A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

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A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by EXBadguy » Fri Jun 09, 2017 10:33 pm

A lot of crazy shit is going on, like the Evergreen College situation, white folks being banned from making tacos at some food truck stops, lyft driver bashed for having a hula doll in his car, social justice madness. All of this makes me wonder, if white subbies and otakus would get flak for cultural appropriation, so I'm wondering if any of you white subbies here were accused or criticized for appropriating Japanese culture for any reason. Now, the reason why I'm only asking the white ones is because in my experience, we minorities can get away with it (I say this as a black man). I've never seen any blacks or hispanics criticized for taking part in Japanese culture.

Anyway, discuss. And I recommend the mods to watch closely if this gets outta hand. And if so, I apologize.
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by DrakenballP » Fri Jun 09, 2017 10:47 pm

The concept of "Cultural Appropriation" baffles me. Much of what has occurred in the past 8 or so years is absolutely redundant. Let people wear clothing or have their how however they want, no matter the culture it's from. Let men, and white men, openly speak and have their say in things without Social Justice Warriors running a-muck.

We're all human. We should just leave it at that, get along, and get over all of this nonsense.

I don't think this is in a proper section whatsoever though. Sad to see no form of "Off-Topic" section, unless if I'm blind.
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by JulieYBM » Fri Jun 09, 2017 11:20 pm

I don't think I have ever been accused of cultural appropriation in real life. Ironically, other geeks that interact on English language forums do all the time. God knows how many times I've been chased off of forums for using the original Japanese names of Pokemon or Dragon Ball characters. It's amazing, considering all the years we fought for unedited releases of anime in the 2000s. Now the nostalgic apologists (for lack of a better term) have settled into complacency and no longer even care that what they grew up on was actively insulting their intelligence.

A big part of why I've come to love Otaku culture in recent years is in part due to their disinterest in anything but consuming the things they love and sharing that passion with others. It's a sub-culture that has little interest in judging others--and inherently self-indulgent act of hypocrisy--because of how it is rooted in their disinterest in being 'cool'. Anime, manga, games and light novels aren't 'cool'. They're not 'hip'. They're niche and because Otaku are proud of that they are removed from the sort of nastiness you'll see among the fan communities here in the west.
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by cheddarsword » Fri Jun 09, 2017 11:39 pm

EXBadguy wrote:A lot of crazy shit is going on, like the Evergreen College situation, white folks being banned from making tacos at some food truck stops, lyft driver bashed for having a hula doll in his car, social justice madness. All of this makes me wonder, if white subbies and otakus would get flak for cultural appropriation, so I'm wondering if any of you white subbies here were accused or criticized for appropriating Japanese culture for any reason. Now, the reason why I'm only asking the white ones is because in my experience, we minorities can get away with it (I say this as a black man). I've never seen any blacks or hispanics criticized for taking part in Japanese culture.

Anyway, discuss. And I recommend the mods to watch closely if this gets outta hand. And if so, I apologize.
First off, cultural appropriation is bullshit. I'll "appropriate" into my life whatever part of whatever culture I want and fuck anyone who says I'm wrong for doing it.

That being said, no, I've never been accused of it.

As for racism, the most racist thing I've ever seen (towards my own skin color anyway) was someone in a youtube livestream chat calling white people crackers, which frankly, racism aimed at me doesn't bother me. I don't give a shit if someone hates me because I'm white.

Hell, I'm 25% Cherokee and 25% Navajo and I couldn't give two craps about American Indian culture and I'm not gonna stand up for the mistreatment of my "kindred brothers and sisters" either.

That's not "me". That's not who "I" am.

