Green Tint and the Japanese Blu-ray of Super Broly

[Scavenger]

The Japanese Blu-ray has no green tint. Screencaps and stats

The Dutch Blu-ray has the green tint, wrong gamma level and a dreadful amount of banding and compression artifacts.

As a note, I tried viewing those screenshots, and I got a pop-up, a big ad splash image, AND my anti-virus blocked a web attack. DO NOT view any of those images.

I always use an adblocker, so I never get a pop up on imgbox, but thanks for telling. I'll reupload them to Postimage.org.

[Scavenger]

The Japanese Blu-ray has no green tint. Screencaps and stats

The Dutch Blu-ray has the green tint, wrong gamma level and a dreadful amount of banding and compression artifacts.

As a note, I tried viewing those screenshots, and I got a pop-up, a big ad splash image, AND my anti-virus blocked a web attack. DO NOT view any of those images.

Re-hosted on postimage:

JP BD screenshots (credits: Footlong Shoe): https://postimg.cc/gallery/1ivebjlkm/
US BD screenshots (credits: Footlong Shoe): https://postimg.cc/gallery/1ewzhjqpi/
Dutch BD screenshots: https://postimg.cc/gallery/qs7zhbw6/
UK BD screenshots: https://postimg.cc/gallery/25pntu4ja/

[Robo4900]

An encoding nerd who's a friend of mine says that the MangaUK BD has problems with the encoding; banding, macroblocking, etc.

Problem is, the Japanese BD has the exact same issues, in the exact same places, with the exact same banding/macroblocking patterns.

So, it looks like Toei prepared two video masters for Broly; one is afflicted with an awful tint and runs at the wrong framerate, and one is afflicted by banding/macroblocking.
Funi's release of the tinted version is also afflicted by some bad encoding, and the Dutch BD seems to have screwed up even harder.

... What a mess.

In any case, best buying option is the MangaUK BD, it seems.

Though realistically, you're probably best off just buying whatever release is local to you, as they're all pretty flawed in one way or another, and both region coding and import costs will probably screw you over if you're going with a foreign release.

[Scavenger]

Sometimes the banding is baked into the master during the rendering stage. The only way to fix it is to re-render the whole movie with better dithering, or to carefully deband the master shot-by-shot. Looking at the Funi/Manga/Toei screenshots, I think much of the banding is baked into the master.

As far as I know, Dynit (Italy) is the only anime distributor that tries to fix color banding issues. A recent example is their Fate/stay night: Heaven's Feel I. presage flower Blu-ray for which about a 100 cuts were improved.

[Forte224]

Speaking of green tint, I am from the US and got my imported Manga UK Broli Blu-ray today. Obviously it does not have the green tint, but I can also sadly confirm that it won't play on Region A Blu-ray players like a PS4 (even a disc says it's Region B, sometimes it will still play on Region A). That said, using MakeMKV and my PC's Blu-ray drive still worked, so I have it lossless now, and man does the movie shockingly better now.

Manga UK

FUNimation

An encoding nerd who's a friend of mine says that the MangaUK BD has problems with the encoding; banding, macroblocking, etc.

Problem is, the Japanese BD has the exact same issues, in the exact same places, with the exact same banding/macroblocking patterns.

So, it looks like Toei prepared two video masters for Broly; one is afflicted with an awful tint and runs at the wrong framerate, and one is afflicted by banding/macroblocking.
Funi's release of the tinted version is also afflicted by some bad encoding, and the Dutch BD seems to have screwed up even harder.

... What a mess.

In any case, best buying option is the MangaUK BD, it seems.

Though realistically, you're probably best off just buying whatever release is local to you, as they're all pretty flawed in one way or another, and both region coding and import costs will probably screw you over if you're going with a foreign release.

Lol, I was just noticing the macroblocking when I read this post. I thought something went wrong with MakeMKV or something. Such a drag. But, I'll take the beautiful colors over the green tint. It's a shame this release has been handled so poorly.

