Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 74 - DBZ 169, movie 8

[Robo4900]

Hello, ladies, gentlemen, and everyone between and beyond, and welcome to week 74 of the first Dragon Ball rewatch of the decade.
We're doing five episodes a week, and we'll be watching every single episode of Dragon Ball, Dragon Ball Z, and Dragon Ball GT. All 508 episodes. Plus the TV specials and the movies.
I encourage you all to watch in Japanese with subtitles, especially if you have never done so before, but watch along in whichever way brings you the most joy.

I must apologise for the inconsistent posting days/times for the past few weeks.
The good news is that we're pretty much at the end of that issue; it shouldn't rear its head again after next week.

Furthermore however, KBABZ and I have decided to move the day we post the threads. Starting after next week, we will be posting threads on Monday, to allow KBABZ to coalate trivia over the weekend and then to allow me to post it on Monday (since I'm often busy over weekends).

So, the current plan is that next week, the thread will go up on Wednesday, then all weeks after that, we will be posting on Monday.

Previous thread: Week 73 (DBZ 164-168)
Next thread: Week 75 (DBZ 170-174)

Anyway, without further ado...

Episode 322 - Goku’s Composure?! Just Rest and Wait for the Cell Games (DBZ episode 169)
Dub title: No Worries Here
Originally aired 16th of December 1992
Kai equivalent: Episode 84 - Training Completed! Does Goku have the Composure to Defeat Cell?!, Episode 85 - An Interrupted Rest! The Self-Defense Army’s General Offensive Against Cell
Written by: Katsuyuki Sumisawa
Episode director: Mitsuo Hashimoto
Animation supervisor: Masayuki Uchiyama

After Goku and Gohan emerge from the Room of Time and Spirit, which they can enter for one more day, they leave Vegeta and the others dumbstruck as they head for Karin Tower. There Goku displays half of his power, but even then Karin thinks that Cell’s is greater. But Goku accepts this with a laugh, and heads to Kame House to meet Chi-Chi. Their family is then reunited for the first time in awhile. Following after them, Kuririn sees Gohan and the relaxed Goku, and wonders why they aren’t training…

Anime-only/filler content: Cell warming up and destroying a meteor, Goku and Gohan fishing, and most of the other related chillout stuff going on.

DBZ movie 8 - Burn Up!! A Red-Hot, Raging, Super-Fierce Fight
Dub title: Broly - The Legendary Super Saiyan
Originally released 6th of March 1993
Written by: Takao Koyama
Director: Shigeyasu Yamauchi
Animation supervisor: Tadayoshi Yamamuro

Vegeta travels to the planet New Vegeta in search of the Legendary Super Saiyan, who has been destroying planets. Goku is also in pursuit of the Legendary Super Saiyan, teleports to the planet, and Broly goes berserk. Goku must defeat the Legendary Super Saiyan… to save the universe!!

-

Interesting trivia about Z episode 169:

• At this point in time in the manga, Goku has Gohan take his place in the fight against Cell, and gives Cell a senzu.
• Kuririn throwing a rock at Goku is arguably a repeat of the joke from DB episode 8, a full 316 episodes before, in which Chichi launches a blade at Roshi while he's not looking to test if he really is Roshi. The joke would repeat once again in Z episode 250, a full 81 episodes later, where Goku throws a ki blast at Elder Kaioshin to test his abilities.
• This episode begins a stretch of filler episodes leading up to the Cell Games. Arguably it even continues after that, with a few of the early Cell Games episodes bogged down by the Mr Satan gang filler, so we don't really get out of the fillerific territory until Goku begins fighting Cell.

Interesting trivia about Z movie 8:

