What specifically was wrong with Vic Mignogna’s take on Broly?

[Cursed Lemon]

Seriously. If he wasn't in FMA, no one would know who he is.

[MetaMoss]

Stop watching nothing but exclusively children's cartoons.

He says in a forum dedicated to exclusively discussing a children's cartoon.

I really wonder how much of this "people only consuming kids' media" thing you're seeing is actually going on here, vs. the fact that this forum is dedicated to discussions that exclusively revolve around Dragon Ball, and that makes for a skewed impression on the media diet of the folks on here. It's not exactly easy to bring up the other pieces of media you're into on this forum if they don't make sense to mention in the context of Dragon Ball. Unless a work was an influence on Dragon Ball (such as wuxia, as you've comprehensively demonstrated) or influenced by Dragon Ball (such as basically every shonen action series made post-1990), why would it be brought up except in a contrived circumstance? I can't really see many natural instances on here where I, for example, have a chance to bring up how much I enjoy the movies of the Coen Brothers or that I read a bunch of foundational (but mostly Western) literature as part of a great books program during college or that I own so many video games that I've set up a small database instance to track them all. Those aren't what I'm here to read about and discuss, now are they?

What I'm here to discuss is a series that was very prominent during my formative years, a series I have many fond memories watching with my family, a series that I've been intrigued to see expand even further during the current decade, even if the new stuff, in my mind, doesn't quite live up to what's come before. But Dragon Ball is not the only piece of media I've enjoyed or will enjoy, and I'd dare say it's not even my favorite anymore. However, it will always have a place in my heart, and I see value on reading and participating in discussions on it, so here I am.

I'll grant you that there likely does exist someone on this forum that fits your description of the infantile cartoon junkie, but do you honestly think your smug elitist routine will do any good to convince them to change their ways? Yeah, there's nothing better to get me interested to experience some "mature" media like someone telling me how stupid I am.


Now, for the topic at hand...

He's popular for his performance in Fullmetal Alchemist, even though it isn't that good of a performance.

As a FMA (well, Brotherhood specifically) fan myself, I'm not sure how much of that performance I enjoy because of the performance itself or just how well-written Edward is. I suspect it's the latter, but I can at least say Vic's acting does not get in the way of said writing.

[SuperSaiyaManZ94]

I thought Vic's Broly was ok but not outstanding when compared to Bin Shimda in the Japanese versions of his films especially Movie 8 and Super Broly, and Eric on FMA was decent but not the best either, other than that i believe he also did Burter (Butta) in Kai for the Ginyu Force episodes as Sabat had given up that role among many others recast which he'd voiced previously. There's also him having done the dub version of Dan Dan Kokoro Hikarteku and one or more of the ending songs for the Green Bricks of GT and the third dubbed performance of Dragon Soul/Yeah Break Care Break in Kai, which happens to be my personal favorite renditions out of the ones done with the home release. Which was also was used for the majority of the edited TV broadcast on Nicktoons until the switch to Kokoro no Hane.

Overall, it seems Dragon Ball and Fullmetal Alchemist are the things i know him most for.

[Thanos]

His speaking voice is, well, fine, I guess. But the screaming is just pathetic. A far cry from Bin Shimada, who actually sounds scary, even in his speaking voice. Definitely someone you don't want to fuck with.

I think this comparison sums it up pretty succinctly:
Mignogna scream: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zjAtkFGTzDo#t=04m10s
Shimada scream: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrGXlLmp29o#t=04m06s

[JulieYBM]

Mic Vignogna's popularity is all about how he markets himself. He and his mother sell him as abrand thtough events and social media interaction. His popularity has nothing to do with genuine talent as an actor.

[MasenkoHA]

Maybe not an argument, but it is a ridiculous comparison to make to claim his stature in the voice acting community was even close to Spacey's stature in the film community. Spacey has not one, but TWO Oscars. What does Vic have in his field that is akin to that? I don't know how anyone makes the comparison.

It's also worth noting he didn't say stop watching kids shows, just stop watching nothing but kids shows.

I just don’t see why one would need to assume that someone else is exclusively watching children’s entertainment to begin with.

