Cell, not Freeza, is the biggest piece of shit in all of Dragon Ball.

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DBZAOTA482
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Cell, not Freeza, is the biggest piece of shit in all of Dragon Ball.

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Tue Dec 06, 2016 3:53 pm

Yes, I know Freeza was monstrous but Cell was an actual monster. At first I considered they pretty much equal in terms of nastiness... both unrepentant, evil bastards who managed to push two of the most good-natured characters (Goku and Gohan) to their limits. However there is something that sets them apart...

Freeza was power-hungry but he enjoyed his powers more for what it gave him in return (wealth, fame, greed) and loved his papa while Cell only wanted power for power's sake and had nobody (he respected Gero but only because he created him). Also unlike Freeza, Cell had no long-term goals.. Cell wasn't a mindless killing machine like Majin Boo... he was well aware of what he's doing is wrong but he does it anyways because he could. He just wants to see the world burn.

Heck, the whole reason he announced the Cell Games was to spread terror and the human Z-Warriors (and Trunks) were even flipping him off:

Image
fadeddreams5 wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
jjgp1112 wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:31 am
I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.

I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.

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Re: Cell, not Freeza, is the biggest piece of shit in all of Dragon Ball.

Post by nickzambuto » Tue Dec 06, 2016 4:12 pm

Freeza didn't love Cold, he said he didn't care about his father being revived in RF. Your reasoning for Cell being the most evil is identical to my reasoning for Freeza being the most evil. Freeza is said to be pure evil, but unlike Daimao, or Majin Boo, Freeza is not a being literally made of nothing but evil. He's a completely natural lifeform in the universe. He COULD have been good, or at least normal. There's nothing in his destiny saying he had to be the way he is. It's all a total choice. He was just so spoiled by the power he was born with, that it nurtured an unfathomable greed within him. He's not like Daimao or Boo who can't accept Goku's offers of redemption. He can, but he consciously rejects it. It's his absolute refusal of redemption which disturbs Goku like no other villain has.

Cell on the other hand falls into the same realms as Daimao and Boo. He's an artificial being created and programmed by Gero. There's no choice in his actions, he was instinctively compelled to absorb 17 and 18 at all costs, and that's why he didn't care about taking hundreds of thousands of human lives in order to power up sufficiently. Even after becoming perfect and having no instinctual drives, he was still a naturally evil being. He was created to be evil, born as evil. It was never a choice, it was who he naturally was. He never had a moment where he was forgiven and given mercy, then consciously took that, threw it aside, and blasted Goku in the back as he flew away like Freeza did. Cell would definitely do the same thing in that scenario, but it wouldn't pack the same significance because it's not really a choice, it's expected.

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Re: Cell, not Freeza, is the biggest piece of shit in all of Dragon Ball.

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Tue Dec 06, 2016 4:24 pm

nickzambuto wrote:Freeza didn't love Cold, he said he didn't care about his father being revived in RF. Your reasoning for Cell being the most evil is identical to my reasoning for Freeza being the most evil. Freeza is said to be pure evil, but unlike Daimao, or Majin Boo, Freeza is not a being literally made of nothing but evil. He's a completely natural lifeform in the universe. He COULD have been good, or at least normal. There's nothing in his destiny saying he had to be the way he is. It's all a total choice. He was just so spoiled by the power he was born with, that it nurtured an unfathomable greed within him. He's not like Daimao or Boo who can't accept Goku's offers of redemption. He can, but he consciously rejects it. It's his absolute refusal of redemption which disturbs Goku like no other villain has.

Cell on the other hand falls into the same realms as Daimao and Boo. He's an artificial being created and programmed by Gero. There's no choice in his actions, he was instinctively compelled to absorb 17 and 18 at all costs, and that's why he didn't care about taking hundreds of thousands of human lives in order to power up sufficiently. Even after becoming perfect and having no instinctual drives, he was still a naturally evil being. He was created to be evil, born as evil. It was never a choice, it was who he naturally was. He never had a moment where he was forgiven and given mercy, then consciously took that, threw it aside, and blasted Goku in the back as he flew away like Freeza did. Cell would definitely do the same thing in that scenario, but it wouldn't pack the same significance because it's not really a choice, it's expected.
Freeza has no regard for any life but he referred to his father in an affectionate way and brought him along with him to kill Goku.

