Is Goku a bad person?

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Krillin
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by Krillin » Sat Mar 24, 2018 6:26 am

TFS isn't much different to original the original Toei animation version.
The only difference is how they reword it a bit.
Goku is just as selfish and dumb if not more than he is in TFS, like when Mr Satan offered him 100 million zenni, he asked "Is 100 million bigger than 100 thousand?"
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by Krillin » Sat Mar 24, 2018 6:27 am

Krillin wrote:TFS isn't much different to original the original Toei animation version.
The only difference is how they reword it a bit.
Goku is just as selfish and dumb if not more than he is in TFS, like when Mr Satan offered him 100 million zenni, he asked "Is 100 million bigger than 100 thousand?"
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by Krillin » Sat Mar 24, 2018 6:30 am

A couple of things Goku has done, he is not aware of being bad
For example, grabbing people's private parts in order to check their gender.
He may not have known it was bad but that doesn't mean it is good.
Now, the wife beating part is sort of invalid due to him accidentally hurting Chichi due to his strength.
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by ABED » Sat Mar 24, 2018 7:07 am

I haven't seen Super so I can't comment
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by kemuri07 » Sat Mar 24, 2018 7:18 am

ABED wrote:I haven't seen Super so I can't comment
oh how I envy you.

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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by SupremeKai25 » Sat Mar 24, 2018 7:44 am

Yes, Goku is a bad person. Just rewatch episode 53 of Dragon Ball: Super. He was very disrespectful towards Zamasu, the apprentice Supreme Kai and fighting prodigy, even annoying him greatly by repeatedly touching him. When Gowasu was discussing the Time Rings with Beerus and Whis, Goku kept bothering Zamasu. And then, after the fight, Goku almost killed Zamasu with his punch. Goku, with his rude manners, egoistical personality (he wanted to fight and didn't care about Zamasu's say on the matter) and foolish behaviour, doomed Zamasu. It doesn't matter if Goku didn't want to come off as 'rude' or 'primitive', he still acted in a very idiotic and aggressive way, and that makes him a bad person, because he doesn't know how to act in front of a GOD.
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by Captain Strawberry » Sat Mar 24, 2018 7:52 am

I think it's been left to ones own personal interpretation.

He is probably so pure of a person he doesn't think of the bad or doesn't think what he is doing is bad which gives off that innocent nature.
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by ABED » Sat Mar 24, 2018 8:39 am

I don't care if a being is a god, that doesn't entitle them to being treated with reverence. It wasn't a position that is earned. In the case of Earth's god/Kami, yes, but the Kaioshin are born into those positions. Also, isn't Zamasu a villain?
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by Dr. Casey » Sat Mar 24, 2018 8:46 am

The "pat pat" thing doesn't really have any moral or emotional relevancy and shouldn't be used to judge him. We know not to do stuff like that because we're part of a larger society and have had others to teach us about things like privacy, consent, and boundaries. Bulma is the second human being that Goku's ever seen, and he's spent an undesignated amount of time (maybe several years) as a feral child living in the middle of the woods. Can't really fairly judge him for that particular social faux pas when there's no possible way he could have learned not to do that.
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by Metalwario64 » Sat Mar 24, 2018 12:13 pm

Krillin wrote:TFS isn't much different to original the original Toei animation version.
The only difference is how they reword it a bit.
Goku is just as selfish and dumb if not more than he is in TFS, like when Mr Satan offered him 100 million zenni, he asked "Is 100 million bigger than 100 thousand?"
Sorry, but that just couldn't be further from the truth. TFS completely changes many characters for the sake of humor, and since it's a parody adds in a ton of jokes and also completely alters characters for the sake of humor (Dodoria, Zarbon and the Grand Elder, just off the top of my head). It also makes references to other series (Goku never called Piccolo Yoshi in the original...). Also, the entire show is spliced footage, that's heavily altered and re-edited. Goku went from being an uneducated man-child to being Family Guy levels of blithering idiocy. It's waaaay more than being reworded a "bit".

I really don't know why TFS fans like to convince themselves that their parody is on the same grounds as an official dub, to the point where people discuss it as if it were the original version, and they also make direct comparisons to actual dubs like the Ocean cast ones and FUNimation's in-house Z and Kai dubs.

