What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by ABED » Sat May 26, 2018 3:17 pm

What is it about Freeza that you constantly make the same exact points in numerous threads and even cut and past paragraphs anytime someone mentions they don't like Freeza constantly being brought back?

And I don't need to have seen the damn universal survival arc. Nothing that happens changes the fundamentals. Not one single bit. Freeza's not effective as a villain. He won't achieve his goals. Bringing him back to square one proves nothing other than terrible writing.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by Toxin45 » Sat May 26, 2018 3:30 pm

ABED wrote:What is it about Freeza that you constantly make the same exact points in numerous threads and even cut and past paragraphs anytime someone mentions they don't like Freeza constantly being brought back?

And I don't need to have seen the damn universal survival arc. Nothing that happens changes the fundamentals. Not one single bit. Freeza's not effective as a villain. He won't achieve his goals. Bringing him back to square one proves nothing other than terrible writing.
Wrong he did get his life back at the universal survival arc proved you wrong since your a too much of a coward to watch super.

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by ABED » Sat May 26, 2018 4:15 pm

Alright, if that's how it's going to be, I'm done engaging with you. I enjoy even a good vehement disagreement and discussion, but this is fruitless. Have a pleasant rest of the day.
Last edited by ABED on Sat May 26, 2018 4:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by Toxin45 » Sat May 26, 2018 4:16 pm

ABED wrote:Alright, if that's how it's going to be, I'm done engaging with you.
Right go on someone who has never watched super and missed out on the arcs.

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by ABED » Sat May 26, 2018 4:19 pm

To Nickzambuto, nothing is inherently wrong with a recurring villain, but if there's no change, it ceases to be as interesting. And as been pointed out several times, until recently, DB wasn't in the business of keeping around villains long after they were dealt with unless they changed in some manner.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by Toxin45 » Sat May 26, 2018 4:25 pm

ABED wrote:To Nickzambuto, nothing is inherently wrong with a recurring villain, but if there's no change, it ceases to be as interesting. And as been pointed out several times, until recently, DB wasn't in the business of keeping around villains long after they were dealt with unless they changed in some manner.
Well now times change dude and some villains did receive some change on some level even if they didn't reform.

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by Gaffer Tape » Sat May 26, 2018 4:33 pm

Toxin45 wrote:
ABED wrote:Alright, if that's how it's going to be, I'm done engaging with you.
Right go on someone who has never watched super and missed out on the arcs.
Well, as someone who has suffered through all of Dragon Ball Super, I can freely say that Freeza has long since worn out his welcome and succumbed to villain decay. And as someone who has read your posts here and in other similar threads, you seem to have a particular bone to pick when it comes to Freeza. You don't seem to be willing to accept anyone having an opinion other than "Freeza is awesome."
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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by Toxin45 » Sat May 26, 2018 4:37 pm

Gaffer Tape wrote:
Toxin45 wrote:
ABED wrote:Alright, if that's how it's going to be, I'm done engaging with you.
Right go on someone who has never watched super and missed out on the arcs.
Well, as someone who has suffered through all of Dragon Ball Super, I can freely say that Freeza has long since worn out his welcome and succumbed to villain decay. And as someone who has read your posts here and in other similar threads, you seem to have a particular bone to pick when it comes to Freeza. You don't seem to be willing to accept anyone having an opinion other than "Freeza is awesome."
I can accept some complaints and I know the flaws and Frieza did get some development in the universal survival arc i don't really see it as annoying but I can understand why they complain I am aware of the decay of villains in dragon ball but at this point Frieza is still alive and I am simply curious about Dragon ball in the future and also I think people complain about modern dragon ball super andyou did see the universal survival we have our own opions but sometimes people exaggerated it and it annoys me I mean look at Dragon Ball super in general people complained about the future trunks ending,and look at the other arcs most of the antagonists aren't actually villains the only ones are Frieza and Zamasu so Frieza can improve Toriyama revived frieza twice and it seems like it or not Frieza is here to stay don't care what he does or anyone's opions since we are not japan . You watched Universal survival arc right?

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by Kaboom » Sun May 27, 2018 8:13 pm

Toxin45 wrote:Wrong he did get his life back at the universal survival arc proved you wrong since you're a too much of a coward to watch super.
This type of confrontational attitude is not okay. Last free, non-strike warning.