I mean when someone compares Mignogna to Kevin Spacey as an actor it’s really not hard to conclude that they only watch children’s entertainment.

[MetaMoss]

I just don’t see why one would need to assume that someone else is exclusively watching children’s entertainment to begin with.

I mean when someone compares Mignogna to Kevin Spacey as an actor it’s really not hard to conclude that they only watch children’s entertainment.

Well, would someone even know who Kevin Spacey is if all they watched was kid's stuff? Or know enough of his acting prestige to make such an ill-fitting comparison?

[MasenkoHA]

I just don’t see why one would need to assume that someone else is exclusively watching children’s entertainment to begin with.

I mean when someone compares Mignogna to Kevin Spacey as an actor it’s really not hard to conclude that they only watch children’s entertainment.

Well, would someone even know who Kevin Spacey is if all they watched was kid's stuff? Or know enough of his acting prestige to make such an ill-fitting comparison?

He was all over news headline not that long ago so yes?

I mean I assume people who have never seen an Alfred Hitchcock movie still know who he is by pop culture ubiquity?

[MetaMoss]

He was all over news headline not that long ago so yes?

I mean I assume people who have never seen an Alfred Hitchcock movie still know who he is by pop culture ubiquity?

How much of that news coverage was dedicated to his status as an "acting legend", though? I don't remember that being really part of the conversation when the allegations against him came out, just that he was a big name.

[Dr. Casey]

Oh, I don't know.

In all honesty, even though this is bad, it seems completely and utterly average by the standards of the dub. Pretty much no better and no worse than any other scream or line of dialogue going back to episode 1. No offense intended to dub fans, not trying to be a prick here.

[VDenter]

Oh, I don't know.

Again: people actually, literally, and unironically DEFEND this fucking dub/voicework as compelling and wonderful, and have for almost 20 years now. And still do to this day even in 2019.

This doesn't even remotely NEED any further elaboration or explanation. Its self-invalidating.

Vic may not be a great human being but I'd argue that the man is a voice actor legend similar to Kevin Spacey in the acting business (even though he's also a shit human).

This shit is straight through the goddamn looking glass. This is so beyond delusional that I can't even think of an adequate enough of a comparison to equate it with.

I'm going to reiterate this for the umpteenth time now, because it bears near-constant repeating in this community, and its a large part of where ridiculous statements like this often tend to come from:

Stop watching nothing but exclusively children's cartoons.

For heaven's sake. Actually make a serious, concerted effort to branch out into REAL movies and media for regular, fully grown-ass adults that aren't made to air on things like the Disney Channel or whatnot. Particularly anything that isn't geek or nerd-related. There's a vast, endless, gargantuan UNIVERSE of wonderful, powerfully moving, and genuinely culturally monumental stuff that's out there and that so many of you folks (not all, but a significant number of you) are completely unaware even exists, stuff that utterly blows off the map and is galaxies beyond just about literally anything you ever watched on Fox Kids or Cartoon Network growing up. I'll even go so far as to say objectively fucking so in a great many cases.

We live in an age where people are flipping out for days on end, because Martin Scorsese said that MCU movies are not cinema. So of course people got to bat for every single terrible thing regarding the dub, including that laughable performance and of course shout endlessly about how "Vic did nothing wrong". Is any of this surprising at this point? Maybe this was always the case that mainstream garbage like MCU and the Funi dub which always seems like it has this indestructible defense force from people that think that the shit that they saw when they were six years old is the greatest thing in our solar system, but i just don't know. It seems to have gotten much worse over the years.

[ABED]

Please don't compare a dub written and performed by amateurs off the street with the MCU which was built by competent professionals and some of the best talent in Hollywood.

I wish people would stop using what they read on social media as any sort of barometer. It magnifies negativity and people losing their shit because there's no filter. It takes no effort to type whatever you think and hit send. I really doubt people are worse now than in decades past. I think people on both sides need to take a step outside. That seems to be where the appraisal of Vic's talent and popularity stems from - lack of perspective.

Mignogna is a competent actor, not great, but he was miscast as Broly. He can't convey menace very well, which is ironic.

[WittyUsername]

The FUNimation dub is mainstream like the MCU? That’s a pretty big stretch, especially when a lot of people these days watch the Japanese version.

