Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Discussion regarding the entirety of the franchise in a general (meta) sense, including such aspects as: production, trends, merchandise, fan culture, and more.

Moderators: General Help, Kanzenshuu Staff

Mr. Slump
Newbie
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2014 12:27 pm

Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by Mr. Slump » Sat May 08, 2021 3:54 pm

Image


Image

Which endings do you guys prefer? I think I’ll pick the GT one since it was the more emotional one for me.

User avatar
Grimlock
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 8241
Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2016 4:11 pm
Location: Cybertron.

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by Grimlock » Sat May 08, 2021 3:59 pm

The Kanzenban ending is definitely better than the original ending of the manga, as it establishes expectations for Uub that has yet to become a reality (though Vegeta's getting the very last line and to top it off, it's him saying he'll surpass Goku is kinda out of place), I think it's right up there with Dragon Ball GT ending, for different reasons, obviously.

I can't really pick one of those two because either way I prefer the ending Dragon Ball Online establishes.
Goodbye friend. You are weak, so you must be destroyed!

~ War of the Dinobots ~

Saiyan Emperor
Newbie
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat May 01, 2021 4:44 pm

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by Saiyan Emperor » Sat May 08, 2021 6:43 pm

As of right now I think I prefer the GT ending. I don't know why but Goku ascending with Shenron feels like the perfect conclusion to his story. GT could of been a lot better but the ending still stays with me

User avatar
Adamant
I Live Here
Posts: 3322
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 1:02 pm
Location: Viking Land

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by Adamant » Sat May 08, 2021 6:56 pm

Grimlock wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 3:59 pm (though Vegeta's getting the very last line and to top it off, it's him saying he'll surpass Goku is kinda out of place)
I'm convinced Toriyama threw that in because he was genuinely annoyed at how people misinterpreted the "you're number one" line in a way he didn't intend it. It makes a lot more sense if you think of it that way.
Satan wrote:Lortedrøm! Bøh slog min datter ihjel! Hvad bilder du dig ind, Bøh?! Nu kommer Super-Satan og rydder op!

User avatar
SuperSunnyDee
Newbie
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:07 pm

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by SuperSunnyDee » Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:04 pm

I feel like I’m in a very slim minority where I like almost all of the Dragon Ball endings. From the original manga, to the Kanzenban, GT, and even stuff like Dragon Ball Online(I don’t know if there are any others).

But if I had to pick one I think it’d be the Kanzenban ending. It adds a little more weight to Uub’s character while still retaining what I liked about the original ending. To quote one of the features from Kanzenshuu, the manga ending made the story feel like it “ended as humbly as it began.” And I feel like that sort of ending is really unique and charming.

Kinokima
I Live Here
Posts: 2005
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2017 2:02 pm

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by Kinokima » Thu Jun 24, 2021 4:58 am

Adamant wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 6:56 pm
Grimlock wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 3:59 pm (though Vegeta's getting the very last line and to top it off, it's him saying he'll surpass Goku is kinda out of place)
I'm convinced Toriyama threw that in because he was genuinely annoyed at how people misinterpreted the "you're number one" line in a way he didn't intend it. It makes a lot more sense if you think of it that way.

And people still misinterpret it

User avatar
RashFaustinho
Newbie
Posts: 23
Joined: Tue Jun 22, 2021 12:56 pm

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by RashFaustinho » Thu Jun 24, 2021 6:03 am

The only thing I don't like too much about GT ending is that, if the whole intention was "figuratively" killing Goku, by sending him to the other world, making him a god or whatever, they could come up with some better way to show it. It's very criptic the way it is now.
Also, Vegeta is nowhere to be seen during the the final recap at the very end. There is almost everyone, almost all enemies, almost all allies, but not his greatest rival. Wth?

That aside, though, it does wrap everything way more nicely. The recap with dan dan playing in the background is way more satisfying than what happens in the Kazenban Ending, which, yeah, shows a successor, that's cute, but it doesn't really have the same overall feeling of closure that you get in the GT ending, where it shows all the adventures Goku had in the past.