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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by sintzu » Fri Jun 09, 2017 11:43 pm

I can't speak from experience cause I've never been accused of something like that but from what I've heared and read I think it's just crazy. There are so many serious issues with America right now like the cost of rent, education, health care, violence yet for some reasons what everyone's up in arms about are social issues that have no affect on one's life or living conditions.
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by Kunzait_83 » Sat Jun 10, 2017 12:20 am

I've only ever watched and appreciated Japanese media and pop culture as a foreign observer. I have never now, nor at any point in my life ever done the whole "Konichiwa Kawaii Desu Ne!!" Wapanese thing where I "felt spiritually like I'm a Japanese person at heart" and tried injecting random Japanese phrases into my speech, or dress like a Japanese high school kid, or whatever the fuck.

Lot of that crap went on around college campuses in the early/mid 2000s and all across the internet throughout that whole decade in general: not sure to what degree its still a thing today. It was cringingly dumb back then, its still cringingly dumb now. Is it racial/cultural appropriation? I don't think its intentionally or consciously that, no: I just think that its dingbat idiot teens and 20 somethings acting like dingbat idiot teens and 20 somethings and getting caught up too deeply into a subculture and pop cultural fad and without anywhere near enough self-awareness or wherewithal to see or comprehend the awkward and offensive racial implications of a white person taking part this kinda stuff to this degree. I don't think there's ever been any outwardly malicious intent behind any of it; not as a consistent, commonplace norm at least.
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by DrakenballP » Sat Jun 10, 2017 12:29 am

Kunzait_83 wrote:I've only ever watched and appreciated Japanese media and pop culture as a foreign observer. I have never now, nor at any point in my life ever done the whole "Konichiwa Kawaii Desu Ne!!" Wapanese
I hate this! I'm a developer for a semi-popular MMORPG and there are far too many people like this. I hear everyday ":3 KAWAII!" "XD" "Senpai" "Nani!?" etc.
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by JulieYBM » Sat Jun 10, 2017 1:45 am

DrakenballP wrote:
Kunzait_83 wrote:I've only ever watched and appreciated Japanese media and pop culture as a foreign observer. I have never now, nor at any point in my life ever done the whole "Konichiwa Kawaii Desu Ne!!" Wapanese
I hate this! I'm a developer for a semi-popular MMORPG and there are far too many people like this. I hear everyday ":3 KAWAII!" "XD" "Senpai" "Nani!?" etc.
So, what you're saying is, they have themselves a secret little club and a secret code and you don't like that they're having fun by themselves? For goodness' sake, they make video games for a living, they're not going to be socially acceptable. They might as well do what makes them happy.

Imagine how some poor bastard feels overhearing words like 'Gokuu', 'Kamehame-Ha', 'Vegeta', 'Saiyan' or 'Piccolo''! 'Piccolo' is--of course--an instrument for making music...but how many of your average folks know what the hell a 'piccolo' is?

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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by Kunzait_83 » Sat Jun 10, 2017 2:37 am

JulieYBM wrote:So, what you're saying is, they have themselves a secret little club and a secret code and you don't like that they're having fun by themselves?


Pretty sure no one said that. YOU'RE the one now saying that.
JulieYBM wrote:Imagine how some poor bastard feels overhearing words like 'Gokuu', 'Kamehame-Ha', 'Vegeta', 'Saiyan' or 'Piccolo''! 'Piccolo' is--of course--an instrument for making music...but how many of your average folks know what the hell a 'piccolo' is?
A LOT of people know what a piccolo is. More than plenty I'd say. That's fairly common knowledge for anyone who took an elementary school music class. Your average 4th grader probably knows what it is and might've even used one. That's one of the biggest non-sequiturs I've seen here in awhile.

I don't even know what the hell it is you're getting excited about or think that you're defending here in the first place.

No one gives two fucks what anyone does to have fun on their own spare time. No one. The problem that some people have with a lot of these genuine "Weaboo" types (the ones who take it so far as to be literally identifying as and behaving as if they're ethnically Japanese) is that it IS racially offensive: regardless of whether or not that's their intent. And I argue that it usually, typically isn't.

