Vic Mignogna

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JazzMazz
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by JazzMazz » Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:06 pm

For reference, slavery still exists. The amount of slaves in the world today is almost as statistically significant as the number of displaced persons(between 20-40 million).

A work fetishising the relationship between an oppressor and an oppressed person to give off some Stockholm syndrome vibes does have an affect of influencing how a viewer may perceive slavery, if only slightly. The media we consume effects our assumptions of the world. A show perpetuating the “good slaver” absurdity shouldn’t be cozied up to when it’s clear the show is presenting slavery, and is a misrepresentation and glossing over of the true horrific nature of slavery. It’s not a sensitive way to handle the topic.

I’m not a particularly articulate poster but that’s generally what people are getting at here.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by miguelnuva1 » Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:27 pm

XanatosVanBadass wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 8:21 pm
miguelnuva1 wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 7:49 pm
Kunzait_83 wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 7:23 pm


I'm gonna say its pretty lateral. Defending the 9/11 hijackers versus defending slavery: those two seem to roughly cancel one another out in terms of which is more brain-meltingly hideous, idiotic, and deranged.


I didn't defend slavery in real.life, I defended the shield hero only as he isn't like slavers from real life.
But you clearly don’t see how depicting a “good slaver” is dangerous? You don’t think normalizing a horrid institution (which this show DOES) is a BAD thing to let incels latch onto? Stop giving the right ANY ammo.
I feel that people should know the difference between an anime and real life. Slavery in an anime the way Naofumi does is completely different from the tragedy that happened in real life. Shield hero's slavery even if every master was like Naofumi could never exist in real life. My only argument is that comparing the shield hero to the slavers from America for example is wrong because despite them both owing slaves the shield hero's slaves are treated leaps and bounds better.

Nafofumi treats his slaves as comrades as opposed to property.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by miguelnuva1 » Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:29 pm

JazzMazz wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:06 pm
For reference, slavery still exists. The amount of slaves in the world today is almost as statistically significant as the number of displaced persons(between 20-40 million).

A work fetishising the relationship between an oppressor and an oppressed person to give off some Stockholm syndrome vibes does have an affect of influencing how a viewer may perceive slavery, if only slightly. The media we consume effects our assumptions of the world. A show perpetuating the “good slaver” absurdity shouldn’t be cozied up to when it’s clear the show is presenting slavery, and is a misrepresentation and glossing over of the true horrific nature of slavery. It’s not a sensitive way to handle the topic.

I’m not a particularly articulate poster but that’s generally what people are getting at here.
No argument here. All I'm saying is Shield hero shows what Naofumi does and what cruel slavers due in the same show. I can watch Shield hero and like that while also watching Roots, Mandingo and 12 years a slave and see the real horror of slavery and know that what Nafomui is doing isn't realistic.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:42 pm

Kunzait_83 wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 7:23 pm
I guarantee you that well under 30% of this forum (and that's a very generous estimate) has ANY fucking clue who ANY of those people are. Here's a quick (and only partial) checklist of just a sample of some of the famous and fairly modern day celebrities and public figures that I've actually, literally, and for real have had to hunker down and personally explain exactly who they are and why they're famous - on a very rudimentary level - to numerous users on here in off-forum convos back in the day at one time or another:

*huge list*
Now I feel bad for not knowing 16 of those names...

On the other hand, you probably don't know who Akiba Rubinstein was.
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:43 pm

miguelnuva1 wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:27 pm
Nafofumi treats his slaves as comrades as opposed to property.
If that were true, they wouldn't be slaves. It's a contradiction. Sorry to go back to the rape analogy, but that's like saying that someone has only consensual sex with their rape victims.
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by miguelnuva1 » Tue Dec 10, 2019 10:02 pm

Polyphase Avatron wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:43 pm
miguelnuva1 wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:27 pm
Nafofumi treats his slaves as comrades as opposed to property.
If that were true, they wouldn't be slaves. It's a contradiction. Sorry to go back to the rape analogy, but that's like saying that someone has only consensual sex with their rape victims.
The entire thing with Shield Hero is that they are only slaves in name only really. He owns them and can force them to do things against their will but he never does and in they choose to fight alongside him and call his master. In the same series we are shown slaves being beaten and treated worse than scum and Naofumi is disgusted by it. From day one it is shown that he cares more about Raphtalia then the average slave owner.

