Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Discussion regarding the entirety of the franchise in a general (meta) sense, including such aspects as: production, trends, merchandise, fan culture, and more.

Moderators: Kanzenshuu Staff, General Help

User avatar
Kaiza_Toshiyuki
Temporarily Banned
Posts: 262
Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:32 pm
Location: South Carolina

Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by Kaiza_Toshiyuki » Fri Oct 05, 2018 2:40 pm

People take this show way too seriously. Its crazy. I love the show but I´ve seen people do and say some stupid stuff because of it.

Dragon Ball Ireland
I'm pretty cozy, here...
Posts: 1652
Joined: Thu May 21, 2015 9:09 am
Location: Kildare, Ireland

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Fri Oct 05, 2018 3:04 pm

Passion. And lots of it. When something is very near and dear to someone often they fall into the trap of going out of their way to justify its merit, despite being well aware of its flaws.

I love Dragon Ball a lot but I also accept none of it is perfect. Every series has aspects I like and don't like.

I love Kai but accept the music placement isn't as good as Z and the Japanese cast are not in their prime, ironically the opposite applies to Z although that has pacing issues, and of course its English dub pales in comparison to Kai.

I love the Ocean cast, but I acknowledge the scripting problems in all their dubs other than the Pioneer trilogy (hopefully Kai will be on that level too).

I love the action in DBZ, but I get that it lacks the comedy and character moments that were well done in original DB and Super too.

I love the home releases for their cover art, Simmons' subtitles and decent picture quality on all of them except Z. You get the picture....

I would say if you can appreciate what made Dragon Ball such a global phenomenon and accept the good with the bad you are a well rounded fan.
Selling
- Arrival DVD single
- Betrayal DVD single

Looking For
- Showdown DVD single
- Madman Level 1.1

If interested PM with offers

User avatar
sintzu
Banned
Posts: 13583
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2011 1:41 pm

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by sintzu » Fri Oct 05, 2018 3:26 pm

It's like with every part of entertainment in life (sports, movies, games, etc.), people have a deep passion for it. For example, the fans who defend modern DB and hope it continues is because of their love for DB so they want to see what they love go on strong with other franchises. The fans who criticize modern DB and wish it never existed do so because of their love for DB and their belief that DB deserves nothing but the best and that the new content isn't living up to that high bar. Both parties have very different opinions but both come from the same place, a deep love for the DB franchise.
July 9th 2018 will be remembered as the day Broly became canon.

User avatar
Doctor.
Banned
Posts: 10529
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:02 am
Location: Portugal

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by Doctor. » Fri Oct 05, 2018 4:21 pm

It was a good show and it no longer is a good show.

User avatar
GigaDrill
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 127
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 9:46 pm

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by GigaDrill » Fri Oct 05, 2018 4:27 pm

Lots of people grew up watching it when they were young, and unlike a lot of childhood cartoons, this franchise keeps on metastasizing. There's also that part where plenty of people have moved on, but the constant vomiting of new material by Toei means that fans have a reason to keep coming back to DB.

ricky84
Banned Alternate Account
Posts: 546
Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:16 pm

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by ricky84 » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:30 pm

Because they have standards
When someone tells you, "Don't present your opinion as fact," what they're actually saying is, "Don't present your opinion with any conviction. Because I don't like your opinion, and I want to be able to dismiss it as easily as possible." Don't fall for it.

User avatar
JohnnyCashKami
Temporarily Banned
Posts: 1597
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:16 pm

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by JohnnyCashKami » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:41 pm

The Dragon Ball community and part of it is quite toxic, which is why I don't even interact with that specific side since they're always arguing with each other.

In ways, those DB fans are worse than console fanboys.

User avatar
Cursed Lemon
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1035
Joined: Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:29 pm
Location: Location, Location
Contact:

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by Cursed Lemon » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:56 pm

How serious or not a thing is will typically have little to no bearing on how seriously its fans take it. Seems to me that it generally boils down to two factors, the first being the personalities that the thing attracts and the neuroses that they drag along with them - anime fans, m i rite? The second is whether or not the thing has a quality of some kind of significance, whether it be level of artistry, scope of influence, etc. that constitute a hill that fans will readily and gleefully die on. Dragon Ball, for example, is arguably the shonen genre's poster child and doubtlessly is one of the most influential anime of all time. It codified the kind of melodrama and corny "2% of my power" shtick that has its tendrils in every other long-running shonen show since. Whip all this together with the anonymity of the internet, and well...
Special Beam Cannon!

(゚Д゚)σ 弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌弌⊃

User avatar
Kuwabara
Regular
Posts: 670
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:36 am

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by Kuwabara » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:01 pm

Doctor. wrote:It was a good show and it no longer is a good show.
Whether it's good or not is totally subjective, but this basic attitude touches on how I feel about the general fan perception of the various series, mainly in reference to Z vs. Super. Many people grew up thinking Z was this amazing series, then ended up feeling burned by Super. It's not that Super is bad compared to Z (comically, they have the exact same problems), people just grew up.

