But seriously, how did the Falcouner soundtrack even make it to air?

[Hellspawn28]

subconsciously might be put off by the strange music(80's music). Same way kids oddly dislike their parent's 'old music', until they grow up.

When I was a kid, I like the Beatles, Aeromsith, Frank Sinatra and Black Sabbath because my dad would play them when I was little. Even as a little kid, I love the music from Akira Ifukube in the Godzilla movies. So not all kids dislike older stuff.

We're talking about the average person. not isolated cases such as yours. Kids just typically dislike older music. Same with older folk, they seem to dislike newer music.

I'm not sure what you mean by isolated because you are not isolated as a kid if you are given exposure to other media that is not the typical family friendly garbage.

[Bardo117]

Sean Schemmel, on the English cast performing more like the Japanese cast:
I generally don't listen to suggestions about trying to be more like the Japanese actors, because I've said that I find, especially for Gokuu, that that's ridiculous.

Sean Schemmel, on the Japanese theme song "Head-Cha-La":
"Head-Cha-La," for another example and I've told you this Jon, even though it's very catchy, it's absolutely ridiculous for the American culture.

Sonny Strait, North American VA for Krillin, on FUNimation's new music score:
I think the main thing about them not using the original music, and I could be wrong, is because of the dated factor of it...But uh, there's definitely an appeal to it, but I don't think that it's as wide a range of appeal as what they want. I mean, people like you, and others that are die-hard anime fans are definitely gonna want as much of the original as possible, but I think the general population is more entertained by screaming guitars and such.

Sonny Strait:
When you try to appeal to the general population, you need to appeal to a different level, and it's not exactly an intellectual one ^_^.

Another quote that dictates exactly what I've been stressing this entire time.

[VegettoEX]

The voice actors don't produce the show. Their opinions are just that: their opinions (at whatever point in time that they're given).

[ABED]

Opinions that have changed if they ever did. A lot of this comes off as PR for the dub product. Their opinions are very different these days.

[Bardo117]

Those opinions probably reflect the sentiment found within the company at the time. Obviously they have different opinions now, but it's very clear that almost all of them share the same opinion. And it's TRUE. For the time it was released.


As Socrates once said, who's bias do you seek? Everybody has their own opinion, but some opinions are more accurate and reflective of the ongoing situation. Like, who else's opinion could be considered more actuate than the actors/producers/distributors themselves at that point in time?

[Gaffer Tape]

Those opinions probably reflect the sentiment found within the company at the time. Obviously they have different opinions now, but it's very clear that almost all of them share the same opinion. And it's TRUE. For the time it was released.


As Socrates once said, who's bias do you seek? Everybody has their own opinion, but some opinions are more accurate and reflective of the ongoing situation. Like, who else's opinion could be considered more actuate than the actors/producers/distributors themselves at that point in time?

I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to demonstrate with those quotes, though. That when FUNimation was changing the music, they thought it was a good idea to change the music? I really didn't think that was ever in question. Of course they thought it was a good idea. If they didn't think that, they wouldn't have done it! You really think they would have gone on record saying, "Well, we don't think anybody's going to like it. It's probably going to lose us a whole bunch of money. But we figure, why the hell not? It'll give nerds something to argue about twenty years from now"?

[Bardo117]

I was simply saying that this shared sentiment was for the better.

[GodVegetto91]

To the OP.. I am actually extremely offended by this. Your "subjective opinion" about Bruce Faulconers score is exactly that, a subjective view point. And nothing more. Nowhere does it proof that Faulconer is objectively bad, or even inferior to the other scores.

As for me, i feel very strongly about my hero Bruce Faulconer, to the point where i'm even willing to say that he's objectively better than any other db score, but i'm not going to do that, since it IS ofcourse always a subjective issue and will always remain as such. That said, i hate it when people say "This and that music doesn't fit dragon ball." Really? And who decides that? There's no one that does. In fact, one could even argue that Faulconers "Badass score" perfectly fits Dragon Ball — a Badass show, with absolutely badass fight scenes. And that person would certainly have a point in that. At least, from a certain perspective, which is also my perspective.

