Tenshinhan's lifespan

[LoganForkHands73]

Tenshinhan's signature technique the Kikoho drains the user's life force and shortens their overall lifespan with each usage. Tien has already died from pouring all of his remaining life energy into the attack against Nappa and almost died again from spamming it too much against Semi-Perfect Cell, he's always bounced back thanks to resurrection and Senzu. Despite the drawbacks, he uses it with more reckless abandon in Super. It looks like Tien at least survives until the End of Z (as well as GT), but that's only going by one artwork by Toriyama. How much longer does he reasonably have left before another one-way trip to the Other World?

Thinking about it, there's a lot to consider here. Being resurrected reset his body clock (I guess the Namek Dragon Balls never had the same limitation against "natural" death and death by Kikoho probably ought to count as that) but his uses of the technique since then have probably shortened his life by at least a decade, unless he somehow worked out a way around the life force drawback but that doesn't seem likely. I know that from a non-storytelling perspective, the reason he keeps using it is because Toei evidently can't think of anything else for him to do.

I guess this thread also counts as a critique against the saturation of the Kikoho. The main thrill of seeing Tien bust it out was knowing how dangerous it was for him to use and that he should only use it under extreme circumstances - compared to the Kamehameha and others, it even looks like a very unnatural and stressful technique.

[TheGreatness25]

I don't recall when the Kikoho was introduced, but does it shorten his lifespan? Also, can a Senzu not replenish that? Because if the answers are "yes" and "no", then Tenshinhan must have a super long lifespan, more than normal humans. Then again, Muten Roshi severely extended his lifespan. I just assume Tenshinhan could too.

[Metalwario64]

I like to think that the whole "lifespan" thing was only really relevant earlier in the series because I think that as he grew stronger and more resilient, the effect it took on him became negligible. That's how it may have thrown his Shin Kikohos left and right at Cell before it became fatal.

[Vijay]

Tien's vitality depletes each time he uses KiKoHo. It's an amped finisher which surpasses destructive capabilities of the likes of even Kamehameha. Dude's human after all. Imagine Kid Goku @ 21st TB or 23rd TB shooting KKH multiple times while it draining his life energy...and basically his life force?

Senzu restores the vitality. But I think in Tien's case, his depleted energy/life force is restored only for that specific moment. Like momentarily halting, thus preventing imminent death. But over long period of time, KiKoHo does exert it's adverse effect on its user's life force is my opinion

Guess Tien realized it in Boo Arc. That's why he only shot once to save Dende...while in anime, he used it to attack Bootenks to no effect. Basically saying there's possibility Tien learnt that burdening his energy & life force may not be good idea after all

Roshi extended his lifespan by drinking Longevity Water/Potion or sumthin. But it could also be merely a gag. As I said earlier, maybe to curb Kikoho's long-term effect on Tien's life force, dude could try out Roshi's Longevity Potion.

Pretty sure not even Toriyama or Toyo wud think this much lol

[Grimlock]

It looks like Tien at least survives until the End of Z (as well as GT). (...) How much longer does he reasonably have left before another one-way trip to the Other World?

The last we heard about Tenshinhan is in AGE 821, when he comes up with his school and such. Whatever is his lifespan now, he will exceed 90 years (as Kuririn is 85 years old by that time).

[90sDBZ]

This reminds me of King Piccolo saying using his full power would shorten his life. This concept is pretty much never brought up again, although it could be King Piccolo's health OCD, like the moment Goku made his thumb bleed by biting it, followed by Piccolo freaking out and drinking it to avoid any bloodloss.

[Vijay]

This reminds me of King Piccolo saying using his full power would shorten his life. This concept is pretty much never brought up again, although it could be King Piccolo's health OCD, like the moment Goku made his thumb bleed by biting it, followed by Piccolo freaking out and drinking it to avoid any bloodloss.

Haha...that Piccolo drinking his own blood part was hilarious...it's not like dude's loosing litres of blood... merely few drops..I think it's more to do with Daimou's ego of not letting even his "Mazoku" blood to drop on land...sigh...

