Also, there's the thing with it being the only way to get the first arc uncut and with the Japanese audio here in the States as a result of the long period of distribution legal red tape that Lionsgate (Kidmark and Trimark prior to that) had over them and DB movie 1 in their 1995 edited dub only forms which didn't revert back to FUNimation until sometime in early 2009 or so.
Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
Spoiler:
Also, there's the thing with it being the only way to get the first arc uncut and with the Japanese audio here in the States as a result of the long period of distribution legal red tape that Lionsgate (Kidmark and Trimark prior to that) had over them and DB movie 1 in their 1995 edited dub only forms which didn't revert back to FUNimation until sometime in early 2009 or so.
DB collection related goals as of now:
1.) Find decent priced copy of Dragon Box Z Vol. 4 (Done)
2.) Collect rest of manga
3.) Get rest of Daizenshuu (2-7)
1.) Find decent priced copy of Dragon Box Z Vol. 4 (Done)
2.) Collect rest of manga
3.) Get rest of Daizenshuu (2-7)
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
Indeed. This would make a lot of sense, since Funi initially stated an intention to produce 26 episodes of Dragon Ball. It would furthermore make sense that, if they were preparing to do the first 26, they would get all 28 of the first two arcs.
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
The switching is programmed beforehand, i'm sure about itZestanor wrote: ↑Fri Aug 28, 2020 8:29 pmFrankly this is blowing my mind. I assumed the guy at the station just popped in a videotape with the programs and commercials all ready to go and hit play. They must have had it down to a science in order not to run into technical difficulties all the time, switching the feed between film telecine and commercials tape at precisely the right time
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
The old masters of Z movie 1 were also of similar quality to their masters for Z episode 1. The colors are also very similar.Lightningexpose wrote: ↑Fri Aug 28, 2020 9:01 am I mean DBZ ep 1 on the old 4:3 DVDs looks very different from the rest.
By a lot of the fandom ep 1 is criticised for how it looks on these old DVDs and there was this notion that ep 1 of every release must be inferior quality.
But it actually looks better than the rest. It has way more grain than the rest of the series so that could be why people assumed it’s worse. But when it comes to so many other artefacts like chroma shifts and blurs as well as excessive ringing, ep 1 is the only one that doesn’t have this. So yeah, maybe funi did have film and ep 1 of Z on the old releases is the example? Not sure.
For DB it appears to be first 28 eps that look filmic then they get that very composite master look with the chroma issues, ringing and less grain.
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
I heard that before 9/11 many independent TV stations had essentially been automated so that the only person that would usually be there was the janitor if that. But after 9/11 local stations had a policy change to have at least one person working there live in case a tragedy like that happened again.AlexSketchy04 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 30, 2020 4:38 pmThe switching is programmed beforehand, i'm sure about itZestanor wrote: ↑Fri Aug 28, 2020 8:29 pmFrankly this is blowing my mind. I assumed the guy at the station just popped in a videotape with the programs and commercials all ready to go and hit play. They must have had it down to a science in order not to run into technical difficulties all the time, switching the feed between film telecine and commercials tape at precisely the right time
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
Not sure where you heard that, but most of the time, stations had two guys working on master control, mostly in case something went wrong, and to put the tapesPlanetnamek wrote: ↑Sun Aug 30, 2020 5:58 pmI heard that before 9/11 many independent TV stations had essentially been automated so that the only person that would usually be there was the janitor if that. But after 9/11 local stations had a policy change to have at least one person working there live in case a tragedy like that happened again.AlexSketchy04 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 30, 2020 4:38 pmThe switching is programmed beforehand, i'm sure about itZestanor wrote: ↑Fri Aug 28, 2020 8:29 pm
Frankly this is blowing my mind. I assumed the guy at the station just popped in a videotape with the programs and commercials all ready to go and hit play. They must have had it down to a science in order not to run into technical difficulties all the time, switching the feed between film telecine and commercials tape at precisely the right time
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
There is so much info to dig through here, but it's so technical and nerdy I love it. Good report Robo
That is so awesome. How in the world did you even get ahold of this? That must've costed an arm and a legkei17 wrote: ↑Fri Aug 28, 2020 5:16 pmThey're yellow-tinted and really, really dark. Every film print from Toei that I've seen is remarkably darker than those from other companies like Shin'ei Douga. I understood why Funi's own film transfers always have the crushed blacks. The film footage itself is already dark as hell.VanceRefrigeration wrote: ↑Fri Aug 28, 2020 4:13 pm So you have some of the actual film that the rebroadcast tapes were transferred from? Does your film happen to have the same kind of tinting that the rebroadcast footage has? I was thinking that the rebroadcast footage looked very tinted because of the film fading, so I'm curious to see if your film looks similar to that.
I'm not sure it's the same approach but that idea makes me think of that SD Blu Ray of Fist of The North Star Discotek put out in 2017. It's SD, but it's still a nice step up from the original 2010/2011 DVD release since it benefits from higher bitrates and such.Robo4900 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 29, 2020 1:17 pmTBH, the way for a "Better release of Dragon Ball" would be for Funi to just rerelease raw DVD represses of the DigiBeta masters they have; it would look better than the singles by virtue of better encoding, and better than the Blue Bricks by virtue of not being DNR'd to hell and back.eledoremassis02 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 29, 2020 12:57 pm I'm assuming so, there is no mention of any restorations in their booklets (like the Orange bricks). I think since Dragon Ball doesnt sell as well as Z they haven't taken the time to rescan the film. I just want a better release of Dragon ball.