[Scavenger]

An insider chimed in on the matter:

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.ph ... 40&page=21

I’ve seen the source files from which the DCP’s were created. Toei’s colorists graded it for cinema (DCIP3).
Funimation and Periscoop used the cinema grade for their Bluray releases. I’ve heard from Periscoop that they wanted to stick as close as possible to the cinematic release… to please the fans. Apparently the fans on this forum feel differently about this.
Why Toei used a more neutral grading for the Japanese and UK release, I don’t know.
It has more magenta in it, personally I like the yellow/green cinematic version better.
In my opinion it’s just a matter of taste.
The Dutch BD was mastered in Scenarist. I think the JP and UK BD’s where created with the same software. The graded master has compression artifacts. I think JP and UK BD’s where created with an ungraded neutral tif/dpx sequence of the entire feature directly from the animation studio.
Grading tends to exaggerate artifacts from the source.
In terms of audio, the Japanese track is full range uncompressed, just as a you want to hear it in the theatres, while the English dub has compression, to stick to the TV audio loudness standards. This was the decision of the dubbing studio.
As a fan, I’m not sure why most of you guys don’t stick to the OV? It was meant to be that way by it’s creators. Dubbing is just a marketing tool to release a film for a wider audience.

FOX is the company that distributes the masters to the local distributors. They send an identical master to Funimation and Persicoop (green tint with visible compression artifacts).
This was also the master for the international DCP, this was shown in theaters all over the world.
Toei did some remastering/grading after the worldwide theatrical release and send this out via FOX. This was too late for the US and NL BD release, but still in time for the UK, JP and AUS BD release.
Every release from now on should be based on the new master.

It is worth noting that the DCI-P3 white point is D63 versus the D65 used in Rec.709. Pure white in D63 has a greenish tint. In the cinema environment it's not very noticeable because your eyes filter out the green.

[Jord]

Speaking of green tint, I am from the US and got my imported Manga UK Broli Blu-ray today. Obviously it does not have the green tint, but I can also sadly confirm that it won't play on Region A Blu-ray players like a PS4 (even a disc says it's Region B, sometimes it will still play on Region A). That said, using MakeMKV and my PC's Blu-ray drive still worked, so I have it lossless now, and man does the movie shockingly better now.

Manga UK

FUNimation

An encoding nerd who's a friend of mine says that the MangaUK BD has problems with the encoding; banding, macroblocking, etc.

Problem is, the Japanese BD has the exact same issues, in the exact same places, with the exact same banding/macroblocking patterns.

So, it looks like Toei prepared two video masters for Broly; one is afflicted with an awful tint and runs at the wrong framerate, and one is afflicted by banding/macroblocking.
Funi's release of the tinted version is also afflicted by some bad encoding, and the Dutch BD seems to have screwed up even harder.

... What a mess.

In any case, best buying option is the MangaUK BD, it seems.

Though realistically, you're probably best off just buying whatever release is local to you, as they're all pretty flawed in one way or another, and both region coding and import costs will probably screw you over if you're going with a foreign release.

Lol, I was just noticing the macroblocking when I read this post. I thought something went wrong with MakeMKV or something. Such a drag. But, I'll take the beautiful colors over the green tint. It's a shame this release has been handled so poorly.

Wow, the Funi release is such a big flop. The difference is immense.
Not only is the green tint annoying, the subtitles are also a lot harder to read due to the small borders around the letters. That wouldn't be so bad for scenes with dark backgrounds but considering a lot of the movie takes place in an arctic environment it's kind of a big problem.

[Scavenger]

Wow, the Funi release is such a big flop. The difference is immense.
Not only is the green tint annoying, the subtitles are also a lot harder to read due to the small borders around the letters. That wouldn't be so bad for scenes with dark backgrounds but considering a lot of the movie takes place in an arctic environment it's kind of a big problem.

