Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

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Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 5:24 am

Don't get me wrong there's still good stuff coming from this era (Xenoverse, Goku Black, Beerus and Whis, etc.) thanks to the great comeback made with Battle of Gods but ever since Minus came out the whole franchise seems to be losing something and the community has become way more conflicted.

We know the original series ended over two decades ago but I (and I'm betting many others) was accepted it ended with the most hoping for some side stories released like for the Peanuts franchise. Ever since Super came out I've become increasingly cynical and jaded (like I already wasn't jaded) with the franchise.

Can anyone feel me?
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fadeddreams5 wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
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I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.

I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.

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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by TheGreatness25 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 5:36 am

Yeah, I liked that the series had a nice little bow on it. I felt like I knew the story inside and out and I had closure with it. I'm not looking to be a 30 year old buying new Blu-rays and re-learning the series because... well, there's just other stuff occupying my time now. Talking about DB was a fun little hobby. Now, I feel like I have to catch up on it, which for whatever reason, is not sitting well with me.

I feel like I don't care about the series anymore, which is the strangest thing that I've ever felt about it. After running home to watch it on Toonami, after spending a fortune on the releases, after wanting to discover the Japanese version, and after loving it so much, for the first time ever, all I feel is disinterest. And this feeling sucks. Maybe it's an over-abundance of DB stuff, maybe it's that there's no nostalgia toward the new stuff, I don't know. But for some reason, I've become apathetic to the whole thing. I have zero interest in buying or even watching anything DB-related (even the old stuff) now. That's a crazy feeling for me.

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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by precita » Fri Dec 09, 2016 6:08 am

Well that's because Super is current. 10 years from now people will be nostalgic for it, just like the older series. Obviously when something is new and airing weekly you have to digest it and it has to linger in the fandom for a while before people appreciate it.

I do get what you're saying though. When the 2008 special came out it was a huge shock and and amazing at the time since it was the first new Dragonball special/episode since 1996. I couldn't believe we got something new, and back then we had no idea we'd get more new stuff so it was a nice fun little special and highly appreciated.

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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Fri Dec 09, 2016 7:37 am

Personally I don't miss it, I actually feel the reverse and I'm loving this phase of Dragon Ball's history. Getting into the Kai dub and the Japanese version in recent times has been like falling in love with the series all over again because I'm learning so much more about the characters and a feel for how it was intended which I was deprived of growing up (although I do still have nostalgia for the old dubs my love for them can't extend beyond that part.

I'm also one of the suckers who has wanted a new series for such a long time, it was truly surreal when Super was announced, I still look forward to seeing it every sunday, and now that we've only seen some of the prominent figures of Universe 6 and a glimpse of Universe 10 I honestly feel like Super has only just got started.

In addition we have amazing dubs nowadays, so I can genuinely enjoy the series in two languages, and it won't be long before we get the Buu saga of the aforementioned Kai and of course the Super dub. I'm putting aside some cash every week waiting for those Blu-Rays to be announced so I can add them to my collection (which I love to have).

All that said I can't imagine how excited I'll be if the Dragon Ball Room brings us some great content (particularly spinoffs).
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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by sintzu » Fri Dec 09, 2016 12:35 pm

From an artistic point of view, I think BOG should've been the only post manga story we got cause it goes back to what Roshi told Goku about there always being someone stronger out there, it added a lot to Goku and Vegeta's characters & it added something new to the lore so it feels like it was a missing story from the original and one that needed to be told which is why I think nearly everyone agrees that it's a good story.

From a fan point of view, I'm happy that we're getting new stories and hope that we always will but they feel like cashgrabs rather than stories that need to be told to complete the story like BOG felt.

Another issue with the post BOG stories is the stakes are very low, Whis helped them kill Freeza, if they lost the tournament then they'd just get sent to U6 & Zeno killed Zamasu for them.
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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by Grimlock » Fri Dec 09, 2016 12:42 pm

I kind of miss. Disappointed because Minus is crappy but Movie 14 is awesome, as it adds to the plot and to the lore of this franchise. Currently Dragon Ball is passing through ups and downs, one after the other ironically. As I'm always in favor of actual content, of what a work can add to this franchise, I'm inclined to say that I don't miss pre-Minus that much, as already said. I do feel however that something is missing but we will always have Dragon Ball Online (and Xenoverse, as you mentioned it) to look forward when and if the dark times come.