• At this point in time in the manga, Cell self-destructs and Goku teleports him to Kaio's planet.
• DBZ movie 8 released in the March 1993 Toei Anime Fair. It was shown with Dr Slump And Arale-chan: N-cha! Clear Skies Over Penguin Village.
• If it wasn't for Goku and Gohan not being Super Saiyan in this movie, it would perfectly fit in the timeline of the TV series, between Goku and Gohan emerging from the Room of Spirit and Time and the gang fighting Cell.
• Akira Toriyama advised on Broly's visual design, specifically providing the idea of the arm bands and the fact he doesn't wear Saiyan armour (since it's actually Freeza armour, and Broly and Paragas never worked for Freeza).
• On its original release, DBZ movie 8 earned a total of 2.47 billion yen at the Japanese box office. It still stands as the 6th-highest-grossing Dragon Ball movie (only edged out of the top 5 by the release of Super Broly in December 2018, which took the top spot with 3.8 billion yen).
• The Funimation dub of this movie features the Team Faulconer opening theme for Dragon Ball Z. This is significant in that it's an arrangement that fits the original Japanese opening visuals for Cha-La Head Cha-La. It still puzzles me to this day that they didn't use this opening on the Season DVDs and Blu-rays as the opening for the first 199 episodes on the US broadcast score mix.
• Funimation censored all dialogue references to Roshi being drunk, except for one line in which he says "I'm so hungover."
• Despite the censorship and some other liberal adaptational choices in the script (such as, when Piccolo explains that he overheard Goku's telepathic conversation with Kaio, the addition of "I couldn't help but listen in; with my ears, I can hear just about everything in the universe."; as usual with Funi's additions of this type, the original meaning of the line is here, right before the quoted portion, but the focus of the line is completely shifted, as Funi's added bullshit now make up more than half of the original line, and this nonsense is how the line ends), it's still arguably the most faithful dub script Funimation would write for the movies until Battle of Gods.
  • Z movies 1 and 2 may be slightly better, but that's only because they're based off the really great Pioneer scripts. Funi's additions and changes are all for the worse there, so all of Funi's writing in those movies is really bad.

Episode summaries, airdates, and titles courtesy of Kanzenshuu's episode guide. Dragon Ball logo provided by KBABZ.

[MasenkoHA]

I must apologise for the inconsistent posting days/times for the past few weeks.
The good news is that we're pretty much at the end of that issue; it shouldn't rear its head again after next week.

No worries. Hope your exams go well!

[*]If it wasn't for Goku and Gohan not being Super Saiyan in this movie, it would perfectly fit in the timeline of the TV series, between Goku and Gohan emerging from the Room of Spirit and Time and the gang fighting Cell.

Well there’s that but also the Cell arc takes place in May where this movie seems to be set in March with Chi Chi trying to get Gohan enrolled in a prestigious cram school, the characters watching the cherry blossoms bloom, and Chi Chi mentioning Gohan’s spring break is over at the of the movie.

Also I don’t buy that Vegeta would just be chilling with everyone else during the 10 day wait for the Cell Games. Dude spent his entire time on the Lookout either training or waiting to train.

[*]The Funimation dub of this movie features the Team Faulconer opening theme for Dragon Ball Z. This is significant in that it's an arrangement that fits the original Japanese opening visuals for Cha-La Head Cha-La. It still puzzles me to this day that they didn't use this opening on the Season DVDs and Blu-rays as the opening for the first 199 episodes on the US broadcast score mix.

Probably the same reason they used the Mark Menza movie theme for the season sets dub for both the Japanese music and US music options. Pure laziness and incompetence on Funimation’s end.


Funny enough the movie rereleases with the Japanese music intact are all random. Dead Zone, World Strongest, Revenge of Cooler, The Second Coming, Bio Broly, and Fusion Reborn all play the Menza theme. Tree of Might, Lord Slug, Return of Cooler, Super Android 13, Legendary Super Saiyan, and Bojack Unbound play Head Cha La.


Why? Funi’s drunk editor only knows




Anyways the movie itself, honestly after how lackluster the past few Z movies have been this was pretty enjoyable. Probably the best Dragon Ball movie since “World Strongest”. Broly’s motivation for hating Goku is incredibly stupid but the movie doesn’t really focus too much on it in favor of just making Broly a wild animal so that’s good. “New Vegeta” lends itself to being a bit more of a visually interesting battleground than the icy wasteland or New Namek. I also quite liked Kikuchi’s score for this movie. Last time I thoroughly enjoyed his score for a movie was Tree of Might (though none of them have been terrible)

Random trivia

Despite the dub’s official title being Broly: The Legendary Super Saiyan when it aired on Adult Swim’s revived Toonami block they retitled it Legend of Broly

https://youtu.be/LzrAmjWuyBc


Anyways ranking the Dragon Ball movies so far

1. Z movie 1
2. Sleeping Princess in Devil’s Castle
3. World Strongest
4. Broly the Legendary Super Saiyan
5. Tree of Might
6. Super Saiyan Son Goku
7. Legend of Shen Long
8. Mystical Adventure
9. Coola’s Revenge
10. Super Android 13
11. Return of Coola

[SuperSaiyaManZ94]

Broly 1 is one of my favorites of the old Z movies, along with 1,3,9,12 and 13. It definitely feels like a breather after how lackluster the previous three were.