[Zestanor]

It looks like Tien at least survives until the End of Z (as well as GT). (...) How much longer does he reasonably have left before another one-way trip to the Other World?

The last we heard about Tenshinhan is in AGE 821, when he comes up with his school and such. Whatever is his lifespan now, he will exceed 90 years (as Kuririn is 85 years old by that time).

What media shows them that old? GT guidebooks or something?

[Grimlock]

Unfortunately, Dragon Ball Online didn't provide images of the cast post-AGE 784. It would have been interesting to see them that old, though. All we have about the characters are texts.

Well, we do have image showing Piccolo, Moori and Dende, but as you can see, only Moori actually changed. Piccolo just got new boots.

Spoiler:

[Zestanor]

Unfortunately, Dragon Ball Online didn't provide images of the cast post-AGE 784. It would have been interesting to see them that old, though. All we have about the characters are texts.

Well, we do have image showing Piccolo, Moori and Dende, but as you can see, only Moori actually changed. Piccolo just got new boots.

Oh yeah. DBOnline. Totally forgot that was a thing. Does that even count though?

[Grimlock]

Well, if Dragon Ball GT, Dragon Ball Super and other loose works "count" (whatever that means), I don't see why Dragon Ball Online wouldn't.

[Civic]

I always thought it meant that repeated use would kill him in that moment, not that it will take years off his life. Kinda like how early Kaioken could stress Goku's body to the point of death if he pushed too far.

[Zestanor]

Well, if Dragon Ball GT, Dragon Ball Super and other loose works "count" (whatever that means), I don't see why Dragon Ball Online wouldn't.

GT counts when you're talking about GT, and Super counts when you're talking about Super. Both of those are fairly big on-going conversations among Dragon Ball fans.

As far as I know, no one has talked about Dragon Ball Online in years, so no it doesn't count, because nobody cares. People have to care about it for it to be relevant to a discussion anyone wants to have.

[Grimlock]

I see. Well, but since I don't subscribe that train of thought, I'll bring Dragon Ball Online up where people would bring GT or Super. Since I care about it.

[Zestanor]

Okay. Practically speaking though, if you bring up how Buu has a wife and children, you're not going to get any engagement because nobody knows what DBOnline is. The conversation is limited by what people want to talk about, and besides for a few people in Korea, it was never an item.

[LoganForkHands73]

True, DBOnline was niche but it was still a thing that existed, even if only a few people had access to it for a brief window of time. Information on it is still available and loads of plot elements from it inspired later game projects. Plus, the fact that Toriyama had a greater degree of creative control over the project is a draw to some fans that gives it some greater significance than it would have otherwise gotten, for what its worth.

It may be about as valuable to us now as Toriyama's still unseen plot outlines for Super that some swear to be the only canon but I see it as a fun look into how Toriyama would have conceived the future of the Dragon Ball world beyond Oob.

Either way, considering that Tenshinhan's Crane dojo has already appeared in Super, I guess his fate beyond that it still on the cards. Thanks for the reminder of the exact date in Online though, Grim.

While it's wishful thinking that anyone involved in the series thinks about poor Tien this much, but seeing as how he's one of the characters the writers seem intent on leaving in the dust, maybe it would be best to give him a dignified send-off. His years of Kikoho abuse (jeez, making it sound like a drug problem) catch up to him, so he asks for one last showdown with Goku. I can't imagine Goku letting Tien win because neither or them are stupid enough to doubt that Son could turn Tien into a fine, three-eyed paste if he wanted to and Tien is too proud to be condescended to, but he lets Tien get some good hits in like he did against Krillin in GT, just to let him know that his lifetime of training hasn't gone to waste. They recreate their first fight at the 22nd Budokai and Tien busts out a Kikoho to end all Kikohos which miraculously does some damage to Goku (seemingly), but it kills Tien for good. This sets up Goku's desire to have a last hurrah against Vegeta at the end of their lives. Hope y'all enjoyed my little flight of fancy there.