Fiction allows people to change real world things to put them in a better light and it is the viewer's job to know what is wrong and right.If you watched General Hospital Luke and Laura are one of the greatest love stories ever told and it started with Luke raping Laura. In the real world this love story would likely never happen but in the fictional world Laura came to love Luke and Luke was redeemed.

Shield Hero does present Naofumi's slavery in a positive light yes but the reason I don't hate it or hate him is because they also take the time to show the horror side of it as well. They don't just sweep it under the rug and present only his side.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Scsigs » Tue Dec 10, 2019 10:37 pm

SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 8:11 pm
Ok, not following here. What exactly do all these conversations/tangents on slavery and the like have to do with the discussion on Vic's misdeeds and the drama over his backfired court case specifically??? Seriously, i'm just wondering because it seems to happen every so often in this thread with derailing into other things that have nothing at all in relation to the topic at hand.

Just an honest observation, it's really making my head spin. :crazy:
Absolutely nothing. People just went off on tangents.
Only dubs that matter are DB, Kai, & Super. Nothing else.
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Captain Awesome » Tue Dec 10, 2019 10:42 pm

Kunzait_83 wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 7:23 pm

And yes, that kind of sheer ignorance and total lack of intellectual curiosity regarding basic facts and history about the world is most certainly indeed how you end up with some of the astonishingly gutter-level viewpoints and complete absence of critical thinking, social consciousness, or ethical understanding that we see not just in this particular thread, but really all over a great many corners of this community.
This is what troubles me the most - not the ignorance but the abject lack of intellectual curiosity and critical thinking. So many people on this forum view everything through the infantile lens of anime or pop-culture and it shows in their miserable, pointless and embarrassing posts.

I think multiple people in this thread need to take a step back from their fandoms and realise what a horrible stultifying influence their interests are having on who they are.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by JulieYBM » Tue Dec 10, 2019 11:06 pm

I wonder what a lot of people in this thread do for a living? That might explain a lot of the attitudes.
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Tue Dec 10, 2019 11:25 pm

JulieYBM wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 11:06 pm
I wonder what a lot of people in this thread do for a living? That might explain a lot of the attitudes.
I am actually unemployed as of a few months ago... :(
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Saimaroimaru » Tue Dec 10, 2019 11:45 pm

miguelnuva1 wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 7:47 pm
Saimaroimaru wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 7:09 pm
miguelnuva1 wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 5:29 pm


I'm not deying that. I said Naofumi is not a bad person just because his friends are technically his slaves.
He is bad person for keeping them in bondage. They don't have a choice, if they decide they want to move on with him for any reason, the slave crest will induce imaginable amounts of pain. They have no choice but to hitch themselves to Naofumi or suffer grave consequences to their well being.
They are bound to him but it is due to choice at that point in the series. Naofumi gives them the option to leave and the girls choose to stay with him. The slave Crest is a technically.

Cleo technically also started as a pet.
Its called Stockholm Syndrome. It's not a good thing.
miguelnuva1 wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 10:02 pm
Polyphase Avatron wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:43 pm
miguelnuva1 wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:27 pm
Nafofumi treats his slaves as comrades as opposed to property.
If that were true, they wouldn't be slaves. It's a contradiction. Sorry to go back to the rape analogy, but that's like saying that someone has only consensual sex with their rape victims.
The entire thing with Shield Hero is that they are only slaves in name only really. He owns them and can force them to do things against their will but he never does and in they choose to fight alongside him and call his master. In the same series we are shown slaves being beaten and treated worse than scum and Naofumi is disgusted by it. From day one it is shown that he cares more about Raphtalia then the average slave owner.

Fiction allows people to change real world things to put them in a better light and it is the viewer's job to know what is wrong and right.If you watched General Hospital Luke and Laura are one of the greatest love stories ever told and it started with Luke raping Laura. In the real world this love story would likely never happen but in the fictional world Laura came to love Luke and Luke was redeemed.