So, I believe much of this sentiment comes from fans grappling with something they grew up with possibly not being as stellar as they once thought...

Some of it is also Funimation's past marketing combined with the general mistake anime fans make of thinking all anime is subversive nuanced adult storytelling elevated far above the likes of those vapid Western baby cartoons.
This is the episode of when Gokuh enrages himself after Freezer talk shit about Kuririn

User avatar
SupremeKai25
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1269
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 9:40 am

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by SupremeKai25 » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:06 pm

I don't take Dragon Ball seriously, I take Zamasu seriously. And that's normal. Millions of people grow quite attached to fictional characters for a wide variety of different reasons and as a result take them very seriously. Many who watch this show do it not because they like the show itself, but because they adore certain characters within it, and in my case it's Zamasu.
"Light of Divine Justice! Strike at me now! A cowering God who appeases evil can never prevail!"

Zamasu/Fused Zamasu fan.

User avatar
Doctor.
Banned
Posts: 10529
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:02 am
Location: Portugal

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by Doctor. » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:17 pm

Kuwabara wrote:So, I believe much of this sentiment comes from fans grappling with something they grew up with possibly not being as stellar as they once thought.
Accusing people of nostalgia is never a good argument to make when trying to discuss why a continuation of a series is received negatively in comparison to the original series for the sole reason that fans can (and have) revisit the original series at any point and form an opinion of it completely independent of their childhood memories (and that's excluding fans that got into the series late and hold little to no nostalgic attachment toward it, like myself). I've gone to rewatch many of my childhood shows and realized that they suck and I couldn't enjoy them. I also watched Star Wars for the first time this year and I largely agree with the people that think modern SW is garbage. Dragon Ball, flawed as it is, has legitimate value as a piece of art. Its modern equivalent lacks an identity of its own and fails at everything that made Dragon Ball enjoyable, whether that be the visuals, the audio, the atmosphere, the choreography, the character designs or even the narrative.

Obviously, it's all subjective as to which approach you prefer, but 90s DB and modern DB are fundamentally different interpretations of the series; that is visible to anyone.

User avatar
Kuwabara
Regular
Posts: 670
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:36 am

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by Kuwabara » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:47 pm

Doctor. wrote:Accusing people of nostalgia is never a good argument to make when trying to discuss why a continuation of a series is received negatively in comparison to the original series for the sole reason that fans can (and have) revisit the original series at any point and form an opinion of it completely independent of their childhood memories (and that's excluding fans that got into the series late and hold little to no nostalgic attachment toward it, like myself).
I'm merely putting forth a possible explanation. I also said much of the fan sentiment could be borne of nostalgia, not all of it. Nostalgia or not, would you find it hard to believe that many fans put Z in particular on too high a pedestal? I think this is all too evident, and it makes me sick when people point out flaws in Super that are also quite prevalent in Z.
Doctor. wrote:Its modern equivalent lacks an identity of its own and fails at everything that made Dragon Ball enjoyable, whether that be the visuals, the audio, the atmosphere, the choreography, the character designs or even the narrative.
You say this so self-assuredly, but I disagree! Super carries on much of Dragon Ball and Z's charm in ways that might not immediately be obvious, while also bringing something new to the table. I certainly can't think of any previous arcs like Goku Black, and, for all its problems, the Tournament of Power is possibly the most ambitious storytelling endeavor in series history as far as how its narrative unfolds. It's also a thrill ride, which is all I wanted and exactly what I got. Super also canonizes decades old fan theories in ways that very naturally tie into the overall fabric of Dragon Ball's world in satisfying ways. All in all, Dragon Ball, Z, and Super are all well worth experiencing.
This is the episode of when Gokuh enrages himself after Freezer talk shit about Kuririn

User avatar
Doctor.
Banned
Posts: 10529
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:02 am
Location: Portugal

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by Doctor. » Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:03 pm

Kuwabara wrote:I'm merely putting forth a possible explanation. I also said much of the fan sentiment could be borne of nostalgia, not all of it. Nostalgia or not, would you find it hard to believe that many fans put Z in particular on too high a pedestal? I think this is all too evident, and it makes me sick when people point out flaws in Super that are also quite prevalent in Z.
It depends on what you mean by "flaws that are also quite prevalent in Z." I find that it's a matter of execution. While Super and Z may share the same flaws superficially, they may be less intrusive to the experience in Z, while they may stick out like a sore thumb in Super. The nonsensical and arbitrary power-ups for one.
Kuwabara wrote:You say this so self-assuredly, but I disagree! Super carries on much of Dragon Ball and Z's charm in ways that might not immediately be obvious, while also bringing something new to the table. I certainly can't think of any previous arcs like Goku Black, and, for all its problems, the Tournament of Power is possibly the most ambitious storytelling endeavor in series history as far as how its narrative unfolds. It's also a thrill ride, which is all I wanted and exactly what I got. Super also canonizes decades old fan theories in ways that very naturally tie into the overall fabric of Dragon Ball's world in satisfying ways. All in all, Dragon Ball, Z, and Super are all well worth experiencing.
The Goku Black arc borrows its premise directly from the Cell arc: Trunks comes back to the past to ask Goku & co for help in the future. There was no need for Trunks or time travel to be involved in a plot about a rogue Kaioshin stealing Goku's body, and the premise of the arc could have actually been far more interesting if reworked to make Goku take a backseat for the majority of the arc, but they decided to bank on familiarity and bring back future Trunks. Much of Super's good, original ideas lead nowhere or are developed poorly and dropped for the sake of rehashing a beat from the original series. I say the series has no identity, because it really has no identity; there's very little iconic imagery in Super that doesn't borrow from the original series. And as for the Tournament of the Power, though the premise may be unique, in execution it plays out exactly like any other arc in Z. It's just a series of isolated fights, with very little being done with the actual setting and scenario being presented.