I don't think those are the subtitles from the BD because Funimation uses a different font for their Blu-ray releases most of the time.

EDIT: Here's how the subs actually look like

[Jord]

Wow, the Funi release is such a big flop. The difference is immense.
Not only is the green tint annoying, the subtitles are also a lot harder to read due to the small borders around the letters. That wouldn't be so bad for scenes with dark backgrounds but considering a lot of the movie takes place in an arctic environment it's kind of a big problem.

I don't think those are the subtitles from the BD because Funimation uses a different font for their Blu-ray releases most of the time.

EDIT: Here's how the subs actually look like

Could be mistaken but the subs on the Dutch BD had the exact same subtitles problem so I figured this could have been the same on the Funi BD.

[PhoenixEX]

Wow I don't know much about video encoding or what-not but the FUNi version looks like complete trash. I wanted to buy it on iTunes but I guess I'll be importing my copy of Super: Broly.

[omegacwa]

Maybe I'm insane, but I watched the movie on blu-ray on my PS4 on a 4K TV and it did not look like that screenshot. I'll have to watch it again but I don't recall it being blurry, green, and having difficult to read subtitles.

[Forte224]

Wow, the Funi release is such a big flop. The difference is immense.
Not only is the green tint annoying, the subtitles are also a lot harder to read due to the small borders around the letters. That wouldn't be so bad for scenes with dark backgrounds but considering a lot of the movie takes place in an arctic environment it's kind of a big problem.

I don't think those are the subtitles from the BD because Funimation uses a different font for their Blu-ray releases most of the time.

EDIT: Here's how the subs actually look like

Spoiler:

I posted the wrong screenshot. The one I posted is from their FUNimationNOW streaming service. But the green tint is there on the Blu-ray too:

FUNi Blu-ray

FUNimationNOW

Manga UK

Maybe I'm insane, but I watched the movie on blu-ray on my PS4 on a 4K TV and it did not look like that screenshot. I'll have to watch it again but I don't recall it being blurry, green, and having difficult to read subtitles.

I felt the same way. It seems it is not AS bad on TVs depending on how your settings are. But on my PC monitor the green tint is incredibly obvious. And once I watched the FUNi one on my TV and then the Manga UK one, the difference became obvious once again.

[professorwho]

So, I just watched the Japanese Blu-ray of Dragon Ball Super: Broly from Toei Video that I bought at a mall in Kyoto on my trip to Japan, and compared to the Dutch and FUNimation BDs, it is a revelation. Now, I had seen the FUNi BD when I rented it to show a friend at his place. His setup is tiny, with a TV that was 30” or less, so most of the banding wasn’t as visible as I thought.

However, having just seen the Toei BD on a 4K 55” TV, it is an insane upgrade. Obviously, the green tint is gone, and the film’s gorgeous colour pallet is restored, but the lessened banding and macroblocking from all other BDs renders this the definitive release. The video has a maxed out technical bitrate* at 35.06 mbps, and while there are few, if any spikes above 45 mbps, there are no outright bitstarved moments. Despite having an LPCM 5.1 mix at full 24-bit, the video bitrate did not suffer due to being placed on a BD-50. (For reference, Toei’s BDs for Battle of Gods and Resurrection F used BD-25s and still had LPCM 5.1 24-bit audio for some reason. In that case, both films are under 90 minutes so they fit fine on a BD-25, but with an LPCM mix, it eats up space that a DTS-HD MA or Dolby TrueHD track could've saved to make the video even better.)

There is still more banding than I'd like, however, if I had to guess, this is a source issue and not due to bad compression, as all the Blu-rays have the same banding at the same places. Unless, say, mp3dom were to de-band it manually ala Fate/Heaven's Feel, it's a thing you'll have to accept. In motion, they aren't easy to spot, so that's a plus, but yes, they are there.