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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by Footlong Shoe » Fri Dec 09, 2016 1:04 pm

Personally, no. I wasn't involved in the fandom pre-BoG, so to me that era wasn't very significant (I'm not even sure if I had seen Z before BoG came out).

The way I see it, the original series will always be there and will always be enjoyable on its own. The franchise can only go forward.
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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by Forte224 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 3:37 pm

I don't miss it because it's still there, untouched. The art style and overall direction of the series is so different now that I can separate them in my head, while still at times connecting them, thinking stuff like: "Man, Vegeta's getting owned by Kid Boo, but in just a couple years he'll be able to stomp him like he did Cui."

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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by Lord Beerus » Fri Dec 09, 2016 6:17 pm

Not really. I mean, it's still there for me to go back and enjoy. If there is something about the new Dragon Ball content I don't like, I'll just read the manga or watch the original Dragon Ball anime, some episodes of Z or some of the old movies.

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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by ekrolo2 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 6:20 pm

The series had a lot less bad content pre-BoG so I'd say there's some merit to missing it. And yes, I am lumping all of the new stuff minus BoG the movie as bad and/or lazy content. I mean the Cell arc was still a POS and the Boo arc a hot mess regardless of the new stuff existing but I'll take it over all of Super.
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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by Lord Beerus » Fri Dec 09, 2016 6:23 pm

ekrolo2 wrote:The series had a lot less bad content pre-BoG so I'd say there's some merit to missing it. And yes, I am lumping all of the new stuff minus BoG the movie as bad and/or lazy content. I mean the Cell arc was still a POS and the Boo arc a hot mess regardless of the new stuff existing but I'll take it over all of Super.
...No love for Jaco? :(

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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by ekrolo2 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 6:24 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:
ekrolo2 wrote:The series had a lot less bad content pre-BoG so I'd say there's some merit to missing it. And yes, I am lumping all of the new stuff minus BoG the movie as bad and/or lazy content. I mean the Cell arc was still a POS and the Boo arc a hot mess regardless of the new stuff existing but I'll take it over all of Super.
...No love for Jaco? :(
Jaco lead to Minus so yeah, screw that too. Its the same reason I acknowledge that the first two acts of the Black arc are good while lumping the whole thing as shit tier just based on its last 6-7 episodes.
When someone tells you, "Don't present your opinion as fact," what they're actually saying is, "Don't present your opinion with any conviction. Because I don't like your opinion, and I want to be able to dismiss it as easily as possible." Don't fall for it.

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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by Lord Beerus » Fri Dec 09, 2016 6:39 pm

ekrolo2 wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote:
ekrolo2 wrote:The series had a lot less bad content pre-BoG so I'd say there's some merit to missing it. And yes, I am lumping all of the new stuff minus BoG the movie as bad and/or lazy content. I mean the Cell arc was still a POS and the Boo arc a hot mess regardless of the new stuff existing but I'll take it over all of Super.
...No love for Jaco? :(
Jaco lead to Minus so yeah, screw that too. Its the same reason I acknowledge that the first two acts of the Black arc are good while lumping the whole thing as shit tier just based on its last 6-7 episodes.
I understand you reasoning, but don't think it would be a bit more fair to reach a middle ground? I mean, I'll agree that the pacing was little off when the arc was reaching its climax and it's clear lack of any kind consistent power scaling was absurd, but for the most part the Goku Black was at least serviceable. Unless you think the last 6-7 were absolute, irredeemable pieces of shit that ruined your enjoyment of the arc, then, well, that's your opinion and I respect that.

Plus, Jaco has nothing to do with Minus, and you know it. The relationship between Minus and Jaco is that Minus is set before Jaco. It was only throw in as a bonus chapter because Shueisha basically told Toriyama to give Goku a mother.
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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by ekrolo2 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 6:46 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:I understand you reasoning, but don't think it would be a bit more fair to reach a middle ground? I mean, I'll agree that the pacing was little off when the arc was reaching its climax and it's clear lack of any kind consistent power scaling was absurd, but for the most part the Goku Black was at least serviceable. Unless you think the last 6-7 were absolute, irredeemable pieces of shit that ruined your enjoyment of the arc, then, well, that's your opinion and I respect that.

Plus, Jaco has nothing to do with Minus, and you know it. It's the relationship between Minus and Jaco is that Minus is set before Jaco. It was only throw in a bonus chapter because Shueisha basically told Toriyama to give Goku a mother.
I didn't know that about the Shueisha thing, that does explain why Minus is so half-assed.

