Broli: from "overrated" to "overhated"

[jjgp1112]

Nah. I still Broly is overrated and for a good read reason. He really brings nothing to table other than large muscles, loud grunting and spiky hair. And the franchise already has many characters that already fit that criteria but provide more in terms of character and story. I don't think Broly and all fans of Broly should be admonished, but I believe if someone were to say that Broly is the most overrated character in the franchise, they would have a point.

He's got more personality then beerus and more originality. You have to at least admit that.

Wha....? Not only do I not admit that, I flat out dispute it. Beerus is unlike just about every "villain" we've ever seen in the series and has a ton of personality, whereas Broly is yet another Saiyan villain with zero character post-Movie 8 besides "KAKAROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOT!!!!!!"

[Lord Beerus]

One of classic memes, even TFS used it, when Vegeta mumbled in sleep, when Zarbon came to pick him

What year was this?

2000, I believe.

[Bansho64]

LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta, how in any way is Broly a genius? The guy's as dumb as a doorknob. He's so stupid he couldn't tell a 7 year old from an adult. Trauma or no trauma, he's an utter one dimensional idiot.

[Dbzfan94]

He's got more personality then beerus and more originality. You have to at least admit that.

I can't tell if you're joking or not.

I made a post on why I feel this way. I'm wondering if you're messing me actually. saying Beerus is well written and broly isn't is like saying YODA is poorly written.

Beerus isn't a superbly written character by any means. In fact, how OP he and Whis are is one of Super's biggest problems.
But he is a very interesting character and while the food gags are old, at least he has a compelling personality that outweigh the flaws,
Broly somewhat has a personality in M8 (which i do like a lot) but in M10 he's basically a Saiyan Kid Buu. M10 Broly is a mindless brute who just laughs screams Kakarot the entire movie except for one line.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

I can't tell if you're joking or not.

I made a post on why I feel this way. I'm wondering if you're messing me actually. saying Beerus is well written and broly isn't is like saying YODA is poorly written.

Beerus isn't a superbly written character by any means. In fact, how OP he and Whis are is one of Super's biggest problems.
But he is a very interesting character and while the food gags are old, at least he has a compelling personality that outweigh the flaws,
Broly somewhat has a personality in M8 (which i do like a lot) but in M10 he's basically a Saiyan Kid Buu. M10 Broly is a mindless brute who just laughs screams Kakarot the entire movie except for one line.

I agree movie 10 and 11 really didn't write broly well. They made him have like no lines but kakarot.

LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta, how in any way is Broly a genius? The guy's as dumb as a doorknob. He's so stupid he couldn't tell a 7 year old from an adult. Trauma or no trauma, he's an utter one dimensional idiot.

Movie 10 broly is poorly written. but going by what was done before the put their heads up their asses with his writing-
Broly is the only person who needs oxygen and thought up flying. He always invented flying and energy control as a infant while others had to learn it after years, broly can react within a seoncd to attacks faster then light with ease. Quick response time with his brain. It's not like he's going "me KILL KAKAROT!"
I mean if broly is dumb then so is the likes of Beerus who has piss poor memory.

[TheMikado]

Nah. I still Broly is overrated and for a good read reason. He really brings nothing to table other than large muscles, loud grunting and spiky hair. And the franchise already has many characters that already fit that criteria but provide more in terms of character and story. I don't think Broly and all fans of Broly should be admonished, but I believe if someone were to say that Broly is the most overrated character in the franchise, they would have a point.

I 100% disagree. Broly as a plot device solves a lot of problems and represents a lot. Broly the "character" is dull and uninteresting but that's what he was meant to be. A vessel.

Broly is the encapsulation of the Saiyan race and the super Saiyan legend personified. He is literally not a person at all but a force of nature. His existence is both functional and symbolic. He represents the evil malicious thirst for blood of Saiyans as well as their raw power. He's basically as close to raw Saiyan power as you can get.

Why it works: Broly the representative of true Saiyan legacy in Hunan form hates the only full Saiyan who does not subscribe to Saiyan heritage. It's a representation of Goku rejecting and overcoming what a Saiyan in his raw form is. Further Brolys move set is that of raw power and domination not seen in DBZ. There are no techniques, move sets or tag names. Broly is a representation of something fair greater than himself and an allegory of how Goku has overcome his own Saiyan heritage.

Quoting myself for new page because no body cared.

[Dbzfan94]

Movie 10 broly is poorly written. but going by what was done before the put their heads up their asses with his writing-
Broly is the only person who needs oxygen and thought up flying. He always invented flying and energy control as a infant while others had to learn it after years, broly can react within a seoncd to attacks faster then light with ease. Quick response time with his brain. It's not like he's going "me KILL KAKAROT!"
I mean if broly is dumb then so is the likes of Beerus who has piss poor memory.

