Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

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eledoremassis02
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Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by eledoremassis02 » Sat Feb 23, 2019 10:05 am

I know its probably not the case but, I'm going thru Dragon Ball again and at Muscle tower, Major Metallitron scans Goku and he comes up as Alien Image

Not sure why he would unless he's just not in the database and is "alien" to the Red Ribbon army. However, it says "Inability to Naturalize Alien" as it cant even determine if he's human or some known alien.
Looking back, is there any other hints that pre-date the arrival of Raddtiz?

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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by MasenkoHA » Sat Feb 23, 2019 10:13 am

Wasn’t the anime version of the Red Ribbon Army arc well before the Raditz arc in the manga? It’s doubtful Toei guessed something Toriyama hadn’t pulled out of his ass yet.

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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by eledoremassis02 » Sat Feb 23, 2019 10:24 am

MasenkoHA wrote:Wasn’t the anime version of the Red Ribbon Army arc well before the Raditz arc in the manga? It’s doubtful Toei guessed something Toriyama hadn’t pulled out of his ass yet.
It aired back in 86 so most definitely. I don't think it's anything to go by, nor do I really think there is anything there pre-Ma Jr. but in hindsight moments like this are kind of interesting

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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Sat Feb 23, 2019 10:31 am

Given that it was about another two years before they officially revealed his origins as a Saiyan in the manga, and three years total in the anime maybe this scene in the RR arc was just some throwaway moment that nobody thought about at the time.

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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by KBABZ » Sat Feb 23, 2019 11:29 am

It could be that this is a reference to Oolong's comment in the 13th episode of Dragon Ball, where after sorting out the Oozaru situation at Pilaf's castle, Oolong speculates that Goku might be an alien.

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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by OutlawTorn » Sat Feb 23, 2019 7:01 pm

In what context was the word used? "Alien" could simply be used as a synonym for "intruder" in this case as, not being a member of the Red Ribbon Army, he is an alien to one of their installations. An American, for example, is an "alien" in Japan and vice versa.

It's obvious from the start, though, that Goku cannot be considered human given he not only has a tail but also transforms into a giant ape at the glimpse of a full moon. But he is close enough to human that he is genetically compatible with humans in order to have children. But that's putting way too much thought into it, as I don't think Akira Toriyama really ever cared about the strict science and biology of characters in a manga.

There are also all of the anthropomorphized animals within the Dragon Ball world. So, if I had to hazard a guess, I imagine "alien" was used to identify Goku as an intruder in this case.

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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Sat Feb 23, 2019 11:08 pm

I once heard that it was a reference to the Alien movie franchise, somehow (which Toriyama also referenced with Freeza's third form).
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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by KBABZ » Sat Feb 23, 2019 11:26 pm

Polyphase Avatron wrote:I once heard that it was a reference to the Alien movie franchise, somehow (which Toriyama also referenced with Freeza's third form).
As well as the Pirate Robot from soon after the Muscle Tower mini-arc:

Image

And the robot soldier from Dragon Boy:

Image

And Alien was directly referenced in the fourteenth chapter of Dr. Slump! The Pirate Robot for me is interesting because, as far as I'm aware, it's one of the earliest instances of Toriyama using line segmentations as a design flourish, which would become famous in the designs for Saiyan armour as well as for Frieza. In fact, the Pirate Robot's chests looks a LOT like the back of Saiyan armour!

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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by ruler9871 » Sun Feb 24, 2019 2:42 pm

Well, Toriyama did say in an interview that he was originally gonna reveal Goku & Piccolo's alien origins in the King Piccolo arc.
zarmack wrote:The whole "Dragonball is only supposed to be light and funny" mentality that exist in a lot of the fandom is in many ways even dumber than the "edgeload" side of the fandom. You know, the contrarians who think DB should be a Slice-of-Life series, the folks who worship Pre-Raditz Dragonball uncritically, the folks who downplay and often flat-out deny that Dragonball is an action series, the folks who try to push that false argument that none of the serious moments in the series were mean't to be taken seriously, etc.

Dragonball doesn't have a single tone. It has both silly and serious moments, both humor and drama, just like real life. The idea that a work of fiction should be only all-comedy or all-serious is unnatural and frankly, retarded.

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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by WhowhoYouwho » Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:05 pm

I have to go with OutlawTorn on this and say they probably mean "alien" in terms of being an "outsider" or a "rouge element" of some sort. I can see people using the knowledge we have now and then retroactively assuming that this is a nod to a far later event, but I take it as being similar to how in a New Hope Uncle Owen mentions Luke "being like his father" and people retroactively using that as a comment about Luke being like his father Darth Vader. It's something that flows into place easily and can add something interesting to fans who notice these details, but they weren't designed to be what the people looking back see them as. Thus, Goku being seen as an "alien" in this situation is much like how Darth Vader wasn't originally going to be Luke's father until various behind the scenes stuff occurred in the creation of Empire, but nonetheless makes them both a bit of interesting serendipity given what came later. Plus, we all know Toriyama's more of a "write on the fly" kinda guy, and I assume didn't think about Goku being an alien that early in the story.

Ps. I know MistareFusion used that comparison as well, but it's a good one so imma steal it.

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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by KBABZ » Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:24 pm

It's definitely a reference to Alien, guys:

Image
Image

It was most likely thrown in there because, to most kids watching the show, the English text would just appear as gibberish to them.

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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by Michsi » Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:32 pm

ruler9871 wrote:Well, Toriyama did say in an interview that he was originally gonna reveal Goku & Piccolo's alien origins in the King Piccolo arc.

Really? Can't remember that. All I remember is him stating that he decided to make Piccolo an alien around the time he came up with Kami, which is about right at the end of the Piccolo arc. I don't remember Toriyama mentioning when he decided he'd make Goku an alien too.

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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by ABED » Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:33 pm

Holy shit that's a great catch. My guess is that given when this was produced, the animators thought it was a fun reference that wouldn't be seen again given that the show wouldn't be released on home video to be paused and analyzed.
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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by KBABZ » Sun Feb 24, 2019 8:46 pm

ABED wrote:Holy shit that's a great catch. My guess is that given when this was produced, the animators thought it was a fun reference that wouldn't be seen again given that the show wouldn't be released on home video to be paused and analyzed.
Makes sense too, considering that from Muscle Tower's perspective, Goku is playing the part of the alien!

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Re: Goku's alien origin revealed sooner?

Post by The Tori-bot » Mon Feb 25, 2019 11:22 am

ruler9871 wrote:Well, Toriyama did say in an interview that he was originally gonna reveal Goku & Piccolo's alien origins in the King Piccolo arc.
Did he, aye?
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