They're not the same thing. I honestly recommend you actually watch the series in Japanese, both so that you'll actually experience the original, and also because it's so damn good and classic.
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by Hyena_Yamcha » Sat Mar 24, 2018 12:52 pm

SupremeKai25 wrote:Yes, Goku is a bad person. Just rewatch episode 53 of Dragon Ball: Super. He was very disrespectful towards Zamasu, the apprentice Supreme Kai and fighting prodigy, even annoying him greatly by repeatedly touching him. When Gowasu was discussing the Time Rings with Beerus and Whis, Goku kept bothering Zamasu. And then, after the fight, Goku almost killed Zamasu with his punch. Goku, with his rude manners, egoistical personality (he wanted to fight and didn't care about Zamasu's say on the matter) and foolish behaviour, doomed Zamasu. It doesn't matter if Goku didn't want to come off as 'rude' or 'primitive', he still acted in a very idiotic and aggressive way, and that makes him a bad person, because he doesn't know how to act in front of a GOD.
Its not like he did it on purpose to disrespect him.

I also think that Goku's personality is somewhat different in super.
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by Dbzfan94 » Sat Mar 24, 2018 1:15 pm

Krillin wrote:TFS isn't much different to original the original Toei animation version.
The only difference is how they reword it a bit.
Goku is just as selfish and dumb if not more than he is in TFS, like when Mr Satan offered him 100 million zenni, he asked "Is 100 million bigger than 100 thousand?"
Super and TFS both exaggerate Goku's stupidity too much. If you want to compare, use the original manga.
SupremeKai25 wrote:Yes, Goku is a bad person. Just rewatch episode 53 of Dragon Ball: Super. He was very disrespectful towards Zamasu, the apprentice Supreme Kai and fighting prodigy, even annoying him greatly by repeatedly touching him. When Gowasu was discussing the Time Rings with Beerus and Whis, Goku kept bothering Zamasu. And then, after the fight, Goku almost killed Zamasu with his punch. Goku, with his rude manners, egoistical personality (he wanted to fight and didn't care about Zamasu's say on the matter) and foolish behaviour, doomed Zamasu. It doesn't matter if Goku didn't want to come off as 'rude' or 'primitive', he still acted in a very idiotic and aggressive way, and that makes him a bad person, because he doesn't know how to act in front of a GOD.
Again, that episode was probably the worst case of flanderization on Super's part.

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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by ABED » Sat Mar 24, 2018 1:20 pm

Again, that episode was probably the worst case of flanderization on Super's part.
Why, because he's rude to a god?
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by SupremeKai25 » Sat Mar 24, 2018 1:21 pm

Its not like he did it on purpose to disrespect him.
It's still irritating, isn't it? Like, Goku should have some maturity and start to respect others' opinions. Zamasu kept telling Goku that he did not want to fight, and yet Goku insisted. I wouldn't mind this behaviour, if Goku weren't an adult.

Goku might not be a 'bad' person, as in an 'evil' person, but he is a bad person because he thinks the world revolves around him solely. Or at least he acted that way in that particular scenario.
I don't care if a being is a god, that doesn't entitle them to being treated with reverence
By that logic, you should be able to treat your teacher like a random drunkard and get away with it. A mortal shouldn't disrespect a God, that's basic knowledge in the Dragon Ball universe; the Gods gave you intellect, reason, life, so logic dictates that you should at the very least show some respect and dignity, not act like a fool.
It wasn't a position that is earned. In the case of Earth's god/Kami, yes, but the Kaioshin are born into those positions.
Zamasu did earn that position. He was actually just the North Kai, so his place was relatively minor in the Gods hierarchy, but he managed to become a Supreme Kai in-training thanks to his fighting skills and intelligence; he was, in fact, revered as a genius even by the Supreme Kais. Which makes his anger at Goku's silly and childish behaviour even more relatable, personally.
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by ABED » Sat Mar 24, 2018 1:33 pm

