Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

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Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by precita » Wed Nov 11, 2020 7:55 pm

I've seen many people say GT Pan is very annoying or how much they hate her, but her personality isn't really that much different than Videl in the Boo saga and people love her.

GT's writing didn't exactly give Pan much chances to shine on her own, but that's a fault of the series in general being way too Goku-focused. What do people dislike about GT Pan and if Super has a timeskip what can they fix?

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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by Jack Bz » Wed Nov 11, 2020 8:05 pm

It's totally different to how she was at the end of Z. She seemed to be much more like Goku in personality, loving fighting and having loads of potential. In GT she takes a lot more personality cues from the worst traits of Bulma, and her role is often that of a damsel in distress.

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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by ABED » Wed Nov 11, 2020 8:33 pm

precita wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 7:55 pm I've seen many people say GT Pan is very annoying or how much they hate her, but her personality isn't really that much different than Videl in the Boo saga and people love her.

GT's writing didn't exactly give Pan much chances to shine on her own, but that's a fault of the series in general being way too Goku-focused. What do people dislike about GT Pan and if Super has a timeskip what can they fix?
It has NOTHING to do with GT being Goku focused. OG DB was Goku focused as well and the supporting characters got plenty of focus and development.

I think Pan being the overly zealous young girl who winds up the damsel is the biggest culprit. I wouldn't put it past people wanting other (male) characters to go along on the trip as a reason for the hate.
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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by 90sDBZ » Wed Nov 11, 2020 8:49 pm

I think it's the fact that she initially shows zero respect towards Goku, who most of us have enormous respect for. We've spent years watching him do incredible things, overcoming insane obstacles, training his ass off, and saving the world/universe. Then along comes this obnoxious brat who has the nerve to boss him around and disrespect him.

And the fact she's constantly making life hard for Goku and Trunks, while also contributing very little.

I think she gets much more likeable as the series progresses, largely because she starts being more respectful and even helpful. I've always found it interesting how she seems to regain a ton of respect for him when he goes SS4. Like him being in a smaller body justified treating him like a younger brother.

I feel Gotenks gets critisized for somewhat similar reasons, but it's easier to forgive because he has the strength to back up his cocky attitude.

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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by ABED » Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:04 pm

Really, would you call that disrespect? It's pretty standard behavior for kids towards grandparents.
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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by 90sDBZ » Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:16 pm

ABED wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:04 pm Really, would you call that disrespect? It's pretty standard behavior for kids towards grandparents.
Standard for younger kids too young to know right from wrong perhaps. At any rate it's clear she had much more respect for him during EoZ.

Perhaps him leaving for 5 years and then showing up in a kids body had something to do with it. Her behavior being realistic still doesn't make it less annoying though, and she disrespects Trunks too.

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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by precita » Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:24 pm

Yeah if Goku wasn't de-aged to a kid, Pan's dynamic with him would have likely been very different than it was in GT. It's the fact that Goku was shorter and looked younger than her (despite Pan being like 8 and Goku probably being 12 again like he was in Dragonball), so it made them appear the same age or her looking after him.

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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by ABED » Wed Nov 11, 2020 10:33 pm

90sDBZ wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:16 pm
ABED wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:04 pm Really, would you call that disrespect? It's pretty standard behavior for kids towards grandparents.
Standard for younger kids too young to know right from wrong perhaps. At any rate it's clear she had much more respect for him during EoZ.

Perhaps him leaving for 5 years and then showing up in a kids body had something to do with it. Her behavior being realistic still doesn't make it less annoying though, and she disrespects Trunks too.
It's not a matter of respect. It's kids being kids. They go through phases as they grow up. They often first start off wanting to be around their families all the time and then they grow embarassed and often wanting independence from their parents/grandparents. She's a KID. And she's not even 10 in GT, jeez. It's just a kid being a kid.
Last edited by ABED on Wed Nov 11, 2020 10:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Wed Nov 11, 2020 10:34 pm

Because she never became a SSJ.
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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by Grimlock » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:56 am

ABED wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 10:33 pmShe's a KID. And she's not even 10 in GT, jeez. It's just a kid being a kid.
She's precisely ten, though. The beginning of Dragon Ball GT takes place ten years after her birthday. Exactly the same age as Gohan by the end of Cell saga, a pre-teen.
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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by ABED » Thu Nov 12, 2020 5:54 am

Grimlock wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:56 am
ABED wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 10:33 pmShe's a KID. And she's not even 10 in GT, jeez. It's just a kid being a kid.
She's precisely ten, though. The beginning of Dragon Ball GT takes place ten years after her birthday. Exactly the same age as Gohan by the end of Cell saga, a pre-teen.
Kids have different personalities and this sort of behavior is not uncommon. And she could be 9. Regardless, the fundamental point still stands, she's young and her behavior is typical of that age, and that's a big reason why she's disliked.

