Vic Mignogna

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SaiyaSith
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by SaiyaSith » Tue Apr 16, 2019 10:18 am

kemuri07 wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 9:57 am
But again, what do you think you're going to get from Vic's lawyer? Some irrefutable evidence that totally proves ALL OF THE ACCUSATIONS, not just one, BUT ALL OF THEM ARE FAKE? I mean, we're talking about accusations dating back to the early 00s. I literally posted a link (and I'm sure others have done the same here) of the many accusations leveled against Vic. You can just type the dude's name in and you'll probably run into a forum post of someone detailing a very unpleasant experience with the man. And I will keep saying this, but the idea that for some people here it's far more believable to believe that hundreds of people formed together to trap this one innocent, "Christian" Man, than it is to believe that that man could actually be pretty shady is all types of fucked up.

There is no conspiracy. This is Vic on the defense. This is Vic knowing that his livelihood is at stake if he's branded a pariah, especially in a post-#MeToo world. So this is him trying to control the narrative. And if you honestly don't think a lawyer could be shrewd enough to use social media to craft this narrative that Mignogna is "the real victim--" man, must be great to be that naive.
I understand how you feel, but this thread is about the ongoing Vic Mignogna situation. Statements from Vic's lawyer are 100% relevant, especially with the supposed upcoming lawsuit involving multiple public figures and maybe Funimation themselves. If you see any other news please update us, it would be appreciated.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Son Dragon » Tue Apr 16, 2019 10:54 am

SaiyaSith wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:39 am
...
Mooreish wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 5:04 am
...
Ignoring what everyone else is saying a moment I don't think it would hurt vic or his fans to clear up the communication they have around other. Also there are gonna be those situations, so maybe it wouldn't hurt to note what's going on a little more often while also maybe respecting both possibilities a little bit more.

And I mean that in general, maybe as msg for both of you. At the same time I don't think
either of you should blasted for the information. Fair enough? The argument over how funimation let employee go is a real argument, but at same the time you don't want it to sully your senses, when something is going on if it is going on, if you catch my drift.
Last edited by Son Dragon on Tue Apr 16, 2019 11:13 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by gokaiblue » Tue Apr 16, 2019 11:01 am

ssj4 wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:40 pm
Why is this nick guy so involved?
Attention most likely. He jumped onto a situation and tried to ride its coattails
Looking for these rare items/information:

Any information or recordings pertaining to Dragon Ball Z's syndicated run on WAWB
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by ssj4 » Tue Apr 16, 2019 11:27 am

Mooreish, your logic is so stupid. This guy seems nice, so I'm going to ignore years of this stuff going on

Also, there's a pattern because unrelated incidents have been faked. duuuuh

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Son Dragon » Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:52 pm

ssj4 wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 11:27 am
...


No he's fine and bullying him isn't gonna bring him closer to understanding your point. If that's what's people facing. Then they're better off learning data on their own. It's not like the info will change that much.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Shaddy » Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:35 pm

We're not trying to change his mind. He had his chance to look at the facts of the situation and the context surrounding it, and he has repeatedly, proudly refused to do so. He chose to be obstinate, but refuting and critiquing his rhetoric and broken mindset is important to how any outsiders viewing this forum could perceive it, and as a way of learning just how ass-backwards the logic of Vic stans are.

We are under no obligation to be nice to him in the process. If he doesn't like being told that his bad opinions are bad, he can leave, or else stop talking about it. This isn't about Kikuchi versus Faulconer or GT versus Super. We're not here to be friends with these people.
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Son Dragon » Tue Apr 16, 2019 2:32 pm

Shaddy wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:35 pm
...
If that's how it's done I think everyone would end creating the next generation of debaters before they stopped it.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:23 pm

About the whole, "He seems nice, so he must be nice" line of reasoning...

I actually have a degree of sympathy for that.

Here's the thing. As some of you may know, I moved to Los Angeles several years ago to pursue my voice-over career. I'm nobody famous, as my main line of work is commercials, promos, and non-broadcast narration. That said, after years of recording sessions, on-location auditions, parties, networking events, and classes, I have crossed paths with quite a number of big-name voice actors (along with some phenomenally talented newcomers...mark my words, as someone who has seen him work, Tom Bauer, who played Shu in the Bang-Zoom dub of Super, and is an awesome person in general, is going to be an A-list dub actor at some point). When I first arrived in LA, I was star-struck pretty easily. Whenever I first saw a voice actor whose work I was familiar with, it took every ounce of will I had within me not to rush up to them and be like, "OHMYGODDUDEILOVEYOURWOOOOORK!!!!"