User avatar
MasenkoHA
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 6201
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 9:38 pm

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by MasenkoHA » Thu Jun 24, 2021 9:10 am

Toriyama’s ending fit his story about a martial artist who went out in the world to train himself and become stronger better.

But GT’s ending fit the story of a pure noble hero who has a fighting spirit. So it works better for the anime which plays up Goku’s more heroic qualities.

So if you like Goku as a guy who is always trying to personally better himself the Toriyama ending is way better. But if you like Goku as a pure hearted warrior who enriched the life of everyone around him GT’s ending is more fitting.

User avatar
Majin Buu
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1106
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2005 2:23 pm

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by Majin Buu » Thu Jun 24, 2021 10:26 am

MasenkoHA wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 9:10 amToriyama’s ending fit his story about a martial artist who went out in the world to train himself and become stronger better.
To add to this, it also works as a summation of Goku's character: A guy who's altruistic actions often come with an underlying motive of seeking a good fight.

BWri
I'm, pretty, cozy, here...
Posts: 1712
Joined: Mon May 02, 2016 1:56 pm
Contact:

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by BWri » Thu Jun 24, 2021 6:45 pm

I like GT's because it feels like closure. I'm not sure if it's entirely earned though. I would like the Kanzenban's more if the backdrop of the tourney was more interesting. The Kanzenban tourney just feels like Buu arc redux.

Or maybe if Uub was the one to seek Goku out I'd like it more. As it stands, it feels like Uub will be another reluctant fighter, like Gohan, so the magic dies a little bit for me personally.

The best ending was post 23rd TB, even though it wasn't intended to be.
Big fan of the characters of Dragon Ball, all of them, especially formerly prominent sub-characters. -__-

User avatar
Thanos
I'm, pretty, cozy, here...
Posts: 1630
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 2:33 am

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by Thanos » Sat Jul 10, 2021 1:43 am

GT's ending hits all the right feels, but finality is something that I don't think really works for Dragon Ball. Toriyama seems to leave it open-ended by design, because it's like you're meant to feel like the adventures are ongoing one way or another. I personally don't have a desire for "closure", because the whole idea is for Goku to have a hunger to get more powerful and to seek even stronger opponents... so when is that meant to end, exactly? GT wrapping it up with a nice bow and it always felt like something fan-made in a way, something extraneous and unnecessary.

On the other hand, the manga ending is very dated now with Super. Kid Buu reincarnating into Uub made sense as a significant event when you assumed nothing major happened between Buu and the time skip, but so much has happened (and has yet to happen in the next film and manga and whatever else) that a reincarnation of him presumably without his most effective ability, being regeneration, in tact. Kid Buu wasn't even the strongest of the Buus, so even if Uub manages to catch up to that level he's small potatoes compared to everything since. Though, Toriyama is no stranger to faking significant plot events so I'm sure if he ever picked the story up after the end of the manga Uub would probably be another Gohan situation.
Thanos before Thanos was cool.

User avatar
Peach
OMG CRAZY REGEN
Posts: 882
Joined: Mon Feb 03, 2020 8:57 am

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by Peach » Sat Jul 10, 2021 4:39 am

The GT ending is one of my favorite endings in fiction.

I love that it flashes back to Grandpa Gohan too.

User avatar
ABED
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 20276
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:23 am
Location: Skippack, PA
Contact:

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by ABED » Sat Jul 10, 2021 4:52 am

I get that people want answers but not knowing where Goku goes is kinda the point. He's dead, we don't know where you go when you die. If we did know, it would just be another place.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.

User avatar
MasenkoHA
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 6201
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 9:38 pm

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by MasenkoHA » Sat Jul 10, 2021 8:30 am

ABED wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 4:52 am . He's dead, we don't know where you go when you die. .
We do in Dragon Ball though.

User avatar
ABED
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 20276
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:23 am
Location: Skippack, PA
Contact:

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by ABED » Sat Jul 10, 2021 8:34 am

MasenkoHA wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 8:30 am
ABED wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 4:52 am . He's dead, we don't know where you go when you die. .
We do in Dragon Ball though.
Which goes against the idea of finality. If we know where he goes, it's just another place, a hard to get to place but still somewhere. Without answers, it puts the characters in the same shoes as the audience. Where do we go when we die? People have different answers but not one we universally agree on. By putting everyone in the same shoes, we get what the story is going for unless you cling to the idea that we need to know because you're uncomfortable not knowing.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.