[Kokonoe]

Mic Vignogna's popularity is all about how he markets himself. He and his mother sell him as abrand thtough events and social media interaction. His popularity has nothing to do with genuine talent as an actor.

Nothing? This seems a rather...Japanese dub biased mindset.

His voice as Edward and Broly are what made him famous and no one can question that. If you mean how he got more and more popular, than yeah it was due to his marketing.

He's not a talentless hack.

[Kunzait_83]

I just don’t see why one would need to assume that someone else is exclusively watching children’s entertainment to begin with.

Because its been a long, ever-present, and persistent recurring issue within the bulk of this forum community for as long as I've been involved with it (so for at least the better part of a decade+), and is the key thing that's most often at the heart of so very many of the most ridiculous, outlandishly ignorant statements and assumptions that have often been thoughtlessly thrown about on here regarding non-children's media for years and years now.

It certainly extends to and is often at the heart of even much of the dub/voice acting-centric silliness so commonly found on here, including the absurd over-inflating of the pop cultural importance (to say nothing of raw talent) of relatively obscure children's cartoon VA's alongside what is often a complete abject ignorance and dismissal of oftentimes INCREDIBLY mainstream actors, filmmakers, and artists from outside the realm of kids' animation & media, who's work has been (justifiably) of FAR greater cultural impact and significance.

I really wonder how much of this "people only consuming kids' media" thing you're seeing is actually going on here, vs. the fact that this forum is dedicated to discussions that exclusively revolve around Dragon Ball, and that makes for a skewed impression on the media diet of the folks on here. It's not exactly easy to bring up the other pieces of media you're into on this forum if they don't make sense to mention in the context of Dragon Ball. Unless a work was an influence on Dragon Ball (such as wuxia, as you've comprehensively demonstrated) or influenced by Dragon Ball (such as basically every shonen action series made post-1990), why would it be brought up except in a contrived circumstance? I can't really see many natural instances on here where I, for example, have a chance to bring up how much I enjoy the movies of the Coen Brothers or that I read a bunch of foundational (but mostly Western) literature as part of a great books program during college or that I own so many video games that I've set up a small database instance to track them all. Those aren't what I'm here to read about and discuss, now are they?

You're major mistake here is in presuming up front that my sole means of interacting with people on this forum has been the forum itself. In actuality though, I've had a tremendous degree of interaction with numerous people here off of the forums as well: via PMs, the old IRC chat, a few of the more recent Discord servers, Skype, and even AIM (way back in the earlier days).

My involvement in this community extends FAR beyond solely the public forum discussions. I've met and had countless off-forum relationships and interactions with a very broad, sizable range of users throughout the past nearly 15 years. I'm not simply pulling this from nothing.

I'll grant you that there likely does exist someone on this forum that fits your description of the infantile cartoon junkie, but do you honestly think your smug elitist routine will do any good to convince them to change their ways? Yeah, there's nothing better to get me interested to experience some "mature" media like someone telling me how stupid I am.

I don't know whether your defensiveness here is simply because you think I'm somehow singling you out personally or because there's simply some other disconnect in how and what I'm writing (along with whatever limits of expression inherent in typed words/prose) versus the actual intent behind my words.

With regards to the former: I can assure you, I'm not in any which way talking here about YOU specifically, as you aren't one of the many people I've had such off-forum interactions with... nor really very many on-forum ones either. Indeed I find it oddly humorous and bizarre how some of the most vocally defensive and passionately outraged responses I've had to my posts on this particular matter (including a good amount via PMs) tend to come from usually folks whom I've never or barely ever exchanged more than a passing few words with and otherwise don't know from Adam.

As far as the latter goes though, all I can do is try to make myself as clear as I possibly, possibly can here:

Once again, this obviously doesn't extend to 100% of EVERYONE who posts on here, and there are plenty of people on here who either have ALWAYS had a more (for lack of a better word) "normal" or "well-balanced" media diet & exposure, or have at the very least much more belatedly started to develop one in more recent years (better late than never) after formerly being of the type of mindset that I'm describing for quite a long time prior.

