What Bardock do you prefer?

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What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by Goe » Thu Jan 31, 2019 1:30 pm

I’m not talking about canon or non-canon, only about our personal preferences. Do you prefer the 1990 Bardock or the DBMinus/DBSB Bardock? Why?

I prefer the old Bardock. Reasons:

DBSB has an inconsistency with the original manga. In the manga, Freezer remembers Bardock as "the saiyan who resisted until the end when I destroyed the planet Vegeta". In DBSB, Freezer does not seem to know that Bardock is trying to stop his death ball.

Besides, DBSB Bardock does not have the bandana on his forehead dyed with the blood of his fallen friends, which gave the character an epic touch and a special charisma. And they have changed him from a ruthless and cold guy to a loving father. The Bardock of 1990 was a very remarkable character for being so evil and at the same time showing affection for his comrades and having such a heroic death. He was the only character with these characteristics in the Dragon Ball universe and that made him very interesting. And the scene of his death fighting alone against Freezer’s soldiers and with his final speech in front of Feeezer, about changing the fate...was reallly epic and touching. Dulcifying his personality and reducing his death to throw rays of energy shouting "haaaaa" have greatly worsened one of the best characters and one of the most epic moments we could see in Dragon Ball.

That’s all. I hope I read your preferences

VOTES:

Old Bardock (17): Goe, dbzfan94, AnimeMaakuo, Lord Beerus, kokonoe, Darkseid, sunsetshimmer, saiyangod117, 8000saiyan, SuperSaiyaManZ94, Kunzait_83, doctor, Potara-Warrior96, ShadowBardock89, ABED, MajinMan, Rubens

New Bardock (10): TKA, Marlowe89, Bruma-rabu, DHM211, Son Dragon, Baggie_Saiyan, SSJGogeto, CJStricker_CBR, JohnnyCashKami, Hulk10

Likes both equally (2): saiyanhajime, robo4900

Total votes: 29
Last edited by Goe on Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:07 pm, edited 15 times in total.

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by Dbzfan94 » Thu Jan 31, 2019 1:34 pm

Old Bardock. I can’t stand Minus or its movie adaptation

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Thu Jan 31, 2019 1:40 pm

Dbzfan94 wrote:Old Bardock. I can’t stand Minus or its movie adaptation
It seems that his character has been Nerfed to the point where he's almost a joke now, i mean Minus completely 180'd him into someone far removed from the Bardock of the 1990 special who was a ruthless warrior like any other Saiyan only to be cursed by premonition powers that tells him of his race's impending doom. The old interpretation of him in the manga and special really felt more believable in the scope of what was known about the Saiyan culture at that point in the story, and made for an interesting anti hero tale about him trying (and failing) to preserve his people although by the end we see that he's hopelessly outmatched by Freeza and dies with only the fleeting thought that his supposed scum son by his own words will someday avenge him and the entire Saiyan race at large.

Minus on the other hand completely blew that out of the water, and we now have a shell of this formerly unique character.

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by KBABZ » Thu Jan 31, 2019 2:00 pm

I've never seen the original special, but from watching the S-Broly film I found the updated version of the character to have a bit more depth than I suspect the original had, and he still had that one shot referencing the original special as well so he still went down fighting to the end.

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Thu Jan 31, 2019 2:03 pm

KBABZ wrote:I've never seen the original special, but from watching the S-Broly film I found the updated version of the character to have a bit more depth than I suspect the original had, and he still had that one shot referencing the original special as well so he still went down fighting to the end.
Yeah, that certainly sounds better than what they did to him with DB Minus though i haven't actually watched the new movie to see for myself.

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by KBABZ » Thu Jan 31, 2019 2:28 pm

SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
KBABZ wrote:I've never seen the original special, but from watching the S-Broly film I found the updated version of the character to have a bit more depth than I suspect the original had, and he still had that one shot referencing the original special as well so he still went down fighting to the end.
Yeah, that certainly sounds better than what they did to him with DB Minus though i haven't actually watched the new movie to see for myself.
Again I'm not at all familiar with Classic Bardock. But what I saw in S-Broly didn't contradict majorly with the opening of DBZ Kai (with the obvious exception of the nature of Goku's departure from Planet Vegeta), although that's mainly due to the inclusion of the three shots. We get a shot of Broly fighting soldiers in space on his own, then firing a Kamehameha-type blast at Frieza's death ball to no avail, and then we get a recreation of "Bardock flies into the orange void and dies" shot from the original special. So there's still room for his "I'm not dying just sitting around" characterization, but still fits in the side that Gine points out is "unusual for a male Saiyan to care about their offspring".