...That's no longer the case. The reason that's no longer the case--apart from becoming a more mature person in general (I was in my early 20's when I moved to LA and I'm in my early 30's now)--was that being around lots of big-name voice actors has stripped away the "magic" aspect for me. These voice actors are not just abstract phenomenons to be viewed on YouTube, they're actual people. And actual people, well...have actual problems. Sometimes really bad ones.

That's a long way of saying that some of them really aren't that cool in real life, for different reasons. Sometimes it's because they're jaded, sometimes you find out that the pleasant personality they put on at conventions is just an act so that they'll get invited to more conventions (which means more income via appearance fees), sometimes they're in a foul mood because they've got bad things going on in their life at the moment, and some of them are just plain jerks. So now, whenever I meet a big-name voice actor, that sense of being star-struck is gone. There's an old saying that goes, "Never meet your heroes," and I began to understand the meaning of that phrase the more time went on.

All of this to say...it can be a major, major bummer when the person you've built up in your head doesn't match the person in real life. So I completely and totally understand the idea of not wanting to believe bad things about somebody based on how they've publicly presented themselves, and the feeling of being bummed when you learn that said bad things are, unfortunately, true.

With all that said, I don't mean to sound overly negative. The vast majority of the people I've met really have been great people, and the voice-over community as a whole is a far, far nicer bunch than the on-camera community. I'm just saying that, as someone who has been able to see "behind the curtain," metaphorically speaking, for a number of years now, I learned a while back to save forming impressions of someone for when you get to know who they really are, not just who they present themselves as and what they're publicly known for.

So, if I see a big-name voice actor today--especially if I'm working with them--I'll absolutely still greet them with a sincere and polite smile and handshake along with a quick, "Love your work, man", or something to that effect, but after that, my impression of them is based solely on how they've acted around me and others I know, not their work.

Granted, my learning of this lesson was hastened by actually getting to meet many of these people, but I think it's also a lesson that one learns with time anyway. Anime fandom has no shortage of young fans who haven't learned this yet. So I really think, the more time goes on, the more people will wake up to the idea that just because someone--even a voice actor--presents themselves as one thing, it doesn't necessarily mean that their private persona matches their public one.
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Bryesque » Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:10 pm

SaiyaSith wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:39 am
Bryesque wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:04 am
Besides which... where is the idea of them suing Funimation coming from? I don't know much about Texam employment law, but my understanding is that Texas is an "at-will" state, and that employers can dismiss employees for pretty much any reason. As well, and I don't know any specific VA's situation, but my understanding is voice actors at Funimation are more freelancers than regular "employees", and I'm almost certain they're not in a union.
It sounds like they're going to sue Funimation for what's called "defamation per se" because of their tweets letting Vic go. In the same tweet thread, Funi said something about "not condoning harassment" which appeared to them to be implicating that Vic was guilty of harassment or something like that. They're not going after Rooster Teeth because they didn't make a tweet and were quiet about the whole thing.
It doesn't imply that at all, though - it's very clearly a blanket statement they're making to their fans and followers in the wake of their decision, telling them they don't condone any harassment (keeping in mind there was and is a great deal of harassment toward their current & former voice actors over the issue):

Image

I'm sure Mignogna's lawyer is going to try to (mis)interpret it toward his client's wishes, but the actual wording doesn't make any accusation toward him at all, and that's very clear to any honest read of their statement.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by SaiyaSith » Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:39 am

Bryesque wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:10 pm
SaiyaSith wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:39 am
Bryesque wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:04 am
Besides which... where is the idea of them suing Funimation coming from? I don't know much about Texam employment law, but my understanding is that Texas is an "at-will" state, and that employers can dismiss employees for pretty much any reason. As well, and I don't know any specific VA's situation, but my understanding is voice actors at Funimation are more freelancers than regular "employees", and I'm almost certain they're not in a union.
It sounds like they're going to sue Funimation for what's called "defamation per se" because of their tweets letting Vic go. In the same tweet thread, Funi said something about "not condoning harassment" which appeared to them to be implicating that Vic was guilty of harassment or something like that. They're not going after Rooster Teeth because they didn't make a tweet and were quiet about the whole thing.
It doesn't imply that at all, though - it's very clearly a blanket statement they're making to their fans and followers in the wake of their decision, telling them they don't condone any harassment (keeping in mind there was and is a great deal of harassment toward their current & former voice actors over the issue):