Other notes:

- The FUNi dub of this film is surprisingly a fairly accurate one from a scripting aspect, not quite on the level of the Pioneer dubs of Z movies 1-3 but good just the same. This is definitely one of their better works of the pre-Kai era, though i would recommend watching the dub w/Kikuchi score version over the original replacement score edition.

- Of course i find the Speedy and Big Green dubs hilarious in particular. Both are laughably bad in their own different ways.

Speedy:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=knvLgGWoL7o

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2pk3UFwum ... &index=135

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pEtseO2pr ... Pu&index=4

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4bJ58hJXS ... Pu&index=8

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=m5ScWDkB-Z0

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=t8oWAoEEJm8

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ee3TX2Gc0P8


Big Green:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WOlYe-A7MaE&t=222s

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gl2-xuUffi4

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WEsmseY5l ... V8&index=3

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kbZBwtW4g ... 8&index=10

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-bbP8U09S ... 8&index=13

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=L6au5a-XU ... 8&index=24

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qR00GZqG9 ... 8&index=18

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gaA2VoKeV ... 8&index=43

[Ssj3Engels]

Cell destroying the Earth's army is filler or not? Can't remember.

[jjgp1112]

Cell destroying the Earth's army is filler or not? Can't remember.

Nope, that's what prompts Goku to find a Namekian that can create a new set of Dragon Balls.

[WittyUsername]

I said this elsewhere, but I guess it’s worth repeating here: out of all the DBZ movies that received the nu-metal treatment from FUNimation, this is easily the one where it’s handled the best. Don’t get me wrong, I’d still much rather stick with the Japanese score, but FUNimation was at least somewhat clever when it came to the music they used here. It’s a step up from Movies 4 and 5, where they clearly didn’t put any thought into the music choices, outside of which ones sounded cool. It helps that the bands they got for this movie are mostly pretty obscure.

Anyway, Movie 8 is more polarizing than it deserves to be. It’s not my favorite Dragon Ball movie, but it’s pretty ambitious compared to most of the other movies from the original run. I really don’t think there’s anything wrong with Broly’s backstory. The movie doesn’t even state that he hates Goku for making him cry. I actually prefer his backstory here over the newer one.

On the subject of FUNimation’s script, I recently rewatched Movie 11 and in terms of faithfulness, that one is at least on par with this. Unfortunately, the name ‘Hercule’ is used in that.

[MasenkoHA]

I said this elsewhere, but I guess it’s worth repeating here: out of all the DBZ movies that received the nu-metal treatment from FUNimation, this is easily the one where it’s handled the best. Don’t get me wrong, I’d still much rather stick with the Japanese score, but FUNimation was at least somewhat clever when it came to the music they used here. It’s a step up from Movies 4 and 5, where they clearly didn’t put any thought into the music choices, outside of which ones sounded cool. It helps that the bands they got for this movie are mostly pretty obscure.

My problem has always been less the song selection itself and more the clueless placement and horrid sound mixing. I don’t remember if this one was any better here or not.

The movie doesn’t even state that he hates Goku for making him cry. I actually prefer his backstory here over the newer one.

He has a problem with Kakarotto and we see flashbacks from his perspective of Goku crying in the nursery. Conclusions can be drawn.

On the subject of FUNimation’s script, I recently rewatched Movie 11 and in terms of faithfulness, that one is at least on par with this. Unfortunately, the name ‘Hercule’ is used in that.

Evidently even the uncut Z dub uses Hercule a lot. Me thinks the only reason he’s called Mr.Satan in the dub is to justify all the Satan banners in the uncensored footage. Otherwise Funimation probably would have called him Hercule in both the uncut and edited versions. I think Uncut Kai was the first time his name was exclusively Mr.Satan.