Shield Hero does present Naofumi's slavery in a positive light yes but the reason I don't hate it or hate him is because they also take the time to show the horror side of it as well. They don't just sweep it under the rug and present only his side.
In name only? The slave crest is a literal magic seal that punishes them if they disobey Naofumi. He has robbed them of their freedom & right to independence. They do in fact glance over slavery, once Raphtalia decides to put her slave crest back on its not mentioned again in any significant way until they decide to use it on another person as a lie detector test, and then goes dormant plot wise(I am up to the Spirit Turtle arc). They are normalizing slavery & then very sly trying to push it as a beneficial tool. That is disgusting.

Also, the way the show presents itself, it makes Naofumi & his party the only competent ones in that dimension with the exception of the Queen who had no issue putting a slave crest on her own daughter when she already had enough evidence to convict her anyway. On top of that same said daughter gets punished by being sent to a king who rapes, mutilates, & kills her.
Last edited by Saimaroimaru on Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by JulieYBM » Tue Dec 10, 2019 11:54 pm

Polyphase Avatron wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 11:25 pm
JulieYBM wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 11:06 pm
I wonder what a lot of people in this thread do for a living? That might explain a lot of the attitudes.
I am actually unemployed as of a few months ago... :(
Bah, me too. Good ol' depression kept me from getting out of bed for a week and I was fired the day I got back to work. :crazy:
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Mr.Saturn99 » Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:04 am

I work retail, but ultimately dream of gaining a position at the library I volunteer at. It rocks!

I'm guilty as charged when it comes to what Kunzait discussed regarding recognizing social consciousness -- not a day goes by when I don't think about 2016's wake-up call on how self-centered I'd been in dismissing politics and the like, namely pointing to my autism/forgetfulness as an excuse that I'd never understand; now, I balance with the struggle of applying critical thinking to everything I consume. As a writer, it's a process that's made me painfully self-aware (often to the point of self-detriment), but in broadening my perspectives and stepping outside my bubble, there's no better place for me than my dream job.
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Fionordequester » Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:11 am

I work with special needs children.
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Scsigs » Wed Dec 11, 2019 2:17 am

Fionordequester wrote:
Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:11 am
I work with special needs children.
I have a friend who works with elderly & disabled people. I personally don't have the patience or want to do anything like that. I barely tolerate normal people enough. I could not work with special needs people, certainly not kids. Hats off to you, good sir, for doing so.
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by KBABZ » Wed Dec 11, 2019 2:40 am

I'm currently a contract walkthorough writer for IGN; I've done guides Spyro Reignited, Astro Bot, CTR: Nitro-Fueled and MediEvil (the first and last ones work with both the originals and the remakes). Before that I was a Junior Animator for Weta Digital; I worked on Alvin 4: The Road Chip, The BFG, a tiny bit on Valerian, War for the Planet of the Apes, and lastly Alita: Battle Angel.

(no I haven't posted in here in ages but who doesn't like talking about themselves and doing things they love?)

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Dr. Casey » Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:00 am

There's a MediEvil remake? I loved those games. MediEvil 2 was brutal, but in a (mostly) fair way that made it really enjoyable.
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by JulieYBM » Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:14 am

JulieYBM wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 11:06 pm
I wonder what a lot of people in this thread do for a living? That might explain a lot of the attitudes.
I spent 4.5 years in retail for tramlaw and it drove me nuts. I only ever enjoyed my female co-workers, whom made me feel at home.
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by goku the krump dancer » Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:28 am

I dont even know where to start lol this thread seems to be all over the place. Granted thats not inherently a bad thing a little bit "drama" for lack of a better word is healthy especially for a place like this, it gives everyone a better idea as to who the hell we've been talking to/ reading posts from over the years. It also provides an opportunity for everyone to learn from each other and hopefully grow as human beings, i mean, its just a forum but you know, a little insight goes a long way trust me, I've had wake up calls for myself while watching freaking talk shows before so you never know.

That said though, I thinks its high time that some us delete Crunchy Roll off our phones/laptops for at least a month, put down the manga, drop the skrillex and 21 Savage (cause rap is the new rock) and pick up some Real Life books (personal Development among others), indulge in a few quality podcasts and start jogging or picking up other habits (outside of gaming).

