So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

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So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by Psajdak » Fri Mar 20, 2020 7:51 pm

Image

...

Or perhaps you still see some faint glimmer of hope for non Saiyans? :lolno:

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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by Grimlock » Fri Mar 20, 2020 7:59 pm

Both. If the games do something with the other characters, pretty sure the series can as well.
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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips » Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:06 pm

I did years ago. It's why I make fun of this fandom as much as I do. Not only has it propped up the most boring warrior race in all of fiction, it's proud of it too!
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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by Zeon_Grunt » Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:18 pm

The series has been the Saiyan Show since Raditz first appeared. Anyone who thought otherwise is just trying to lie to themselves. Sure, Piccolo got a few showings here or there, but it was mostly to show off the next threat.

That said, I'm not remotely resentful of the fact that DB has turned into the Saiyan show. They're easily the most interesting aspect of the universe, much like the Force and the Jedi/Sith conflict are the only really interesting part about Star Wars.

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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips » Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:21 pm

Zeon_Grunt wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:18 pm
They're easily the most interesting aspect of the universe, much like the Force and the Jedi/Sith conflict are the only really interesting part about Star Wars.
lol
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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by Zeon_Grunt » Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:28 pm

It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:21 pm
Zeon_Grunt wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:18 pm
They're easily the most interesting aspect of the universe, much like the Force and the Jedi/Sith conflict are the only really interesting part about Star Wars.
lol
What else is there to Star Wars that's unique to it and sets it apart from other sci-fi films of it's time or from the decades since? Especially given how many of the films are just straight awful.

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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by Cursed Lemon » Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:39 pm

If by "finally" you mean "15 years ago" then yup.
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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips » Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:45 pm

Zeon_Grunt wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:28 pm
It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:21 pm
Zeon_Grunt wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:18 pm
They're easily the most interesting aspect of the universe, much like the Force and the Jedi/Sith conflict are the only really interesting part about Star Wars.
lol
What else is there to Star Wars that's unique to it and sets it apart from other sci-fi films of it's time or from the decades since? Especially given how many of the films are just straight awful.
The 'lol' was more at the Saiyans part of your comment than the Star Wars bit but to answer your question

Loads. I can only speak for myself and the communities I've been involved in but most of us spent way more time gushing/fantasizing about rogues like Han Solo than we did the Force. (We even used to joke that only emo twelve year olds and women with hybristophilia care about the Sith.) The Mandalorians in particular have been so popular that despite only being a foot note to George Lucas, they've got their own (non Lucas ltd affiliated) comics, novels, and tv show (which seems to be the only consistently well reviewed piece of new Star Wars media).
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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by Zeon_Grunt » Fri Mar 20, 2020 9:17 pm

It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:45 pm
Zeon_Grunt wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:28 pm
It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:21 pm


lol
What else is there to Star Wars that's unique to it and sets it apart from other sci-fi films of it's time or from the decades since? Especially given how many of the films are just straight awful.
The 'lol' was more at the Saiyans part of your comment than the Star Wars bit but to answer your question

Loads. I can only speak for myself and the communities I've been involved in but most of us spent way more time gushing/fantasizing about rogues like Han Solo than we did the Force. (We even used to joke that only emo twelve year olds and women with hybristophilia care about the Sith.) The Mandalorians in particular have been so popular that despite only being a foot note to George Lucas, they've got their own (non Lucas ltd affiliated) comics, novels, and tv show (which seems to be the only consistently well reviewed piece of new Star Wars media).
To each their own, but a whole generation grew up loving the Jedi/Sith lore moreso than the vague "WWII in space with shady characters" setting of the original trilogy.

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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by Robo4900 » Fri Mar 20, 2020 11:02 pm

The original run wasn't "The Saiyan show", so Dragon Ball is not "The Saiyan show" at any point that matters.

Super, on the other hand? Yes, this is one of many, many dumb flaws in its writing.
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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips » Fri Mar 20, 2020 11:38 pm

Robo4900 wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 11:02 pm
The original run wasn't "The Saiyan show", so Dragon Ball is not "The Saiyan show" at any point that matters.

Super, on the other hand? Yes, this is one of many, many dumb flaws in its writing.
Eh. I think it's fairer to say that the best parts of Dragon Ball weren't "The Saiyan show" rather than 'it wasn't the Saiyan show at any point that mattered.' Once Saiyans are introduced they quickly become the dominant force in the series. Goku is said to enjoy combat because he is a Saiyan, Gohan and Vegeta are presented as better ki users than the Earth warriors, and the Earth warriors are consistently depicted as being almost totally incompetent fighters. Even the influence the elderly Gohan had on young Goku is quickly phased out, with Goku's love of martial arts and self-improvement being attributed to his genetics (because if there's one thing sadistic space pirates are all about, it's self-improvement).

