Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

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HakkaiBills93
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Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by HakkaiBills93 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 6:22 am

Here is something interesting pointed by andiandi from somewhere else (and far more interesting dragon ball related things than all speculations about lot of things like vic mignogna or all the "what if" things related)
it's seems that the dragon box audios is a kind of "redub" on some part and that the original broadcast have differrent lines

for example in the z 269 here is the Vegito original sentence
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dq7Pxv ... 8_d1D/view

and here what you can hear in all regular japanese version from later
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1FYXL6p ... nnFut/view

so japanese dub suffer from some kind of "redub" too on some part, maybe there is other things but it's a things that show why it's important to preserve the original broadcast audios as for the audio quality but also for all original lines

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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by Ringworm128 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 7:46 am

If this is indeed real and not a hoax, then that brings up the question of when exactly the second audio was recorded.

As for why it was recorded, my best guess is that maybe they lost literally every single source of that clip and had to redub it. Why they changed the dialogue is beyond me.
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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by HakkaiBills93 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:11 am

Ringworm128 wrote:
Sat Jul 06, 2019 7:46 am
If this is indeed real and not a hoax, then that brings up the question of when exactly the second audio was recorded.

As for why it was recorded, my best guess is that maybe they lost literally every single source of that clip and had to redub it. Why they changed the dialogue is beyond me.
it can be an error in the dub or something they wanted to change, in french dub you have the same things where each "berdock" became "baddack" (they also did change in the sentence but it was the main reason as it affect z movie 5 and 8 only in those two part)

but it's interesting as i allways heard that Master audio was thrown away after the original run but it surely didn't have been done immediately

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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by Robo4900 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 9:55 pm

One thing I wonder is whether the broadcast version is the redub, but that was only pressed to the master tape at a very late stage in production, leaving the optical track stuck being the original, incorrect, pre-redub line.

... I'm curious, anyone know what exactly the two different lines mean? They sound pretty different, so I'm kinda curious. If possible, it'd be nice to have some of the surrounding dialogue too.
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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by HakkaiBills93 » Sun Jul 07, 2019 6:08 am

Robo4900 wrote:
Sat Jul 06, 2019 9:55 pm
One thing I wonder is whether the broadcast version is the redub, but that was only pressed to the master tape at a very late stage in production, leaving the optical track stuck being the original, incorrect, pre-redub line.

... I'm curious, anyone know what exactly the two different lines mean? They sound pretty different, so I'm kinda curious. If possible, it'd be nice to have some of the surrounding dialogue too.
kei said (without translating) that it's probably cause the BA original dub lines could be an offense to amputees

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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by crabshank1 » Sun Jul 07, 2019 8:10 am

I make it:
Itsu made sonna mittomonai kakoishiteiru tsumori da!

Only part I can't work out is "kakoishiteiru", or it could be "ka koishiteiru".

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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by Vegard Aune » Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:37 am

crabshank1 wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 8:10 am
I make it:
Itsu made sonna mittomonai kakoishiteiru tsumori da!

Only part I can't work out is "kakoishiteiru", or it could be "ka koishiteiru".
"itsu made sonna mittomonai kakko o shiteiru tsumori da! hayaku saisei shiro!"
Translated extremely literally, it's "How long are you planning to stay in that pitiful state? Hurry and regenerate!"

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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by crabshank1 » Mon Jul 08, 2019 9:29 am

Vegard Aune wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:37 am
crabshank1 wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 8:10 am
I make it:
Itsu made sonna mittomonai kakoishiteiru tsumori da!

Only part I can't work out is "kakoishiteiru", or it could be "ka koishiteiru".
"itsu made sonna mittomonai kakko o shiteiru tsumori da! hayaku saisei shiro!"
Translated extremely literally, it's "How long are you planning to stay in that pitiful state? Hurry and regenerate!"
Thanks for the transcription, it makes way more sense now.

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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by Robo4900 » Mon Jul 08, 2019 2:58 pm

Vegard Aune wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:37 am
crabshank1 wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 8:10 am
I make it:
Itsu made sonna mittomonai kakoishiteiru tsumori da!

Only part I can't work out is "kakoishiteiru", or it could be "ka koishiteiru".
"itsu made sonna mittomonai kakko o shiteiru tsumori da! hayaku saisei shiro!"
Translated extremely literally, it's "How long are you planning to stay in that pitiful state? Hurry and regenerate!"
Thanks.

And, anyone have the Simmons translation line to hand too?
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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by OmegaRockman » Mon Jul 08, 2019 3:49 pm

Robo4900 wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 2:58 pm
Vegard Aune wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:37 am
crabshank1 wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 8:10 am
I make it:
Itsu made sonna mittomonai kakoishiteiru tsumori da!

Only part I can't work out is "kakoishiteiru", or it could be "ka koishiteiru".
"itsu made sonna mittomonai kakko o shiteiru tsumori da! hayaku saisei shiro!"
Translated extremely literally, it's "How long are you planning to stay in that pitiful state? Hurry and regenerate!"
Thanks.

And, anyone have the Simmons translation line to hand too?
Z
"The Grand Kaioshin-sama was right. The power of these Potara is incredible!"

Kai
"The Grand Kaioshin-sama was right. The force of these potara earrings is awesome!"

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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by HakkaiBills93 » Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:12 pm

Robo4900 wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 2:58 pm
Vegard Aune wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:37 am
crabshank1 wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 8:10 am
I make it:
Itsu made sonna mittomonai kakoishiteiru tsumori da!