The problem is, you can't act like you live in a vacuum here amidst a large mixed civilization like the U.S. Other people, different people with different perspectives than you all live here too alongside you, and at times you're gonna have to think over how some of your actions and decisions might impact or affect others before you go through with them. Case in point, if you're a young 16 to 25 year old high school or college student in the United States (college students ESPECIALLY given the heavily diverse makeup of most campuses) and you dress, behave, speak, and flat out IDENTIFY as a different ethnicity, that's gonna be MASSIVELY insulting to other people who actually ARE of that ethnicity.

It may, from your point of view, be simple harmless fun and a show of genuine love and endearment to a culture you're excited about, but that's NOT how other people from the ethnicity in question (Japanese in this case) are largely going to see it. Some here or there may be cool with it and just laugh it off, plenty of others however will not. And they have more than a right not to.

Especially given the racial history in the United States in particular (and you absolutely HAVE to take that into account, whether you like it or not: again, we're not all living in a vacuum here), a white person running around in racial dress and spouting racial catchphrases in what is essentially Yellowface, is just NOT a good or advisable course of action to take. And again, a lot of it certainly doesn't come from any malicious, ill-intended place: but a lot of it DOES come from pure, unbridled, youthful stupidity, ignorance, and an inability to see things from beyond one's own perspective.

No one thinks anyone should be prevented from liking anime, getting interested in Japanese culture, learning the language, learn to draw manga-style, etc. All that's perfectly more than fine. But you CAN take these things too far to the point where you effectively make a ridiculous minstrel show out of yourself, and if you in any way actually, genuinely cared about Japanese people, you'd understand their perspective and why it might seem offensive and uncomfortable and maybe tone it down a few notches out of respect.
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Journey to the West, chapter 26 wrote:The strong man will meet someone stronger still:
Come to naught at last he surely will!
Zephyr wrote:And that's to say nothing of how pretty much impossible it is to capture what made the original run of the series so great. I'm in the generation of fans that started with Toonami, so I totally empathize with the feeling of having "missed the party", experiencing disappointment, and wanting to experience it myself. But I can't, that's how life is. Time is a bitch. The party is over. Kageyama, Kikuchi, and Maeda are off the sauce now; Yanami almost OD'd; Yamamoto got arrested; Toriyama's not going to light trash cans on fire and hang from the chandelier anymore. We can't get the band back together, and even if we could, everyone's either old, in poor health, or calmed way the fuck down. Best we're going to get, and are getting, is a party that's almost entirely devoid of the magic that made the original one so awesome that we even want more.
Kamiccolo9 wrote:It grinds my gears that people get "outraged" over any of this stuff. It's a fucking cartoon. If you are that determined to be angry about something, get off the internet and make a stand for something that actually matters.
Rocketman wrote:"Shonen" basically means "stupid sentimental shit" anyway, so it's ok to be anti-shonen.

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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by cheddarsword » Sat Jun 10, 2017 3:53 am

Kunzait_83 wrote: No one gives two fucks what anyone does to have fun on their own spare time. No one. The problem that some people have with a lot of these genuine "Weaboo" types (the ones who take it so far as to be literally identifying as and behaving as if they're ethnically Japanese) is that it IS racially offensive: regardless of whether or not that's their intent. And I argue that it usually, typically isn't.

The problem is, you can't act like you live in a vacuum here amidst a large mixed civilization like the U.S. Other people, different people with different perspectives than you all live here too alongside you, and at times you're gonna have to think over how some of your actions and decisions might impact or affect others before you go through with them. Case in point, if you're a young 16 to 25 year old high school or college student in the United States (college students ESPECIALLY given the heavily diverse makeup of most campuses) and you dress, behave, speak, and flat out IDENTIFY as a different ethnicity, that's gonna be MASSIVELY insulting to other people who actually ARE of that ethnicity.
Okay, so are women offended by gay men who act more feminine than they do? Also, by your logic, Eminem's mistreatment by blacks is justified.