Image

I'm sure Mignogna's lawyer is going to try to (mis)interpret it toward his client's wishes, but the actual wording doesn't make any accusation toward him at all, and that's very clear to any honest read of their statement.
Pardon me if I get anything wrong, I'm only going off of memory:

Their reasoning is that Funimation's first tweet about Vic's termination after their investigation, being attached to the harassment tweet, is implying that Vic is guilty of harassment which caused him to get dropped from cons and future job opportunities. They said that the first tweet alone is grounds alone for "defamation per se" because of the implications of publicly announcing his termination due to an investigation. So the whole investigation is going to be investigated. Not only that, but they're going about "discovery" to see if there was conspiracy between companies and VA's.

It's going to get crazy. :crazy:

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Fionordequester » Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:47 am

SaiyaSith wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:39 am
It's going to get crazy. :crazy:
And why would the company itself have something against Mignogna?
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".

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SaiyaSith
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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by SaiyaSith » Wed Apr 17, 2019 5:00 am

Fionordequester wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:47 am
SaiyaSith wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:39 am
It's going to get crazy. :crazy:
And why would the company itself have something against Mignogna?
I don't know anything bro, I'm just an observer like everyone else. But I think we're going to learn a lot soon.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Fionordequester » Wed Apr 17, 2019 5:05 am

SaiyaSith wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 5:00 am
I don't know anything bro, I'm just an observer like everyone else. But I think we're going to learn a lot soon.
Well I should certainly hope so. Remember, this money isn't coming out of Vic's own pocket. This is all being done with money the FANS gave him!

Just imagine; $200,000 being given, only for the papers to NOT be filed... again... and again... and again... and again :P .
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Bryesque » Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:27 am

SaiyaSith wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:39 am
Bryesque wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:10 pm
SaiyaSith wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:39 am


It sounds like they're going to sue Funimation for what's called "defamation per se" because of their tweets letting Vic go. In the same tweet thread, Funi said something about "not condoning harassment" which appeared to them to be implicating that Vic was guilty of harassment or something like that. They're not going after Rooster Teeth because they didn't make a tweet and were quiet about the whole thing.
It doesn't imply that at all, though - it's very clearly a blanket statement they're making to their fans and followers in the wake of their decision, telling them they don't condone any harassment (keeping in mind there was and is a great deal of harassment toward their current & former voice actors over the issue):

Image

I'm sure Mignogna's lawyer is going to try to (mis)interpret it toward his client's wishes, but the actual wording doesn't make any accusation toward him at all, and that's very clear to any honest read of their statement.
Pardon me if I get anything wrong, I'm only going off of memory:

Their reasoning is that Funimation's first tweet about Vic's termination after their investigation, being attached to the harassment tweet, is implying that Vic is guilty of harassment which caused him to get dropped from cons and future job opportunities. They said that the first tweet alone is grounds alone for "defamation per se" because of the implications of publicly announcing his termination due to an investigation. So the whole investigation is going to be investigated. Not only that, but they're going about "discovery" to see if there was conspiracy between companies and VA's.

It's going to get crazy. :crazy:
If that's what they're going with... uh, okay. I'm not a lawyer and I have no idea how things work in Texas, but that seems like a hell of a stretch that'd be very easy to dispute. The wording very clearly says: "We've done an investigation and made this decision. We want our products to be positive for everybody, so please don't harass or threaten anybody." You'd have to specifically be looking to make a connection between the last sentence and the first tweet, and even then it's a leap, as their wording doesn't suggest it at all.