[jjgp1112]

I said this elsewhere, but I guess it’s worth repeating here: out of all the DBZ movies that received the nu-metal treatment from FUNimation, this is easily the one where it’s handled the best. Don’t get me wrong, I’d still much rather stick with the Japanese score, but FUNimation was at least somewhat clever when it came to the music they used here. It’s a step up from Movies 4 and 5, where they clearly didn’t put any thought into the music choices, outside of which ones sounded cool. It helps that the bands they got for this movie are mostly pretty obscure.

My problem has always been less the song selection itself and more the clueless placement and horrid sound mixing. I don’t remember if this one was any better here or not.

The movie doesn’t even state that he hates Goku for making him cry. I actually prefer his backstory here over the newer one.

He has a problem with Kakarotto and we see flashbacks from his perspective of Goku crying in the nursery. Conclusions can be drawn.

On the subject of FUNimation’s script, I recently rewatched Movie 11 and in terms of faithfulness, that one is at least on par with this. Unfortunately, the name ‘Hercule’ is used in that.

Evidently even the uncut Z dub uses Hercule a lot. Me thinks the only reason he’s called Mr.Satan in the dub is to justify all the Satan banners in the uncensored footage. Otherwise Funimation probably would have called him Hercule in both the uncut and edited versions. I think Uncut Kai was the first time his name was exclusively Mr.Satan.

Ehh, in the original Z dub for the series at least, the only time I remember Hercule in the uncut dub is when he's first introduced, where he's presented as "Hercule Satan."Everything after that is Mr. Satan exclusively, though obviously video games kept Hercule. Wouldn't surprise me if that influenced the name popping up Movie 11 since that was released around the same time the games became more prominent.

[MasenkoHA]

I said this elsewhere, but I guess it’s worth repeating here: out of all the DBZ movies that received the nu-metal treatment from FUNimation, this is easily the one where it’s handled the best. Don’t get me wrong, I’d still much rather stick with the Japanese score, but FUNimation was at least somewhat clever when it came to the music they used here. It’s a step up from Movies 4 and 5, where they clearly didn’t put any thought into the music choices, outside of which ones sounded cool. It helps that the bands they got for this movie are mostly pretty obscure.

My problem has always been less the song selection itself and more the clueless placement and horrid sound mixing. I don’t remember if this one was any better here or not.

The movie doesn’t even state that he hates Goku for making him cry. I actually prefer his backstory here over the newer one.

He has a problem with Kakarotto and we see flashbacks from his perspective of Goku crying in the nursery. Conclusions can be drawn.

On the subject of FUNimation’s script, I recently rewatched Movie 11 and in terms of faithfulness, that one is at least on par with this. Unfortunately, the name ‘Hercule’ is used in that.

Evidently even the uncut Z dub uses Hercule a lot. Me thinks the only reason he’s called Mr.Satan in the dub is to justify all the Satan banners in the uncensored footage. Otherwise Funimation probably would have called him Hercule in both the uncut and edited versions. I think Uncut Kai was the first time his name was exclusively Mr.Satan.

Ehh, in the original Z dub for the series at least, the only time I remember Hercule in the uncut dub is when he's first introduced, where he's presented as "Hercule Satan."Everything after that is Mr. Satan exclusively, though obviously video games kept Hercule. Wouldn't surprise me if that influenced the name popping up Movie 11 since that was released around the same time the games became more prominent.

I’ll have to check again but I’m pretty sure his PR agent Pizza mostly called him Hercule in the uncut dub iirc.

[WittyUsername]

He has a problem with Kakarotto and we see flashbacks from his perspective of Goku crying in the nursery. Conclusions can be drawn.

It’s a rather surface level conclusion to draw, though. It might not be an invalid conclusion to draw, but I don’t think the movie established that Goku and Broly were born on the same day just to say that Goku made him cry a lot. It’s supposed to suggest that their destinies are intertwined and that their different upbringings and power levels made them polar oppositions to one another.

Evidently even the uncut Z dub uses Hercule a lot. Me thinks the only reason he’s called Mr.Satan in the dub is to justify all the Satan banners in the uncensored footage. Otherwise Funimation probably would have called him Hercule in both the uncut and edited versions. I think Uncut Kai was the first time his name was exclusively Mr.Satan.

If I recall, the dub of Movie 9 exclusively refers to him as Mr. Satan. Generally speaking, Mr. Satan is what the uncut version refers to him as, but there are some instances where Hercule either seems to slip through the cracks or is used in a way that implies it’s his first name, with Satan being his last name, which seems to be the case in Movie 11.

