Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

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Cursed Lemon
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by Cursed Lemon » Sat May 25, 2019 4:58 pm

ABED wrote:
Sat May 25, 2019 4:11 pm
Neither movie had a great fight scene.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by ABED » Sat May 25, 2019 5:16 pm

I wish this meme culture would die a swift but painful death. No, I didn't like the fight. It was alright, but nothing great. I just don't feel any of it. I don't feel the impact of the blows, the exhaustion from the intensity and brutality of the battle. The fight against Broly was nowhere near as intense as the fights against Piccolo or Raditz or Vegeta or even Reacoom.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by Cursed Lemon » Sat May 25, 2019 5:24 pm

"Super Broly didn't have any memorable fight scenes" is a stupefyingly absurd statement that deserves only a meme in response. It's as close to objectively wrong as is virtually possible in the realm of opinion, and is making me nope-the-fuck-out of this conversation.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by ABED » Sat May 25, 2019 5:55 pm

Cursed Lemon wrote:
Sat May 25, 2019 5:24 pm
"Super Broly didn't have any memorable fight scenes" is a stupefyingly absurd statement that deserves only a meme in response. It's as close to objectively wrong as is virtually possible in the realm of opinion, and is making me nope-the-fuck-out of this conversation.
Really? Not liking a fight from the movie is close to objectively wrong? Tell me what is so great about the fight and don't say the damn animation because that doesn't make up for the bland characters and thin story. I didn't even say the fight was bad, just that I don't remember much of it beyond Broly getting mad a lot and a cool sequence where Goku goes from SSG to SSB. I don't remember the beats of the battle. All I recall is asking what the logic is behind Broly being stronger than Super Saiyan Gods. It's okay but nowhere near great.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by Lord Beerus » Sat May 25, 2019 8:08 pm

Battle Of Gods is the far superior movie narratively speaking. It has a better antagonist, explores Goku and Vegeta's characterization in very wholesome and progressive manner, the introduction and premise of Super Saiyan God is fantastic and the film opens the door to more information of the Dragon Ball cosmos. It's also really, really funny. I guess the only major issue with the film I have is how bloated the film feels in the first act. The plot grinds to a halt when Beerus arrives on Earth and it only really starts again when Goku arrives on Earth. In between those two points or the story, there is a lot of fluff.

DBS Broly production values are stunning in every area, the character dynamics with the supporting cast are more interesting, and it manages to successfully reboot a character with a more layered and nuanced approach. It's just such a shame that Dragon Ball Minus portion of the story is poorly tacked on and the final 30 minutes is a seemingly endless fight scene, where how much mileage you gain from it will vary from how you're invested in Broly and/or Goku and Vegeta.

When comparing the two films, in regards to which is the superior total package, Dragon Ball Super Broly wins... barely. Honestly though, in terms of my favourite Dragon Ball films, DBS Broly and BOG are pretty much interchangeable with the first and second placing on my list.

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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Sat May 25, 2019 8:48 pm

My opinions on the two are as further apart as it can be!

BoG is simply awful. Worse offender than Evolution that isn't hyperbole because everyone expected that to be crap. BoG- Shitty production values, action scenes that barely last a few minutes and terrible introduction to SSG, Beerus and Whis and a whooooole bunch of padding.

DBS retelling gave us an infinitely better intro to Beerus becase we actually saw him God of Destruction-ing before he goes to Kaio therefore we as the audience know exactly what Beerus is about without the constant need of reiteration through dialogue the movie gives us.

The whole film is about getting to the SSG and when we finally do it barely has a few minutes screen time.

Broly knows exactly that the story isn't about Goku/Vegeta so we waste little to no time with them and most of the movie is done through to perspective of the titular character, best of all no shitty gaggy humour!

Broly is the best thing come out this franchise in my opinion.