But even then, there's a bit more context than just Funimation's tweets. Mignogna himself addressed the situation quite a bit before Funimation's statement, and in great detail:

Image

...so it could easily be argued that Funimation was put in a position that they had to publicly address their decision because of the attention Mignogna put on the situation. Mignogna fired up his fanbase over the issue, and that fanbase was already harassing the company and their other talent and employees over it, which isn't something an employer can reasonably just not address. Heck, Mignogna even acknowledged the harassment and threats being sent on his behalf here, days before Funi's statement:

Image

...so, if anything, Funimation's statement seems to be backing up what Mignogna said in that tweet. (And you'll notice his wording there is very similar to Funimation's comment on harassment and threats. Hmm!)

Now, none of us know what Funimation's investigation entailed. It's not my business, frankly - Funimation made a decision they have every right to, and other participants have said they covered their bases, so... I guess we'll all see if that does come out. But I wonder if there's a point Mignogna should ask himself if apologizing, seeking help, and genuinely trying to atone would have been better for his career than going all scorched-earth on his formers employers and colleagues. Because I can't see many other employers who'd want to risk getting into business with the guy after all this.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by SaiyaSith » Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:35 am

Bryesque wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:27 am
Now, none of us know what Funimation's investigation entailed. It's not my business, frankly - Funimation made a decision they have every right to, and other participants have said they covered their bases, so... I guess we'll all see if that does come out.
They claim to already know what the investigation entailed and talked about 1 out of the 3 stories the other night:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJuFJ3cGnUE

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by Bryesque » Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:43 am

SaiyaSith wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:35 am
Bryesque wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:27 am
Now, none of us know what Funimation's investigation entailed. It's not my business, frankly - Funimation made a decision they have every right to, and other participants have said they covered their bases, so... I guess we'll all see if that does come out.
They claim to already know what the investigation entailed and talked about 1 out of the 3 stories the other night:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJuFJ3cGnUE
Yeah, I'm not clicking that. As I've said before, I'm not giving those people a red cent of monetization money, and nobody else should either.

And once again, this as biased as a source of information gets, and shouldn't be presented as necessarily truthful or accurate. If anything, even if they do have actual information, they'd be motivated to misrepresent or cherry-pick from the investigation in order to portray their opponent in a bad light. The only valid source of information is what would come out in court, so watching, believing, and sharing videos like this only helps Mignogna & Co's propaganda campaign.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by SaiyaSith » Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:11 am

Bryesque wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:43 am
SaiyaSith wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:35 am
Bryesque wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:27 am
Now, none of us know what Funimation's investigation entailed. It's not my business, frankly - Funimation made a decision they have every right to, and other participants have said they covered their bases, so... I guess we'll all see if that does come out.
They claim to already know what the investigation entailed and talked about 1 out of the 3 stories the other night:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJuFJ3cGnUE
Yeah, I'm not clicking that. As I've said before, I'm not giving those people a red cent of monetization money, and nobody else should either.

And once again, this as biased as a source of information gets, and shouldn't be presented as necessarily truthful or accurate. If anything, even if they do have actual information, they'd be motivated to misrepresent or cherry-pick from the investigation in order to portray their opponent in a bad light. The only valid source of information is what would come out in court, so watching, believing, and sharing videos like this only helps Mignogna & Co's propaganda campaign.
To each his own. Listening to one side and not the other is biased in my opinion, even if the other side is propaganda.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by kemuri07 » Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:12 am

SaiyaSith wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:39 am
Bryesque wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:10 pm
SaiyaSith wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:39 am


It sounds like they're going to sue Funimation for what's called "defamation per se" because of their tweets letting Vic go. In the same tweet thread, Funi said something about "not condoning harassment" which appeared to them to be implicating that Vic was guilty of harassment or something like that. They're not going after Rooster Teeth because they didn't make a tweet and were quiet about the whole thing.
It doesn't imply that at all, though - it's very clearly a blanket statement they're making to their fans and followers in the wake of their decision, telling them they don't condone any harassment (keeping in mind there was and is a great deal of harassment toward their current & former voice actors over the issue):

Image

I'm sure Mignogna's lawyer is going to try to (mis)interpret it toward his client's wishes, but the actual wording doesn't make any accusation toward him at all, and that's very clear to any honest read of their statement.
Pardon me if I get anything wrong, I'm only going off of memory:

Their reasoning is that Funimation's first tweet about Vic's termination after their investigation, being attached to the harassment tweet, is implying that Vic is guilty of harassment which caused him to get dropped from cons and future job opportunities. They said that the first tweet alone is grounds alone for "defamation per se" because of the implications of publicly announcing his termination due to an investigation. So the whole investigation is going to be investigated. Not only that, but they're going about "discovery" to see if there was conspiracy between companies and VA's.