It may, from your point of view, be simple harmless fun and a show of genuine love and endearment to a culture you're excited about, but that's NOT how other people from the ethnicity in question (Japanese in this case) are largely going to see it. Some here or there may be cool with it and just laugh it off, plenty of others however will not. And they have more than a right not to.
"How dare you replicate our culture!? How dare you love it so much that you wish you were one of us!? How dare you look and act just like we do!? I am offended that you love our culture to this degree and I order you to stop!" Yeah, I just don't see how this = logic. Or reality either.
Especially given the racial history in the United States in particular (and you absolutely HAVE to take that into account, whether you like it or not: again, we're not all living in a vacuum here), a white person running around in racial dress and spouting racial catchphrases in what is essentially Yellowface, is just NOT a good or advisable course of action to take. And again, a lot of it certainly doesn't come from any malicious, ill-intended place: but a lot of it DOES come from pure, unbridled, youthful stupidity, ignorance, and an inability to see things from beyond one's own perspective.
I agree with this statement but it only signifies that America has a long way to go in forgiving old scars and accepting cultures outside of our own.
No one thinks anyone should be prevented from liking anime, getting interested in Japanese culture, learning the language, learn to draw manga-style, etc. All that's perfectly more than fine. But you CAN take these things too far to the point where you effectively make a ridiculous minstrel show out of yourself, and if you in any way actually, genuinely cared about Japanese people, you'd understand their perspective and why it might seem offensive and uncomfortable and maybe tone it down a few notches out of respect.
This wasn't what you were talking about a few paragraphs earlier. If this was your intent, you should have made it clear from the start.

In my day to day life, I see people walking around in clothing from their native country. Speaking their native language. Being themselves. And this is within MY country. MY home soil. Should I be offended? Should I say "You're in my country so your religious beliefs, outfit, language and lifestyle in general should match mine completely."?

Do you know how idiotic that would make me look?

But according to your logic, it's okay simply because they ARE those races. They're not mimicking them because they love them, they're living them because they ARE them. And in the end, what's the difference? Race.

How is it possible to offend an entire race of people by mimicking their lifestyle in part or in whole, out of love and respect for it?

If they're offended then the entire PLANET has a long way to go. I wouldn't care if people from other countries mimicked American customs. Hell, many already have!

And on the subject of "cultural appropriation", did you know that many of Japan's customs come from outside influence? Primarily China, Korea and America. Many of them practice multiple religions and christian style weddings are quite popular over there. Does this make them racist?

Bhudism alone, a VERY popular religion in Japan and Asia as a whole (It's even in Dragon Ball!) actually has origins in Nepal!

A quote from Wikipedia in regards to Sailor Fukus:
An official from Tombow Co., a manufacturer of the sailor fuku (sailor outfits), said that the Japanese took the idea from scaled down sailor suits worn by children of royal European families. The official said "In Japan, they were probably seen as adorable Western-style children’s outfits, rather than navy gear

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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by Cipher » Sat Jun 10, 2017 4:31 am

While I fully believe that yes, cultural appropriation can be a thing, in all its tone-deafness and insensitivity, I'd never think to put watching subtitled media in that boat. That just shows an interest in the art and a willingness to interact with it in terms of the culture that made it.

For me, and I'd assume for most people who watch Dragon Ball subtitled, white or otherwise, it isn't some special concession I make for Japanese media alone. That's how I watch any foreign media. It's just the way I have of watching the material with the fewest barriers between me and the way the creators intended to present it, outside of being able to understand the language myself.