Beerus is millions (billions?) of years old and sleeps for loong periods of time. He couldn't possibly remember everything he did.
Broly didn't invent flying either. Pan has been flying since she was a baby too. Also quick reactions to attacks is a quality every DBZ character has, not a special quality for him.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

Movie 10 broly is poorly written. but going by what was done before the put their heads up their asses with his writing-
Broly is the only person who needs oxygen and thought up flying. He always invented flying and energy control as a infant while others had to learn it after years, broly can react within a seoncd to attacks faster then light with ease. Quick response time with his brain. It's not like he's going "me KILL KAKAROT!"
I mean if broly is dumb then so is the likes of Beerus who has piss poor memory.

Beerus is millions (billions?) of years old and sleeps for loong periods of time. He couldn't possibly remember everything he did.
Broly didn't invent flying either. Pan has been flying since she was a baby too. Also quick reactions to attacks is a quality every DBZ character has, not a special quality for him.

Not unique for fighters but the brain has to send signals MUCH faster the nyou'd be able to if you were dumb ,also beerus cant remember the name of ssjgod minutes after talking about it with whis.

[Dbzfan94]

Not unique for fighters but the brain has to send signals MUCH faster the nyou'd be able to if you were dumb ,also beerus cant remember the name of ssjgod minutes after talking about it with whis.

Sending signals to he brain fast is still not a special ability of Broly in any way though. He doesn't do it better than anyone else. H

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

Not unique for fighters but the brain has to send signals MUCH faster the nyou'd be able to if you were dumb ,also beerus cant remember the name of ssjgod minutes after talking about it with whis.

Sending signals to he brain fast is still not a special ability of Broly in any way though. He doesn't do it better than anyone else. H

For your brain to process information that fast is a sign of intelligence. As is knowing how to use ki as a newborn traumatized stabbed infant. Heck he could even SENSE ki. He knew the planet was going to be destroyed and got the fuck out of there. Flew to another planet without a ship.

[Dbzfan94]

Not unique for fighters but the brain has to send signals MUCH faster the nyou'd be able to if you were dumb ,also beerus cant remember the name of ssjgod minutes after talking about it with whis.

Sending signals to he brain fast is still not a special ability of Broly in any way though. He doesn't do it better than anyone else. H

For your brain to process information that fast is a sign of intelligence. As is knowing how to use ki as a newborn traumatized stabbed infant. Heck he could even SENSE ki. He knew the planet was going to be destroyed and got the fuck out of there. Flew to another planet without a ship.

When was it shown he could sense ki? It was implied he did all that on instinct, not because he had the brain capacity to. As an infant no less.

[Cipher]

Brolli is fine. He's a nice break from the type of villains we normally get in the series, and probably the most genuinely frightening/interesting version of the "evil muscleman" route the old movies often went for. Movie 8 is a real departure from the previous seven -- a much bleaker tone and plot, world-building oddly integrated with the rest of the series, and Brolli himself offers a legitimately unnerving villain. I don't mind his two repeat performances either.

Nearly all of the villains in the main series are charismatic, have whimsical designs, or some sort of bizarre gimmick. To have one major enemy in the franchise, especially in ancillary media, who takes the exact opposite approach -- a plain design, clear display of power, and a no-nonsense, no-charisma sense of sadism (that seems to go all the way back to his childhood) is ... nice, honestly. It's refreshingly outside of the series' wheelhouse to have at least once. Again, it's the best version of the movie's multiple attempts at similar characters: Slug, Android 17, Bojack -- Brolli is more interesting and more unsettling than any of them, and it's easy to see why he came back a few times.

Unfortunately, he became wrapped up in what some Western fans think typifies the series at some point, rather than standing in stark opposition to it, and that's been the target of backlash from fans who want to distance themselves from that take in favor of a more faithful presentation. It's led to these extreme views on what should really just be a moderately refreshing movie character.

Also, at some point he became a meme in Japan, and while I still don't quite understand what the origins of that are, or what fandom attitudes might lay behind it, I do find it kind of delightful.

tl;dr: "Overrated" and "overhated" are both stupid internet words.

[Bansho64]

The main thing that labels him as an idiot for me is the fact that he hates and is murderous towards one man all because he heard him freaking crying. It wasn't Goku hitting him with a baby rattle. It wasn't Goku stealing his apple juice box and fruit snacks on the playground. And it wasn't Goku stealing his favorite spot at nap time. Out of all the things they could've chosen, they chose crying. And that makes him the stupidest villain in Dragon Ball for me.

[Cetra]

I can't tell if you're joking or not.