*I say "technical average" as it generally hovers in the 37-38 mbps region, but because the credits, which aren't as visually demanding as the rest of the film, were encoded at a lower bitrate, it drops the "technical" average down, even though it's mostly 37ish mbps most of the time.

However, I’d say the biggest upgrade is the audio. Now, the FUNi BD rendered the Japanese audio in Dolby TrueHD 5.1 at 16-bit, and while there were no major issues with it in terms of clarity, it was rather soft and required a major increase in volume to hear the audio at an acceptable level. However, Toei surpasses FUNi and Manga UK with a mighty impressive LPCM 5.1 mix at full 24-bit. It is, out of my collection, the loudest and most aggressive audio mix on any BD I own. If you set your TV or sound system to your normal settings, you may find it deafeningly loud, so it’s the opposite of Disney’s current UHD audio issues.

The closest anime to compare it to in regards to its sound mix is JoJo's Bizarre Adventure. In that case, starting with Stardust Crusaders, there was a DTS-HD MA 2.1 mix created in addition to an LPCM stereo downmix. It's a shame we never got the 2.1 mixes in Viz's BDs, but they are loud as is. In fact, while JoJo certainly has more bass due to the prominent use of the subwoofer, DBS: Broly is even louder. If you want an insanely loud track, get Toei's BD.

In addition, due to the change in codec- using superior LPCM and at full 24-bit, there is more clarity to the audio. What was soft and partially muffled is now crystal clear hiding nothing. The music is very easy to hear unlike the mixing of the English dub, and the sound effects are not overpowering the track either. Dialogue is clear.

In addition, there are Japanese SDH subtitles, and they have furigana on ALL the kanji! It’s very useful for me to have furigana on all the kanji, so I am grateful Toei did that. For me, it’s just as useful as English subtitles, with me knowing Japanese.

Overall, Toei's BD of DBS: Broly is the definitive release of the film, with the best video and audio of any release. Obviously, no English subs or dub are included, but at this point there's several people who have synced up subtitles to it, so there's that. If you want the best AV quality, this is the one to get, however, the UK BD isn't far behind in terms of video, and I hope their DTS-HD MA 5.1 Japanese mix is equally as aggressive as Toei's.

[HakkaiBills93]

An encoding nerd who's a friend of mine says that the MangaUK BD has problems with the encoding; banding, macroblocking, etc.

Problem is, the Japanese BD has the exact same issues, in the exact same places, with the exact same banding/macroblocking patterns.

So, it looks like Toei prepared two video masters for Broly; one is afflicted with an awful tint and runs at the wrong framerate, and one is afflicted by banding/macroblocking.
Funi's release of the tinted version is also afflicted by some bad encoding, and the Dutch BD seems to have screwed up even harder.

... What a mess.

In any case, best buying option is the MangaUK BD, it seems.

Though realistically, you're probably best off just buying whatever release is local to you, as they're all pretty flawed in one way or another, and both region coding and import costs will probably screw you over if you're going with a foreign release.

you can add the french release to the list of affected footage by the banding / macroblocking

https://imgur.com/a/7LeqmHq
source
https://twitter.com/AnimeHauteDef/statu ... 6515852288

[PhoenixEX]

God just looking at the one with the green tint is nauseating. I sure hope people don't support that downgrade by purchasing the Bluray.

[KBABZ]

Thought I'd bump this thread to confirm that my AU/NZ Blu-Ray copy of Super Broly does NOT have the green tint! Hooray!

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

Thought I'd bump this thread to confirm that my AU/NZ Blu-Ray copy of Super Broly does NOT have the green tint! Hooray!

If I recall correctly Madman received the same masters as Manga UK, so theoretically their Blu-Rays should be identical.

[KBABZ]

Thought I'd bump this thread to confirm that my AU/NZ Blu-Ray copy of Super Broly does NOT have the green tint! Hooray!

If I recall correctly Madman received the same masters as Manga UK, so theoretically their Blu-Rays should be identical.

Certainly looks that way.