?
Maji kayo??
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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by Soppa Saia People » Thu Sep 21, 2017 9:11 am

Amazon deleting my 39 Volumes of Dragon Ball. Right when I'm about to reread it to.
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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by Tombstone1988 » Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:38 am

One recent thing that grinds my gears is the members of the community who are "anti-power scaling," for lack of a better term. This is NOT referring to anyone who dislikes or even hates power levels and power scaling in the series; those are legitimate opinions to have. I'm talking about people who apparently find joy in people that get frustrated or confused over bad scaling moments. People who like power scaling in the show like it for reasons; for me, it's because it creates a set of rules that the show loosely follows. However, there seems to be a rising number of people who despise power scaling so much that they want it to be intentionally nonsensical just to mess with people that like it. A year ago I would have called it trolling, but there's enough people with that mindset now that it's frankly quite annoying.
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Re: Things that grind your gears

Post by ABED » Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:47 am

Tombstone1988 wrote:One recent thing that grinds my gears is the members of the community who are "anti-power scaling," for lack of a better term. This is NOT referring to anyone who dislikes or even hates power levels and power scaling in the series; those are legitimate opinions to have. I'm talking about people who apparently find joy in people that get frustrated or confused over bad scaling moments. People who like power scaling in the show like it for reasons; for me, it's because it creates a set of rules that the show loosely follows. However, there seems to be a rising number of people who despise power scaling so much that they want it to be intentionally nonsensical just to mess with people that like it. A year ago I would have called it trolling, but there's enough people with that mindset now that it's frankly quite annoying.
This, so much.
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