The fact is, no one decides what OBJECTIVELY fits or doesn't fit dragon ball, it's a man-made show, based around man-made rules and logic. There can never be an objective rule or law that states wether a certain musical score fits it or not.

That said, subjective opinions are always welcome, and certain ones can even be given high praise and respect based on their level of reason and logic.

I absolutely LOVE Faulconer, it's the best thing that ever happened to me, and is for me, what makes the show. Dbz just isn't gonna be the same without it. The great music also corresponded greatly with the appropriate scenes to me. Badass music belongs to a badass show, and that, to me, is a much better reason for why it "fits Dragonball" as opposed to, "Oh Hey! It's a japanese score with a certain instrument that is used that they always normally use in that culture or type of shows." No. That, to me, is a bad reason to prefer kukichi over Faulconer.

On a side note, Norihito Sumitomo is my second favorite musical composer! He's capable of making many great songs!

[thaman91]

As a fan of the Faulconer score, it's not just "badass music" though. The whole thing is comprised of a wide variety of music that is capable of fitting every single type of tone. I mean, it can be badass at times, but it is so much more than that and I feel that the "badass" designation does it a great disservice and only serves as a quick & easy bashing point for those that hate the score.

[GodKaio-Ken]

I had to re-listen to some tracks to participate in this discussion. His tracks make me feel like I'm playing some creepy version of Mega Man. I agree they are pretty horrible.

[ABED]

based around man-made rules and logic. There can never be an objective rule or law that states wether a certain musical score fits it or not.

I don't think you have a proper conception of what objectivity is. Yes, the show was man made, and based on the story, a cheap synth score of that type doesn't fit the tone and feel of the show. There is clearly a tone and a feel that the scenes Toei/Toriyama were going for and all elements should be working towards it. Faulconer's score doesn't.

I absolutely LOVE Faulconer, it's the best thing that ever happened to me, and is for me, what makes the show.

I can not EVER go along with a statement like this. I don't understand it. Even under the best of circumstances, the music will help a scene but it can't make it without the story, characters, and the acting.

[MajinMan]

So Faulconer creating a "badass" score for a show that apparently has nothing of value other than hot, sweaty men having "badass" fights is a good justification as to why Faulconer's score fits the series? I would argue that Faulconer's score is not badass. In fact, I think it's quite lame overall. Labeling Kikuchi's score as "some Japanese score with a certain instrument" is incredibly ignorant and clearly biased against it.

Dragon Ball has so much more to offer than just being a badass show. There's the comedy, character moments, development, and world building. Not to mention all the Wuxia influence. People seem to have a one track mind when they think about "DEEBEEZEE" about how cool and epic the screaming and fighting is. There's so much more to like about this series. This is why Kikuchi will always be the number one score. It captures the tone and genre of the show perfectly. Faulconer is only fitting of the poorly made old English dub. It was CLEARLY meant to change the original tone of the series into a more American Saturday morning cartoon tone. If you somehow put it with the Japanese or other competently made dubs, like English Kai, it will feel completely out of place.

[GodKaio-Ken]

based around man-made rules and logic. There can never be an objective rule or law that states wether a certain musical score fits it or not.

I don't think you have a proper conception of what objectivity is. Yes, the show was man made, and based on the story, a cheap synth score of that type doesn't fit the tone and feel of the show. There is clearly a tone and a feel that the scenes Toei/Toriyama were going for and all elements should be working towards it. Faulconer's score doesn't.

I absolutely LOVE Faulconer, it's the best thing that ever happened to me, and is for me, what makes the show.

I can not EVER go along with a statement like this. I don't understand it. Even under the best of circumstances, the music will help a scene but it can't make it without the story, characters, and the acting.

The thing is he's implying that me making fart noises can be considered the best background music as well. It certainly COULD be that way, but its a rabbit hole where nothing means anything. All things lose all qualities, we can even question whether Goku is the good guy because all perspectives become equally valid.

If someone loves his tracks its their right and I respect that.

[ABED]

I wasn't arguing his right to like something.

[GodKaio-Ken]

I wasn't arguing his right to like something.

I know...and I agree with what you said. Just pointing out why his argument has limits.