[Robo4900]

Re: DBOnline:

DB Online's future info was all written up by Toriyama, so for all you "IF IT WASN'T TORIYAMA THEN IT DOESN'T COUNT!!" type folks, the DB Online timeline is "canon".
Though personally, I'd not put much stock into it; it's all background worldbuilding stuff (and a lot of it is really stupid. Ever read the stuff about the Boo race? ). I prefer to pay attention to narrative material; GT, Super, etc.

... But yeah, if you want to consider DBO, its material is "canon". Probably in the same "branch" of "canon" as Super is, judging by what we've seen so far.

Roshi extended his lifespan by drinking Longevity Water/Potion or sumthin.

He did not. It's mentioned once or twice early on as an aside, then is brought up once or twice again all the way in the Piccolo arc, before Roshi finally admits to Tenshinhan, right before facing Piccolo, that he never drank any elixir of eternal life, or any other such thing. I'm surprised how few people remember this; it was quite an important moment.

I don't recall when the Kikoho was introduced, but does it shorten his lifespan?

Yes.

But, much like how the Mafuba was initially introduced as being so physically draining that it kills everyone who used it except for God, but then was later brought back without even the slightest hint of it being much more draining than raising a hand, this deadly consequence of using such a powerful technique was eventually forgotten.

Though, in fairness, every time Tenshinhan used the Kikoho, it was shown to be VERY draining. He was pretty much on death's door when he used it on Cell; he was okay after a senzu, though until Super, I think he was only then involved in a couple of further fights in the rest of his life, so maybe it took a toll and he's looking to better himself through training so he can live as long as Roshi and Tao both have.

This reminds me of King Piccolo saying using his full power would shorten his life. This concept is pretty much never brought up again, although it could be King Piccolo's health OCD, like the moment Goku made his thumb bleed by biting it, followed by Piccolo freaking out and drinking it to avoid any bloodloss.

I believe the idea there was that Piccolo using certain techniques would shorten his life, but he didn't particularly mind it because he was going to wish for eternal youth/life soon, so it wouldn't be a concern anymore. Though because he was already super old, he did have to be somewhat careful to not burn all his life out before he got his wish.

[ArmenianPepsi]

I like to think that the whole "lifespan" thing was only really relevant earlier in the series because I think that as he grew stronger and more resilient, the effect it took on him became negligible. That's how it may have thrown his Shin Kikohos left and right at Cell before it became fatal.

This feels like the most DB-way of explaining it. But in a good way. I like it.

[Zestanor]

He did not. It's mentioned once or twice early on as an aside, then is brought up once or twice again all the way in the Piccolo arc, before Roshi finally admits to Tenshinhan, right before facing Piccolo, that he never drank any elixir of eternal life, or any other such thing. I'm surprised how few people remember this; it was quite an important moment.

He lied to Tenshinhan about taking an immortality elixir to make him think he couldn't die. I never took that as denying that he took a longevity elixir.

--
Wait, I was under the impression that Online is not compatible with Super (or GT for that matter). If it doesn't contradict, then I take back what I said about referencing it.

[Grimlock]

Okay. Practically speaking though, if you bring up how Buu has a wife and children, you're not going to get any engagement because nobody knows what DBOnline is. The conversation is limited by what people want to talk about, and besides for a few people in Korea, it was never an item.

That's unfortunate, but not something I should be concerned about. It's not like people can't delve into the game themselves, it is still possible to play it (called "Dragon Ball Online Global") and/or take a look at TheDevilsCorpse's threads about the game right here on this forum, which will provide people with all the information they need if they don't want to play the game.

I don't mind that much if I'm not getting any engagement, as long as I can contribute with something that wasn't originally there.

True, DBOnline was niche but it was still a thing that existed, even if only a few people had access to it for a brief window of time. Information on it is still available and loads of plot elements from it inspired later game projects. Plus, the fact that Toriyama had a greater degree of creative control over the project is a draw to some fans that gives it some greater significance than it would have otherwise gotten, for what its worth.

Like I said above, one can still play the game and in English! But yeah, like you said, information is still out there and with the Internet/translations these days, very easy to find/understand too.

Though personally, I'd not put much stock into it; it's all background worldbuilding stuff

It is only "background worldbuilding" within Dragon Ball Online's context. In the grand scheme of things, it's the epilogue of the manga.