If we move beyond watching something subtitled into full-blown otaku-dom, and I'm not sure how far in that direction the opening post intended to take the conversation, that's something else entirely, my feelings become a little more complex, and I think that requires a much lengthier response that outlines the difference between contextually harmful forms of cultural appropriation and ones that are just kind of misguided and intellectually dishonest.
Last edited by Cipher on Sat Jun 10, 2017 4:38 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by Gaffer Tape » Sat Jun 10, 2017 4:36 am

Thankfully, no, I have never been accused of cultural appropriation, especially not in regards to how I watch anime. Oh, I've been criticized for it, certainly, but not for that reason. As for the subject itself, I feel its intentions are good. After all, there are plenty of cultural stereotypes ripe for the picking that would legitimately cause offense to others. It's hard to pinpoint those kinds of elements, though, because there is no one set standard for what is "offensive." People are individuals, not their cultures, so everyone, therefore, has their own idea of what crosses the line. It's sort of like the old adage about pornography: I'll know it when I see it.

Unfortunately, like a lot of well-intentioned ideas, it has become latched onto like dogma to the point where I feel it's causing the kind of harm it's trying to remedy. It basically does boil us down to our cultures. It defines us by *what* we are instead of *who* we are. It therefore carries the very unfortunate implication that people should just stick with their own kind. And I think that's a very dangerous idea. Society should be working to bring people closer together, not finding ways to continue to divide people into us versus them.
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by Soppa Saia People » Sat Jun 10, 2017 4:42 am

cheddarsword wrote:
Kunzait_83 wrote: No one gives two fucks what anyone does to have fun on their own spare time. No one. The problem that some people have with a lot of these genuine "Weaboo" types (the ones who take it so far as to be literally identifying as and behaving as if they're ethnically Japanese) is that it IS racially offensive: regardless of whether or not that's their intent. And I argue that it usually, typically isn't.

The problem is, you can't act like you live in a vacuum here amidst a large mixed civilization like the U.S. Other people, different people with different perspectives than you all live here too alongside you, and at times you're gonna have to think over how some of your actions and decisions might impact or affect others before you go through with them. Case in point, if you're a young 16 to 25 year old high school or college student in the United States (college students ESPECIALLY given the heavily diverse makeup of most campuses) and you dress, behave, speak, and flat out IDENTIFY as a different ethnicity, that's gonna be MASSIVELY insulting to other people who actually ARE of that ethnicity.
Okay, so are women offended by gay men who act more feminine than they do? Also, by your logic, Eminem's mistreatment by blacks is justified.
Mistreatment, what ? I mean, I never really cared for Eminem outside of TMMLP, and I'm sure he had a harder time getting into the industry, then someone like DMX, but the guy is arguably the most popular rapper of all time, I don't think people where shouting racial slurs, or breaking into his house to write "cracker". And a lot of his fame comes from being white. Guys like Rakim, Nas, Ghostface, Hov, GZA, Chuck D, Biggie, Kanye, and Ice Cube, are all better MCs (Jay, Ghostface, Ice Cube, Rakim), better lyricist (Nas, Biggie, Chuck D, GZA), or just a better discography (Kanye, Nas again, and Ghostface again), and are either not as popular, or hated on much more.
Also "blacks". Really ?

Anyway, watching a anime subbed isn't cultural appropriation, it's just watching something in its original form. Wearing native tribal gear and acting like it's not big deal is.
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by Kid Buu » Sat Jun 10, 2017 4:52 am

cheddarsword wrote: Bhudism alone, a VERY popular religion in Japan and Asia as a whole (It's even in Dragon Ball!) actually has origins in Nepal!
It actually originated in India, although it is true the Buddha himself was born in Nepal.
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by Kunzait_83 » Sat Jun 10, 2017 5:45 am

cheddarsword wrote:Okay, so are women offended by gay men who act more feminine than they do? Also, by your logic, Eminem's mistreatment by blacks is justified.
Women aren't an ethnic culture with the same kinds of baggage that that comes with. And certain types of flamboyant gays are certainly not by any means "acting" effeminate, and if you think that that's an act they're putting on then I can only conclude you've never once known or been around an actual gay person before (at least not one of that specific disposition). That IS how some of them naturally are in terms of manner of speech and how they carry themselves normally. Certainly not ALL gay guys, but some.

Both of these are hugely disingenuous attempts to find an argument where there isn't any.

