Is it time to accept Faulconer OST did it better than the original?

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Re: Is it time to accept Faulconer OST did it better than the original?

Post by WittyUsername » Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:39 pm

Yuli Ban wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:30 pm
Honestly, a replacement score would've been just fine for Dragon Ball in the 90s if FUNimation were fully on board with making it like a 1970s kung fu flick first and foremost. They could easily have gotten away with introducing electronic and rock aspects to it because it's not like that's something foreign to kung fu movies, even of that time (most notably Master of the Flying Guillotine, which even used krautrock!).

They couldn't even accomplish that.
It’s fair to say that FUNimation was never going for a Kung fu vibe to begin with. They wanted it to sound more like other popular action shows that were geared towards kids, which was why they initially hired Shuki Levy/Ron Wasserman. Bruce Faulconer was pretty much just hired as the low budget alternative to that. Still, I always found the Faulconer score to be more memorable than the Saban score.

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Re: Is it time to accept Faulconer OST did it better than the original?

Post by Yuli Ban » Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:59 pm

WittyUsername wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:39 pm
Yuli Ban wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:30 pm
Honestly, a replacement score would've been just fine for Dragon Ball in the 90s if FUNimation were fully on board with making it like a 1970s kung fu flick first and foremost. They could easily have gotten away with introducing electronic and rock aspects to it because it's not like that's something foreign to kung fu movies, even of that time (most notably Master of the Flying Guillotine, which even used krautrock!).

They couldn't even accomplish that.
It’s fair to say that FUNimation was never going for a Kung fu vibe to begin with. They wanted it to sound more like other popular action shows that were geared towards kids, which was why they initially hired Shuki Levy/Ron Wasserman. Bruce Faulconer was pretty much just hired as the low budget alternative to that. Still, I always found the Faulconer score to be more memorable than the Saban score.
After listening to the Saban score, I can't even make out more than four or five distinct tracks. I love the atmosphere they build quite a bit— when the senshi are preparing to fight the Illusion Saiyans, for example, the music set the mood perfectly, even though it was unfitting for what was going on (like using Christian aural hymns for what amounts to a Taoist god's mystical room).
What they have over Faulconer is production value.
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Re: Is it time to accept Faulconer OST did it better than the original?

Post by WittyUsername » Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:11 pm

Yuli Ban wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:59 pm
WittyUsername wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:39 pm
Yuli Ban wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:30 pm
Honestly, a replacement score would've been just fine for Dragon Ball in the 90s if FUNimation were fully on board with making it like a 1970s kung fu flick first and foremost. They could easily have gotten away with introducing electronic and rock aspects to it because it's not like that's something foreign to kung fu movies, even of that time (most notably Master of the Flying Guillotine, which even used krautrock!).

They couldn't even accomplish that.
It’s fair to say that FUNimation was never going for a Kung fu vibe to begin with. They wanted it to sound more like other popular action shows that were geared towards kids, which was why they initially hired Shuki Levy/Ron Wasserman. Bruce Faulconer was pretty much just hired as the low budget alternative to that. Still, I always found the Faulconer score to be more memorable than the Saban score.
After listening to the Saban score, I can't even make out more than four or five distinct tracks. I love the atmosphere they build quite a bit— when the senshi are preparing to fight the Illusion Saiyans, for example, the music set the mood perfectly, even though it was unfitting for what was going on (like using Christian aural hymns for what amounts to a Taoist god's mystical room).
What they have over Faulconer is production value.
They definitely have better production values than Faulconer Productions, but I’d argue that the low production values is part of helps the Faulconer score stand out more. The Saban score sounds too much like a generic 90s action cartoon.

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Re: Is it time to accept Faulconer OST did it better than the original?

Post by jjgp1112 » Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:27 pm

The Faulconer score always had a lot of interesting, striking melodies and other musical elements. To me the big problems were the 1) never-ending music and 2) the instrument quality, though this improved significantly by the Buu saga. If they were using the type of equipment that contemporary kung-fu composers were using it would've blown people's socks off. Something along the lines of Enter The Dragon or the Mortal Kombat movie (I mean shit, Yamamato plagiarized heavily from the MK soundtrack for Kai so we already know it fits :lol: )
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Re: Is it time to accept Faulconer OST did it better than the original?

Post by MCDaveG » Fri Jun 05, 2020 7:24 pm

Yuli Ban wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:30 pm
Honestly, a replacement score would've been just fine for Dragon Ball in the 90s if FUNimation were fully on board with making it like a 1970s kung fu flick first and foremost. They could easily have gotten away with introducing electronic and rock aspects to it because it's not like that's something foreign to kung fu movies, even of that time (most notably Master of the Flying Guillotine, which even used krautrock!).