But with all those necessary caveats said, this is still a mindset prevalent within a significant enough of a chunk of the posting populace on here (from the mid-2000s right on up through to today) that forms so much of the more absurdly skewed, slanted views and objectively warped perspectives on sometimes basic media literacy that dominates the general discourse that's generally found on here: one that's often filtered through a lens that heavily biases and favors exclusive focus on the minutia of 90s and 2000s children's action cartoons and TV shows while at the same time showing a near total and complete apathy, ignorance, and unwillingness to remotely engage with very much of anything else that's from outside that realm of media.

And the main reason I harp on that drum so much isn't to be "smug" or "elitist", or whatever handy, dismissive label is most simple and convenient to throw at me without actually engaging with any of the actual substance of what I'm trying to say: the reason is because this skewed media perspective genuinely gets in the way of and sabotages fruitful discussion and perspective relating to examining ANY form of artistic/creative media... even one for children like Dragon Ball is.

While Dragon Ball is a singular work made for children, its also one that happens to have an extraordinarily wide range and hodgepodge of disparate creative influences that are crucial to its creation: many of which themselves are indeed decidedly NOT necessarily made for or aimed at children (like The Terminator for an oft-recognized Western example). And obviously DB is hardly the ONLY work made for children who's creative DNA is hugely informed by non-children's/adult-skewed media.

Even if your subject of discussion or interest happens to be a work aimed at kids, a complete blinding ignorance of adult-aimed works of art & media, and a refusal/unwillingness to engage with much of any of it on almost any level will almost certainly cripple your ability to examine and thoughtfully discuss it.

I think part of the issue for people like yourself (who have an at least fairly reasonably balanced diet and perspective on media) is that its SO easy to take for granted how much incredibly basic foundational ways of parsing a work of art or media even halfway critically are almost completely hobbled when you're only frame of reference for how to critically gauge a work is predicated solely on just a fairly narrow range of works.

In other words like... I can't really properly critically analyze or dig into the creative context of a movie like say, Pulp Fiction (for an obvious, easy example) if its literally the ONLY crime movie I've ever seen or have any real interest in ever seeing. Likewise for something like The Princess Bride (for a children's example), a movie who's entire existence is predicating on spoofing and turning on their head cliches and conventions of traditional Western fairy tale standards, if I somehow have literally ZERO understanding or baseline knowledge of what fairy tales even are.

For Dragon Ball, this has most commonly manifested in the overall fanbase's total lack of experience, knowledge, or curiosity towards martial arts narratives (both fantasy/mythical/wuxia, and otherwise): but it ALSO extends even FURTHER past that to a lack of experience, knowledge, understanding, and even basic curiosity regarding how a great deal of works outside of that of children's cartoons tend to be executed and carry themselves (via direction, acting, scoring, editing, etc).

This tends to come up a lot with regards to the dub, which goes out of its way the most in stripping whatever production aspects the Japanese version had that allowed the series to demonstrate flourishes of directorial execution that aren't necessarily native to Western conventions of children's TV animation, and instead replace them with production elements that more conform themselves to the standards of Western children's TV (particularly within the 1980s and 90s).

This impacts everything from the style of the acting, the tone and use of the replacement score chosen, how episodes are re-edited at times, etc. And to go deeper, it impacts how so many of this audience views the benefits of even things like subtlety or nuance in how a given scene or moment conveys basic character or plot information without talking down to or insulting the audience's intelligence versus "hitting the audience upside the face with blaring and clunky exposition".

Or when going outside the realm of just Dragon Ball (as I've done with so many folks here throughout the years) it certainly greatly hobbles just the basic ability to digest, appreciate, and form a basic human connection with (and thus, maybe even god forbid actually LEARN something new from) almost ANY other kind of story, character, or narrative that isn't firmly centered around a Star Wars or G.I. Joe-esque "Intrepid band of heroes versus black garbed, moustache twirling EEEEEVIL doers" setup. And about a bazillion countless other examples I could be here all day listing.

Once again, obviously this issue doesn't pertain to EVERY SINGLE SOLITARY person who posts on this forum: if you look at what I'm writing and think to yourself "But I watch and love a ton of Scorsese and Coens movies! How could he accuse ME of this kind of myopia?!" etc, then guess what? You're NOT in fact one of the people here that I'm talking about!