More on Eminem momentarily.
cheddarsword wrote:"How dare you replicate our culture!? How dare you love it so much that you wish you were one of us!? How dare you look and act just like we do!? I am offended that you love our culture to this degree and I order you to stop!" Yeah, I just don't see how this = logic. Or reality either.
Because you're completely and thuddingly missing the entire point.

Loving Japanese culture and wanting to experience and partake of it is one thing. No harm in that whatsoever, any Japanese person would probably be flattered.

When you reduce all of Japanese culture down to a collection of ridiculous tics and stereotypes (culled from anime, and largely anime made for small children at that), the INTENT may be however complimentary, but that's NOT how it comes across. It comes across as belittling, even condescending, and you look like an outright moron who isn't genuinely serious about understanding the culture on any serious level and with any real depth beyond what some cheap, shitty kids cartoons have told you, and who thinks that THIS is all that "being Japanese" amounts to.

If you cannot see how that can be grotesquely insulting to a normal Japanese person, then I don't know what to tell you. You seem to just not understand the concept in this case of some people simply being callous assholes about something without intending or meaning to be.
cheddarsword wrote:This wasn't what you were talking about a few paragraphs earlier. If this was your intent, you should have made it clear from the start.
Its EXACTLY what I was talking about right from the start and I've no idea how I could've made it any clearer. You seemed to be much more interested in trying to nitpick apart what I was saying and find some kind of "Aha! Gotcha!" fault in it than you were in actually listening to the substance of what was being said.

You want it further simplified into soundbite status? Here's the sum total of my point:

Love other cultures. Explore other cultures. Become enmeshed in other cultures. Whatever gives you happiness, follow your heart. Just, when it comes to getting into a foreign culture (ANY foreign culture) just don't go so far overboard with it that you make a ridiculous racial caricature out of yourself (thus being unintentionally reductive of the entire ethnicity and culture) and then say "See? I'm Japanese (or whatever) now too!" Most people of that given culture probably won't think too fondly of that, and you ought to have more respect for something and for a people that you profess to love so much.
cheddarsword wrote:In my day to day life, I see people walking around in clothing from their native country. Speaking their native language. Being themselves. And this is within MY country. MY home soil. Should I be offended? Should I say "You're in my country so your religious beliefs, outfit, language and lifestyle in general should match mine completely."?

Do you know how idiotic that would make me look?
.....

No one said any of that. Like ANY of that.

Yes, of COURSE people from a given foreign culture are gonna sometimes walk around in clothing from it or speak the native language. Yeah, no shit. And they have EVERY RIGHT to do that wherever they want, certainly in the United States which is (theoretically, ostensibly, not as much in practice all the time sadly) supposed to be ALL ABOUT that stuff. And telling them they can't do that, that they can't be themselves, is about as much the height of hateful and asshole-ish as it gets.

But if you're not from one of those cultures, if you're not Japanese, Mexican, Indian, what have you, and you're walking around in their style of clothes and speaking their language in such a way as if you're trying to pass yourself off as one of them when you're not....you are treading on some SERIOUS thin fucking ice here. Is it possible for a white person (or whomever else) to walk around in garb from foreign culture without being outwardly insulting? Yeah it is, but you gotta be VERY goddamn delicate and respectful about how you approach it, and it damn well had better be within the right context.
cheddarsword wrote:But according to your logic, it's okay simply because they ARE those races. They're not mimicking them because they love them, they're living them because they ARE them. And in the end, what's the difference? Race.
Race and culture of upbringing.
cheddarsword wrote:How is it possible to offend an entire race of people by mimicking their lifestyle in part or in whole, out of love and respect for it?
Easy: when you're mimicry of their culture is heavily, HEAVILY skewed and filtered by what you've seen on some dumpy Japanese kids cartoons. When anime and manga are and embody effectively ALL you know about Japanese culture as you tout your knowledge of and love for it (to the point that you claim yourself an honorary Japanese person), it shows that you are profoundly unserious and incurious about really getting into cold, hard depth and really learning about what the ACTUAL culture is genuinely like like, and that maybe somewhere deep down (to get all armchair psychoanalyst for a moment) some part of you actually thinks very little of it and simply sees it as no different than being into any other given dumb, vapid fad.