Please start putting a little more care into your spelling and grammar, too.
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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by Toxin45 » Sun May 27, 2018 8:31 pm

Kaboom wrote:
Toxin45 wrote:Wrong he did get his life back at the universal survival arc proved you wrong since you're a too much of a coward to watch super.
This type of confrontational attitude is not okay. Last free, non-strike warning.

Please start putting a little more care into your spelling and grammar, too.
Sorry my bad.

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by AloversGaming » Sat Jun 02, 2018 3:38 pm

I don't read comics because of endless returning villains. The Joker is no different to a Lord Zed or Dr. Claw. *I'll get you next time Goku!!!....* May as well bring Team Rocket into DB.

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by Toxin45 » Sat Jun 02, 2018 3:58 pm

AloversGaming wrote:I don't read comics because of endless returning villains. The Joker is no different to a Lord Zed or Dr. Claw. *I'll get you next time Goku!!!....* May as well bring Team Rocket into DB.
Really dude? Frieza is the only recurring villain at this point.

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by ABED » Sat Jun 02, 2018 5:27 pm

AloversGaming wrote:I don't read comics because of endless returning villains. The Joker is no different to a Lord Zed or Dr. Claw. *I'll get you next time Goku!!!....* May as well bring Team Rocket into DB.
At least he does actually kill people, so it's not exactly like a Saturday morning cartoon, and many superheroes these days refrain from killing. Otherwise I get your point.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by Toxin45 » Sat Jun 02, 2018 7:41 pm

ABED wrote:
AloversGaming wrote:I don't read comics because of endless returning villains. The Joker is no different to a Lord Zed or Dr. Claw. *I'll get you next time Goku!!!....* May as well bring Team Rocket into DB.
At least he does actually kill people, so it's not exactly like a Saturday morning cartoon, and many superheroes these days refrain from killing. Otherwise I get your point.
Again with this? Yet Goku allowed Frieza to be revived at the end.

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by kemuri07 » Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:51 am

AloversGaming wrote:I don't read comics because of endless returning villains. The Joker is no different to a Lord Zed or Dr. Claw. *I'll get you next time Goku!!!....* May as well bring Team Rocket into DB.
that's really funny considering the anime we're talking about.

Also, my guess is you probably haven't read a comic in a while.

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by AloversGaming » Sun Jun 03, 2018 11:10 am

kemuri07 wrote:
AloversGaming wrote:I don't read comics because of endless returning villains. The Joker is no different to a Lord Zed or Dr. Claw. *I'll get you next time Goku!!!....* May as well bring Team Rocket into DB.
that's really funny considering the anime we're talking about.

Also, my guess is you probably haven't read a comic in a while.
You're correct, I haven't. Considering the fact that comics haven't changed at all since I quit reading my point still stands true.

But hey, who am I to judge. Enjoy your Batman version of Wile E. Coyote and the Road Runner. I'm sure The Joker will get his hands on Batman any day now, no matter how many poorly written stories and pointless reboots he has to suffer through. There's a Batman movie out where he's a ninja now, i'm sure that will keep The Joker's character fresh for another week!

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by Toxin45 » Sun Jun 03, 2018 11:34 am

AloversGaming wrote:
kemuri07 wrote:
AloversGaming wrote:I don't read comics because of endless returning villains. The Joker is no different to a Lord Zed or Dr. Claw. *I'll get you next time Goku!!!....* May as well bring Team Rocket into DB.
that's really funny considering the anime we're talking about.

Also, my guess is you probably haven't read a comic in a while.
You're correct, I haven't. Considering the fact that comics haven't changed at all since I quit reading my point still stands true.

But hey, who am I to judge. Enjoy your Batman version of Wile E. Coyote and the Road Runner. I'm sure The Joker will get his hands on Batman any day now, no matter how many poorly written stories and pointless reboots he has to suffer through. There's a Batman movie out where he's a ninja now, i'm sure that will keep The Joker's character fresh for another week!
Now Frieza is a recurring villain after tournament and the pilaf gang were the team rocket of dragon ball before they reformed dude.

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by ABED » Sun Jun 03, 2018 11:49 am

AloversGaming wrote:
kemuri07 wrote:
AloversGaming wrote:I don't read comics because of endless returning villains. The Joker is no different to a Lord Zed or Dr. Claw. *I'll get you next time Goku!!!....* May as well bring Team Rocket into DB.
that's really funny considering the anime we're talking about.