Pan is hated for the same reason Scrappy Doo is hated - they are overconfident and always wind up getting in over their head and in need of rescuing.
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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by 90sDBZ » Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:46 am

ABED wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 10:33 pm It's not a matter of respect. It's kids being kids. They go through phases as they grow up. They often first start off wanting to be around their families all the time and then they grow embarassed and often wanting independence from their parents/grandparents. She's a KID. And she's not even 10 in GT, jeez. It's just a kid being a kid.
Like I said before even if it is realistic kid behaviour it can still make for an annoying viewing experience. When a character is given that much screen time they can't afford to be too annoying, although she does get a lot better later on in GT.

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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by ABED » Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:56 am

90sDBZ wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:46 am
ABED wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 10:33 pm It's not a matter of respect. It's kids being kids. They go through phases as they grow up. They often first start off wanting to be around their families all the time and then they grow embarassed and often wanting independence from their parents/grandparents. She's a KID. And she's not even 10 in GT, jeez. It's just a kid being a kid.
Like I said before even if it is realistic kid behaviour it can still make for an annoying viewing experience. When a character is given that much screen time they can't afford to be too annoying, although she does get a lot better later on in GT.
What is annoying is a matter of opinion and the characters don't have to be likeable, they just have to be interesting and contribute to the story.
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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by coola » Thu Nov 12, 2020 10:10 am

ABED wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:56 am
90sDBZ wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:46 am
ABED wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 10:33 pm It's not a matter of respect. It's kids being kids. They go through phases as they grow up. They often first start off wanting to be around their families all the time and then they grow embarassed and often wanting independence from their parents/grandparents. She's a KID. And she's not even 10 in GT, jeez. It's just a kid being a kid.
Like I said before even if it is realistic kid behaviour it can still make for an annoying viewing experience. When a character is given that much screen time they can't afford to be too annoying, although she does get a lot better later on in GT.
What is annoying is a matter of opinion and the characters don't have to be likeable, they just have to be interesting and contribute to the story.
If character is so annoying it make you wanna stop watching, then it is a problem :) Personally, i didn't mind Pan at all, she was nowhere near as annoying as Chi-Chi, but i can see why people don't like her, especially if they were fans of Gohan and others, they didnt get chance to shine even in Shadow Dragons saga.
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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by Cursed Lemon » Thu Nov 12, 2020 12:03 pm

Pan is "that" character. The one who is completely useless, devoid of any wit, and exists only to stare dumbly at what's going on and verbally confirm what the viewer is already very clearly aware of.
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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by precita » Thu Nov 12, 2020 12:12 pm

Cursed Lemon wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 12:03 pm Pan is "that" character. The one who is completely useless, devoid of any wit, and exists only to stare dumbly at what's going on and verbally confirm what the viewer is already very clearly aware of.
Yeah, but you can say the same thing about the entire supporting cast when Goku is fighting. :lol:

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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by Cursed Lemon » Thu Nov 12, 2020 12:15 pm

precita wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 12:12 pmYeah, but you can say the same thing about the entire supporting cast when Goku is fighting. :lol:
True, but can you imagine if Yamcha was present in literally every scene in DBZ? And he was somehow LESS funny?
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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by 90sDBZ » Thu Nov 12, 2020 2:45 pm

ABED wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:56 am What is annoying is a matter of opinion and the characters don't have to be likeable, they just have to be interesting and contribute to the story.
Obviously it's my opinion. The topic asks "Why do people dislike GT Pan?", so I gave my opinion as to why. How else am I supposed to reply?

And I never said she has to be likeable. She just shouldn't be annoying because nobody enjoys watching an annoying character.

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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:26 pm

It's also weird for Pan to be treating her grandfather like a younger brother. Much like Goku not taking Cell and Freeza seriously in their fight I think TOEI were trying to recreate that wacky Toriyama humour in GT, but for a lot of fans (at least back then as GT is more respected now) it didn't feel as natural and it felt like Dragon Ball was becoming a parody of itself.
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Re: Why do so many people dislike GT Pan?

Post by WittyUsername » Thu Nov 12, 2020 5:15 pm

She does have a bratty attitude in GT, and does often play the role of a damsel in distress, but in fairness, so did Bulma at the start of the manga. I think part of the reason Pan tends to get more hate for it is because people don’t like how the show gives her so much attention, while sidelining other characters. Also, to be fair to Bulma, while she does have a short temper, it’s often more justified for her than with Pan. Pan’s abuse of Gill isn’t an especially endearing quality.

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