And yeah, I really did find the last chunk of the Black arc that bad :P
If the first act of it was that bad and it progressively got better and better It'd be another story but the climax really killed the whole thing for me. It's probably the most I've been disappointed in Dragon Ball.
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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by Lord Beerus » Fri Dec 09, 2016 6:59 pm

ekrolo2 wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote:I understand you reasoning, but don't think it would be a bit more fair to reach a middle ground? I mean, I'll agree that the pacing was little off when the arc was reaching its climax and it's clear lack of any kind consistent power scaling was absurd, but for the most part the Goku Black was at least serviceable. Unless you think the last 6-7 were absolute, irredeemable pieces of shit that ruined your enjoyment of the arc, then, well, that's your opinion and I respect that.

Plus, Jaco has nothing to do with Minus, and you know it. It's the relationship between Minus and Jaco is that Minus is set before Jaco. It was only throw in a bonus chapter because Shueisha basically told Toriyama to give Goku a mother.
I didn't know that about the Shueisha thing, that does explain why Minus is so half-assed.

And yeah, I really did find the last chunk of the Black arc that bad :P
If the first act of it was that bad and it progressively got better and better It'd be another story but the climax really killed the whole thing for me. It's probably the most I've been disappointed in Dragon Ball.
Nah, the honour is shared among GT, Evolution and the Resurrection F arc.

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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by ekrolo2 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 7:05 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:Nah, the honour is shared among GT, Evolution and the Resurrection F arc.
I can't really agree with any of those besides maybe the F arc. GT executes several things pretty well for me, making a live action DB movie is a bad idea period so that had no hope of being good from the start. F and the Black arcs had potential, tons of it and they completely squandered every ounce.

I will give the Black arc this, the last two episodes are so fascinatingly bad I kind of wish the rest of show went in this Batman & Robin-esque situation where the writers just give up and have any random stuff happen. It'll be good for a laugh.
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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by Lord Beerus » Fri Dec 09, 2016 7:25 pm

ekrolo2 wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote:Nah, the honour is shared among GT, Evolution and the Resurrection F arc.
I can't really agree with any of those besides maybe the F arc. GT executes several things pretty well for me, making a live action DB movie is a bad idea period so that had no hope of being good from the start. F and the Black arcs had potential, tons of it and they completely squandered every ounce.

I will give the Black arc this, the last two episodes are so fascinatingly bad I kind of wish the rest of show went in this Batman & Robin-esque situation where the writers just give up and have any random stuff happen. It'll be good for a laugh.
Well, we will have to agree to disagree on GT. Because while there are some things in that show I like and there are far too many things I don't like. And who's to say that a live action Dragon Ball movie can't work? With the right creative and visionary direction, a relativity faithful script and a good special effects and hair/make up crew behind the project, a Dragon Ball live action movie could be great. All of the pieces would have the fall together properly, but it's possible.

Dare to dream, man. :P

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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by ekrolo2 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 7:29 pm

Lord Beerus wrote: Well, we will have to agree to disagree on GT. Because while there are some things in that show I like and there are far too many things I don't like. And who's to say that a live action Dragon Ball movie can't work? With the right creative and visionary direction, a relativity faithful script and a good special effects and hair/make up crew behind the project, a Dragon Ball live action movie could be great. All of the pieces would have the fall together properly, but it's possible.

Dare to dream, man. :P
I'll believe anime live action movies can work when I see a good one, there's got to be some precedent for daring to dream. My hope is that Ghost in the Shell IS the movie that makes me a believer.
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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by Dbzfan94 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 7:30 pm

Honestly yeah. One of my favorite things was that it actually ended, and didn't go on far longer than it should have.

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Re: Does anyone kinda miss the Pre-Minus (or Pre-BoG) era?

Post by PelicanDynasty » Fri Dec 09, 2016 7:33 pm

Footlong Shoe wrote:Personally, no. I wasn't involved in the fandom pre-BoG, so to me that era wasn't very significant (I'm not even sure if I had seen Z before BoG came out).

The way I see it, the original series will always be there and will always be enjoyable on its own. The franchise can only go forward.
I agree with this. You can always ignore any new stuff that you think is bad. You're either getting new stuff to enjoy, or it's staying the same.

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