Zephyr wrote:Yes, all in contexts which are utterly sexless. Children have genitals. Children will be nude sometimes. Did you know that children are actually born nude, with their genitals exposed and everything, around at least one grown adult?
I don't know if you're missing the point on purpose. Yes, I know that children are born nude and are around adults nude. What is this meant to disprove? I agree that kid Goku's penis is harmless; I also think Roshi's antics are harmless. Roshi's antics are sexual in nature but they are completely isolated from the negative repercussions that sexual harassment has; obviously you would argue this is a bad thing, because that 'normalizes' sexual harassment as this harmless gag, allowing for an environment where rapists and harassers feel they have more freedom to act on their urges. And much in the same way, showing Goku naked so frequently (which, in spite of your one example where this is the case, does not happen in the real world; children are always clothed in public) 'normalizes' naked children in public, allowing for an environment that entices child predators to act on their urges.
Does that sound ridiculous? Good, because it is. Both cases are. Dragon Ball is not responsible for the social repercussions you think
it has. And that's the entire point: your argument is based on your perception alone, which is why my analogy stands, because if we're arguing perception, then everything is equally valid.
Zephyr wrote:Don't worry, I'm perfectly aware that you're making a blatantly false analogy in bad faith. I don't think you owning up to it really helps sell it or make your posting of it a remotely worthwhile or thoughtful contribution, though. Moreover, I'm not sure why you keep popping into these threads to make arguments that seem to utterly miss the point, only to insist that you "don't actually care". Are you just here to troll?
I didn't say I didn't care. I said I didn't care about Roshi's antics. If it makes you feel better, I don't find them particularly funny, and the series would probably be better off without them on those grounds, not because they're offensive. I do, however, care about art, an artist's freedom and the way art is perceived. The idea that a work of art should be morally responsible for what people take away from it (outside of obvious exceptions, such as Mein Kampf and other such political works), that
I care about.
Now saying I argue in bad faith and am here to troll, that seems like an attempt to lash out at your opponent because he disagrees with certain stances that seem dogmatic in this forum. I'll go out on a whim and say it's because some of you older millennials are feeling displaced now that the young generation seems to be embracing more traditional and conservative values, and I can't say I don't empathize, but being bitter and hostile won't help you.
Zephyr wrote:These jokes, however, occur, in a children's show, in a country that does a historically very bad job of acknowledging sexual assault as a bad thing in the first place (which isn't throwing shade or anything; not like the US is much better).
And much in the same way, Goku's penis is flaunted in a children's show, in a country and industry that does a historically very bad job of dealing with its child pornography and child molestation problem.
Zephyr wrote:How is that communicated? None of the actual reasons why sexual assault is bad factor into any of the scenes where Kame Sennin is performing it. It's presented as funny and harmless, because nobody shows any signs of having experienced any long term trauma. That's tone deaf. And in a kid's thing, in Japan, that's just one more small thing contributing to a large problem.
This just seems like a result of your obtuse way of thinking that inaction equals action. The fact is that it's communicated that sexual harassment is bad, that's it, Dragon Ball isn't endorsing sexual assault because it fails to show the trauma. The series already
speaks out against it via the fact Roshi is punished at all; the fact that he's punished so lightly has more to do with Dragon Ball's own comedic and light-hearted nature than any real, social commentary, lest you think Goku normalizes child abandonment (actually this should be even worse because the series doesn't even comment on how child abandonment is a bad thing, like it does with sexual harassment) and Piccolo child abuse and Stockholm syndrome (which are treated as a stepping stone in Gohan and Piccolo's arcs and serve as the fuel that keeps their relationship going to this day). Dragon Ball is not a morally correct series, and Roshi's antics are not any more real or personal than all of the other countless dubious shit the series has.
What you're saying is "Saying sexual harassment is bad isn't good enough, you have to show
the traumas of sexual assault and scar them for life" which is far more tone deaf than anything Dragon Ball has ever done.