Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

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Rebel_Yeh
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Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Rebel_Yeh » Sat Jul 23, 2016 11:40 pm

What are your thoughts on Akira Toriyama's version of Hell (shown in Dragon Ball: Resurrection F and Dragon Ball Super)?:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYmvPk5i384

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TheGreatness25
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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by TheGreatness25 » Sat Jul 23, 2016 11:57 pm

It's pretty cool, honestly. I like it; it actually makes me feel like someone who's gone to hell is really suffering.

The thing is that now we have three versions of hell: the original version where they turn into spirits and float around for eternity (with no memory of their life, I believe), the Toei version of hell that many people have been accustomed to for decades, and now this version (which is kind of closer to Toei's hell than the original).

Honestly, I like it. I feel like everyone has something different. For Freeza, it's being surrounded by cuteness because he hates that. For Goku, maybe it would be bunch of giant food-looking people walking around him lol

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by FoolsGil » Sat Jul 23, 2016 11:59 pm

It's better. The DBZ anime and GT's hell had too many plot holes.
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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Soppa Saia People » Sun Jul 24, 2016 12:13 am

Its better IMO, the Toei one made it seem like it Hell was a fun place to live, when it should be the opposite.
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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by precita » Sun Jul 24, 2016 12:23 am

That's only Freeza's prison in hell. For all we know where the other villains are, are probably totally different.

Seeing a person as evil as Freeza be trapped with fairies, songs, an dancing bears would definitely be his personal definition of Hell.

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Grimlock » Sun Jul 24, 2016 12:25 am

I think the concept it's better, sending someone to a place that doesn't accommodate the person. Dabura was sent to Heaven for that case. By the way, I think Freeza was also sent to Heaven instead of Hell (despite everyone saying that it is actually Hell, I think...).

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Rebel_Yeh » Sun Jul 24, 2016 12:28 am

TheGreatness25 wrote:the original version where they turn into spirits and float around for eternity (with no memory of their life, I believe)
But we don't really see much of Hell in the original version. All we pretty much see in the manga is Goku flying across Serpent Road.

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Hellspawn28 » Sun Jul 24, 2016 12:31 am

I think it's funny. It's like what like the Yugopotamians probably think what Hell looks like.
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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Nejishiki » Sun Jul 24, 2016 12:33 am

It's all fine and dandy for several levels of Hell to exist as we know there's a Heaven in the afterlife, too. I like how the primarily Eastern take of death mixes in details of Western concepts, creating a unique environment that can be thought-provoking in its own right. The only detail that strikes me is why Freeza's soul purification is taking so long? I prefer a bit of fadeddreams5's take on the subject where they must go through an entire process before being ready to pass on. Still, it's pushing it a bit to take so many years!

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Rebel_Yeh » Sun Jul 24, 2016 12:35 am

precita wrote:That's only Freeza's prison in hell.
There was no prison there.

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Pantalones » Sun Jul 24, 2016 2:18 am

I think the concept it's better, sending someone to a place that doesn't accommodate the person. Dabura was sent to Heaven for that case. By the way, I think Freeza was also sent to Heaven instead of Hell (despite everyone saying that it is actually Hell, I think...).
The difference between these two situations seems to be that in hell you're trapped, while in heaven you're free to move and do things like you would normally.

Dabura was seen just sitting there free of any restraints surrounded by all the flowers and fluffy critters and such (and presumably he'd even be able to come across other dead people in heaven and interact with them... maybe even qualify for Kai training at some point in the future if he keeps up good behavior?)

On the other hand, Freeza was stuck in this weird veiny pod hanging from a tree so he could do absolutely nothing but watch and listen over and over forever as the same parade with the same little angels and stuffed animals happens every... single... day... for years... and decades... and centuries... until he's finally sent off to have his soul purified and reincarnated.

(A hypothetical Goku's Hell having him trapped where he can see all these delicious foods and strong fighters, but never eat the food or fight anyone, seems likely. Something like Freeza's torture wouldn't work on him, he'd just block everything out and go off to do some mental training like when he got distracted in the "here Goten, you run the giant tractor for a while!"episode... but the possibility of good food and a fight with a new opponent, right there within his line of sight, would distract him way too much for that to be possible.)
There was no prison there.
He was trapped in an impenetrable goo-pod hanging from a tree, with only his face sticking out. How is that not a prison? It's like the worst parts of a straitjacket, shackles, and solitary confinement all rolled up into one thing.

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by TheDevilsCorpse » Sun Jul 24, 2016 2:44 am

It's probably worth noting that the version of Hell seen in the Saiyan Arc filler is actually based off Toriyama's ideas for the staff. We don't have specifics on everything he contributed to it, but the Dragon Ball Z Anime Special guide notes that it's "full of Akira Toriyama-sensei‘s ideas!!”
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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by sintzu » Sun Jul 24, 2016 3:14 am

I think somewhere like M12's hell would've been better.
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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Rebel_Yeh » Sun Jul 24, 2016 1:20 pm

TheDevilsCorpse wrote:It's probably worth noting that the version of Hell seen in the Saiyan Arc filler is actually based off Toriyama's ideas for the staff. We don't have specifics on everything he contributed to it, but the Dragon Ball Z Anime Special guide notes that it's "full of Akira Toriyama-sensei‘s ideas!!”
If I had to guess, he probably only contributed vague outlines for the episodes.

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by TheGreatness25 » Sun Jul 24, 2016 1:24 pm

Honestly, the version of hell that Goku goes to isn't even that far from a stretch of what was established in the manga. There were ogre demon things that guarded all of the body-less souls. Weren't the souls wiped of their identities and memories? So technically, it's fine. It's later on when everyone started keeping their body that things get wonky. I guess if you're outstandingly good or bad you get to keep your body... for some reason.

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Lord Beerus » Sun Jul 24, 2016 6:48 pm

I find it quite charming and funny. It certainly stands out from all the other depictions of Hell that I've seen in other kinds fiction.

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Desassina » Mon Jul 25, 2016 1:41 pm

I don't like it, and I wish that Toriyama would stop with the contrarian design. It's not in Freeza's character to be annoyed by such creatures, when he's charismatic and likes to amuse himself, although with killing intent. The only reason it would seem like hell is the fact that he's restrained, but I prefer the idea of freedom to accomplish nothing, because their souls will get cleansed sooner or later, and their bodies turned to former shells of themselves. With that being said, Toei's got the right idea, but it's inconsistent between the anime and movie 12.

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Luso Saiyan » Mon Jul 25, 2016 1:53 pm

Desassina wrote:It's not in Freeza's character to be annoyed by such creatures,
I'd say it's very much in Freeza's character to be annoyed by such creatures and music.

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Desassina » Mon Jul 25, 2016 2:44 pm

He hired a bunch of dancing freaks who did errands in their free time to earn their power. Plus, we had to be told about the annoyance that hell was, instead of just feeling it. I looked at Freeza's face in his coccoon, and he reminded me of the grudge that he had against Goku and/or Trunks, but not the hell-ish place that he was in.

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Re: Your thoughts on Toriyama's version of Hell

Post by Cipher » Mon Aug 29, 2016 12:14 am

I prefer the hodge-podge Chinese mythological Hell we see in the original anime and GT to the more personalized version we get in Resurrection F. It feels more in the spirit of Dragon Ball's afterlife and mythological influences. They're not impossible to line up with each other, of course, even if that's not the intent.

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