User avatar
Skar
I Live Here
Posts: 2206
Joined: Mon Jul 01, 2013 11:04 pm
Location: US

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by Skar » Sat Jul 10, 2021 12:06 pm

ABED wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 4:52 am I get that people want answers but not knowing where Goku goes is kinda the point. He's dead, we don't know where you go when you die. If we did know, it would just be another place.
Did the GT ending imply Goku died? He didn't have a halo when he returned 100 years later. There's an afterlife in DB so we already have an idea of what happens when they die. Goku is one of the select few who was allowed to keep his body in Other World both times he was killed while most people would only have their soul. There might still be finality to death in DB since keeping their bodies might only be a temporary luxury and eventually they're reincarnated or "pass on". I'm not sure if that's what happened when he left with Shenron though.

User avatar
MasenkoHA
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 6201
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 9:38 pm

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by MasenkoHA » Sat Jul 10, 2021 1:19 pm

Thanos wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 1:43 am

On the other hand, the manga ending is very dated now with Super. Kid Buu reincarnating into Uub made sense as a significant event when you assumed nothing major happened between Buu and the time skip, but so much has happened (and has yet to happen in the next film and manga and whatever else) that a reincarnation of him presumably without his most effective ability, being regeneration, in tact.
Not really no. What happens in Super only matters when watching or reading Dragon Ball Super. I’m not going to pretend a 20 year revival interquel meant to pander to nostalgia matters when reading the Dragon Ball manga or watching Dragon Ball Z

Cipher
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 6333
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 11:54 pm
Location: Nagano
Contact:

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by Cipher » Sat Jul 10, 2021 1:34 pm

GT's the better ending of the two, but I think I only hold that opinion because the Kanzenban ending is a step down from the original for me. Goku encouraging the timid Oob to shout and get excited for his first adventure gets me a little choked up in a way the--frankly less meaningful for the actual characters--Kinto'un hand-off does not. Kinto'un is there for the reader; the original version of the scene is there for Goku and Oob.

Of the three my preference is increasingly for the original Volume 42. Goku taking a new protoge off onto his first adventure, and leaving behind friends and family without a care to do so, as he's always had a tendency to do, is probably the more fitting character ending for him and the series--mirroring Bulma bringing him out of the woods way back when--and that's the slightly better version of it.

User avatar
ABED
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 20276
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:23 am
Location: Skippack, PA
Contact:

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by ABED » Sat Jul 10, 2021 5:43 pm

Skar wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 12:06 pm
ABED wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 4:52 am I get that people want answers but not knowing where Goku goes is kinda the point. He's dead, we don't know where you go when you die. If we did know, it would just be another place.
Did the GT ending imply Goku died? He didn't have a halo when he returned 100 years later. There's an afterlife in DB so we already have an idea of what happens when they die. Goku is one of the select few who was allowed to keep his body in Other World both times he was killed while most people would only have their soul. There might still be finality to death in DB since keeping their bodies might only be a temporary luxury and eventually they're reincarnated or "pass on". I'm not sure if that's what happened when he left with Shenron though.
It's all very vague. If he ended up in DB's typical afterlife, why the ambiguity? Whether he was in fact dead, he might as well be since he's gone and no one can bring him back.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.

MyVisionity
Banned
Posts: 1834
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2004 11:51 pm
Location: US

Re: Toriyama’s Kanzenban Ending Versus Dragon Ball GT Ending: Which One Is The Best?

Post by MyVisionity » Sat Jul 10, 2021 6:21 pm

ABED wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 4:52 am Where do we go when we die? People have different answers but not one we universally agree on.
This isn't some grand mystery or big unanswered question for people. We don't universally agree on a lot of things that we know to be true but that's not because it isn't knowledge.

As for GT's ending I don't think it's clear whether Goku's dead or not, just that he's gone and likely for good. Although it seems like he went with Shenlong to whatever place Shenlong goes when he's not summoned.

Post Reply