[PacificOceanDub]

[/quote]I find that to be pure BS. Just like adults, kids love a story that pulls them in. They don't need something playing for every single second.[/quote]


That’s exactly right, as a child my favorite thing about DBZ right off the bat was the fact that it was a serial. Every other cartoon was episodic, because everyone thinks kids can’t handle a serial cartoon, but we totally could. Having said that, I didn’t mind the Faulconer score as a kid, because I didn’t really know any better. And I still don’t mind it now

[8bitdee]

It's not so much that the Falcouner OST was bad, but rather how it was used. It was overused, with literally almost every damn minute of anime air time having background music that killed the atmosphere of it. Especially those scenes that required some quiet time. The songs and production value of it wasn't necessarily bad, especially for the early 2000s in Western culture, but the sound director(s) in charge of the show used it so disastrously.

[TheGreatness25]

I think that the Faulconer score was fine. I liked the Shuki Levy score, but the Faulconer music was good in its own way. People compare it to the Kikuchi score -- which is fair, I guess -- but the Faulconer music wasn't as bad as many make it seem. My one chief complaint was that it always sounded synthesized. Maybe if it had stronger drums or something, I'd like it more. Though the tunes themselves, for the most part, were catchy. I didn't like the "in-between" music, though (like Goten and Trunks running around, etc.). I mean, it is what it is and it wasn't this horrendous, terrible thing. It was just a replacement soundtrack to a cartoon that came from Japan. It wasn't something crazy, especially in the time. Many people look at it from a 21st century anime-exposed world angle of, "How dare they change the music and script?!" When really, that was just kind of standard practice back in the day. Power Rangers got that treatment (and it's live action!), Yu-Gi-Oh got that treatment, Pokemon got that treatment, Sailor Moon got that treatment. Street Fighter II The Animated Movie (an incredible release) got that treatment. Hindsight is 20/20. Even back in 1998 or whenever, there was a relatively small pocket of fans that explored DB further and liked the Japanese version more, even that was hindsight because the series got dubbed before then. I just think that it's a little silly to judge a series that was released between 1996-2002, by today's standards. The anime boom in the U.S. didn't happen until after that. And in 2007, Funimation released the orange bricks with the dub using the Japanese BGM. Hey, points for that. And even to this day, that's their preferred track (look at the Dragon Box release, Funimation Now, and when it was on Hulu).

But, back to Faulconer. It's fine. It's not on the same emotional level as the Kikuchi score, obviously, but I do find it pretty cool in its own way. It certainly feels like it might have pulled some inspiration from the video games (I can totally see the Dragon Ball Greatest Legends soundtrack influencing the music, even though I know it didn't). Again, my only real complaint against it, was that it sounded too synthesized. It sounded too manufactured and wasn't as natural as a Batman the Animated Series score, or even a Tom & Jerry score. But that was kind of a fit for the dub, in my opinion. The majority of the voice acting sounded too manufactured as well, which is why I always found the Ocean actors to be much more natural-sounding. But that's another argument for another time.

[SuperCyan2]

It's not so much that the Falcouner OST was bad, but rather how it was used. It was overused, with literally almost every damn minute of anime air time having background music that killed the atmosphere of it. Especially those scenes that required some quiet time. The songs and production value of it wasn't necessarily bad, especially for the early 2000s in Western culture, but the sound director(s) in charge of the show used it so disastrously.

The only country dubs to have changed the music of Dragon Ball (Z) was Canada and America, the rest used the original soundtrack. Same applies to other shows; Doraemon, Kiteretsu, Ninja Hattori, Shin-chan, Captain Tsubasa, The Legend of Zorro, Grimm's Fairy Tale Classics, Dr. Slump and Arale-chan, Future Boy Conan, etc. In the early days, US and CA seriously had a thing to go around and purposefully change the music intended for "improving" the show they were dubbing.

Credit where credit is due, the Ocean Dub soundtrack is pretty kick ass at least. I can't say the same for the Funimation Dub score (Faulconer).

[TheGreatness25]

Yeah, U.S. and Canada did it... so it's not a Funimation concept, it's just how things were done. You're judging it by the standard of how something was done back in the day. And even so, how sure is anyone that they got good, if any, quality audio from the series?