User avatar
Lord Beerus
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 20563
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 5:20 pm
Location: A temple on a giant tree
Contact:

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by Lord Beerus » Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:25 pm

Developing a personal attachment to a fictional stories can lead to a drive of a certain quality and/or specific direction of said fictional story needing to be maintained for the utmost gratification for one-self and others who have the same personal attachment or simply those who may want to get invested in the fictional story as well.

It's human nature.

SSJgogeto
Beyond-the-Beyond Newbie
Posts: 411
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 3:11 pm

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by SSJgogeto » Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:33 pm

I think it's because of a set of factors like nostalgia, passion and maybe unrealistic standards.

precita
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5467
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2015 3:10 pm

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by precita » Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:56 pm

Dragonball is serious business and people treat it like a religion or their lifeblood. It's why some people act so offended when people insult their favorite character, saga, or a concept they liked...it's like an attack onto oneself.

Dragonball isn't even my favorite series or fandom, it's like 4 or 5 for me, but even then, it's serious business.

User avatar
KorgDTR2000
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 210
Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2017 11:39 pm

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by KorgDTR2000 » Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:25 pm

Depends on what axis you're talking about.

I love Dragon Ball (the manga) and view it as an imperfect yet brilliant comic book. I take Toriyama seriously as an artist, and embrace his eccentricities. I care a lot about this story.

At the same time, I am bewildered by how much arguing there is over power levels. And the arguing over characters being treated poorly I view as indicative of some kind of psychosis or break from reality.

User avatar
Kaiza_Toshiyuki
Temporarily Banned
Posts: 262
Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:32 pm
Location: South Carolina

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by Kaiza_Toshiyuki » Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:50 pm

KorgDTR2000 wrote:Depends on what axis you're talking about.

I love Dragon Ball (the manga) and view it as an imperfect yet brilliant comic book. I take Toriyama seriously as an artist, and embrace his eccentricities. I care a lot about this story.

At the same time, I am bewildered by how much arguing there is over power levels. And the arguing over characters being treated poorly I view as indicative of some kind of psychosis or break from reality.
We see things alike. I can get behind a general discussion about the series, but people arguing and threatening people over a cartoon is silly and it baffles me on how these people in the community can get so angry and aggresive over the simplest of things.

User avatar
FortuneSSJ
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5306
Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2013 9:07 pm
Location: Portugal

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by FortuneSSJ » Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:56 pm

It depends how much "seriously" you mean.

For a lot of people, it's our childhood franchise which a lot of us grew up with and invested a lot of our time on it.
There's a lot of passion about it and it's one of those things that should be treasured.

Those 90's days where people would skip class, meet at school bar or hurry back home to watch the new episode, were really something else.
A world without Dragon Ball is just meh.

User avatar
sintzu
Banned
Posts: 13583
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2011 1:41 pm

Re: Why Does everyone Take Dragon Ball So Seriously?

Post by sintzu » Sat Oct 06, 2018 1:57 am

Doctor. wrote:
Kuwabara wrote:So, I believe much of this sentiment comes from fans grappling with something they grew up with possibly not being as stellar as they once thought.
Accusing people of nostalgia is never a good argument to make when trying to discuss why a continuation of a series is received negatively in comparison to the original series for the sole reason that fans can (and have) revisit the original series at any point and form an opinion of it completely independent of their childhood memories.
Fans using the nostalgia argument do so to justify modern DB's bad quality instead of simply just calling it what it is. The reason the original is held up in high regard has nothing to do with nostalgia, it's a good product overall. The reason the most successful manga authors such as Kishimoto, Oda and others point to the original DB as their works' influence is because it's objectively a good product. The reason modern DB is constantly criticized is because it's not that good of a product, simple as that. That's not to say modern DB isn't enjoyable but objectively speaking, compared to the original and other shonen, it's not a good product and it will not be influencing anyone like the original did.
Last edited by sintzu on Sat Oct 06, 2018 2:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
July 9th 2018 will be remembered as the day Broly became canon.

Post Reply