Does the original Dragonball need a reboot?

[MaGyunia]

The quality of the animation and of the choreography of the fights is much, much lower than the average of DBZ, DBZ's Movies, DBSuper.

Err, I respectfully disagree with this. Considering Dragon Ball is much more rooted in hand-to-hand martial arts, it's able to display much better choreography as the combatants fight and dodge each other during combat. Even just the short fight between Krillin and the Orin Temple bully at the 21st Tournament shows much better choreography than the "loop the characters punching and kicking" trick that became a standard fall-back after the Saiyan arc. To say nothing of beam spam or putting the focus on one big ki attack.

Do you honestly want to compare the majority of Dragon Ball's fights (except perhaps Goku vs Tao Pai Pai, Yamcha vs Tenshinhan, both Goku vs Piccolo Daimao fights, Goku vs Tenshinhan in the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai semi-finals and Goku vs Piccolo) with something of the quality and surreality of Goku vs Vegeta, Piccolo vs Freeza, Goku vs Majin Vegeta, SSJ3 Goku vs Kid Buu, among many, many others ? Because these aren't just a barrage of Ki beams or taking almost an entire episode to charge up a hugely powerful Ki attack with just a few punches and kicks, they combine that with also the elements you described (martial arts moves).

[ABED]

The quality of the animation and of the choreography of the fights is much, much lower than the average of DBZ, DBZ's Movies, DBSuper.

Err, I respectfully disagree with this. Considering Dragon Ball is much more rooted in hand-to-hand martial arts, it's able to display much better choreography as the combatants fight and dodge each other during combat. Even just the short fight between Krillin and the Orin Temple bully at the 21st Tournament shows much better choreography than the "loop the characters punching and kicking" trick that became a standard fall-back after the Saiyan arc. To say nothing of beam spam or putting the focus on one big ki attack.

Do you honestly want to compare the majority of Dragon Ball's fights (except perhaps Goku vs Tao Pai Pai, Yamcha vs Tenshinhan, both Goku vs Piccolo Daimao fights, Goku vs Tenshinhan in the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai semi-finals and Goku vs Piccolo) with something of the quality and surreality of Goku vs Vegeta, Piccolo vs Freeza, Goku vs Majin Vegeta, SSJ3 Goku vs Kid Buu, among many, many others ? Because these aren't just a barrage of Ki beams or taking almost an entire episode to charge up a hugely powerful Ki attack with just a few punches and kicks, they combine that with also the elements you described (martial arts moves).

I do. Because there are a number of fights in DB you haven't mentioned and they are fantastic. There are a lot of great fights in Z, but they're just different, not necessarily better or worse.

[KBABZ]

Do you honestly want to compare the majority of Dragon Ball's fights (except perhaps Goku vs Tao Pai Pai, Yamcha vs Tenshinhan, both Goku vs Piccolo Daimao fights, Goku vs Tenshinhan in the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai semi-finals and Goku vs Piccolo) with something of the quality and surreality of Goku vs Vegeta, Piccolo vs Freeza, Goku vs Majin Vegeta, SSJ3 Goku vs Kid Buu, among many, many others ? Because these aren't just a barrage of Ki beams or taking almost an entire episode to charge up a hugely powerful Ki attack with just a few punches and kicks, they combine that with also the elements you described (martial arts moves).

I don't consider this choreography:

Spoiler:

I'm more thinking stuff like this:

Spoiler:

And yes I know that's a Buu era gif in there, it illustrates my point! In the old Dragon Ball days, there was more choreography where you could tell what each unique move was, how a fighter dodged/took them, their mental figuring out of their opponent's attacks, the close spatial awareness, and stuff like that which defines choreography to me. Ki blasts, being ranged attacks, don't get to feature this as much, so the choreography is much less emphasized, and the much faster nature of DBZ era fights (bar the occasional moments like the Goku/Vegeta gif) means that they often come as more of a blur. DBZ also has more focus on the characters "owning" the fight (be it the usual one-upmanship of not showing their full strength, or a curb-stomp battle like Gohan vs Cell), so there's less interplay and more "one character attacks the other for two minutes" (and I'm only talking my experiences with Kai, so I'm not taking any obvious plays for padding here). That's certainly not to say that these fights can't be awesome and engaging and impactful and all the other stuff that makes them great, of course. But there's less choreography in there, is my point.

[ABED]

I understand your point, but even when the flurry of punches and kicks and ki attacks became more frequent, that was not all there was to those battles. They told great stories and more importantly you saw and felt the impact of the blows. It's all still choreography.

[KBABZ]

I understand your point, but even when the flurry of punches and kicks and ki attacks became more frequent, that was not all there was to those battles. They told great stories and more importantly you saw and felt the impact of the blows. It's all still choreography.

I didn't realize story counted as choreography these days... yes you can tell a story with choreography, but that doesn't work the other way around.

[ABED]

I understand your point, but even when the flurry of punches and kicks and ki attacks became more frequent, that was not all there was to those battles. They told great stories and more importantly you saw and felt the impact of the blows. It's all still choreography.

I didn't realize story counted as choreography these days... yes you can tell a story with choreography, but that doesn't work the other way around.

Huh? It's all choreography. You've created an arbitrary distinction. Ki attacks and fast flurry of punches and kicks are choreography. And choreography in this context is story. Choreography literally means "dance writing." You may not like the flurry of punches and kicks, but they are choreography.

[Tavarano]

Using this one as an example is unfair, it appears on the screen for a very brief period of time, around 1 second, it's a well incorporated part of the choreography, not a cheap time waster.

Spoiler:

I could also "cheat" the same way with DB fights.

Spoiler:

[Gligarman]

Absolutely not! It would get toned down to a shell of it's former self with today's standards and practices.