But regardless, when pressed on the matter, yes a very sizable segment of this community throughout my 15 years-long time spent eyeball-deep within it (including some fairly prominent members of it) will openly cop to holding both a disdainful view of non-children's media as a whole while simultaneously in many cases also admitting oftentimes to having an incredibly limited and narrow personal experience with very much of any of it beyond a relative handful of cheesy network TV sitcoms and crappy Hollywood blockbuster movies. I know this not just from dicking around on the forums itself, but moreover from my OFF-FORUM experience with interacting with a great many of these folks and talking about decidedly non-Dragon Ball topics across a very large number of years now.

And that viewpoint of "kids media as the center of my world, whereas non-kids media is inherently negligible and not worth my time or attention" generally breeds a kind of all-purpose ignorance and lack of basic understanding about basic critical gauging and understanding of so much of creative media overall (film, television, music, and otherwise), even those on otherwise a fairly mainstream level outside of children's media, that completely guts and cripples any kind of remotely intelligent, fruitful discussion of it on even a barebones baseline level.

Basically, its the root of a LOT of the most frustrating and absurdly myopic aspects of this community's general overall makeup that routinely crops up across a vast majority of threads here. Its the problem that's behind a LOT of its myriad of other problems when it comes to basic media comprehension and discussion (or the lack of it) that's often found lurking behind most of the stupidest threads and posts on here.

And I bring it up so much not because I have any remote interest in being an asshole, or a snob, or an elitist (god knows my own film and media habits are rife with PLENTY of guilty pleasure junkfood nonsense, same as anyone else), or to be some kind of asinine "taste police", the way so many people here (including yourself apparently) take it and frame it.

Rather, its because without acknowledging and dealing with this community-wide issue, we're ultimately just going to keep going round and round in circles endlessly in thread after thread, discussion after discussion, where thoughtful discourse is routinely hamstrung by so many people in their 20s and 30s who don't understand incredibly basic and universally recognized film and TV precedents (both within and well far outside of just anime) that extends past the INSANELY narrower than hell range that's embodied by the kinds of shows played on Cartoon Network, Nickelodeon, Fox Kids, etc. as well as Disney, MCU, or Pixar films or whatnot (or on Japan's end, Shonen Jump anime & manga or Toei Tokusatsu/Sentai shows and so forth).

If calling out and examining that kind of fundamental issue with basic media comprehension as being inherently intellectually unhealthy, abnormal, and not particularly conducive to healthy critical discussion about virtually almost any given piece or work of art (regardless of whether or not its made for kids) therefore somehow inherently makes me an elitist and a snob... then Jesus Christ, I don't know what to tell you at that point, other than we are probably seriously undercutting and robbing those particular words of any semblance of meaning.

Also:

Yeah, there's nothing better to get me interested to experience some "mature" media like someone telling me how stupid I am.

Apart from the fact that I clearly wasn't referring to or talking about you (whom I've NOT had any particularly significant on or off-forum interactions with), I should also note that with ONE sole notable exception, I've literally NEVER in my ENTIRE time posting here called ANYONE "stupid" nor would I.

That one exception by the way was reserved for someone who was parroting /pol/ apologetics for Nazi ideology awhile back. So I think that one was fairly warranted.

Actually, watch Twin Peaks. Y'all should watch Twin Peaks, that's some good shit with fabulous acting.

Twin Peaks is an absolutely outstanding, utterly classic show that had a significant as all hell impact on pop culture for years, and is almost PRECISELY the very type of standout original work I would enthusiastically encourage almost anyone to seek out and experience ASAP.

I suggest trying to read some LGBTQIA+ books, they're better than a lot of shitty, boring movies out there. ♥

The Price of Salt (aka Carol) is an absolutely essential and phenomenal piece of queer literature (not to mention crucial piece of LGBTQ history) that's long had an unprecedented and seismic impact on the LGBTQ community (particularly queer women) for generations now, helping queer people come to grips with who they are and demolishing stereotypes since as far back as its original publishing in the goddamn 1950s. Its relatively recent 2015 film adaptation is pretty damn great as well. I'd highly recommend both to just about anyone.