Saiyans absolutely overshadow everything else in Dragon Ball to the point you could cut everything pre-Raditz and the series wouldn't feel incomplete. It'd be missing its best stories but this isn't exactly the sort of fandom that would notice or care about that.
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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by JulieYBM » Fri Mar 20, 2020 11:56 pm

I like Saiyans. If the people making something like Saiyans and only want to use Saiyans that is up to them. It's all ultimately the Gokuu show, anyhow.
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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by Matches Malone » Sat Mar 21, 2020 12:33 am

Accept it ? yes, Like it ? Not much. DB has a very diverse and interesting cast of characters, yet it does little to nothing with them. It's even worse if you watch other anime that has just as good of a cast and utilizes them in meaningful ways. I think DB did a good job until the end of the Cell arc, but starting with Buu is when things started going downhill for non-Saiyans, with Super essentially putting them in the ground.

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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by Zeon_Grunt » Sat Mar 21, 2020 2:45 am

Robo4900 wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 11:02 pm
The original run wasn't "The Saiyan show", so Dragon Ball is not "The Saiyan show" at any point that matters.

Super, on the other hand? Yes, this is one of many, many dumb flaws in its writing.
The "original show," sure wasn't if you're specifically referreing exclusively to Vols 1-17 of the manga and ignoring the anime after the title change. After Raditz showed up, it very much was the Saiyan show through and through. This was not only the last time the Earthlings were "relevant" towards a fight, but they were sidelined pretty hard even with this arc; only showing up to either die to Nappa or be almost entirely useless like Krillin (who only lands a clean his when he and Piccolo tag team Nappa for a brief moment).

Piccolo is the only non-Saiyan to get any love and even that's mostly just for the first arc before becoming a walking plot device that just shows up to stall the main one of the Saiyans can take over (either for the victory in Goku's case or a handy ass whooping in Vegeta's).

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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by ABED » Sat Mar 21, 2020 5:17 am

I think people place ENTIRELY too much emphasis on the Saiyan race. It's easier to write them as relevant to battle - sure, but it's not where Goku's ethos comes from and all of the Saiyans are all very different characters.
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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by DragonBallFoodie » Sat Mar 21, 2020 8:05 am

The Saiyans have become front and center, and have (indirectly) pushed the Namekians and humans into the background.

But I think that may have been inevitable when they were introduced.
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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by jjgp1112 » Sat Mar 21, 2020 8:31 am

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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by Matches Malone » Sat Mar 21, 2020 9:21 am

DragonBallFoodie wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 8:05 am
The Saiyans have become front and center, and have (indirectly) pushed the Namekians and humans into the background.

But I think that may have been inevitable when they were introduced.
Even when they were introduced, the others were still used in meaningful ways. Piccolo for example was sometimes ahead of them, such as on Namek against 2nd form Freeza and after fusing with Kami. Now it's not even the saiyan show, it's the Goku and Vegeta show. I think better planning would've helped avoid this, such as allowing the others to train and keep up, like what was done back in the day.

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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Sat Mar 21, 2020 9:32 am

Matches Malone wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 9:21 am
DragonBallFoodie wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 8:05 am
The Saiyans have become front and center, and have (indirectly) pushed the Namekians and humans into the background.

But I think that may have been inevitable when they were introduced.
Even when they were introduced, the others were still used in meaningful ways. Piccolo for example was sometimes ahead of them, such as on Namek against 2nd form Freeza and after fusing with Kami. Now it's not even the saiyan show, it's the Goku and Vegeta show. I think better planning would've helped avoid this, such as allowing the others to train and keep up, like what was done back in the day.
Point is that the slowly started being pushed aside. Just look at the Buu arc. Piccolo was relegated to being a tutor, Bulma and co were relegated to cheering on the side and when they weren't needed Toriyama wrote them out either by turning them into stone or chocolate and being eaten by Buu.

Mr. Satan was the only non Saiyan to do anything meaningful in the Buu arc.

It's easy to criticise modern DB but the cast had be treated like shit long before but since the Buu arc was part of the original I guess some fans are too scared to be critical. Perfect example is Videl people talk about how modern DB ruined her character except she was ruined in the same arc she was introduced when she was relegated to just being Gohan's love interest on the sidelines, it's funny when people talk about how "badass" Videl was they never mention anything post Spopovich...

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Re: So, have you finally accepted that this is Saiyan show now?

Post by Matches Malone » Sat Mar 21, 2020 9:38 am

Baggie_Saiyan wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 9:32 am
Perfect example is Videl people talk about how modern DB ruined her character except she was ruined in the same arc she was introduced when she was relegated to just being Gohan's love interest on the sidelines, it's funny when people talk about how "badass" Videl was they never mention anything post Spopovich...
Videl may not have been written perfectly in the Buu arc, but at least she had a personality. Not only has her personality been reduced to nothing, she even lost her design in favor of the most simplistic, generic one imaginable.

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