As silly as it is for me to think that some folks dont know who Dr. Dre or Malcholm X is, its never too late to learn, we all come from different parts of the globe (granted most of us are american born) so its understandable that certain things/figures of history may not be prominent in your culture/public curriculum (Hell some of those names arent mentioned much here in the States either but that's a can of worms all its own).

I'm sure i've made some air headed posts on this forum before and have said some dumb things in the past in general, just own your mistakes, own your ignorance and just be willing to learn more thats with life in general though not just Kanzenshuu. You dont always have to be the smartest guy in the room nor should you want be, because the moment you are, then the room is no longer serving you.. Okay i'm preaching sorry.

Miguelnuva you done fucked up lol, the craziest part about your post is that i have no idea what point you it is you were trying to make with that comparison between anime slavery and real life slavery, especially being black/Moor/Ethiopian yourself. If someone offered you to be their slave but in return they'll feed you and give you a place to stay but you can never see your family again, would you take it? They wont beat you or anything but you have to do as they say. There people who at this very moment are living EXACTLY like that by the way, against their will .You should embarrassed bro but again learn from it.

Even if you wanted to go out on a limb and defend yourself and say owning a pet is a form of slavery, while that might be halfway somewhat true depending on the circumstance. Adopting a cat or dog or fish or rabbit etc, is different from holding a person against there will regardless of how some dumb anime tries to romanticize it ( which is stupid in its own right). When you adopt a person or a pet the idea is to raise it with love and care like you would your own, not hold it against its will, force it to do house work and justifying it by saying "But I feed you everyday". I don't know anything about Shield Hero but just from little I've read on this posts,i ts gonna be hard pass from me.
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by miguelnuva1 » Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:59 am

goku the krump dancer wrote:
Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:28 am


Miguelnuva you done fucked up lol, the craziest part about your post is that i have no idea what point you it is you were trying to make with that comparison between anime slavery and real life slavery, especially being black/Moor/Ethiopian yourself. If someone offered you to be their slave but in return they'll feed you and give you a place to stay but you can never see your family again, would you take it? They wont beat you or anything but you have to do as they say. There people who at this very moment are living EXACTLY like that by the way, against their will .You should embarrassed bro but again learn from it.

Even if you wanted to go out on a limb and defend yourself and say owning a pet is a form of slavery, while that might be halfway somewhat true depending on the circumstance. Adopting a cat or dog or fish or rabbit etc, is different from holding a person against there will regardless of how some dumb anime tries to romanticize it ( which is stupid in its own right). When you adopt a person or a pet the idea is to raise it with love and care like you would your own, not hold it against its will, force it to do house work and justifying it by saying "But I feed you everyday". I don't know anything about Shield Hero but just from little I've read on this posts,i ts gonna be hard pass from me.
I not defending real life slavery is the point. My argument is that I don't consider Naofumi to be as bad a real life slavers was because while his comrades are slaves on paper he treats them better. I brought pets because Philo started as Naofumi's pet before she gained a human form.

I feel like a lot of people glanced over my post saying slavery in fiction is set up different. I'll admit if my post wasn't clear as I was tired last night. I'm strictly talking if we had a line that said slave owners go to hell I wouldn't send Nafomui to hell because his scenario is different.

Raphtlia who is slave 1 was going to die in a week and couldn't defend herself. The Shield Hero bought her taught her how to fight as he needed someone to fight for him and fed her. Something her previous owner didn't do. When she messed up he didn't beat her which her previous owner did. He even buys her a toy when she sees other kids. Her parents are also dead at this point. When she is given the chance to be free from him she returns on her own free will.

Slave 2 who is Philo started as a pet Bird that gained a human form and she also chooses to stay with Nafomui despite being his slave official in the eyes of the government.

My second argument was that despite how Shield Hero uses slavery it doesn't bother me because I've seen real slavery in the form of Roots, Mandingo, 12 years of slave. Shield hero has an arc where Raphtlia has to face the true form of slavery when she returns to her old master to look for a friend she left behind. I can enjoy Shield Hero despite the issue of slavery becasue it's an Anime at the end of the day not real life.

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