They couldn't even accomplish that.
But except for Kenji Yamamoto being composer where the distinction between original composition and what is actually him rearanging plagiarized music get's thrown out of the window, his replacement score was pretty good!

And I hate to say it, but even better than Norihito Sumitomo, as 80% of what he does doesn't work with me, unless he uses orchestra or arranging opening themes...

I was angry and heartbroken at the same time when Yamamoto was called away... Like remake the Avatar score for a series popular and airing worldwide in the 21st Century, that is like poking your eye out with violin bow. But outside of blatant stupidity like this, Yamamoto rellay fit the series in my opinion even more so, that I have known his work for ages since playing a lot of older DB games.
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Re: Is it time to accept Faulconer OST did it better than the original?

Post by ABED » Fri Jun 05, 2020 7:45 pm

WittyUsername wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:11 pm
Yuli Ban wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:59 pm
WittyUsername wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:39 pm


It’s fair to say that FUNimation was never going for a Kung fu vibe to begin with. They wanted it to sound more like other popular action shows that were geared towards kids, which was why they initially hired Shuki Levy/Ron Wasserman. Bruce Faulconer was pretty much just hired as the low budget alternative to that. Still, I always found the Faulconer score to be more memorable than the Saban score.
After listening to the Saban score, I can't even make out more than four or five distinct tracks. I love the atmosphere they build quite a bit— when the senshi are preparing to fight the Illusion Saiyans, for example, the music set the mood perfectly, even though it was unfitting for what was going on (like using Christian aural hymns for what amounts to a Taoist god's mystical room).
What they have over Faulconer is production value.
They definitely have better production values than Faulconer Productions, but I’d argue that the low production values is part of helps the Faulconer score stand out more. The Saban score sounds too much like a generic 90s action cartoon.
To be fair Saban scored a number of popular 90's action shows including X-Men and Power Rangers
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Re: Is it time to accept Faulconer OST did it better than the original?

Post by GhostEmperorX » Sat Jun 06, 2020 1:47 am

Yuli Ban wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:30 pm
Honestly, a replacement score would've been just fine for Dragon Ball in the 90s if FUNimation were fully on board with making it like a 1970s kung fu flick first and foremost. They could easily have gotten away with introducing electronic and rock aspects to it because it's not like that's something foreign to kung fu movies, even of that time (most notably Master of the Flying Guillotine, which even used krautrock!).

They couldn't even accomplish that.
They didn’t understand DB, how do you expect them to do that? And no, replacement scoring (as well as other American adaptation elements used to completely butcher a series), for better or worse, really shouldn’t exist. Whatever the original is, it should have been left alone.

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Re: Is it time to accept Faulconer OST did it better than the original?

Post by Yuli Ban » Sat Jun 06, 2020 11:49 am

GhostEmperorX wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 1:47 am
Yuli Ban wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:30 pm
Honestly, a replacement score would've been just fine for Dragon Ball in the 90s if FUNimation were fully on board with making it like a 1970s kung fu flick first and foremost. They could easily have gotten away with introducing electronic and rock aspects to it because it's not like that's something foreign to kung fu movies, even of that time (most notably Master of the Flying Guillotine, which even used krautrock!).

They couldn't even accomplish that.
They didn’t understand DB, how do you expect them to do that? And no, replacement scoring (as well as other American adaptation elements used to completely butcher a series), for better or worse, really shouldn’t exist. Whatever the original is, it should have been left alone.
Key phrase: In the 90s. I'm referring to the mindset that existed at the time, not what's ideal. If a replacement score had to happen (and it really didn't, but we Americans are arrogant like that), it could have still worked out.
FUNimation may or may not have understood DB. Those making it surely were old enough to have remembered and watched those old kung fu movies of the past. Their goal was, irrespective of what went into it, to put something out that fit with making what they erroneously felt aged 7-15 American boys of the late 1990s would like.
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Re: Is it time to accept Faulconer OST did it better than the original?

Post by WittyUsername » Sat Jun 06, 2020 1:46 pm

Side note, but are there any anime dubs besides Pokémon and Yu-Gi-Oh that still use replacement scores at this point?

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Re: Is it time to accept Faulconer OST did it better than the original?

Post by Planetnamek » Fri Jul 31, 2020 9:27 pm

WittyUsername wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 1:46 pm
Side note, but are there any anime dubs besides Pokémon and Yu-Gi-Oh that still use replacement scores at this point?
If there are, I can't think of any at the moment.

I agree on Saban's soundtrack not being very memorable, whatever you want to say about the Faulconer score(and the Menza score on GT) it's at least distinctive and has way more pieces of musc, I can't think of another soundtrack like it, but Saban seemingly only has like 5-6 different pieces of music and they sound too similar to their other shows.
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