[Robo4900]

On the subject of FUNimation’s script, I recently rewatched Movie 11 and in terms of faithfulness, that one is at least on par with this. Unfortunately, the name ‘Hercule’ is used in that.

Evidently even the uncut Z dub uses Hercule a lot. Me thinks the only reason he’s called Mr.Satan in the dub is to justify all the Satan banners in the uncensored footage. Otherwise Funimation probably would have called him Hercule in both the uncut and edited versions. I think Uncut Kai was the first time his name was exclusively Mr.Satan.

Ehh, in the original Z dub for the series at least, the only time I remember Hercule in the uncut dub is when he's first introduced, where he's presented as "Hercule Satan."Everything after that is Mr. Satan exclusively, though obviously video games kept Hercule. Wouldn't surprise me if that influenced the name popping up Movie 11 since that was released around the same time the games became more prominent.

I'm pretty sure "Hercule Satan" is used a lot in general in the uncut dub. They usually don't call him "Hercule" on its own, though sometimes they do.

He has a problem with Kakarotto and we see flashbacks from his perspective of Goku crying in the nursery. Conclusions can be drawn.

It’s a rather surface level conclusion to draw, though. It might not be an invalid conclusion to draw, but I don’t think the movie established that Goku and Broly were born on the same day just to say that Goku made him cry a lot. It’s supposed to suggest that their destinies are intertwined and that their different upbringings and power levels made them polar oppositions to one another.

Agreed.

The "Broly only hates Goku because he made him cry" has never had any real basis I've been able to get behind. IIRC there is a line in the English dub at least (I saw the dub a few times as a kid, I've seen the Japanese version once, a couple of years ago ) that goes something like "Haha, Kakarot won't stop bothering Broly with his crying!", but I don't think there's really anything aside from that to really suggest this is why Broly hates Goku so much. I always read it more as a case of Broly having Goku's presence imprinted upon him strongly as a baby, at the dawn of his weird, corrupted ki or whatever is up with him.

But really, I don't think the movie ever makes any effort to explain Broly's hatred of Goku aside from vague hints and suggestion. It's up to interpretation, really. And personally, I don't assume the dumbest possible interpretation is the correct one, even if most of the fandom disagrees with me.

[MasenkoHA]

He has a problem with Kakarotto and we see flashbacks from his perspective of Goku crying in the nursery. Conclusions can be drawn.

It’s a rather surface level conclusion to draw, though. It might not be an invalid conclusion to draw, but I don’t think the movie established that Goku and Broly were born on the same day just to say that Goku made him cry a lot. It’s supposed to suggest that their destinies are intertwined and that their different upbringings and power levels made them polar oppositions to one another.

Sure, but “they were born on the same day”’ isn’t really any sort of explanation for why Broly has it out for Goku. It’s like Koyama had an idea “Here’s a character who has the exact opposite predetermined fate as Goku and he’s born on the same day and he hates Goku because.... reasons”

Not helping that his second movie has him awaken from his slumber by Goten crying which triggers memories of Goku crying.

Koyama’s Broly is just a horribly developed villain.

He’s the Venom of Dragon Ball villains.

If I recall, the dub of Movie 9 exclusively refers to him as Mr. Satan. Generally speaking, Mr. Satan is what the uncut version refers to him as, but there are some instances where Hercule either seems to slip through the cracks or is used in a way that implies it’s his first name, with Satan being his last name, which seems to be the case in Movie 11.

He’s first introduced as Hercule Satan. And I’m pretty sure there’s more than a few instances of the uncut dub calling him Hercule Satan or just Hercule. So yes Hercule Satan is suppose to be his full name.

[Ssj3Engels]

Cell destroying the Earth's army is filler or not? Can't remember.

Nope, that's what prompts Goku to find a Namekian that can create a new set of Dragon Balls.

Oh, I see. Thanks.

[ABED]

He’s the Venom of Dragon Ball villains.

Venom? Of all the villains you could've chose as analogous to Broly...

[MasenkoHA]

He’s the Venom of Dragon Ball villains.

Venom? Of all the villains you could've chose as analogous to Broly...

Incredibly popular but also polarizing villain that came relatively later into the franchise and has a really shoddy m.o.