There is really no need to think that it is a fact that Beerus is better written than Broly. Beerus is written as super powerful deity that is moody and uses his mood and role to justify what he does only to get defended by people with the argument "well he is the God of Destruction, that's his job (and because the story says exactly that, I do not need to think about the very fact that he does not really do decide based on harmony but his own current mood)". I am glad that the story of Super shows Beerus a bit more casual like the interactions with Goku actually do change him and that is something I think of as good indeed. But there is still not much behind the character himself. For Broly I at least have the backstory that makes me think "wow, he is really to be pitied; shown to be an awesome powerhouse but a character that was used from the very beginning and treated so poorly, probably the most miserable life a Saiyajin ever had to live." I think Broly has a lot of potential. And if people can accept Freeza coming back and getting a random power up, have his revenge that is not even a revenge and then go to hell again, Broly should also be tolerated a bit more. Exactly the Freeza thing does really show that Dragon Ball does not even care about giving great reasons for power ups and other stuff. But for Freeza it is accepted by many - not all people - with the obvious "well actually it makes sense because *insert made up reason here*". The point I want to make with my post: You were answering him because you think Beerus is an overly better written character than Broly. But apart from how he behaves right now (in an obviously still running show) and the fact that Broly is ironically in a shallow show as Dragon Ball despite no real present story still presented with a background story that gives you the chance to think about him a bit deeper, I cannot really see Beerus as better written.

I would actually love to have a return of Broly with more writing about his character.

[TheMikado]

I think an interesting concept would be a Hulk like personality, where his normal form is a Z fighter for good but when he gets pushed too far in battle he goes ultra Broly and kills enemy and friend alike so he's a liability and only brought to the fight in an A-bomb situation which is to wipe out everything.

[HeroR]

Does Broly have more personality than Beerus. My answer is no.

Broly doesn't really have a personality. He's a physical personification of rage. He just wants to destroy everything and kill Goku because he made him cry, that is it. There is no there, there for his character. Kid Buu has more of a personality than Broly, and he's also an embodiment of chaos and death. The only thing that makes Broly interesting as a character is his backstory where he's almost killed because King Vegeta feared his power and he was enslaved by his own father because he was such an out-of-control nutcase.

I think Broly being more of a force than a personality works for him in the first movie where he's presented as this unstoppable force that can't be reason with or seemingly overpowered. This is part of the reason why Kid Buu worked as a good final villain in Z since he didn't have the personality flaws that hampered the other major villains like pride and the need for a good fight. Where Broly falls apart is when they kept bringing him back and he lost the luster that made him appealing. You can only do so much with a force of nature before it just becomes boring. I also hate comparing him to the Hulk, since the Hulk has more personality and development than most of the cast in Dragon Ball and other comic characters, especially if you put Banner in the mix.

Beerus is presented as an unstoppable force of nature, but he does have motives outside of just destroying everything. The best way to describe Beerus is that he is what Goku would be like if he didn't have a moral compress early in his life and grew up to be a chaos neutral.

Finally to answer the question, is Broly overhated because he's overrated. Yes and no. I think most fans are neutral towards Broly, but hate his fanbase with a burning passion since they wank him as being invincible and grows stronger just by standing still. So in enough time, he can kill Beerus and Whis. I also disagree with Broly being what a 'true' Legendary Super Saiyan is. He is the only the true Legendary Super Saiyan in Toei's movie world. In the canon, the Super Saiyan is never described in such a way.

Personally, I find Broly's father more interesting and complex. He's a man who got on his knees and begged King Vegeta to spare his son, something that isn't normal Saiyan behavior. He is then nearly killed and thrown in the trash with his son, who saves his life. His son grows up to be a berserker because of his experience and his unstable Legendary Super Saiyan form and nearly kills him while destroying a planet, forcing him to enslave his son to keep him from randomly destroying everything. He then plots revenge against Vegeta for nearly killing him and Broly. His plan almost works, except Goku stirs up some terrible memories in Goku, allow him to break the slave crown, forcing Broly's father to leave his son to die since he couldn't control him anymore. He showed loved for his son, but also a willingness to use him, but he also wanted to avenge him.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

Sending signals to he brain fast is still not a special ability of Broly in any way though. He doesn't do it better than anyone else. H

For your brain to process information that fast is a sign of intelligence. As is knowing how to use ki as a newborn traumatized stabbed infant. Heck he could even SENSE ki. He knew the planet was going to be destroyed and got the fuck out of there. Flew to another planet without a ship.

When was it shown he could sense ki? It was implied he did all that on instinct, not because he had the brain capacity to. As an infant no less.

Broly-WHERE IS HE GETTING ALL OF THIS ENERGY?! GRR!!

Broly can sense energy. No training, nobody to show him the way. When was it implied to be instinct? It was never even hinted at to be instincts. broly isn't dumb. he's written to look brainless in movie 10 sure, but that was more of bad writing. I mean gohan is supposed to be smart in the buu arc but he just stood there and got absorbed and didn't blast the goo off. That doesn't make him dumb, it makes toriyama stupid for forgetting about common sense.