On a side-note, I actually appreciated that we saw Goku in his growth pod as well, as it puts a bit more emphasis on how young he is compared to DB- that I think emphasized the "Goku in the pod in armour" part too much. Now it feels more like Gine and Bardock put Goku in that armour to protect him. Bardock also tells Goku to be strong and do his best to survive. Maybe I'm a sap but I was tearing up at the scene where he and Gine send Goku away. I also really liked seeing a bit more of just ordinary Saiyan day-to-day, and how the slums contrast to life in King Vegeta III's palace.

Anyways, while S-Broly does tell the DB- version of the story, it leaves a couple of threads that at least leaves a spot open for what we saw of Bardock in the opening of Kai. But I'll also say that I think what we saw in the Super Saiyan Bardock special sounds like fanfic trash and I just ignore it.

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by AnimeMaakuo » Thu Jan 31, 2019 2:35 pm

I prefer the 1990 bardock because of the acting, story, animation, music and sound effects. The new stuff is garbage.
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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Thu Jan 31, 2019 2:42 pm

KBABZ wrote:
SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:
KBABZ wrote:I've never seen the original special, but from watching the S-Broly film I found the updated version of the character to have a bit more depth than I suspect the original had, and he still had that one shot referencing the original special as well so he still went down fighting to the end.
Yeah, that certainly sounds better than what they did to him with DB Minus though i haven't actually watched the new movie to see for myself.
Again I'm not at all familiar with Classic Bardock. But what I saw in S-Broly didn't contradict majorly with the opening of DBZ Kai (with the obvious exception of the nature of Goku's departure from Planet Vegeta), although that's mainly due to the inclusion of the three shots. We get a shot of Broly fighting soldiers in space on his own, then firing a Kamehameha-type blast at Frieza's death ball to no avail, and then we get a recreation of "Bardock flies into the orange void and dies" shot from the original special. So there's still room for his "I'm not dying just sitting around" characterization, but still fits in the side that Gine points out is "unusual for a male Saiyan to care about their offspring".

On a side-note, I actually appreciated that we saw Goku in his growth pod as well, as it puts a bit more emphasis on how young he is compared to DB- that I think emphasized the "Goku in the pod in armour" part too much. Now it feels more like Gine and Bardock put Goku in that armour to protect him. Bardock also tells Goku to be strong and do his best to survive. Maybe I'm a sap but I was tearing up at the scene where he and Gine send Goku away. I also really liked seeing a bit more of just ordinary Saiyan day-to-day, and how the slums contrast to life in King Vegeta III's palace.

Anyways, while S-Broly does tell the DB- version of the story, it leaves a couple of threads that at least leaves a spot open for what we saw of Bardock in the opening of Kai. But I'll also say that I think what we saw in the Super Saiyan Bardock special sounds like fanfic trash and I just ignore it.
It sounds like what they have in the new movie sort of pieces together elements from both the original 1990 special and Minus, while yes Episode of Bardock did feel like someone's fan fiction pipe dream that i honestly feel was too far fetched to even sound remotely plausible. That's especially the case when he became a Super Saiyan out of nowhere to fight Freeza's supposed relative/descendant in the whatever the hell alternate past dimension was that he ended up in after getting sent back by Freeza's energy ball.

Geez Louise, they really went on a weird tangent with that one. :crazy:

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by Luso Saiyan » Thu Jan 31, 2019 3:03 pm

Goe wrote:DBSB has an inconsistency with the original manga. In the manga, Freezer remembers Bardock as "the saiyan who resisted until the end when I destroyed the planet Vegeta". In DBSB, Freezer does not seem to know that Bardock is trying to stop his death ball.
It's incredible the amount of people who bring this up when there's nothing to back it up. The fact is that Bardock did resist until the end when Freeza destroyed planet Vegeta. Also a fact is that Freeza did see him since Bardock was the only Saiyan up there when he came out of his ship and fired against the planet. Freeza never claimed to know Bardock. Freeza never claimed to have talked to Bardock. Freeza never claimed Bardock talked to him either. The movie has time gaps so we haven't seen everything that might have happened either.

There's no inconsistency.

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by Grimlock » Thu Jan 31, 2019 3:07 pm

You have not provided a source to back it up "the fact that Freeza saw Bardock" (not a fact as it didn't happen in the movie) either. So you can't really blame others for not doing something you haven't done yourself.
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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by Kokonoe » Thu Jan 31, 2019 3:15 pm

I prefer the Father of Goku Bardock because it's fleshed out and the style of the movie went outside of Dragon Ball's norms in a refreshing way.