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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by sintzu » Sat May 25, 2019 8:50 pm

I think the main issue with Broly is that although its fighting looks amazing, they give you too much of it at one time. Goku, Vegeta, & Gogeta each get a good length fight with broly but there's nothing to break them up. In BOG, there was a gap between Ssj3 Goku's fight with Beerus and his fight with the Z fighters. After that there was another gap between that and the fight with SsjG. Finally, during the fight between SsjG and Beerus, there was a small break that had them both talking. I think Broly lacks this balance which hurts the movie a bit. On the flip side, little to nothing happens during the first half of Broly's movie so had things been more mixed up I think it would've resulted in an overall better movie.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by ABED » Sat May 25, 2019 9:17 pm

Sintzu makes a good point about the battle against Broly being one relatively undifferentiated mass. I fail to see this multilayered and nuanced approach to the character. The abusive father angle comes off as a short cut to depth instead of actual depth.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by 90sDBZ » Sun May 26, 2019 10:09 am

I might be biased here because I got to see Broly on the bigscreen, and it's still new, but I do prefer it at least a bit.

For me the stuff with Pilaf and co. brought BoG down slightly, as it inteferred with the main plot and felt out of place. I always liked them in DB and even GT, but they hurt the pacing in BoG, and were much funnier as adults. I loved Goku vs Beerus and the pride speech in the middle of it.

DBS Broly was the best kind of fanservice. They cherrypicked a bunch of popular elements and combined it into an overall awesome viewing experience. I did find it a bit slow in the middle, although Bardock's segment felt rushed. Apart from that it was great fun once the fighting started, and seeing Gogeta return and fight Broly pleased my inner fanboy. And I loved the song Blizzard and the Broly vs Gogeta theme with the chanting.

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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by MasenkoHA » Sun May 26, 2019 10:47 am

Cursed Lemon wrote:
Sat May 25, 2019 5:24 pm
"Super Broly didn't have any memorable fight scenes" is a stupefyingly absurd statement that deserves only a meme in response. It's as close to objectively wrong as is virtually possible in the realm of opinion, and is making me nope-the-fuck-out of this conversation.
Objectively nothing. The fights in Super Broly were not that good. Abed is right we’ve seen much much better choreographed fights in the tv series. Heck we’ve had better fights in a lot of the other movies.

Of course it’s all subjective but I for one am not a fan of fight scenes where I can hardly tell what the hell is going on. The pew pew pew pew boom boom flash doesn’t do it for me.

Baggie_Saiyan wrote:
Sat May 25, 2019 8:48 pm
, best of all no shitty gaggy humour!

.
Dragon Ball is built on gaggy humor.
Last edited by MasenkoHA on Sun May 26, 2019 11:06 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by Grimlock » Sun May 26, 2019 11:03 am

Overall: Dragon Ball Z: Battle of Gods.

I enjoyed it throughoutly. They didn't put a lot of emphasis on fights, they didn't rush anything just to get to the fights. The pacing is alright. Cool interactions and dialogues. And hell... They introduced the Multiverse concept in it!

Dragon Ball Super Broly had the potential and all the right tools to be the best movie ever, but they preferred to take the wrong path instead. They put emphasis on what shouldn't get emphasized, they rushed what shouldn't be rushed, all in favor to a mindless, unnecessary and gigantic fight scene. It's the complete opposite of what makes something being good, what made Movie 14 good. Only this time, Dragon Ball Super Broly had just a little bit of story in the first 25 minutes and for that moment, it felt interesting and promising (which speaks a lot considering the previous movie... urgh! :sick:).