Though speaking of movies... I would generally be EXCEEDINGLY wary and careful not to throw under the bus a medium as rich and dense with development and history as live action film as a broad whole in general with the kind of careless abandon that Julie has repeatedly shown on here for a good number of years now.

Live action film has had roughly a whole century now to experiment and push its boundaries to an utterly breathtaking universe's worth of styles, tones, subject matter, depicting and commenting on pretty much almost the entire gamut of human experience in the 20th and 21st centuries (and a vast swath of it from centuries well prior). This extends also certainly to LGBTQ experiences, issues, and subjects.

I'm saying this in no way whatsoever to be belittling or condescending to either Julie, or to anyone else posting here or reading this (even though I've no doubt that that's how most of this will be taken regardless): I'm saying this in as good-faith and earnestly sincere as I can possibly mean it.

There is so, so, so, so, so, so, SOOOOOOOOOO very much more in the way of styles and types of works that have long existed and have long been made within JUST THE MEDIUM OF NON-ANIMATED FILM ALONE (to say nothing of film that is well outside of those made for children and all ages families), that it utterly dwarfs the comprehensions of anyone who's almost entire gamut of experience with the medium is largely and solely just within the realms of mainstream children's & family films or mainstream, contemporary Hollywood blockbusters.

I cannot STRESS enough how much in the way of filmmaking has been made and been in existence within the realm of just non-animated film alone (particularly non-children's films), the sheer breathtaking SCOPE of it, since in some cases nearly a hundred years ago (or at least a little more than half that) and how INCREDIBLY wide and robust of a spectrum of different creative minds, perspectives, and visions that they've encompassed throughout all of that time (some of which, once again, are even pretty damn relevant to Dragon Ball as it happens).

I don't say this to belittle or look down on any of you from some holier than thou ivory tower of "expertise" or however the fuck its generally seen and perceived as when I talk about this, and indeed I NEVER HAVE meant it in anywhere REMOTELY CLOSE to that way in all my years of both posting here and talking about this particular topic: but rather I've been saying this to PLEAD with you guys - those of you rather to whom this actually applies anyway - as someone who enjoys seeing people grow and expand past their formerly limited horizons just for the sheer joy and sake of seeing them grow (you might catch onto why exactly a story like DB's with its particular themes might therefore resonate with me ), to please, PLEASE consider at some point in life just making an even half-serious effort at digging into the history and backlogs of non-animated and non-children's filmmaking (along with non-children's and non-family friendly animation while we're at it), and of filmmaking in general that exists not as just brainless entertainment and comfort food, but as a thoughtful and even experimental art form, as a venue of creative expression, and as a chronicling of human emotions and experiences of a DIZZYING variety.

Since Julie brought it up, just within the realm of LGBTQ-centric films alone, here's some essential standout works of excellent live action filmmaking just off the top of my head (thus I'm likely missing a TON more) that are beyond worth checking out: both broadly in general as great films in and of themselves, and also as utterly fantastic and compelling stories and artistic snapshots that are for, from, and about LGBTQ people for both Julie's consideration, and anyone else who happens to have an interest in the subject.

Happy Together (1997)
My Own Private Idaho (1991)
Funeral Parade of Roses (1969)
Mysterious Skin (2004)
Heavenly Creatures (1994)
Teorema (Theorem) (1968)
Moonlight (2016)
Looking for Langston (1989)
I Don’t Want to Sleep Alone (2006)
Mulholland Drive (2001)
Bound (1996)
The Adventures of Priscilla, Queen of the Desert (1994)
Paris Is Burning (1990)
Orlando (1993)
The Living End (1992)
Totally Fucked Up (1993)
Law of Desire (1987)
Nighthawks (1978)
Pink Flamingos (1972)
The Rocky Horror Picture Show (1975)
Hedwig and the Angry Inch (2001)
Kiki (2016)
Victim (1961)
Je, tu, il, elle (aka I, You, He, She) (1974)
Born in Flames (1983)
My Beautiful Laundrette (1985)
Tongues Untied (1989)
Weekend (2011)
The Bitter Tears of Petra von Kant (1972)
Mädchen in Uniform (1931)
Michael (1924)
Sunday Bloody Sunday (1971)
The Birdcage (1996)
Beautiful Thing (1996)
Get Real (1998)
Portrait of Jason (1967)
The Watermelon Woman (1997)
Tangerine (2015)
Pariah (2011)
Tomboy (2011)
Boys Don’t Cry (1999)
Brokeback Mountain (2005)
Different From the Others (1919)

[JulieYBM]

I'm writing from mobile so I'll keep it terse. Animation is still superior a medium, but there are some good films and series out there in live action. Hollywood shit is just really fucking boring.