Cell also ignored Gero's ambitions for world domination and revenge against Goku which was the whole reason he was created. He wasn't exactly created to be evil... he was created to be the perfect fighting machine. He even chose to kill himself than to accept defeat.
fadeddreams5 wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
jjgp1112 wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:31 am
I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.

I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.

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Re: Cell, not Freeza, is the biggest piece of shit in all of Dragon Ball.

Post by nickzambuto » Tue Dec 06, 2016 4:28 pm

DBZAOTA482 wrote:
nickzambuto wrote:Freeza didn't love Cold, he said he didn't care about his father being revived in RF. Your reasoning for Cell being the most evil is identical to my reasoning for Freeza being the most evil. Freeza is said to be pure evil, but unlike Daimao, or Majin Boo, Freeza is not a being literally made of nothing but evil. He's a completely natural lifeform in the universe. He COULD have been good, or at least normal. There's nothing in his destiny saying he had to be the way he is. It's all a total choice. He was just so spoiled by the power he was born with, that it nurtured an unfathomable greed within him. He's not like Daimao or Boo who can't accept Goku's offers of redemption. He can, but he consciously rejects it. It's his absolute refusal of redemption which disturbs Goku like no other villain has.

Cell on the other hand falls into the same realms as Daimao and Boo. He's an artificial being created and programmed by Gero. There's no choice in his actions, he was instinctively compelled to absorb 17 and 18 at all costs, and that's why he didn't care about taking hundreds of thousands of human lives in order to power up sufficiently. Even after becoming perfect and having no instinctual drives, he was still a naturally evil being. He was created to be evil, born as evil. It was never a choice, it was who he naturally was. He never had a moment where he was forgiven and given mercy, then consciously took that, threw it aside, and blasted Goku in the back as he flew away like Freeza did. Cell would definitely do the same thing in that scenario, but it wouldn't pack the same significance because it's not really a choice, it's expected.
Freeza has no regard for any life but he referred to his father in an affectionate way and brought him along with him to kill Goku.

Cell also ignored Gero's ambitions for world domination and revenge against Goku which was the whole reason he was created. He wasn't exactly created to be evil... he was created to be the perfect fighting machine.
Freeza is polite to everyone, not just his father. Acting like he respected his father during their interactions is par for the course for Freeza. He clearly possessed no genuine affection for Cold because he outright told Sorbet not to revive him.

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Re: Cell, not Freeza, is the biggest piece of shit in all of Dragon Ball.

Post by ABED » Tue Dec 06, 2016 4:45 pm

It's faux politeness. I like that aspect of Freeza's personality. He's a monster but thinks of himself as a gentleman.

It's an interesting philosophical question, can Cell be deemed evil if he was created to be evil? Choice is a prerequisite of morality.
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Re: Cell, not Freeza, is the biggest piece of shit in all of Dragon Ball.

Post by DBZ Macky » Tue Dec 06, 2016 4:52 pm

ABED wrote: It's an interesting philosophical question, can Cell be deemed evil if he was created to be evil? Choice is a prerequisite of morality.
Well, Piccolo was created to be evil as well. He fulfilled his original goal of killing Goku and went on to be one of the greatest protectors of the Earth. In this case, I guess you can say he wasn't really "Evil".

Future Android #17 & #18's goal was to kill Goku, but since Goku was already dead, they just killed everyone else.
You can say that they were truly "Evil".
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Re: Cell, not Freeza, is the biggest piece of shit in all of Dragon Ball.

Post by ABED » Tue Dec 06, 2016 4:58 pm

With Piccolo it's different because we're dealing with his son/reincarnation so the line gets blurry. And Dr. Gero didn't create the cyborgs simply to kill Goku. He made them strong enough to kill Goku and made that one of their top priorities because he knew Goku would be an impediment to his plans, but they were always to take over the world, so their disregard for human life was programmed in.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
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Re: Cell, not Freeza, is the biggest piece of shit in all of Dragon Ball.

Post by ssjjanemba » Tue Dec 06, 2016 9:24 pm

At the end of the day, Freeza still killed more people, but imperfect hell was freaking scary.
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