Movie 14 did what should be a common thing by now: develop, make characters to interact (give special attention to ones that wouldn't normally interact), introduce something interesting (and that can be explored later if not right away), and if it needs to have a fight, do it, but doesn't make it take half of the movie.
Last edited by Grimlock on Sun May 26, 2019 11:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by ABED » Sun May 26, 2019 11:12 am

Between the two films, there's a lot to like and they encompass a lot of what I love about DB - cool animation, silliness, weird but endearing characters, and cool fights. Just so it's clear, I don't hate the fight in Broly, I simply don't think it's that memorable, but I do remember enjoying it, just not loving it. On one end, Battle of Gods is very humor driven, and Broly is more earnest and action driven.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by Cursed Lemon » Sun May 26, 2019 10:40 pm

MasenkoHA wrote:
Sun May 26, 2019 10:47 am
Objectively nothing. The fights in Super Broly were not that good. Abed is right we’ve seen much much better choreographed fights in the tv series. Heck we’ve had better fights in a lot of the other movies.
...Like what

If you found none of the fights in Super Broly "memorable" then you just plain aren't watching DB for the fighting, which is weird.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by ABED » Mon May 27, 2019 6:39 am

Can't speak for MasenkoHA, but the fights are a draw of DB and I don't recall much of the Broly battle beyond the transformations and Broly screaming a lot. I guess a lot of that can be chalked up to not enough feeling unique or informed by character.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by Cursed Lemon » Mon May 27, 2019 7:55 am

Really.

So when Broly tried to let go of Vegeta's hands but couldn't, you didn't think that was a badass assertion of dominance by the prince of all saiyans?

When Vegeta gave Broly that hilariously composed backhand punch to the schnozz, you didn't laugh and think that was awesome?

When Broly crushed Goku's ball of energy and proceeded to Hulk-Loki-Smash him, you didn't think that was cool?

When Broly tanked the Stardust Breaker, you didn't find that the least bit intriguing?

When Gogeta and Broly literally punched through a dimension, you didn't think that was hype as balls?

You guys are either lying or out of your minds.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by Grimlock » Mon May 27, 2019 9:07 am

I mean, I don't think you can say someone is out of their minds when you just said watching Dragon Ball for any other reason other than fighting is "weird".

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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by Cursed Lemon » Mon May 27, 2019 9:17 am

I said watching DB despite the fighting would be weird. It would be like watching a slice of life show while balking at situational comedy.

But this is me searching for a rationalization to combat what seems to me to be a deliberately contrarian and purist narrative in the face of how much the "filthy casuals" absolutely loved Super Broly.

"It didn't have the SOUL of Dragon Ball."

What. Ever.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by ABED » Mon May 27, 2019 10:23 am

Cursed Lemon wrote:
Mon May 27, 2019 7:55 am
Really.

So when Broly tried to let go of Vegeta's hands but couldn't, you didn't think that was a badass assertion of dominance by the prince of all saiyans?

When Vegeta gave Broly that hilariously composed backhand punch to the schnozz, you didn't laugh and think that was awesome?

When Broly crushed Goku's ball of energy and proceeded to Hulk-Loki-Smash him, you didn't think that was cool?

When Broly tanked the Stardust Breaker, you didn't find that the least bit intriguing?

When Gogeta and Broly literally punched through a dimension, you didn't think that was hype as balls?

You guys are either lying or out of your minds.
No because I don't remember any of that. I don't find tanking a blast the least bit interesting. I don't care about Broly so I have no compelling reason to watch it again and recall the individual moments. I'm sure I thought it looked cool when watching it, but I can't remember it. It is not as you claim us being contrarian. Why the hell would we want to not enjoy it and recall it? I recall a lot of the film except the battle. Seeing as how I just got done defending entertainment aimed at mass audiences, taking such a view would be hypocritical.

Many of DB's battles have longer combined running times than the fight against Broly, but I can recall the overall shape and great moments in the battles I enjoy, even the longer ones.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by Cursed Lemon » Mon May 27, 2019 10:48 am

ABED wrote:
Mon May 27, 2019 10:23 am
I don't care about Broly
Okay that's called bias and explains just about everything.
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Re: Battle of Gods vs Super: Broly

Post by mfwlegend3 » Mon May 27, 2019 11:27 am

ABED it seems to me that you don’t remember those scenes because you choose not to remember them due to your bias against Broly as a whole.

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