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by Luso Saiyan » Thu Jan 31, 2019 3:46 pm

Grimlock wrote:You have not provided a source to back it up "the fact that Freeza saw Bardock" (not a fact as it didn't happen in the movie) either. So you can't really blame others for not doing something you haven't done yourself.
The source to my claim is the movie. It shows Bardock up there facing Freeza. It shows Bardock is in his line of sight when he comes out of his ship. It shows Freeza firing towards him and the planet.

To say that Freeza didn't see him is what there's no evidence of (and where the burden lies). But the claim continues to be made again and again.

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by Lord Beerus » Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:12 pm


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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by KBABZ » Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:20 pm

SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote:It sounds like what they have in the new movie sort of pieces together elements from both the original 1990 special and Minus, while yes Episode of Bardock did feel like someone's fan fiction pipe dream that i honestly feel was too far fetched to even sound remotely plausible. That's especially the case when he became a Super Saiyan out of nowhere to fight Freeza's supposed relative/descendant in the whatever the hell alternate past dimension was that he ended up in after getting sent back by Freeza's energy ball.

Geez Louise, they really went on a weird tangent with that one. :crazy:
It's a unique idea and concept, but it was executed horribly. Bardock is given the flimsiest emotional connection in the history of Dragon Ball that is then used to motivate the Super Saiyan transformation, so none of it works!
Grimlock wrote:You have not provided a source to back it up "the fact that Freeza saw Bardock" (not a fact as it didn't happen in the movie) either. So you can't really blame others for not doing something you haven't done yourself.
IMO Frieza would be aware that he exists because Bardock makes a point to call Frieza out and make a big speech on how he'll change everything shortly before Frieza blows up the planet.

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by Gligarman » Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:22 pm

I prefer non-psychic Bardock.

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by KBABZ » Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:23 pm

Gligarman wrote:I prefer non-psychic Bardock.
He's gone from Psychic type to Fairy type! (haha, couldn't resist, even if I disagree with my own joke)

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by Gligarman » Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:30 pm

KBABZ wrote:
Gligarman wrote:I prefer non-psychic Bardock.
He's gone from Psychic type to Fairy type! (haha, couldn't resist, even if I disagree with my own joke)
I 100% approve of this joke.

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:32 pm

KBABZ wrote:
Gligarman wrote:I prefer non-psychic Bardock.
He's gone from Psychic type to Fairy type! (haha, couldn't resist, even if I disagree with my own joke)
LOL, clever Pokemon reference there. :lol:

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by saiyanhajime » Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:38 pm

I'd personally like a mix of both. I don't like the idea of Goku having been sent off by his parents, I like the idea of them having not had a choice. It feels just a bit too cliche for them to have chosen to send him off and managed to get away with it. They can care - they can mourn even, that's fine. I just want it to have been a "this is the way it is and always has been since we can remember, at least we've still got Raditz tho, well, kinda..." Like, combine the awkward social structure with a more caring parenting and you actually have something REALLY interesting. Gine mentions Bardock is unusual, but we never see anything in the Broly movie to suggest he actually he unusual. Same when Paragus says a trustworthy saiyan doesn't exist... These are like, references to OLD saiyan stereotypes that aren't actually portrayed here at all? It's weird.

As for him overall - I prefer his original visual design - as in his banana and the Armour colour scheme. I wish we'd got to see him in action in the new movie, seen his crew for more than a cameo-second. I think his personality is just more fleshed out but essentially the same - it's just we see him in very different contexts. I miss the mental turmoil as he wrestled with premonitions, too. That's not to say I like psychic Bardock better - I just really dig characters in mental turmoil because I'm awful. I like the affect it had on him, not necessarily the actual premonitions.

So yeah, can I has both plz?

EDIT: I've edited this post like twice to add content and to fix typos, but I'm leaving banana in.
Last edited by saiyanhajime on Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:53 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: What Bardock do you prefer?

Post by KBABZ » Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:50 pm

saiyanhajime wrote:I'd personally like a mix of both. I don't like the idea of Goku having been sent off by his parents, I like the idea of them having not had a choice. It feels just a bit too cliche for me to have chosen to send him off and managed to get away with it. They can care - they can mourn even, that's fine. I just want it to have been a "this is the way it is and always has been since we can remember, at least we've still got raditz tho, kinda..."
I think sending him off like that is also a way to patch up a plot-hole, which is that if Goku was sent off as part of business as usual just before Frieza destroyed planet Vegeta, if he was so scared of the Saiyan myth, why didn't he personally track down all the infant pods that were sent out with baby Saiyans that could grow up and overthrow him? The revised version at least has more believable circumstances for Goku being missed by Frieza in that he was sent off in complete secrecy.

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