Only part I can't work out is "kakoishiteiru", or it could be "ka koishiteiru".
"itsu made sonna mittomonai kakko o shiteiru tsumori da! hayaku saisei shiro!"
Translated extremely literally, it's "How long are you planning to stay in that pitiful state? Hurry and regenerate!"
Thanks.

And, anyone have the Simmons translation line to hand too?
as ALL releases except the BA have the redubbed line, it's the reddubed subs , impossible that it can be the BA one, also , after some check it's the only alteration line in the BA at least for Z

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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by Robo4900 » Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:30 pm

HakkaiBills93 wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:12 pm
as ALL releases except the BA have the redubbed line, it's the reddubed sub
Yes, I know.
I was just curious to compare what the optical line was in comparison to the literal translation of the broadcast line.

But note that we don't know which line was the "redub".
It's possible the line was originally what we hear on the optical, but was redubbed to the master tape at the last minute, and then when the master tape was thrown out, the change was lost.
This would make some sense, since Funi's film is release prints, and Toei's film is the negatives, so any changes made after the initial broadcasts would probably not be present on those film sources. It would be really weird if they were.

Just speculation on my part, of course, but worth considering; we don't actually know which way around this is.
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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by HakkaiBills93 » Mon Jul 08, 2019 5:45 pm

Robo4900 wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:30 pm
HakkaiBills93 wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:12 pm
as ALL releases except the BA have the redubbed line, it's the reddubed sub
Yes, I know.
I was just curious to compare what the optical line was in comparison to the literal translation of the broadcast line.

But note that we don't know which line was the "redub".
It's possible the line was originally what we hear on the optical, but was redubbed to the master tape at the last minute, and then when the master tape was thrown out, the change was lost.
This would make some sense, since Funi's film is release prints, and Toei's film is the negatives, so any changes made after the initial broadcasts would probably not be present on those film sources. It would be really weird if they were.

Just speculation on my part, of course, but worth considering; we don't actually know which way around this is.
In the final chapter, it use the almost the same as dbox one so the dbox is the redub
anyway the original sentence could be an offense to the amputees so it take more sense that Toei remove this line to the regular one talking about dai kaioshin potaras

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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by Robo4900 » Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:34 pm

HakkaiBills93 wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 5:45 pm
In the final chapter, it use the almost the same as dbox one so the dbox is the redub
Hard to say either way in that regard; it's likely that, either way, any record of the broadcast line is either gone from Toei's archives, or at least beyond the scope of the base-level quick glance Toei likely embarked on when looking to make Kai.

However, if they went back to the original production scripts for the show when doing Kai, it would likely not count last-minute redubs added after the initial broadcast. So... Hard to say.
HakkaiBills93 wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 5:45 pm
anyway the original sentence could be an offense to the amputees so it take more sense that Toei remove this line to the regular one talking about dai kaioshin potaras
IDK. I don't particuarly take issue with either line, I'm just interested about the behind the scenes details on it.
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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by crabshank1 » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:02 am

Robo4900 wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 2:58 pm
Vegard Aune wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:37 am
crabshank1 wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 8:10 am
I make it:
Itsu made sonna mittomonai kakoishiteiru tsumori da!

Only part I can't work out is "kakoishiteiru", or it could be "ka koishiteiru".
"itsu made sonna mittomonai kakko o shiteiru tsumori da! hayaku saisei shiro!"
Translated extremely literally, it's "How long are you planning to stay in that pitiful state? Hurry and regenerate!"
Thanks.

And, anyone have the Simmons translation line to hand too?
I've read that mittomonai meant originally some thing you didn't want to see and is used when something is very impolite, so I'd make it indecent/disgraceful/shameful.

I agree with the rest.

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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by HakkaiBills93 » Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:47 am

Robo4900 wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:34 pm
HakkaiBills93 wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 5:45 pm
In the final chapter, it use the almost the same as dbox one so the dbox is the redub
Hard to say either way in that regard; it's likely that, either way, any record of the broadcast line is either gone from Toei's archives, or at least beyond the scope of the base-level quick glance Toei likely embarked on when looking to make Kai.

However, if they went back to the original production scripts for the show when doing Kai, it would likely not count last-minute redubs added after the initial broadcast. So... Hard to say.
HakkaiBills93 wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 5:45 pm
anyway the original sentence could be an offense to the amputees so it take more sense that Toei remove this line to the regular one talking about dai kaioshin potaras
IDK. I don't particuarly take issue with either line, I'm just interested about the behind the scenes details on it.
what i said about the amputees is from kei so i think that's serious informations
https://twitter.com/nappasan/status/1147510595253501952

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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by Valerius Dover » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:29 pm

Interestingly enough, the English Z dub's line here suggests it was translated from the original broadcast version. The Kai dub obviously goes with the second version.
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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by Mosaic » Fri Jul 12, 2019 10:18 am

It was most likely changed shortly after the episode aired.

A similar incident happened with Dororon Enma-kun episode 24, back in 1974. The episode title used the term きちがい (kichigai), which is discriminatory against people with mental illnesses. Reruns, and the home video release changed it to くるった (kurutta) .

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Re: Dragon Ball Dragon Box have redubbed part

Post by MadSpecialist » Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:16 am

Great find, also agree it was probably changed shortly after airing as it ended up as (optical) audio on the Dragon Box. This, if anything, exemplifies the importance of archiving (and of course, sharing). Looking forward to more discoveries like this.

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