It's going to get crazy. :crazy:
Dude. You keep saying that you're just an observer but, come on. Seriously?

The only "conspiracy" is a relatively simple one: Funimation realizes that it can no longer harbor someone like Vic without being dragged through social media. So they threw him under the bus. And the whole defamation thing doesn't make fucking sense because this information has been widely available "for years." Again, it was common knowledge that Vic Mignogna was a problematic presence for years.

But if the goal of the investigation is to "reveal" a conspiracy (you know, other than wanting a shitty person shitcanned), then I don't believe for a second that Vic and his lawyers truly believe they have a case. That's not what this is about. It's about controlling a narrative. And the more you push this narrative that Vic is innocent--the more it becomes true. It's a tactic more commonly used than you think.

This is the point that many of us are getting across: Stay away from the youtubers because their "interest" in discovering a conspiracy is directly tied with wanting that youtube money. If you truly want to stay neutral--then stay neutral.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by kemuri07 » Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:17 am

SaiyaSith wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:11 am
Bryesque wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:43 am
SaiyaSith wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:35 am

They claim to already know what the investigation entailed and talked about 1 out of the 3 stories the other night:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJuFJ3cGnUE
Yeah, I'm not clicking that. As I've said before, I'm not giving those people a red cent of monetization money, and nobody else should either.

And once again, this as biased as a source of information gets, and shouldn't be presented as necessarily truthful or accurate. If anything, even if they do have actual information, they'd be motivated to misrepresent or cherry-pick from the investigation in order to portray their opponent in a bad light. The only valid source of information is what would come out in court, so watching, believing, and sharing videos like this only helps Mignogna & Co's propaganda campaign.
To each his own. Listening to one side and not the other is biased in my opinion, even if the other side is propaganda.
But if you know it's propaganda, then you know that it's mostly bullshit. And if it's mostly bullshit, then what is the fucking point. Yes, there are always multiple sides to understand--but that only works if both sides are actually arguing in good faith. You're doing that thing that moorish (or whatever the fuck his name is) is doing is trying to make your decision to engage in conspiracy theories as some sort of self-less act. It isn't.

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Re: Vic Mignogna

Post by SaiyaSith » Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:34 am

kemuri07 wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:12 am
Dude. You keep saying that you're just an observer but, come on. Seriously?

The only "conspiracy" is a relatively simple one: Funimation realizes that it can no longer harbor someone like Vic without being dragged through social media. So they threw him under the bus. And the whole defamation thing doesn't make fucking sense because this information has been widely available "for years." Again, it was common knowledge that Vic Mignogna was a problematic presence for years.

But if the goal of the investigation is to "reveal" a conspiracy (you know, other than wanting a shitty person shitcanned), then I don't believe for a second that Vic and his lawyers truly believe they have a case. That's not what this is about. It's about controlling a narrative. And the more you push this narrative that Vic is innocent--the more it becomes true. It's a tactic more commonly used than you think.

This is the point that many of us are getting across: Stay away from the youtubers because their "interest" in discovering a conspiracy is directly tied with wanting that youtube money. If you truly want to stay neutral--then stay neutral.
I don't understand how posting Vic's lawyer's legal strategy is such an issue. If you want to stay in the dark because you're afraid you're weak to propaganda, just ignore it. If you want to know what's happening but don't want youtubers to monetize your clicks, just use adblock like everyone else. I would post updates on Monica and the other parties but they've recently been silent about the whole thing. If you get any updates surrounding this ordeal please post them, I won't complain because I'm interested.
kemuri07 wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:17 am
But if you know it's propaganda, then you know that it's mostly bullshit. And if it's mostly bullshit, then what is the fucking point. Yes, there are always multiple sides to understand--but that only works if both sides are actually arguing in good faith. You're doing that thing that moorish (or whatever the fuck his name is) is doing is trying to make your decision to engage in conspiracy theories as some sort of self-less act. It isn't.
Each side is making their case and I'm not going to ignore them because they're going to be biased towards themselves. The courts won't either. I, like many others, like being in-the-know.

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