Feels apt to me

[WittyUsername]

I myself have used the Venom comparison before when it comes to Broly. The fact that the current depiction of Broly is a good guy actually strengthens the analogy, since Venom is usually portrayed as an anti-hero these days.

[ABED]

He’s the Venom of Dragon Ball villains.

Venom? Of all the villains you could've chose as analogous to Broly...

Incredibly popular but also polarizing villain that came relatively later into the franchise and has a really shoddy m.o.

Feels apt to me

I never found Eddie Brock's reasons for going after Spider-Man to be shoddy. He blames him for his troubles. Peter got him fired. He blames him for his own failings.

Broly hates Goku because... checks notes... ... ... I got nothing.

[MasenkoHA]

Venom? Of all the villains you could've chose as analogous to Broly...

Incredibly popular but also polarizing villain that came relatively later into the franchise and has a really shoddy m.o.

Feels apt to me

I never found Eddie Brock's reasons for going after Spider-Man to be shoddy. He blames him for his troubles. Peter got him fired. He blames him for his own failings.

Broly hates Goku because... checks notes... ... ... I got nothing.

In the comics, Eddie Brock lost his job as a reporter because he had written an expose on the alleged identity of a serial killer, only for Spider-man to catch the real killer which made Eddie lose credibility and his job. He doesn’t know Peter from Adam until the symbiote bonds with him.

The 90s cartoon and every subsequent adaptation ran with the idea of Eddie knowing Peter prior to becoming Venom and having grown animosity toward Peter .


I guess Venom has better motivation than Broly, by virtue of having some sort of motivation but its still rather flimsy.

[ABED]

Incredibly popular but also polarizing villain that came relatively later into the franchise and has a really shoddy m.o.

Feels apt to me

I never found Eddie Brock's reasons for going after Spider-Man to be shoddy. He blames him for his troubles. Peter got him fired. He blames him for his own failings.

Broly hates Goku because... checks notes... ... ... I got nothing.

In the comics, Eddie Brock lost his job as a reporter because he had written an expose on the alleged identity of a serial killer, only for Spider-man to catch the real killer which made Eddie lose credibility and his job. He doesn’t know Peter from Adam until the symbiote bonds with him.

The 90s cartoon and every subsequent adaptation ran with the idea of Eddie knowing Peter prior to becoming Venom and having grown animosity toward Peter .


I guess Venom has better motivation than Broly, by virtue of having some sort of motivation but its still rather flimsy.

That's NOT a flimsy excuse. The metal arms told me to or whatever the hell Doc Ock's was is flimsy, but people claim he was 3 dimensional because he had a dead wife. Most supervillains have fairly cliched or dumb motives when you look at them with any sort of scrutiny.

And as far as Eddie's motives, that's a fantastic one. Most real life villains have BS motives when it boils right down to it. It's appropriate given it's the anniversary of the incident but look up Killdozer if you haven't. That guy's motives were downright dumb.

Broly has ZERO motive. Eviil for the sake of evil is fine, but the reason he has it out for Goku is vague and stupid no matter how you slice it. Even if we aren't super literal and take crying out of the equation, them being born and implying a sort of bond of destiny between them is downright lazy.

[MasenkoHA]

.
That's NOT a flimsy excuse. The metal arms told me to or whatever the hell Doc Ock's was is flimsy, but people claim he was 3 dimensional because he had a dead wife. Most supervillains have fairly cliched or dumb motives when you look at them with any sort of scrutiny.

People also claim Spider-man 2 was great despite it being terrible, even in 2004. But that’s not neither here nor there.

Nothing inherently wrong with simple villains (that’s pretty much the entire Dragon Ball rogues gallery) I think Doctor Octopus motivation in the comics amounted to “and then the radiation made him crazy or something”

And as far as Eddie's motives, that's a fantastic one. Most real life villains have BS motives when it boils right down to it. It's appropriate given it's the anniversary of the incident but look up Killdozer if you haven't. That guy's motives were downright dumb.

He has an intense hatred for Spider-man who he’s never actually crossed paths with. There’s a good reason every adaptation built on an animosity between Peter and Eddie and not going the “Remember me? The guy whose life you ruined and never met??!?” path


At any rate the Venom and Broly comparison goes beyond “weak or not weak” motivation.