SpiritBombTriumphant wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 26, 2019 12:48 am
VegettoEX wrote: ↑
Fri Oct 25, 2019 9:48 am
jjgp1112 wrote: ↑
Fri Oct 25, 2019 9:47 am
I have a simpler solution: how about we keep identity politics out of some dumb kung-Fu cartoon?
This is not an appropriate response.
It's an appropriate response, you just disagree with it. An inappropriate response would be along the lines of "keep ideologies that promote mental illness out of my anime!" or something along those lines. That is an example
and not a line I believe, so don't punish me for it please. Something that insults people here who are just trying to discuss opinions. But his response is appropriate, non-insulting, and just trying to find middle ground. We've had threads on this forum in the past where someone talks about injecting American left-wing politics into Dragon Ball for values such as representation and diversity. It always ends poorly. This community (Dragon Ball in general) already has the following:
* Faulconer vs Kikuchi
* GT sucking vs not sucking
* Z vs Kai
* Super sucking vs not sucking
* Vic is innocent vs Vic is guilty
* Shoving American politics into a Japanese cartoon
I feel like there is one that I forgot, but you should get my point. I really like you dude. You are a cool guy. But you should be better than this. He didn't insult anyone like in my example. He just wants people to not start fights and is trying to find middle ground. Everything else in the world has politics these days. There is nothing wrong with wanting a bit of escapism where you can just sit back, relax, and enjoy something without having to worry about left vs right wing politics. Hell, I remember when Xbox Live had gamer pictures for McCain and Obama.
So is this seriously an abbreviation used by the LBGT community? Or is this a friendly joke? The most I've heard was something like LBGTQIA, and that already seems stupid in my opinion
. Call me old fashioned (or just old, it fits I guess), but I remember when it was just LBGT and everyone was fine as we fought for equality for homosexuals.
You know, as someone who's been active in the LGBTQ+ community spaces since finally coming out years ago, I absolutely and really do not appreciate your response by any means. You're comparing our existence to something trivial discussion such as in-related discussion for most of the points that you bring up.
Also, your "Shoving American politics into a Japanese cartoon" is absolutely infuriating, given there's plenty of movements in Japan similar to the US that are in a less defined state than here, but are similar in nature. Most recently, issues regarding topics of sexism and stuff have exploded on Japanese social media and news outlets over a recent depiction of the Red Cross anime character. These are similar issues that we discuss, including stuff found in the Dragon Ball anime.
Don't you EVER dare say these discussions aren't worth discussing, because representation in media as a whole is incredibly important. This isn't "identity politics" when Dragon Ball does have various identities presented in it's media as a whole, with an early example of a known openly queer gay character in the show (which, he does openly have some issues, but it's notable for the time frame when he was depicted, ignoring... the bit Toei Animation added in the anime, which is still frustrating, not gonna lie).
Plus, when you say "lay off identity politics", it makes it very clear that you have no interest in said discussion and just want to cause issues for people who want to create such discussion. Your follow up response only makes that incredibly clear where you lean on these issues and not representative towards vulnerable communities as a whole.
Not to say we can't have open discussion, but when you create such hostility immediately, your opinion, at this point, is no longer valid and as Vegetto said, is not appropriate in any manner. Plus, as it stands, I don't want an individual such as your self commenting on issues that affect me, a gay man, as well as many members of the LGBTQ+ community as a whole. It's very clear you're not supportive of efforts to be inclusive in media as a whole and as it stands, I'll be blunt:
I really don't care or value your opinion at this point, especially when it comes to issues that affect me. I've long had to hide in the damn closet, feeling the fact that my attraction towards men was bad. I was bullied to the point at one point, I legit considered committing suicide. I was sexually and verbally harassed by my peers. Cops refused to do anything, and told my mother, straight to her face: "If your son was a girl, we could do something". How does that shit makes me feel?
Plus, as it stands, you have no idea how much I wish I saw more representation of Queer characters in media as a whole, be it kids entertainment or otherwise. I'd probably felt a lot better about myself as a whole. Many Queer Kids and Teens have felt a lot better knowing there's nothing wrong with them when they see positive representation in the media as a whole. While I was growing up, I had almost nothing of the sort, outside of some stuff on Sailor Moon and that's about it. Hell, the Canadian cartoons that started including Queer characters were often heavily edited to avoid showing it or cut the episodes out entirely. Brace Face being a notable example of this.
So no, I think these discussions are important and should be discussed. Also, infusing politics? Sir, most anime, games, heck, media in general, is infused with politics to the 'nth degree. Japanese media, especially, has heavy focus on politics, such as anti-war messages, environmental story messages. Heck, Final Fantasy VII is littered with this, a well known game across the world, with a strong anti-corporation, pro-environmental message, focusing how we're damaging out world with the energy we're using (it comes off as an anti-nuclear message as well).
So as a whole, media has so much politics going on. Whether you choose to be blind to it, that's on you, but they're there.