Everytime I think back to Richard from Twin Peaks Season Three I think about how much of a fucking awesome villain he was, easily kicking the shit out of any comic book movie villain. I hated that guy so much.

I need to check out Lynch's other work. I've only also seen Blue Velvet, so I'm curious about his other stuff. I also need to check out more Kubrick and some tokusatsu.

[Kokonoe]

Stop watching nothing but exclusively children's cartoons.

He says in a forum dedicated to exclusively discussing a children's cartoon.

I really wonder how much of this "people only consuming kids' media" thing you're seeing is actually going on here, vs. the fact that this forum is dedicated to discussions that exclusively revolve around Dragon Ball, and that makes for a skewed impression on the media diet of the folks on here. It's not exactly easy to bring up the other pieces of media you're into on this forum if they don't make sense to mention in the context of Dragon Ball. Unless a work was an influence on Dragon Ball (such as wuxia, as you've comprehensively demonstrated) or influenced by Dragon Ball (such as basically every shonen action series made post-1990), why would it be brought up except in a contrived circumstance? I can't really see many natural instances on here where I, for example, have a chance to bring up how much I enjoy the movies of the Coen Brothers or that I read a bunch of foundational (but mostly Western) literature as part of a great books program during college or that I own so many video games that I've set up a small database instance to track them all. Those aren't what I'm here to read about and discuss, now are they?

What I'm here to discuss is a series that was very prominent during my formative years, a series I have many fond memories watching with my family, a series that I've been intrigued to see expand even further during the current decade, even if the new stuff, in my mind, doesn't quite live up to what's come before. But Dragon Ball is not the only piece of media I've enjoyed or will enjoy, and I'd dare say it's not even my favorite anymore. However, it will always have a place in my heart, and I see value on reading and participating in discussions on it, so here I am.

I'll grant you that there likely does exist someone on this forum that fits your description of the infantile cartoon junkie, but do you honestly think your smug elitist routine will do any good to convince them to change their ways? Yeah, there's nothing better to get me interested to experience some "mature" media like someone telling me how stupid I am.


Now, for the topic at hand...

He's popular for his performance in Fullmetal Alchemist, even though it isn't that good of a performance.

As a FMA (well, Brotherhood specifically) fan myself, I'm not sure how much of that performance I enjoy because of the performance itself or just how well-written Edward is. I suspect it's the latter, but I can at least say Vic's acting does not get in the way of said writing.

I agree. As with any community, specifically one as exclusive on Dragon Ball and as focused on the japanese voice dub itself will lead itself to an echo chamber of sorts.

Just the nature of communities. Generally the english fans tend to be pushed away overtime with only select few choosing to remain. This is certainly by design as the owner of this site admits boldly what the intent of this place is.

That said despite how out of place I and a few others do feel here, I stick around namely cause the site owner has something more important to me which is a progressive mindset regarding social issues.

[VDenter]

The FUNimation dub is mainstream like the MCU? That’s a pretty big stretch, especially when a lot of people these days watch the Japanese version.

The dub is still pretty mainstream and was the version that millions of potentially new fans got exposed to. A broken and completely irredeemable version of the show. That said i wasn't comparing the dub to MCU directly, it was just something that was on my mind,thanks to the crazy reactions online recently . Reactions that seemed all too similar to how dub fans react whenever someone dares to speak anything even remotely negative about it. It's one of those things where the extreme reaction to set criticism make no sense. The countless issues with the dub are so obvious and the fans of set dub bend over backwards in every conceivable way to defend it, and shit on the original version when all else fails. That's pretty insane. A normal reaction would be something like "Yeah we know it's trash or it has a ton of problems but we enjoy it anyway" that's however not what happens in 98% of the cases online.