It's still irritating, isn't it?
No, it's just Goku.
By that logic, you should be able to treat your teacher like a random drunkard and get away with it. A mortal shouldn't disrespect a God, that's basic knowledge in the Dragon Ball universe; the Gods gave you intellect, reason, life, so logic dictates that you should at the very least show some respect and dignity, not act like a fool.
Not at all. I believe in treating people with a given amount of due respect unless I'm given reason to treat them otherwise. And screw the god hierarchy. They aren't due anything because of some characteristic given to them at birth. What makes gods more deserving of respect than mortals. And how did the gods give them reason? As for giving someone life, that doesn't entitle you to respect. A teacher is also something inherently different. That takes skills they've accrued over years and again, it has its limits. I don't respect teachers who can't teach even if they have the title of professor. Maybe it's answered in Super, but what do any of the gods do? Beerus destroys to bring balance, but what does Kami, Kaio, Grand Kaio, Kaioshin, etc. do?
Which makes his anger at Goku's silly and childish behaviour even more relatable, personally.
Again, doesn't he become a villain? In that case - screw him. His fighting skills are to be commended but we're talking about ethics. The Kami we know got that position by being a good person. That is something to respect. As for Goku, he's mixed. Even though the consequences of his issues are world threatening, he never does so out of malice so I can't slap the label of "bad person" on him.
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by dbgtFO » Sat Mar 24, 2018 1:41 pm

ABED wrote:Maybe it's answered in Super, but what do any of the gods do? Beerus destroys to bring balance, but what does Kami, Kaio, Grand Kaio, Kaioshin, etc. do?
They oversee and create life and celestial objects.
You have the Hakaishin/God of Destruction and the Sozoshin/God of Creation aka Kaioshin/Supreme Kai. The GoD can be chosen from the mortal realm, while the GoC are always the race of the Kaioshin.

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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by ABED » Sat Mar 24, 2018 1:51 pm

Thanks, though I still think respect is earned, not an entitlement, even in DB world.

Goku isn't respectful, but it's not out of malice.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by Champa The Destroyer » Sat Mar 24, 2018 3:55 pm

Of course not. He can come off as rude, and has done bad things before, but he is definitely pure and a good person. He acts selfishly quite a lot, but he'll still protect his friends and family when they're in danger.

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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by DragonBallFoodie » Sun Mar 25, 2018 9:13 am

No he isn't. He's a bit of an idiot and goof, but he's not a bad person like Vegeta or Frieza.
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Re: Is Goku a bad person?

Post by Lightdasher » Sun Mar 25, 2018 11:09 am

I get the feeling that this topic was made just to reinforce the belief of Goku being a bad guy in good guy uniform. It's been said already, no need to go into much detail, but I also believe that Goku's intentions are generally innocent and nice enough, despite that his actions sometimes imply otherwise. Speaking to OP directly, you did comment that the case of Goku hitting Chi-Chi is invalid (I assume for the purpose of this conversation), but I feel that's selective bias when you mention cases like pat-pat showing malice. Sure, he did that intentionally, but the intention was to get information and he didn't know it was disrespectful to do. Also, no offense, but you would be doing the forum a favor by learning to quote correctly. You just press the quote button to the top-right of any post, then type your response in the same dialouge box that pops up with the text already there.
SupremeKai25 wrote:Yes, Goku is a bad person. Just rewatch episode 53 of Dragon Ball: Super. He was very disrespectful towards Zamasu, the apprentice Supreme Kai and fighting prodigy, even annoying him greatly by repeatedly touching him. When Gowasu was discussing the Time Rings with Beerus and Whis, Goku kept bothering Zamasu. And then, after the fight, Goku almost killed Zamasu with his punch. Goku, with his rude manners, egoistical personality (he wanted to fight and didn't care about Zamasu's say on the matter) and foolish behaviour, doomed Zamasu. It doesn't matter if Goku didn't want to come off as 'rude' or 'primitive', he still acted in a very idiotic and aggressive way, and that makes him a bad person, because he doesn't know how to act in front of a GOD.
Are you... him? The sun that lights this world? The wisdom, the law, and the power of the universe? The most spendid, and undying, Zamasu..?! :lol: jk, I'm still mad at you for killing Goten.. :cry:
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