Someone claiming to be "Japanese deep down themselves" because they speak in anime cliches, eat pocky, dress in a Sailor Fuku, and have memorized every episode of K-On line by line, but has ZERO intellectual curiosity or wherewithal to know who Yukio Mishima, Hidari Jingoro, Toshiko Akiyoshi, or Masaki Kobayashi are, what Ukiyo-e is, or who the current goddamn prime minister even is? Liking a collection of foreign TV shows and pop cultural minutia is in NO way the same thing as being serious about understanding a foreign culture, but there are Otaku who are SO adamant that they're Japanese cultural experts to the point that it makes THEM Japanese by extension, when that very obviously couldn't be farther from the case.

Its tantamount to a white person being SO into hip hop and gangsta thug life (from which they've picked them up from mainly albums and movies) that they go around in stereotypical gangsta clothes and talking the slang (in as over the top a manner as possible) while insisting that they're now black too: meanwhile having NO real understanding of the institutional poverty and racism that's at the heart of gangsta culture's existence, having ZERO interest in the unglamorous struggles that most hip hop artists come up from, and DAMN sure having no possible firsthand experience with dealing with true-blue racism. But its cool, they get it fully and they're black too cause they listen to Nas on their Beats By Dre. That kind of example's even vastly worse than the whole Weaboo thing on FAR more levels (and is an exceedingly common and well known real life cliche in and of itself), but its the same rough idea here.

Note: This is also how Eminem largely gets away with it BTW: he actually grew up in serious poverty and squalor in some of the worst parts of early 90s Detroit, and he's genuinely LIVED the struggle in virtually every conceivable way except for pure racial profiling (which is physically impossible). He's not black, but he lived the life from childhood, and walked the walk in ways that a giant swath of wannabe white rappers up till that point could only pretend at (*cough* Vanilla Ice).

Why should someone be offended when you mimic their cultural identity out of love for it? For starters, when you you demonstrate loudly and clearly that you in NO way, shape, or form actually UNDERSTAND anything of substance about the culture which you profess to love and think so little of it that you cannot be bothered to know a damn thing about it beyond what a collection of dumb cartoons have taught you. When you trivialize a culture and reduce it to the point that you feel entitled to wearing it like a new style of jacket that's trendy that year.

You can EASILY insult (without meaning to) someone or something that you love with a misbegotten or ill-thought out display of affection. It happens in the dating realm ALL the goddamned time.
cheddarsword wrote:And on the subject of "cultural appropriation", did you know that many of Japan's customs come from outside influence? Primarily China, Korea and America.
Yes, its very common knowledge that a GIANT chunk of Japanese culture was appropriated from China originally. There's been a LOT of bad blood over this (and several noteworthy military invasions/occupations) that has largely persisted between both countries up to this very day.
cheddarsword wrote:Does this make them racist?
If you ask the Chinese, they'll very likely say "yes, it does". Seriously, there's not a lot of love lost between those two nations.
http://80s90sdragonballart.tumblr.com/

Kunzait's Wuxia Thread
Journey to the West, chapter 26 wrote:The strong man will meet someone stronger still:
Come to naught at last he surely will!
Zephyr wrote:And that's to say nothing of how pretty much impossible it is to capture what made the original run of the series so great. I'm in the generation of fans that started with Toonami, so I totally empathize with the feeling of having "missed the party", experiencing disappointment, and wanting to experience it myself. But I can't, that's how life is. Time is a bitch. The party is over. Kageyama, Kikuchi, and Maeda are off the sauce now; Yanami almost OD'd; Yamamoto got arrested; Toriyama's not going to light trash cans on fire and hang from the chandelier anymore. We can't get the band back together, and even if we could, everyone's either old, in poor health, or calmed way the fuck down. Best we're going to get, and are getting, is a party that's almost entirely devoid of the magic that made the original one so awesome that we even want more.
Kamiccolo9 wrote:It grinds my gears that people get "outraged" over any of this stuff. It's a fucking cartoon. If you are that determined to be angry about something, get off the internet and make a stand for something that actually matters.
Rocketman wrote:"Shonen" basically means "stupid sentimental shit" anyway, so it's ok to be anti-shonen.