Some of course take this kind of crazy mentality to a ludicrous extreme and defend a F tier talentless hack voice actor. As if they know him personally! While they also simultaneously ignore the vast amounts of credible evidence that he is a fucking creep and shouldn't be defended in any way.

[WittyUsername]

The FUNimation dub is mainstream like the MCU? That’s a pretty big stretch, especially when a lot of people these days watch the Japanese version.

The dub is still pretty mainstream and was the version that millions of potentially new fans got exposed to. A broken and completely irredeemable version of the show. That said i wasn't comparing the dub to MCU directly, it was just something that was on my mind,thanks to the crazy reactions online recently . Reactions that seemed all too similar to how dub fans react whenever someone dares to speak anything even remotely negative about it. It's one of those things where the extreme reaction to set criticism make no sense. The countless issues with the dub are so obvious and the fans of set dub bend over backwards in every conceivable way to defend it, and shit on the original version when all else fails. That's pretty insane. A normal reaction would be something like "Yeah we know it's trash or it has a ton of problems but we enjoy it anyway" that's however not what happens in 98% of the cases online.

Some of course take this kind of crazy mentality to a ludicrous extreme and defend a F tier talentless hack voice actor. As if they know him personally! While they also simultaneously ignore the vast amounts of credible evidence that he is a fucking creep and shouldn't be defended in any way.

Maybe I’m just not looking hard enough, but I haven’t really seen a particularly strong devotion to the dub these days. People don’t really seem to talk much about it anymore, beyond this website, at least based on my observation. If anything, Super seems to have caused people to become more familiar with the Japanese version, seeing as how most people were watching the show in Japanese before FUNimation ever started dubbing it. I don’t even see much complaints about Masako Nozawa these days.

Sure, the dub was extremely popular back in the day (even though most people online hated it), but these days? I don’t see much reason to believe that the masses hold it up as a gold standard of English dubbing. The most I’ve seen was a few people saying that they wish FUNimation would bring Tiffany Vollmer back, and that’s only because they hate Monica Rial for the whole KickVic situation.

[SuperSaiyaManZ94]

The FUNimation dub is mainstream like the MCU? That’s a pretty big stretch, especially when a lot of people these days watch the Japanese version.

The dub is still pretty mainstream and was the version that millions of potentially new fans got exposed to. A broken and completely irredeemable version of the show. That said i wasn't comparing the dub to MCU directly, it was just something that was on my mind,thanks to the crazy reactions online recently . Reactions that seemed all too similar to how dub fans react whenever someone dares to speak anything even remotely negative about it. It's one of those things where the extreme reaction to set criticism make no sense. The countless issues with the dub are so obvious and the fans of set dub bend over backwards in every conceivable way to defend it, and shit on the original version when all else fails. That's pretty insane. A normal reaction would be something like "Yeah we know it's trash or it has a ton of problems but we enjoy it anyway" that's however not what happens in 98% of the cases online.

Some of course take this kind of crazy mentality to a ludicrous extreme and defend a F tier talentless hack voice actor. As if they know him personally! While they also simultaneously ignore the vast amounts of credible evidence that he is a fucking creep and shouldn't be defended in any way.

Maybe I’m just not looking hard enough, but I haven’t really seen a particularly strong devotion to the dub these days. People don’t really seem to talk much about it anymore, beyond this website, at least based on my observation. If anything, Super seems to have caused people to become more familiar with the Japanese version, seeing as how most people were watching the show in Japanese before FUNimation ever started dubbing it. I don’t even see much complaints about Masako Nozawa these days.

Sure, the dub was extremely popular back in the day (even though most people online hated it), but these days? I don’t see much reason to believe that the masses hold it up as a gold standard of English dubbing. The most I’ve seen was a few people saying that they wish FUNimation would bring Tiffany Vollmer back, and that’s only because they hate Monica Rial for the whole KickVic situation.

I know i read somewhere that Tiffany apparently moved at some point and either went on indefinite hiatus or retired from voice acting completely after she left FUNimation around the mid 2000's not long before Kai's dub started production, which is why Bulma was recast with Monica taking over and i'll bet she most likely wouldn't return even if they were to reach out and ask her.