Last edited by ArmenianPepsi on Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:47 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
Spoiler:
Last edited by eledoremassis02 on Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
I just realized that 18's forehead is fucking huge.
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
Whoops forgot something, here's a quick comparrison I whipped up for HnK if you care to lookeledoremassis02 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:40 pmI am 100% in support of SD-Blu rays! Infact FUNi used Dragon Box footage on one of the season bluray special features (18's VA interveiw). Id but it in a heart beat. If anyone wants to compare with the US /JP DB 9 (these were taken with VLC so the colors off but it's to show the higher bitrate. I'm trying to get used to how virtual dub works)Spoiler:
- - > https://imgur.com/a/GXEdHfh
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
Hokuto no ken have been HD remastered around 2008 for the 25 th anniversary box, i think that dragon ball kai was done cause 291 ep+ was too much for Toei, i wonder why Bluray never came at that time, i only know that actual SD bluray released in japan use the premium box (the dragon box version of Hokuto no ken) i wonder why they never used the HD footage they actually hadArmenianPepsi wrote: ↑Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:48 pm
Whoops forgot something, here's a quick comparrison I whipped up for HnK if you care to look
- - > https://imgur.com/a/GXEdHfh
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
That first shot definitely doesn't look like an actual screenshot from the DVDs. It looks like one of the heavily compressed streaming versions of the show. There's compression and smearing all over the place, and the Discotek DVDs are of pretty good quality. I don't have a screenshot from that specific scene, but this is one I do have on hand:ArmenianPepsi wrote: ↑Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:48 pm Whoops forgot something, here's a quick comparrison I whipped up for HnK if you care to look
- - > https://imgur.com/a/GXEdHfh
I don't remember the episode number, but I'm pretty sure it's the episode where he first fought Raoh.
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
Oh I see now, thanks for correcting me. I'll correct my mistake here. Turns out what I used for comparison was the version of the show ripped from CrunchyRolll. My bad, sorry if I ended up misguiding anyoneMetalwario64 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:27 amThat first shot definitely doesn't look like an actual screenshot from the DVDs. It looks like one of the heavily compressed streaming versions of the show. There's compression and smearing all over the place, and the Discotek DVDs are of pretty good quality. I don't have a screenshot from that specific scene, but this is one I do have on hand:ArmenianPepsi wrote: ↑Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:48 pm Whoops forgot something, here's a quick comparrison I whipped up for HnK if you care to look
- - > https://imgur.com/a/GXEdHfh
I don't remember the episode number, but I'm pretty sure it's the episode where he first fought Raoh.
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
Robo4900 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 27, 2020 8:05 pm This is the common understanding of Funimation's video masters:
In the '90s, Toei supplied Funimation with Digital Betacam transfers of film prints of the first ~20 episodes of DB, as well as the three original movies, for use in their 1995 dub with BLT. They were later given similar copies of DBZ for the first two seasons (and the related movies). Funimation then switched to getting materials from Latin America when they moved in-house, because it was cheaper.
I never knew this. So it's not my imagination that the picture quality for Funimation's DBZ dub went down the shitter from "Ginyu Assault" onwards? The picture looks so vibrant and colorful in the Saban dub and then as soon as Funimation went in-house, the quality of the picture looks so much older.
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
As I note later in the post, the understanding I explained there wasn't completely right -- the material they got from Toei was film that Funi transferred themselves. I'm not sure what form the Latin American footage was in, but I think it may very well have been tape; transfers that were done years ago in Latin America.TVfan721 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:54 pm I never knew this. So it's not my imagination that the picture quality for Funimation's DBZ dub went down the shitter from "Ginyu Assault" onwards? The picture looks so vibrant and colorful in the Saban dub and then as soon as Funimation went in-house, the quality of the picture looks so much older.
But yes, most likely the reason the post-Saban footage doesn't look as good as the Saban footage is because they switched to cheaper methods of getting footage.
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
So, I actually have evidence right now that FUNimation did indeed receive 16mm film for all 153 episodes of Dragon Ball. However, they had disposed of it all.
The part of the evidence I can show to you right now is insufficient so you'll have to wait a bit. Once I can show the full evidence I'll post here.
The part of the evidence I can show to you right now is insufficient so you'll have to wait a bit. Once I can show the full evidence I'll post here.
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
Really? I thought they had only standard def digibeta tape masters of DB, this is is interesting to hear.Lightningexpose wrote: ↑Mon Sep 21, 2020 7:41 am So, I actually have evidence right now that FUNimation did indeed receive 16mm film for all 153 episodes of Dragon Ball. However, they had disposed of it all.
The part of the evidence I can show to you right now is insufficient so you'll have to wait a bit. Once I can show the full evidence I'll post here.
DB collection related goals as of now:
1.) Find decent priced copy of Dragon Box Z Vol. 4 (Done)
2.) Collect rest of manga
3.) Get rest of Daizenshuu (2-7)
1.) Find decent priced copy of Dragon Box Z Vol. 4 (Done)
2.) Collect rest of manga
3.) Get rest of Daizenshuu (2-7)
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
That's interesting. Do you know if they're getting new masters to work with, or not every episode being destroyed?Lightningexpose wrote: ↑Mon Sep 21, 2020 7:41 am So, I actually have evidence right now that FUNimation did indeed receive 16mm film for all 153 episodes of Dragon Ball. However, they had disposed of it all.
The part of the evidence I can show to you right now is insufficient so you'll have to wait a bit. Once I can show the full evidence I'll post here.
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Re: Myth - "Funimation didn't acquire film masters of DBZ until 2008"
Was there ever an explanation given as to why the first 13 episodes or so are so zoomed in?