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DBS916
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by DBS916 » Sat Jun 10, 2017 6:44 am

No, thankfully. But my friend thought it was funny that I explained what I liked about Dragon Ball with my hands. And before you ask, yes, I'm Italian and it's second nature for me to use my hands while talking to someone.

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DrakenballP
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by DrakenballP » Sat Jun 10, 2017 8:04 am

JulieYBM wrote:
DrakenballP wrote:
Kunzait_83 wrote:I've only ever watched and appreciated Japanese media and pop culture as a foreign observer. I have never now, nor at any point in my life ever done the whole "Konichiwa Kawaii Desu Ne!!" Wapanese
I hate this! I'm a developer for a semi-popular MMORPG and there are far too many people like this. I hear everyday ":3 KAWAII!" "XD" "Senpai" "Nani!?" etc.
So, what you're saying is, they have themselves a secret little club and a secret code and you don't like that they're having fun by themselves? For goodness' sake, they make video games for a living, they're not going to be socially acceptable. They might as well do what makes them happy.

Imagine how some poor bastard feels overhearing words like 'Gokuu', 'Kamehame-Ha', 'Vegeta', 'Saiyan' or 'Piccolo''! 'Piccolo' is--of course--an instrument for making music...but how many of your average folks know what the hell a 'piccolo' is?

It must be Italian!
I am the game developer here.. not sure why you referred to the players as the game developer.

I don't see it as them trying to "Have fun", but rather try to roleplay or WANT to be Japanese.
"I am the hope of the universe. I am the answer to all living things that cry out for peace. I am protector of the innocent. I am the light in the darkness. I am truth. Ally to good! Nightmare to you!" - Goku.

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Kanassa
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by Kanassa » Sat Jun 10, 2017 8:21 am

I remember a year or so back when a white friend of mine was constantly yelled at for having dreadlocks. At first, he found it funny that he wasn't "Black enough for the hair!", but then the responses got a bit extreme (Well, as 'extreme' as you can get without the police getting involved). People had stopped insulting him for likiing anime and no one got on his case for watching subbed anime though, so, progress?
When Super apparently shoves Goku down our throats:


Obligitory Fan Fic Plug: Dragon Ball - Another Road
Kanassa wrote:
FoolsGil wrote:I hope Mark is dead. But chances are the dragonballs will bring his stupid ass back. :D
- FoolsGil, Out of Context, 2017

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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by dbgtFO » Sat Jun 10, 2017 8:24 am

I think they should be allowed to have their fun, however non sensical it is (there are of course certain limits, since we don't have Dragon Balls and magic beans in real life..).

I may just find it dumb, silly or offensive, but at the end of the day, I'd strive to not worry about such small time things and instead worry about more serious stuff.

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Kanassa
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Re: A question to the white subbies (don't worry it's not what you think)

Post by Kanassa » Sat Jun 10, 2017 8:25 am

DBS916 wrote:And before you ask, yes, I'm Italian and it's second nature for me to use my hands while talking to someone.
Why would anyone ask? It isn't an odd thing for somone to use their hands while talking to someone, it's pretty normal really.
When Super apparently shoves Goku down our throats:


Obligitory Fan Fic Plug: Dragon Ball - Another Road
Kanassa wrote:
FoolsGil wrote:I hope Mark is dead. But chances are the dragonballs will bring his stupid ass back. :D
- FoolsGil, Out of Context, 2017

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