Also, my guess is you probably haven't read a comic in a while.
You're correct, I haven't. Considering the fact that comics haven't changed at all since I quit reading my point still stands true.

But hey, who am I to judge. Enjoy your Batman version of Wile E. Coyote and the Road Runner. I'm sure The Joker will get his hands on Batman any day now, no matter how many poorly written stories and pointless reboots he has to suffer through. There's a Batman movie out where he's a ninja now, i'm sure that will keep The Joker's character fresh for another week!
What is the difference between a necessary reboot and a pointless reboot?
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by AloversGaming » Sun Jun 03, 2018 3:50 pm

ABED wrote:
AloversGaming wrote:
kemuri07 wrote: that's really funny considering the anime we're talking about.

Also, my guess is you probably haven't read a comic in a while.
You're correct, I haven't. Considering the fact that comics haven't changed at all since I quit reading my point still stands true.

But hey, who am I to judge. Enjoy your Batman version of Wile E. Coyote and the Road Runner. I'm sure The Joker will get his hands on Batman any day now, no matter how many poorly written stories and pointless reboots he has to suffer through. There's a Batman movie out where he's a ninja now, i'm sure that will keep The Joker's character fresh for another week!
What is the difference between a necessary reboot and a pointless reboot?
I would say a necessary reboot would be one that oocurs when a property still has value, but the quality has been on decline for a period of time causing a negative effect on sales. Like the Halloween movies getting a reboot this year and James Cameron with the Terminator franchise, where everything beyond T2 doesn't matter.

An example of an unnecessary reboot would be DMC: Devil may Cry. DMC4 was one of the best selling games of the franchise, but due to mixed reviews CAPCOM rebooted the whole thing. Fans weren't happy and didn't buy the reboot, it died upon release.

New 52 from DC is another unnecessary reboot. You don't delete an entire mutiverse canon due to a few years of bad writing causing everything to become a tangled mess. You simply start telling simpler stories instead. Simple story telling is one of DB's most notable traits and something fans have always seen as a positive to the franchise.

@Toxin45, I don't get the point of your reply. If you're trying to make a case for a recurring villain in DB being something fans want, you chose odd examples. People hated the F arc of Super and found the movie version underwelming, and this forum was filled with endless hate towards the Pilaf gang every week before ToP whenever they had any screen time. The Pilaf gang don't do much these days in the ways of villiany, Goku and Bulma don't recognize who they are and haven't been given reason to.

Freeza being alive again after ToP means little if he isn't going to do anything. Building an army in the middle of nowhere space and showing up every now and then to talk to Goku will be a waste of time. Him getting killed again and sent back to Hell would also be a waste of time and devalue the character greatly. Not sure if you have your own ideas on how to make Freeza interesting again. Personally, i'm stumped.

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Re: What's so bad about the idea of a recurring villain?

Post by kemuri07 » Sun Jun 03, 2018 3:52 pm

AloversGaming wrote:
kemuri07 wrote:
AloversGaming wrote:I don't read comics because of endless returning villains. The Joker is no different to a Lord Zed or Dr. Claw. *I'll get you next time Goku!!!....* May as well bring Team Rocket into DB.
that's really funny considering the anime we're talking about.

Also, my guess is you probably haven't read a comic in a while.
You're correct, I haven't. Considering the fact that comics haven't changed at all since I quit reading my point still stands true.

But hey, who am I to judge. Enjoy your Batman version of Wile E. Coyote and the Road Runner. I'm sure The Joker will get his hands on Batman any day now, no matter how many poorly written stories and pointless reboots he has to suffer through. There's a Batman movie out where he's a ninja now, i'm sure that will keep The Joker's character fresh for another week!
I mean, I guess if you're just going to admit you have no idea what you're talking about.

Who are you to judge?



1. Let's not pretend the issues prevalent in comic books don't appear in anime/manga--they do. It's the fucking problem of "oh shit, these things have to make money." So story lines, characters get regurgitated again and again because they have to make sure they make that money back. So far all the zillions of anime shows that get released every season, only about a couple of them are actually worth checking out. Calling out Comic books is a lot like the pot calling the kettle black. It's the same shit.

2. And I know you don't know what you're talking about because there's so many different variety of comics that aren't superhero books, and that actually are willing to do interesting things with the medium. Shit, I'll give you one. Saga. Hell, I'll give you another freebie: East of West. Maybe actually do some reading, and then we can have a conversation.

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